Coach Fages and the coaching group

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If we are able to find the money to bring on a Senior Assistant, Hodgey is the Man for me.
We would need to stump up though, to pry him away from the cushy Media role.
1-2 years under Fagan before taking over in 26-2027.
Fages to move to the Head Of Footy in Tassie.

Committing to a succession plan is dangerous as one can't predict how a person will cope with the stresses of being a senior coach, which are different to being a champion player and/or special comments media person.
 
Committing to a succession plan is dangerous as one can't predict how a person will cope with the stresses of being a senior coach, which are different to being a champion player and/or special comments media person.
No doubt!
 
Maybe the southern clubs who carry on about the academies could also have a think about what it does to the overall structures of the club given we need to spread the same dollars further.

I hate the messiness and speculation when coaches reach what is perceived as the beginning of the end... just seems vulgar in some way. Fages does not deserve to be speculated about and his bones picked for the next 18 months no matter what you think about him.

The idea of a succession plan seems like a fairytale way to go but have they ever really worked? Does that transition period stifle the assistant and change his thinking? Does it become more a continuation than a restart if that's what you are looking for? What does it mean if he then want's new assistants?

It's probably just me but I can't remember too many success stories...
 

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Succession plans can work but just don't put it in ink and the person in line to take the reins must coach a side ie ressies etc to a standard that suggest that they would be a capable of being a senior coach, have involvement in the media, show specific plans and strategy for when things do not go according to plan.
 
You can't draw anything definitive from that and I agree with Dlanod that Fagan has earnt the right to see out his contract at least but if we continue the way we're going this year and we get more of the same next year then it's only reasonable to look for a change in approach.

I'm really hoping in the off season that we can bring in someone whom Fagan can mentor for the next era . That means a Chris Scott type as an example would not be considered. You'd like someone younger with drive ambition and the smarts. They're not easy to find , but Roos did it at the Swans ,even after they managed extreme success and also at Melbourne.
I agree with all of this. I'm hoping for Daniel Giansiracusa personally. He's been an assistant at two clubs (Bulldogs and Essendon), he's won a flag, been named assistant coach of the year and coached a VFL side. I'm sure he's played a part in Essendon's big rise this year too. And he's clearly hungry for a senior role.

 
Maybe the southern clubs who carry on about the academies could also have a think about what it does to the overall structures of the club given we need to spread the same dollars further.

I hate the messiness and speculation when coaches reach what is perceived as the beginning of the end... just seems vulgar in some way. Fages does not deserve to be speculated about and his bones picked for the next 18 months no matter what you think about him.

The idea of a succession plan seems like a fairytale way to go but have they ever really worked? Does that transition period stifle the assistant and change his thinking? Does it become more a continuation than a restart if that's what you are looking for? What does it mean if he then want's new assistants?

It's probably just me but I can't remember too many success stories...
As far as I’m aware, Academy funding is outside the soft cap, so to the Academy coaching salaries.

We still need to fund the academy ourselves, but it shouldn’t be factored in to the running of the senior club.
 
JR's article adds nothing to what is a common theme here, just spreads the word to a wider audience.

That said, I am in full agreement with the sentiment. Would love to see a Gia here next year.
 
Do you seriously behove they aren't practising and trying to fix?

I mean, it's not like they are professionals who have high expectations of themselves right? They only do what the coach says and never say hey I want to improve any fact of their game.

Sheesh.
Just one thing on these "high expectations". We often see players who hit the post or just miss to the left or right and you can see the look on their face: "gee, so close" or "that was unlucky".

No, that was not close, you weren't unlucky. You've missed your target by more than 3 metres. Your target, as a professional, is not the goal mouth. Your target is the centre of the goals. The "black dot", to borrow from our other oval ball codes.

Practice does not make perfect. Perfect practice makes perfect.
 
Maybe the southern clubs who carry on about the academies could also have a think about what it does to the overall structures of the club given we need to spread the same dollars further.

I hate the messiness and speculation when coaches reach what is perceived as the beginning of the end... just seems vulgar in some way. Fages does not deserve to be speculated about and his bones picked for the next 18 months no matter what you think about him.

The idea of a succession plan seems like a fairytale way to go but have they ever really worked? Does that transition period stifle the assistant and change his thinking? Does it become more a continuation than a restart if that's what you are looking for? What does it mean if he then want's new assistants?

It's probably just me but I can't remember too many success stories...
The two would be Roos to Longmire and Roos to Goodwin. In both instances, it was essentially led by Roos, who knew he was leaving, was comfortable with that, and by the end of his tenures he was essentially coaching his understudy, who was in turn coaching the team.

