EDFL Premier Discussion 2023

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Define blatant cheating though, Armstrong cheated in the tour de France with the use of banned substances.

What are they doing different to other EDFL clubs? Offering more money to players than another club that has probably offered them a fair bit more than $277 per game, it is a serious question mate, if you are a club after a player from another club which is completely normal, new club offers a dollar figure, current club counter offers, the players play clubs off against each other for their own financial gain. Some clubs are in a better financial position than others, you can't compare clubs against other clubs as it is apples and oranges. That goes for all divisions.

The last 2 posts referenced a portion of what I wrote and neither have answered a question, are we deflecting for a reason? Is it easier to just single out one club?

And the point of ranting about it on here? How much has it actually achieved, it is like arguing with an umpire, waste of time. Doesn't seem to be any EK people taking the bait either which is why I am wondering why it is still going, all that seemed to do was feed their egos.
The challenge is simple, when you recruit mercenaries its a simple comparison to previously salaries, which these types cant keep it quiet.
Secondly when you recruit youth and pay them above market rate they cant keep it quiet
These are the two big problems EK have vs other clubs at this moment
 
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Salary cap discussions expose an ethical leadership dilemma for clubs​

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Salary cap discussions expose an ethical leadership dilemma for clubs​

General Category​

In a previous life I had the honour and pleasure of being the CEO of the Mornington Peninsula Nepean Football League (MPNFL). At the time, 2007 -2008, the MPNFL was a combination of three separate football leagues and a netball league.
During my CEO tenure one of the biggest issues continually raised by clubs was the burden of rising player payment costs. Clubs felt, if they wanted to reach the finals, they had to spend significant and increasing amounts of money each year on attracting and retaining players to their club. The burden of raising the funds as normal fell to the volunteers.
It was with much interest that I read the press release issued by AFL Victoria on 22 October 2014 (Access full release here) that announced the “Player Payments Working Party” established by AFL Victoria had suggested a framework which sought to “halt the escalating cost of player payments“. The potential framework included, amongst other things, a state wide salary cap with specific limits for individual leagues.
My initial thought, as an ex league CEO, was of course it will never work because it can’t really be enforced. The online feedback from the various clubs and leagues is pretty much summarised by the following comments by various club presidents which appeared in the Monash Weekly (Access full article here ) the day after the AFL Victoria press release:
“It’s impractical. It won’t work,”
“If clubs want to pay someone they will just direct it through someone else”
“If there are third-party arrangements, such as a hotel, what’s to stop the hotel paying players direct?”
“How are you going to police that?”
“I don’t mind the intent and the principle of it, but realistically, it’s not practical.”
“I think it would be impossible to police”
“You could give clubs guidelines, I guess, on what the rules are going to be, but you’ll always have coterie groups, backhanded deals, that sort of thing going on.”
As I was reading the various articles I found myself agreeing whole heartedly with the various Presidents’ comments. Co-incidentally at the same time I was reading these articles I was preparing a training workshop on ethical leadership and it really forced me to think about the concept of a salary cap from an ethical leadership perspective.
Why wouldn’t a voluntary salary cap work?
The logical argument was that it was impossible to police, and so it is, but why does it need to be policed?
Would community sports clubs consciously cheat? Surely not?
Not knowing any answers I decided to change the format of the Ethical Leadership session and to tackle the issue head on.
The results were startling.
About 65 committee members from about 20 different sports and community organisations attended the session. I opened the session reading from the AFL Victoria release about the possible introduction of a salary cap and then I read the above feedback from various Presidents from the Monash Weekly. Everyone was nodding their heads in agreement. “Impossible to police” was the consensus around the crowd.
I then asked the following questions.
Would you consciously disregard the salary cap?
A few sheepish hands were raised.
What if you knew you would never get caught, would you disregard the cap?
A small number of hands rose slowly, but not many.
What about if you had finalised the team for the year and were just on the salary cap and in walks the club’s “favourite son”, a club legend back from playing at a higher level. Would you renegotiate players’ contracts to fit him in? Say there was no room in the salary cap would you knowingly and consciously breach the cap?
There was deep thought in the room now. What would they do? Some indicated they would breach the cap.
To those who answered that they would knowingly breach the cap I asked why:
“Whatever it takes to win”
“You have to do it to be able to compete”
I said to those who had been honest enough to say they would breach the cap:
So as president you agree to abide by the rules of the competition when entering it but knowingly you would breach its rules. What sort of a leader does that make you? I then asked:
Would you be prepared to stand up in front of your members and openly say we consciously broke the rules?
Would you as President be comfortable to have your conscious cheating, because that is what it is, on the front page of the local newspaper?
Would you be comfortable explaining to your friends and family why you are a cheat?
Is a person willing to cheat and break the rules of the competition the sort of person who should be leading a community club?
If the values and culture of your club is set by the leaders of the club, what sort of culture are you really creating at your club?
And so began one of the most enthralling workshops I have ever been involved in. To AFL Victoria I say congratulations on having the courage to tackle one of the biggest issues in community football. For what it’s worth I think the points system is great because it forces clubs to develop their juniors but it does not, in my experience at the MPNFL, have an impact on player payments. In fact MPNFL clubs told me it actually had the opposite effect, driving up the demands of middle and lower tier players.
If AFL Victoria proceed with the implementation of the salary cap, as I believe they should, it should be accompanied with an ethical leadership training program. Leaders of clubs need to be given not only the information about the rule but the skills they are going to need to tackle the very real issues that will arise when they seek to follow the rules.
If leaders are not given these skills then the path of least resistance will be taken, as it often is with poor leadership, and the player payment arms race will continue again.
Steve Pallas
Managing Director
Sports Community
I remember this article.

