List Mgmt. Father / Son / Daughter Selections

[Apsaalooke]

Would champion have made a difference in 93 he was a very very good player

Watched him a bit at Brisbane with this in mind and wasn't overly regretful we didn't get him to be honest. Good but not great defender who never lived up to his surname. Did a great Jimmy Barnes impersonation on the Footy Show though and actually sang rather than the crap miming they do now.

What would have made a difference was no D Jarman, we would have had a flag in 93 with him I think.

 

[Pugsley]

Has he nominated Hawthorn yet ?

 

[Apsaalooke]

If Jarman goes 3rd round, no discount given for farther/son ......just a normal 3rd round draft pick

So presumably we would have to use pick 50ish on him if we nominate whereas if we don't we have the option of him or someone better at that pick (if no-one takes him before then). Hawthorn finished one place above us so will have a later pick in each round at this stage. Getting complicated here.

 

[Apsaalooke]

Has he nominated Hawthorn yet ?

No he has until the end of the month

 

[WaynesWorld19]

So presumably we would have to use pick 50ish on him if we nominate whereas if we don't we have the option of him or someone better at that pick (if no-one takes him before then). Hawthorn finished one place above us so will have a later pick in each round at this stage. Getting complicated here.

Correct ......if a 3rd round, whichever club he nominates ATS he'll go 3rd round in the 50's .....unless a club challenges by offering a 2nd round pick

Some suggestion Hawthorn and Adelaide playing games around Jarman to get as cheap as possible ....not sure the benefit of any games in this case?

 

[madstar]

Have heard that the Crows only had him out to training once whereas Hawks have flown him over 4 times to talk to him etc. Maybe what Andrew meant by unprofessional.

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

 

[Bicks]

If Jarman goes 3rd round, no discount given for farther/son ......just a normal 3rd round draft pick

That would only apply if neither club nominate him??

 

[marty36]

That would only apply if neither club nominate him??

Here's a question we come to our 2nd pick and we actually have one due to trading, we need to use it as another club has nominated Jarman, cox is still available, who would you take Jarman or cox

 

[Bicks]

Here's a question we come to our 2nd pick and we actually have one due to trading, we need to use it as another club has nominated Jarman, cox is still available, who would you take Jarman or cox

Now that's a hard one Marty given Brennan Cox has shown he is quite effective both in defence and up forward and at around 194cm is a nice size for AFL, probably that high in the draft Cox is probably the better "value"?

 

[WaynesWorld19]

That would only apply if neither club nominate him??

Bicks, as i understand it, there's no 20% discount for father/son in the 3rd round

 

[Wouldbetackler]

Worked OK for Dad

You really think he will come back though?

 

[Sam_Malone]

According to trade radio Darren said it's better for Ben's career to choose hawthorn and then move back to south Australia in a few years if that's what he wants. I'm not what his reasons would be for thinking that though.

Because if we draft "darren Jarman" son, everyone will have enormous expectations for him to be the second coming of Darren.

However, if he goes to the Hawks, he will have all the pressure removed and he can just play footy.

 

[marty36]

Now that's a hard one Marty given Brennan Cox has shown he is quite effective both in defence and up forward and at around 194cm is a nice size for AFL, probably that high in the draft Cox is probably the better "value"?

I agree I'm not caught up in Jarman as there seem to be a lot better players in the draft whether they are available and whether we are forced to bid early is the question

I hope they hold their nerve

 

[Elite Crow]

Can read this two ways because the club would have formed an opinion of him by now:

A) they don't think he's good enough and laying the groundwork now to justify their position.
B) when they select him they want it to be known it was because of his ability and not his name

I'm hoping behind closed doors we are telling Ben it's the latter with a lot of love and a Roo headlock

 

[Bicks]

Can read this two ways because the club would have formed an opinion of him by now:

A) they don't think he's good enough and laying the groundwork now to justify their position.
B) when they select him they want it to be known it was because of his ability and not his name

I'm hoping behind closed doors we are telling Ben it's the latter with a lot of love and a Roo headlock

Mark Ricciuto has suggested Adelaide will try and lock in Ben Jarman as a father-son pick - if he's good enough.


Jarman is eligible to play for both Adelaide and Hawthorn as a father-son pick via his father Darren, and starred in the skills tests at the draft combine on Friday.

But Roo told Triple M's Dead Set Legends his surname will have nothing to do with it.

"If he's the player to pick, if he's the right player for the club, they'll get him," he said.

"They're not just going to pick him up because he's Darren Jarman's son - if he's a great player or he's going to be a good player, they'll pick him up.

"That's the way recruiting works, so we'll back in our recruiters and just give us some time and see what happens."

Ricciuto said Adelaide's track record at the draft suggested they were more than capable of making the right call.

"They haven't stuffed up too many recruits, lately, the Crows," he said. "They've been pretty good.

"You've got to back them in, they're the ones watching every player, every week, all of the time."

 

[tappy43]

Dean Gore and Keenan Ramsey both smashed it in the combine kicking tests.

Ramsey one of only two who got 100% for kicking in 2014 combine. Excellent foot and hand disposal in SANFL with limited opportunities.

 

[GrommoT]

Bicks, as i understand it, there's no 20% discount for father/son in the 3rd round

Err... no quite - unless they've radically changed the rules from last year, THIS AFL PDF (states on page 8):

• In the first round, a maximum discount of 20% will be applied
• The discount will then be fixed at 197 points (the discount for pick 18).