Contrast that with Malthouse, Worsfold and Clarkson, none of whom wanted to leave, and it becomes pretty clear that the success of any succession plan is really dependent on the attitude of the outgoing coach.
 
The players need to take more responsiblity. We have a lengthy injury list. Our senior players are playing poorly. Our coach is getting quite old, do we need a succession plan? A freshen up at the coaching level isn't a bad thing. Fagan deserves time to fix things.

All of these facts are true in my eyes. The worst thing the club could do though is be hasty and support a toxic mindset of dumping a coach because of a hiccup. Fagan has earned the right to to right the ship (Pun intended). In saying that, I've said before in this thread that I think the best thing the club can do is begin the process of a succession plan being implemented.

This is not a case of "SACK HINKLEYY!11!!" after a decade of failures where the majority of the fanbase feels disdain for their coach. We're in uncharted waters for the first time in Fages' tenure. The first real bump in the road, it's quite a big bump though. It's testing our love & faith for a man who helped take us out of the mire so I'm not surprised to see two sides of the conversation clashing in here. Let's not forget his accomplishments but we cannot hold onto the past to move forward.

Just as we analyse the players and ask the question, so we should to the coach and the rest of the club. Over to you Fages, fix this mess.
IMO we cannot make the 8, and whilst it is a results driven business, I believe Fages should see out his 2025 contract, but there are caveats;
 
Not sure of his name, but one of the reporters on the Foxtel show "The Midweek Tackle" had quite a bit to say about the talk from, particularly David King, of getting rid of Fagan for Chris Scott.

He was critical of all talk of it and then put up on the screen statistics for both over the time Fagan has been our coach...wins, losses etc

They were identical.

He finished by saying a bit of deeper research would've found those statistics..

I think it's time to back Chris Fagan, get off his back and stop adding to the pressure he's already under. He deserves that from us at the very least.

We are not going to get a better all round coach. Imo he will sort things out, players will come back from injury and we're in the game again....just work on the goal kicking, again imo, that's the main problem. Had the majority of the points kicked been goals, this discussion probably wouldn't be happening.

Sometimes certain expectations can be way too high when things get difficult.
Just King again seeking a headline.
 
The two would be Roos to Longmire and Roos to Goodwin. In both instances, it was essentially led by Roos, who knew he was leaving, was comfortable with that, and by the end of his tenures he was essentially coaching his understudy, who was in turn coaching the team.

Contrast that with Malthouse, Worsfold and Clarkson, none of whom wanted to leave, and it becomes pretty clear that the success of any succession plan is really dependent on the attitude of the outgoing coach.
Exactly right. If the outgoing coach isn't actively and happily involved it's not a succession process it's a replacement/sacking process.
 

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The two would be Roos to Longmire and Roos to Goodwin. In both instances, it was essentially led by Roos, who knew he was leaving, was comfortable with that, and by the end of his tenures he was essentially coaching his understudy, who was in turn coaching the team.

Contrast that with Malthouse, Worsfold and Clarkson, none of whom wanted to leave, and it becomes pretty clear that the success of any succession plan is really dependent on the attitude of the outgoing coach.
And I want to say they tried it at Adelaide as well?? :think:

Not sure Roos to Goodwin was really a success... not in the sense that the team was stable, settled and successful... not if memory serves. It took Goodwin a while to get it rolling and I thought his first years were a bit tumultuous?

If we were to try and do this it would still be in our "window" I would think... I'm not sure the 12 months leading into the actual changeover would be either productive or successful with one coach looking over his shoulder and the other biting his tongue.

For me it needs the shortest lead time and just to not be a blood bath or trial by media.
 
IMO Chris Fagan would be the kind of person that would be open to a succession plan although I am not a fan of it.

When a new coach comes in we need someone who has been an assistant coach for a good period of time, preferably at at least a couple of clubs and is ready to get to it from the get go.
 
And I want to say they tried it at Adelaide as well?? :think:

Not sure Roos to Goodwin was really a success... not in the sense that the team was stable, settled and successful... not if memory serves. It took Goodwin a while to get it rolling and I thought his first years were a bit tumultuous?

If we were to try and do this it would still be in our "window" I would think... I'm not sure the 12 months leading into the actual changeover would be either productive or successful with one coach looking over his shoulder and the other biting his tongue.

For me it needs the shortest lead time and just to not be a blood bath or trial by media.
Most successful businesses have a succession plan that sometime evolves over years. Roos mentored Longmire for a long time and Goodwin for at least 2 years .Melbourne was a basket case when Roos took over and hadn't won a flag since 1964.
They improved the first year under Goodwin and finished 5th ,1st and 2nd within the next 6 years so you'd have to say that was an outstanding success.