I am in 100% agreeance with a salary cap, AFL Vic need to supply resources to the metro and country leagues to police it though. The amount of clubs that were being investigated without any findings though has been a high number.

The points cap is a much easier method to police but that doesn't help clubs that don't have a strong junior program, the list is huge. The ones with solid junior programs: strathmore, Keilor, abers, hillside, Craigieburn, a couple of attractive clubs with proven success then a couple of clubs that the preferred choice in an area with 1 or 2 competitors. There are definitely more clubs but I am sure you are picking up what I am putting down.

Kids have a choice of Hillside or taylors lakes..... Craigieburn, roxy or Greenvale etc, etc...
 
Define blatant cheating though, Armstrong cheated in the tour de France with the use of banned substances.

What are they doing different to other EDFL clubs? Offering more money to players than another club that has probably offered them a fair bit more than $277 per game, it is a serious question mate, if you are a club after a player from another club which is completely normal, new club offers a dollar figure, current club counter offers, the players play clubs off against each other for their own financial gain. Some clubs are in a better financial position than others, you can't compare clubs against other clubs as it is apples and oranges. That goes for all divisions.

The last 2 posts referenced a portion of what I wrote and neither have answered a question, are we deflecting for a reason? Is it easier to just single out one club?

And the point of ranting about it on here? How much has it actually achieved, it is like arguing with an umpire, waste of time. Doesn't seem to be any EK people taking the bait either which is why I am wondering why it is still going, all that seemed to do was feed their egos.
Hearing they haven’t learnt from their mistakes and still offering big $$ to players over 30+.
Could take a guess and say Dennis or Stewart maybe finishing up?

Where has Bash gone. Change of coach of he hasn’t posted much. Ummm 🤔
 

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Hearing they haven’t learnt from their mistakes and still offering big $$ to players over 30+.
Could take a guess and say Dennis or Stewart maybe finishing up?

Where has Bash gone. Change of coach of he hasn’t posted much. Ummm 🤔
Stewart might finish up or at least drop down to a lower country league. He would be great at a small bush club where he could still get paid well and contribute.
Maybe injured this year but he looked pretty slow and not the threat he was once was, barely rucked in games I saw. No way Dennis finishes up, he won their B&F and would be one of the leading chances for the comp medal. Arguably BOG in a flogging last Sunday, he is a freak! I was skeptical with his age in Premier but he’s been the one positive out of Overland for ‘23.
Probably easy to keep going when you can earn what the average Joe takes home in a year for kicking a footy around.