So while technically there's no 20% discount, it's actually a relatively larger discount for the 3rd round on.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Err... no quite - unless they've radically changed the rules from last year, THIS AFL PDF (states on page 8):

• In the first round, a maximum discount of 20% will be applied
• The discount will then be fixed at 197 points (the discount for pick 18).

So while technically there's no 20% discount, it's actually a relatively larger discount for the 3rd round on.

Sorry, i found this a tad confusing .......so this clarifies the situation in that 197 points is equivalent to pick 56 ......so it's 20% discount or 197 points, whichever is greater

The bidding system was further refined in 2015. Under the current system:[9]

• Each draft pick is assigned a value (with No. 1 starting at 3000 points, declining exponentially until No. 74 which has no value), which is regressed from historical player salary data.
• During the draft, any club may bid for a father-son eligible player with any draft pick.
• The father's club, if it wishes to select the son, must then use its next one or more draft picks until the total points value of the surrendered picks adds up to the value of the draft pick used by the bidding, less a discount – which is either 20% of the bid value or 197 points (equivalent to pick No. 56), whichever is greater. Any points left over after reaching the bid value result in the draft pick being shuffled down the order.
• The club which originally made the bid then has the next selection in the draft.

 

[GrommoT]

Sorry, i found this a tad confusing .......so this clarifies the situation in that 197 points is equivalent to pick 56 ......so it's 20% discount or 197 points, whichever is greater

Yeah, I think your wiki link is consistent with the PDF I linked.

20% of pick 18 (985 points) is 197 points and 197 is also about the value of pick 56 (194).

So that 197 point discount is like the floor (minimum) value a nominated club can use for matching bids from other clubs.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Yeah, I think your wiki link is consistent with the PDF I linked.

20% of pick 18 (985 points) is 197 points and 197 is also about the value of pick 56 (194).

So that 197 point discount is like the floor (minimum) value a nominated club can use for matching bids from other clubs.

Think this is the confusion .....it's 20% discount off pick 18 (985 points) is actually 788 points required if Jarman were bid on at pick 18

 

[GrommoT]

Think this is the confusion .....it's 20% discount off pick 18 (985 points) is actually 788 points required if Jarman were bid on at pick 18

Yes ... but how likely is a team going to bid for BJ with pick 18?


[I'm working on an example for a post reply using pick 27 bid ... stand by]

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Yes ... but how likely is a team going to bid for BJ with pick 18?


[I'm working on an example for a post reply using pick 27 bid ... stand by]

I was just clarifying your post

 

[GrommoT]

If getting Ben Jarman makes it harder to acquire Jackson Edwards it would be a big pass from me.
Edwards looks like he will be something special IMO. Having seen him play a few games.

I wondered whether they were too similar physical types (ie. short!) so maybe the Club might not been keen to have too many shorties on their list but it seems Edwards is already at 184cm (and probably growing) so that's probably no an issue.

To see if AFC will have problems getting the points to match a bid given our current draft picks, let's say:
* BJ nominates us and AFC is keen to draft BJ
* a club with mid-2nd round pick 27 (703 points) bids on BJ
* then AFC get a 197 point discount and needs 506 points to match and draft BJ
* as our pick after our 13 is pick 49 - that's 287 points
* we'd need to add pick 67 (69 points)
* our next picks 85 & 103 are worth no points
* at this point we're still 150 points short of matching the pick 27 bid

The F-S draft rules PDF I posted earlier also says we can carry the 150 points to the 2017 draft and get deducted from our first pick in 2017.

Also Hawks currently have 2nd round pick 32 worth 584 ( -197 = 387 ) and we'd carry over 31 points deficit to 2017 draft.

What does this mean? Without trading in any more picks, AFC could match a mid-2nd round bid from another club but it means our picks 67, 85 & 103 get pushed to the end of the draft order - we probably won't draft anyone unless we have an extremely well hidden smoky somewhere.

I think we can still use those shunted bids to upgrade our rookies.

So if we don't trade in any more draft picks, for AFC it will be a choice of BJ or a couple of other draft picks ... so Rooch is kind of right, I guess (yuk! pffft!)


Also... if there are bids on Academy draft prospects and get matched at earlier picks, it may help our cause to draft BJ to some degree.

 

[GrommoT]

Nice little bit of tid from Scouting notes: SANFL U17 futures & Reserves GF (September 26, 2016)

#16 Jackson Edwards– One of Adelaide’s few father-son prospects, Edwards was prolific today. The skinny Glenelg midfielder was in everything today for the Blues as he cut up the opposition with his great vision and his damaging kick. He has an extremely damaging right leg which he uses to hit pin point passes to players in dangerous spots. He used his hands extremely well in congestion often finding the open man. His kicking though damaging can be inconsistent but can improve under an elite system. The son of Tyson has all the skill and footy smarts of his old man which should have Crows fans excited.

 

[Firewalker]

Nice little bit of tid from Scouting notes: SANFL U17 futures & Reserves GF (September 26, 2016)

#16 Jackson Edwards– One of Adelaide’s few father-son prospects, Edwards was prolific today. The skinny Glenelg midfielder was in everything today for the Blues as he cut up the opposition with his great vision and his damaging kick. He has an extremely damaging right leg which he uses to hit pin point passes to players in dangerous spots. He used his hands extremely well in congestion often finding the open man. His kicking though damaging can be inconsistent but can improve under an elite system. The son of Tyson has all the skill and footy smarts of his old man which should have Crows fans excited.

For mine I reckon we'd be keen to get our 1st rounder for 2017 involved in a trade either this year or next year knowing that we'd have Edwards (who already looks 1st round quality) coming through to us