Malthouse and Buckley hated each other and Woosha was Woosha and Clarko was Clarko so none of those were ever going to work
 
Just wonder if it's what's best for the team in those handover years if the coach has to spend time getting the new coach ready

Would rather a clean break. Especially if we're going after a premiership next year
That would mean getting someone who doesn't need mentoring.

i.e. they've been mentored or successful at other clubs.
 
Just wonder if it's what's best for the team in those handover years if the coach has to spend time getting the new coach ready

Would rather a clean break. Especially if we're going after a premiership next year
And thinking that through further someone who believes we maybe haven't played to our capacity and has a plan to improve the team and individual players.

I just can't see that happening before 2026 because the club would never not honour Fagan's contract and I don't think Fagan is the type to walk away.
 
That would mean getting someone who doesn't need mentoring.

i.e. they've been mentored or successful at other clubs.

So what you're after is an assistant that's ready to step up as a senior coach?

Again though if Fagan knows its his last season then is he really the best option

If he goes to Swanny and says I'm not coaching in 2026 and we can attract someone to be his replacement we should just pull the trigger
 
So what you're after is an assistant that's ready to step up as a senior coach?

Again though if Fagan knows its his last season then is he really the best option

If he goes to Swanny and says I'm not coaching in 2026 and we can attract someone to be his replacement we should just pull the trigger
To get back to the original point I would much prefer someone who's ready to step up as Senior coach.

Your last point is valid. But if it's between not getting hold of someone and having them as Senior Assistant for a year in an amicable arrangement I'd take the latter

But I don't see it happening unless Fagan has too much on his plate or other opportunities and steps aside. Which is highly unlikely unless something arises that we're not aware of.

Too many hypotheticals now that we're down to discussing it.

And maybe the club wants to keep Fagan on beyond 2025. Who knows.
 
To get back to the original point I would much prefer someone who's ready to step up as Senior coach.

Your last point is valid. But if it's between not getting hold of someone and having them as Senior Assistant for a year in an amicable arrangement I'd take the latter

But I don't see it happening unless Fagan has too much on his plate or other opportunities and steps aside. Which is highly unlikely unless something arises that we're not aware of.

Too many hypotheticals now that we're down to discussing it.

And maybe the club wants to keep Fagan on beyond 2025. Who knows.
Bolded.
A possible Federal Court case. However, i hope the Rioli camp decide not to proceed.
Tasmania team date is apparently 2028.
So, the AFL could appoint Fagan in an ambassador/admin role in 2026 then interim coach from 2027.
There will be a lot to do in setting up a new AFL club.
 
Bolded.
A possible Federal Court case. However, i hope the Rioli camp decide not to proceed.
Tasmania team date is apparently 2028.
So, the AFL could appoint Fagan in an ambassador/admin role in 2026 then interim coach from 2027.
There will be a lot to do in setting up a new AFL club.
On the cards unless Fagan and our club are fully committed to each other for the foreseeable future.

At this point there's probably too many moveable issues going on in the background ,plus midway through a season , the off season might sort it.
 
And I want to say they tried it at Adelaide as well?? :think:

Not sure Roos to Goodwin was really a success... not in the sense that the team was stable, settled and successful... not if memory serves. It took Goodwin a while to get it rolling and I thought his first years were a bit tumultuous?

If we were to try and do this it would still be in our "window" I would think... I'm not sure the 12 months leading into the actual changeover would be either productive or successful with one coach looking over his shoulder and the other biting his tongue.

For me it needs the shortest lead time and just to not be a blood bath or trial by media.
Hard to see how Roos to Goodwin could not be considered a success.

Roos' last year at Melbourne was 2016, when they finished 11th with a 10-12 record and 97.6%. It was their best performance since they last made finals, which was in 2006.

Then in Goodwin's first year, 2017, they went 12-10, 105.2%, finished 9th and missed finals by a p00fteenth.

Then in 2018, they improved to 14-8, their first finals berth in 12 years, 131.4%, won 2 finals.

That to me is an unqualified success whichever way you look at it. Even if they hadn't won the 2021 flag and competed at the pointy end every year ever since, the consistent uptick from 2014 (when Roos took over) to 2018 is pretty emphatic I'm sure you'd agree.
 
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Stewart Dew has joined the coaching staff in a part time role working 1 day a week in skill development

He's back! Ex Suns coach Stuart Dew returns to club land - https://www.afl.com.au/news/1144789
 

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Coach Fages and the coaching group

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