EK will go big and try and land some big fish regardless of cost to feed the Prescoach’s ego. Problem is, any local player of decent character isn’t going there for any other reason than cash and that comes through when things get tough. Their depth is questionable at best and the only real fix for that is development which Pat is incapable of.

Deer Park/EK can play off for the Christnuffi Cup and a $1m prizemoney round.1 next year. No points, no Cap. One week only 😆.

Rumours that Digby needs to win tomorrow and improve on last seasons finish to keep his job. Harsh on the surface, but they have had a quality list the last few years.

Some at Lebanon Res saying that Allison could win the flag and still be asked to move on. Players not in love with him.

APW with a very brave appointment of a bloke that’s never coached Senior football before, has been there in the past so maybe they know what they wanted and he fits the bill. Hard to see them pushing finals next season but should stay out of relegation battle is they can add a couple more.

Avondale get Byrne back and Gleeson from Coburg Districts as assistant. Talk they are going to be active but coming from a long way back. Have had a lot of VFL aligned players in recent years, surely at some point they go back and play full time.

Douttas very active and speaking to some quality but as is the speeehump most years potential recruits are inpatient around playing finals and contending. If they can get a spine I would think they can improve a bit.

Bewick had to 2 years now and would be finals minimum for the 3rd you would imagine. No depth this season. When full strength they were capable of beating anyone, when a few out they dropped to Douttas. Would be backing in Boris to get them in the 4 next year.

Abers will not be happy missing the finals and played a lot of younger ones this season. They should be well placed to add some match winners and contend again. Marcon wouldn’t survive another season without finals. No Abers team playing on the last day, probably been a while since that happened ?

If West Coburg pull off an upset tomorrow then the other 9 clubs can take relegation of the table. They can’t afford to pay this years group let alone recruit another half dozen to compete in Premier. Dale May to go home ?
 
Stewart might finish up or at least drop down to a lower country league. He would be great at a small bush club where he could still get paid well and contribute.
Maybe injured this year but he looked pretty slow and not the threat he was once was, barely rucked in games I saw. No way Dennis finishes up, he won their B&F and would be one of the leading chances for the comp medal. Arguably BOG in a flogging last Sunday, he is a freak! I was skeptical with his age in Premier but he’s been the one positive out of Overland for ‘23.
Probably easy to keep going when you can earn what the average Joe takes home in a year for kicking a footy around.

EK will go big and try and land some big fish regardless of cost to feed the Prescoach’s ego. Problem is, any local player of decent character isn’t going there for any other reason than cash and that comes through when things get tough. Their depth is questionable at best and the only real fix for that is development which Pat is incapable of.

Deer Park/EK can play off for the Christnuffi Cup and a $1m prizemoney round.1 next year. No points, no Cap. One week only 😆.

Rumours that Digby needs to win tomorrow and improve on last seasons finish to keep his job. Harsh on the surface, but they have had a quality list the last few years.

Some at Lebanon Res saying that Allison could win the flag and still be asked to move on. Players not in love with him.

APW with a very brave appointment of a bloke that’s never coached Senior football before, has been there in the past so maybe they know what they wanted and he fits the bill. Hard to see them pushing finals next season but should stay out of relegation battle is they can add a couple more.

Avondale get Byrne back and Gleeson from Coburg Districts as assistant. Talk they are going to be active but coming from a long way back. Have had a lot of VFL aligned players in recent years, surely at some point they go back and play full time.

Douttas very active and speaking to some quality but as is the speeehump most years potential recruits are inpatient around playing finals and contending. If they can get a spine I would think they can improve a bit.

Bewick had to 2 years now and would be finals minimum for the 3rd you would imagine. No depth this season. When full strength they were capable of beating anyone, when a few out they dropped to Douttas. Would be backing in Boris to get them in the 4 next year.

Abers will not be happy missing the finals and played a lot of younger ones this season. They should be well placed to add some match winners and contend again. Marcon wouldn’t survive another season without finals. No Abers team playing on the last day, probably been a while since that happened ?

