Essendon and North Melbourne - who finishes higher in 2023?

[zoomba23]

Season's greetings Elmer.

Have to take issue with you. North just turned in one of the worst seasons on record. They have recruited B graders there for super boosting purposes and drafted some promising kids.

Their list is poor from drafting and trades. Clarko has a massive challenge to get them to ground zero from where they are at which is at bottom of a sink hole.

Realistically if they can get their % to the high 70s and jag one or maybe two more wins they will have done well.

The Dons are further advanced and provided Scott can keep poisonous media types like Watson and Robbo at bay, they have a chance of a small improvement. The key is getting more established players to run both ways.

Talking out of your ass mate. It'll be a disappointing season if we finish with less than 4 wins. Ideally, it'd be 5-6, but I'm no optimist. If all of our key position players stay healthy, we should be good for at least 4. You're understating the toxicity that Noble brought (some damning things have been said about him by those with connections to the club on the North board), as well as the appalling training standards that we've had since around the time Shaw dropped his bundle. Essendon finish higher, definitely, but if we do what you've set as the benchmark, it'll have been a shit season, not an ok one

 

[Red Black and Blue]

I don't buy the "Essendon has defensive issues", we finished 6th best for points against, better than Melbourne, Geelong, Bulldogs despite being pathetic as a clearance team (3rd last).


I will give you the leadership or lack thereof but as an Essendon supporter, hoping the next wave of dudes finally step up and take control of the group.

We don't have defensive half issues, we had defensive issues from the forward line and midfield. Firstly without Tippa we had no pressure, we've got him back and added to our small forwards significantly with Tex fit, plus the Davey's/Munkara. The problem that will persist this year is poor transition from the midfield. It's just too ingrained in Parish, Merrett, Stringers and Shiel's game. Need to start to bleed the kids more and develop it in the likes of Tsatas/Hobbs/Perkins/Cox before it gets ingrained, though looks to be already part of Caldwell, Martin and Durham's games.

 

[Deadly Assassin]

North Melbourne.

Better list, far superior coach.

Clarkson at North has Malthouse at Carlton written all over it.

 

[Psicosis]

Will be touch and go next year as to finishes higher.

Where I have no doubt though, is that North will rocket past Essendon in the next couple years. The upside of our u24 group is significantly better then Essendons IMO. Both clubs couldn’t have taken a more drastically different approach to drafting balanced, defensively minded mids over.

Now with a good system behind them, it’s just a matter of time.

 

[Jeremias]

Maybe he was off by a year or two, and wrong about Stephenson and Thomas, but that future North midfield is going to be very good (LDU is almost at an elite level now) and I think Phillips and Powell will thrive under Clarko

Looks good on paper but has a long way to go yet.

Massive gap at the moment between the top two and the rest.

Sheezel is probably going to end up the best player of his draft class (even better than Ashcroft) and Wardlaw, if his body holds up, is going to be a contested possie beast.

Lol, classic.

It’s probable Sheezel ends up the best player of his draft class?

Possible? Sure. Probable? Lol.

Definitely taking North's list going forwards over Essendon (which has a significantly smaller ceiling on current and exposed form)

I’m not sure you know what current or exposed form means.

There’s a significant gap between the two sides on that metric and it’s not in favor of North.

That may change in 2023 but I’m not holding my breath.

 

[faible]

Looks good on paper but has a long way to go yet.

Massive gap at the moment between the top two and the rest.


Lol, classic.

It’s probable Sheezel ends up the best player of his draft class?

Possible? Sure. Probable? Lol.


I’m not sure you know what current or exposed form means.

There’s a significant gap between the two sides on that metric and it’s not in favor of North.

That may change in 2023 but I’m not holding my breath.

A Carlton supporter defending Essendon? Hell might very well have frozen over…

 

[Yoda_]

Can someone explain to me why North Melbournes youth is apparently so much better than Essendon’s?

