Tank won’t be an issue.
Finding room to fit Prior, Ah Chee, Berry and McCluggage in the midfield, along with Neale and Ashcroft will be an issue.
First 22 in 2023
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Finding room to fit Prior, Ah Chee, Berry and McCluggage in the midfield, along with Neale and Ashcroft will be an issue.
I think I'd go Berry, Ashcroft and Prior rotating on the wing. Ah Chee as the seventh forward or defender. Neale and McCluggage to continue their midfield time, with hopefully another midfielder to help out (or Robertson if he stays).
Something like:
B: Payne Adams Starcevich
HB: Coleman Andrews Answerth
C: Berry Neale Ashcroft
HF: Rayner Hipwood Bailey
F: McCarthy Daniher Cameron
R: McInerney McCluggage Robertson
I: Prior Ah Chee Fort Wilmot/Lohmann
Realistically, it's unlikely all of Zorko, Rich and Lyons will be out of the side, but I do think we've moved passed them based on their performance this year.
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I think not playing Zorko, Rich and Lyons would be an admission that winning isn't our number 1 focus next year
I agree, which is why I don't think realistically it'll happen. It would take Zorko and Rich retiring/being injured for them not to be in the side round 1.
Lyons I'm not as sure about as his drop off this year has been so dramatic that I'm not sure where his performance level will be at next season.
mattsmob
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Is it? Lyons has made us worse this season and the other two have significantly contributed to our team defence behind very poor. If you replace those 3 with guys that can physically make it to the right position it’ll make a pretty big positive difference.
Dev Robertson for Lyons, one of Wilmot/Madden/Michael for Richy, Will Ashcroft for Zorks.
Josh Dunkley would be handy as well.
Dalions
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Or maybe an admission that they are passed it and the game has moved beyond them.
We have some weaknesses / players struggling to hang on. But players knocking on the door.
Backline: Gardiner - Lester or Payne to possibly replace
Rich / Answerth - Wilmot looks ready. I like the idea of Madden but still panics in the 2s. Michael looked okay. Ah Chee has to play somewhere so backline an option. Mindset the biggest change - stop zoning off, get more desperate.
Midfield: Mathieson / Lyons / Zorko all vulnerable. Robertson, Ashcroft both should play. Tunstill looks promising in 2s. Fletcher a maybe. Dunkley would be a huge boost. Prior should be first 22.
Forwards - mcstay should go. Lohmann looks very promising. Fort, Fullarton serviceable. Henry Smith has really progressed this year and might go past them all.
We are at a bit of a crossroads because some of our stars from past years are falling away in Rich, Zorko, Lyons and Robinson. McStay is leaving. It’s hard to replace all of them with the same quality, but we could actually become a better team if we address some of our weaknesses.
We clearly have an issue with run and spread. Replace Lyons, Matho and Rich from Friday’s team with Wilmot, Robertson and Ashcroft and we go a long way to fixing that. Wilmot has never played so compared to Rich will be some costly moments. But our defence could hardly leak any more than it does!
We are so reliant on kicking it out of defence; again Wilmot provides a different option or run.
Our 3 key forwards have been the pillar of our gameplan. Does it work well in finals? I think in particular we have ended up with 3 enigmatic left-footers. They have great periods and games. But they all go missing. What about a big solid forward whose main ability is not being outmarked? Could be Oscar sent back there. Or Henry Smith. Absolute lump of a lad.
There is every chance with 5-6 changes we lack a bit of cohesion and it costs us a game or two. Could a year of going slightly backwards.
But younger players also have a way of bringing instant energy. Look at Collingwood.
Regardless there is no way the likes of Lyons and Rich are going to play in a flag next year in my view.
So let’s be proactive. We don’t give away 2023. But we figure out our most likely flag side in 2024, and start getting it into place now.
Backline: Gardiner - Lester or Payne to possibly replace
Rich / Answerth - Wilmot looks ready. I like the idea of Madden but still panics in the 2s. Michael looked okay. Ah Chee has to play somewhere so backline an option. Mindset the biggest change - stop zoning off, get more desperate.
Midfield: Mathieson / Lyons / Zorko all vulnerable. Robertson, Ashcroft both should play. Tunstill looks promising in 2s. Fletcher a maybe. Dunkley would be a huge boost. Prior should be first 22.