If West Coburg pull off an upset tomorrow then the other 9 clubs can take relegation of the table. They can’t afford to pay this years group let alone recruit another half dozen to compete in Premier. Dale May to go home ?
Jack ziebell a chance to play at AH if he doesn’t get an afl coaching gig. Father in law the new senior coach
 
What happened to Little? Resigned? It would have been a tough year with what he had at his disposal.

Heard he chose to leave, didn’t get sacked had a poor list at his disposal and coached them to stay up at premier division, pretty good effort all things considered.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 
Heard he chose to leave, didn’t get sacked had a poor list at his disposal and coached them to stay up at premier division, pretty good effort all things considered.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
He may have decided to leave but I think he was getting told to move on anyway. I was hearing he was sacked by the club, but they release a statement that was beneficial to both parties.
 
Hopefully not too much wind at high gate tomorrow. After watching Pacco last week they will need to bring their a game tomorrow or it could get nasty. Unfortunately for Pacco some of their big name players go missing when they play the better teams they go alright against weaker opponents but not seen against the better ones.
Strathmore to win this one
 
Congratulations Bongo on winning a premiership as a coach 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆
Maybe EK coach can ring him for some tips 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Absolutely, what a brilliant effort winning a B-grade flag with the team that were 17 wins and 1 loss last year and bottled the grand final better than my nonna bottles pasta sauce.
 

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Congratulations Bongo on winning a premiership as a coach 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆
Maybe EK coach can ring him for some tips 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Were u there?? Did u see the game??
May not as well played.. from what I saw had 1 shot on goal and kicked it into the man on the mark… that was it for the day then when the game was done esp in the last 1/4 was antagonising the opposition trying to get them to fight…
The games gone past the bloke.. he’s no good..
Struggled at EK last year… would run faster to the kebab stand than what he did at the ball…
In saying that if we r talking size and pound for pound about bongetti give me Goodwin any day of the week he was fantastic today.. imposed himself, played his role, tackled, chased.. maybe dress him up like a kebab and we actually may see something out of bongo… the bloke u are hailing as great…. Far far from it 😂😂😂
 
Were u there?? Did u see the game??
May not as well played.. from what I saw had 1 shot on goal and kicked it into the man on the mark… that was it for the day then when the game was done esp in the last 1/4 was antagonising the opposition trying to get them to fight…
The games gone past the bloke.. he’s no good..
Struggled at EK last year… would run faster to the kebab stand than what he did at the ball…
In saying that if we r talking size and pound for pound about bongetti give me Goodwin any day of the week he was fantastic today.. imposed himself, played his role, tackled, chased.. maybe dress him up like a kebab and we actually may see something out of bongo… the bloke u are hailing as great…. Far far from it 😂😂😂
snout in the trough not sure I mentioned how he played yesterday, played his role and enabled Maley to kick 6 and be BOG
I was saying as a coach at least he has won a premiership.
Anyway enjoy your off-season and look forward to the EK recruits for 2024
 
Were u there?? Did u see the game??
May not as well played.. from what I saw had 1 shot on goal and kicked it into the man on the mark… that was it for the day then when the game was done esp in the last 1/4 was antagonising the opposition trying to get them to fight…
The games gone past the bloke.. he’s no good..
Struggled at EK last year… would run faster to the kebab stand than what he did at the ball…
In saying that if we r talking size and pound for pound about bongetti give me Goodwin any day of the week he was fantastic today.. imposed himself, played his role, tackled, chased.. maybe dress him up like a kebab and we actually may see something out of bongo… the bloke u are hailing as great…. Far far from it 😂😂😂
Goodwin is well above B grade standard and a star. Bongo did coach the side so I guess it’s more about his coaching as agree he might be past premier footy but didn’t even he admit that himself that he retired when at EK.
 
Goodwin is well above B grade standard and a star. Bongo did coach the side so I guess it’s more about his coaching as agree he might be past premier footy but didn’t even he admit that himself that he retired when at EK.
Bongo - Premiership Coach, Premiership Captain, BOG in a Premiership, multiple B&F’s

EKPat - Under 16 division 4 premiership coach, has lots of money.

Compare the pair
 
Bongo - Premiership Coach, Premiership Captain, BOG in a Premiership, multiple B&F’s

EKPat - Under 16 division 4 premiership coach, has lots of money.