I’m not buying it and the current defence is “Essendons crap” is rubbish


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[eth-dog]

Can someone explain to me why North Melbournes youth is apparently so much better than Essendon’s?

I’m not buying it and the current defence is “Essendons crap” is rubbish


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We do suck tbf. It's just that North are worse.

 

[TheUnicorn]

Can someone explain to me why North Melbournes youth is apparently so much better than Essendon’s?

I’m not buying it and the current defence is “Essendons crap” is rubbish


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Being a high draft pick > Actually playing well.

 

[Rod Stroker]

Clarkson at North has Malthouse at Carlton written all over it.

So we play and win finals in Clarko's first year. I'll take it!

 

[TheBigHorne]

Clarkson at North has Malthouse at Carlton written all over it.

Elaborate.

 

[Pistol Night]

Can someone explain to me why North Melbournes youth is apparently so much better than Essendon’s?

I’m not buying it and the current defence is “Essendons crap” is rubbish


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Scott will get you guys up and going unfortunately

 

[Psicosis]

Can someone explain to me why North Melbournes youth is apparently so much better than Essendon’s?

I’m not buying it and the current defence is “Essendons crap” is rubbish


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Yoda_]

We do suck tbf. It's just that North are worse.

The chest beating in this thread from North Melbourne supporters has been staggering, but as soon as a genuine question has been posed, nothing has come of this.

 

[Irish BlueBagger]

Essendon i suppose, but i don't think it means anything in the long run really. You have negotiations with Alastair Clarkson whilst Ben Rutten is still in the job, and then you get rid of Rutten, and bring in the Scott twin who doesn't win anything as coach as the replacement! Brad Scott spent about ten years as coach at the Roos, and he couldn't even manage one top four finish.

His Roos team were destroyed in one prelim final, and were beaten comfortably enough in the other one. If i was a Bombers fan (and thankfully i'm not!), i would be pretty bewildered by the whole experience. They sack Ben Rutten just because he had one poor season, and they bring in the mediocre Scott twin as coach instead. I'm way more optimistic about North Melbournes prospects going forward.

 

[topdon]

Voss was a failed coach. Didn't stop Carlton.

Rutton had more than "one bad season". He has no tactical nous, no game plan. The change had to be made.

 

[Irish BlueBagger]

Voss was a failed coach. Didn't stop Carlton.

Rutton had more than "one bad season". He has no tactical nous, no game plan. The change had to be made.

I get the whole changing the coach thing, but having negotiations with Clarko whilst Rutten was still employed by the club. That was a very underhanded thing to do imo. I don't think Essendon as a club have moved on from the Kevin Sheedy era. It's a bit like Manchester United in the post Sir Alex Ferguson era.

 

[topdon]

I get the whole changing the coach thing, but having negotiations with Clarko whilst Rutten was still employed by the club. That was a very underhanded thing to do imo. I don't think Essendon as a club have moved on from the Kevin Sheedy era. It's a bit like Manchester United in the post Sir Alex Ferguson era.

I don't disagree with any of that. The EFC leadership needed to go after that. Rutten may have been a poor coach, but he deserved better on a human level.

 

[Yoda_]

Can someone explain to me why North Melbournes youth is apparently so much better than Essendon’s?

I’m not buying it and the current defence is “Essendons crap” is rubbish


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The Nostradamus Engimal v3 I'll even take a tidy pot shot from Wild Bill if he can come up with a reasonable reason for why North's youth is better than Essendon's

 

[The Nostradamus]

The Nostradamus Engimal v3 I'll even take a tidy pot shot from Wild Bill if he can come up with a reasonable reason for why North's youth is better than Essendon's

Lol comparing our youth to essendons isn’t even worth discussing

We are comparing our youth to the best in the comp like a Sydney or gc

Just enjoy 2023 maybe being the final year you finish above us for a long time

Just look at this midfield LDU Simpkin Wardlaw Powell Phillips Thomas. That’s dynasty like with clarko

Sheezel and sleevo rotating from the forward line to the mids also

 

[TheUnicorn]

Lol comparing our youth to essendons isn’t even worth discussing

We are comparing our youth to the best in the comp like a Sydney or gc

Just enjoy 2023 maybe being the final year you finish above us for a long time

Just look at this midfield LDU Simpkin Wardlaw Powell Phillips Thomas. That’s dynasty like with clarko

Sheezel and sleevo rotating from the forward line to the mids also

Dynasty ? I’ll give you LDU and Simpkin.