Compare the pair
Don’t forget Pat’s also got 4 ex EK players in team of the year in Div 1 & 2 in 2023 😂😂😂😂, the gift that keeps giving.
 
Surely these umpires need to be looked at. Just seen a Pacco player #5 get taken high and no free kick yet a few seconds later that player gets called for holding the ball.
Then a few minutes later Cavanagh kicks to a SM player who clearly marks it ( well not sure he actually marked it) over the boundary line near coaches box and it’s called a mark.

Look Strathmore are playing better I admit but over the years the decisions that go the way of sides such as keilor, strathmore, continue to bemuse me.

What is the league going to do about this competition to get a more competitive competition as it’s again Keilor vs Strathmore. I think Deer Park will definitely be a force in premier but other than that it’s the same old, same old in this competition.
 
Surely these umpires need to be looked at. Just seen a Pacco player #5 get taken high and no free kick yet a few seconds later that player gets called for holding the ball.
Then a few minutes later Cavanagh kicks to a SM player who clearly marks it ( well not sure he actually marked it) over the boundary line near coaches box and it’s called a mark.

Look Strathmore are playing better I admit but over the years the decisions that go the way of sides such as keilor, strathmore, continue to bemuse me.

What is the league going to do about this competition to get a more competitive competition as it’s again Keilor vs Strathmore. I think Deer Park will definitely be a force in premier but other than that it’s the same old, same old in this competition.
Cmon turbo don’t be a sore loser. Strathmore have been class all game couple of cheap decisions their way and the EDFL always look after Keilor and Strathmore? What about pacco constantly holding jury as he tries to link up in a play, should have got 6+ free kicks
Pacco’s best chance this year and they didn’t turn up when it mattered
Most people had Keilor out the 4 to start the year and a lot counted strathmore out during the year.
What’s your solution? EK have a red hot crack to recruit and compete and they get slammed, your club has been one of the bigger spenders over the previous years let’s not forget that although you will no doubt deny that
 
Surely these umpires need to be looked at. Just seen a Pacco player #5 get taken high and no free kick yet a few seconds later that player gets called for holding the ball.
Then a few minutes later Cavanagh kicks to a SM player who clearly marks it ( well not sure he actually marked it) over the boundary line near coaches box and it’s called a mark.

Look Strathmore are playing better I admit but over the years the decisions that go the way of sides such as keilor, strathmore, continue to bemuse me.

What is the league going to do about this competition to get a more competitive competition as it’s again Keilor vs Strathmore. I think Deer Park will definitely be a force in premier but other than that it’s the same old, same old in this competition.
Attention might be better focused on why Pacco were so undisciplined and bringing the umpires into the game. Bad loss today, didn’t give a yelp!
Digby is a proven coach and I don’t lay the blame at him but they will need a different approach. If he can’t do it will all the resources of recent seasons then can anyone outside the AFL system do it ?
Might be time to pay one less big sign on and stack the bench with quality support.
Accepted their fate way too easily today
 
Cmon turbo don’t be a sore loser. Strathmore have been class all game couple of cheap decisions their way and the EDFL always look after Keilor and Strathmore? What about pacco constantly holding jury as he tries to link up in a play, should have got 6+ free kicks
Pacco’s best chance this year and they didn’t turn up when it mattered
Most people had Keilor out the 4 to start the year and a lot counted strathmore out during the year.
What’s your solution? EK have a red hot crack to recruit and compete and they get slammed, your club has been one of the bigger spenders over the previous years let’s not forget that although you will no doubt deny that
Im not a sore loser and admit Strathmore WAY to good. You do realise Watson is held almost every contest it goes to him. Strathmore a bit to quick and that Cavanagh is a gun. Where’s he from.
I only watched the stream on & off though mate.

Not sure people wrote off Keilor or Strathmore but I didn’t think SM would go this far.
Yes Pacco no doubt spend decent $$ but please don’t tell us that Strathmore don’t spend big $$ as well and don’t get me started on Keilor. They spend huge just on McGuane let alone others.
EK spent huge $$

Greenvale and Abers probably less so than other years I reckon.

Just a quick overview mate.
 
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