 

[Zephyr Effekt]

Dynasty ? I’ll give you LDU and Simpkin.

Also only interested in comparing their youth to the best in the competition like Sydney and GC.

Didn't Essendon beat both those teams this year.

 

[Yoda_]

Lol comparing our youth to essendons isn’t even worth discussing

We are comparing our youth to the best in the comp like a Sydney or gc

Just enjoy 2023 maybe being the final year you finish above us for a long time

Just look at this midfield LDU Simpkin Wardlaw Powell Phillips Thomas. That’s dynasty like with clarko

Sheezel and sleevo rotating from the forward line to the mids also

Why is North Melbourne's youth better?


More than happy to go toe to toe with you on this one if you can give me ample reasons why they should be considered better. At the moment you are bearting your chest because you go for them.

 

[Psicosis]

Why is North Melbourne's youth better?


More than happy to go toe to toe with you on this one if you can give me ample reasons why they should be considered better. At the moment you are bearting your chest because you go for them.

My view is:

Midfield, really a no contest. As I said earlier, Essendon have a habit of neglecting two things: Tall and accountable mids. Hobbs is the only that breaks the mould (from a defensive perspective), but I expect Wardlaw and even Phillips to be better. For me, LDU is so clearly the best young player of the two clubs, that alone leaves provides a gap, but on top of that we run far deeper considering the level of investment we’ve made in young mids.

Backline, both are pretty average tbh. McKay & Logue (although not exactly young anymore) are a KPD combination Essendon could only dream of. Both clubs need a fair bit of work in this area, hopefully Reid & Hayes come good. Whilst North need Goater to continue what he did late last year.

Forward, I have North but still an area both need to improve. Larkey & 2MP (2 years older) are pretty comparable but Larkeys age gives him the advantage in this debate. Jones looks a good prospect, North have big wraps on Comben and expect him to play 23 games next year but jury is out. Zurhaar, Thomas, Taylor, Ford all proven to kick bags at AFL level. Dons fans rate Martin (rightly so) but I expect him to move into the mid. Paul Curtis I think has the makings of one of the best small forwards in the comp. Finally there is Harry Sheezel, who is the best u18 forward prospect of either club…

 

[TheUnicorn]

My view is:

Midfield, really a no contest. As I said earlier, Essendon have a habit of neglecting two things: Tall and accountable mids. Hobbs is the only that breaks the mould (from a defensive perspective), but I expect Wardlaw and even Phillips to be better. For me, LDU is so clearly the best young player of the two clubs, that alone leaves provides a gap, but on top of that we run far deeper considering the level of investment we’ve made in young mids.

Backline, both are pretty average tbh. McKay & Logue (although not exactly young anymore) are a KPD combination Essendon could only dream of. Both clubs need a fair bit of work in this area, hopefully Reid & Hayes come good. Whilst North need Goater to continue what he did late last year.

Forward, I have North but still an area both need to improve. Larkey & 2MP (2 years older) are pretty comparable but Larkeys age gives him the advantage in this debate. Jones looks a good prospect, North have big wraps on Comben and expect him to play 23 games next year but jury is out. Zurhaar, Thomas, Taylor, Ford all proven to kick bags at AFL level. Dons fans rate Martin (rightly so) but I expect him to move into the mid. Paul Curtis I think has the makings of one of the best small forwards in the comp. Finally there is Harry Sheezel, who is the best u18 forward prospect of either club…

So u pretty much listed LDU, a bunch of guys who aren't youth and a lot of wishful thinking.