Forwards - mcstay should go. Lohmann looks very promising. Fort, Fullarton serviceable. Henry Smith has really progressed this year and might go past them all.
We are at a bit of a crossroads because some of our stars from past years are falling away in Rich, Zorko, Lyons and Robinson. McStay is leaving. It’s hard to replace all of them with the same quality, but we could actually become a better team if we address some of our weaknesses.
We clearly have an issue with run and spread. Replace Lyons, Matho and Rich from Friday’s team with Wilmot, Robertson and Ashcroft and we go a long way to fixing that. Wilmot has never played so compared to Rich will be some costly moments. But our defence could hardly leak any more than it does!
We are so reliant on kicking it out of defence; again Wilmot provides a different option or run.
Our 3 key forwards have been the pillar of our gameplan. Does it work well in finals? I think in particular we have ended up with 3 enigmatic left-footers. They have great periods and games. But they all go missing. What about a big solid forward whose main ability is not being outmarked? Could be Oscar sent back there. Or Henry Smith. Absolute lump of a lad.
There is every chance with 5-6 changes we lack a bit of cohesion and it costs us a game or two. Could a year of going slightly backwards.
But younger players also have a way of bringing instant energy. Look at Collingwood.
Regardless there is no way the likes of Lyons and Rich are going to play in a flag next year in my view.
So let’s be proactive. We don’t give away 2023. But we figure out our most likely flag side in 2024, and start getting it into place now.
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- May 3, 2015
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Yes. What else would It be?
Nunez
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Ashcroft would absolutely play half back or half forward. Think he'll get time around the ball but we won't want to risk injury.
Dev and Wilmot in makes sense with me. I think we need to build a team and gameplan without Zorko, JL and Rich in mind. Time to move on from them.
- Aug 21, 2013
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we all thought they move on from Robbo this year.. Fagan keeps going back to him.
I cannot see him move on from Lyons, Zorko or Rich.
We do not blood as many younger guys. You only get a game when one of the favs injured then back to the VFL
Even though Matho was banging the door down, we could of gone for Dev.
Same VFL we have 5 ruck forwards all taking each others game time.
I cannot see him move on from Lyons, Zorko or Rich.
We do not blood as many younger guys. You only get a game when one of the favs injured then back to the VFL
Even though Matho was banging the door down, we could of gone for Dev.
Same VFL we have 5 ruck forwards all taking each others game time.
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B Payne Adams Coleman
HB Madden Andrews Wilmot
C Berry Robertson McCluggage
HF Rayner Hipwood Bailey
F McCarthy Daniher Cameron
R McInerney Neale Starcevich
I Lane Ah Chee Ashcroft Prior
S Lohmann
Big change up obviously with an injection of youth. Move Starcevich into the midfield alongside Dev to add some grunt, contested ball winning and a defensive edge. Rayner to spend more time on ball, Ashcroft and McCluggage to rotate through the midfield and on the wing. Berry and Prior to spend time off the wing with Ah Chee playing off half back and wing. Madden to replace Answerth, additional speed to cover players like Kosi Pickett and Shai Bolton. Wilmot can provide plenty of run out of the backline but I also rate his defensive work and believe he can play the Starcevich lockdown role.
Kalin Lane to back up in the ruck and O to spend time forward. Lohmann to play plenty of games right on the edge of the 22.
Massive change with regulars such as Zorko, Rich, Lyons, Robinson, McStay and Gardiner out plus Mathieson being overtaken by Dev/Ashcroft.
Potential for a best 22 trade in to slot in somewhere as well. I like the balance of this side a lot better than our current line up. I like the idea of playing two genuine rucks, Fort probably starts over Lane but hoping Lane pushes for senior games next season. I'd say we will drop off a little replacing experienced veterans with younger prospects such as Lane, Madden, Wilmot, Ashcroft and Lohmann, however, it won't take us long to move back up, particularly if those younger guys reach their potential, plus I can see Rayner, Payne and Bailey really hitting their straps next season and we still have the likes of Neale, Cameron, Daniher, Andrews, Adams, McInerney ect. in their prime.
Been a disappointing season(Albeit not yet over), however, seeing the above team live at the Gabba next season would excite me greatly, we still have a really promising young squad with the potential to play finals and compete for premierships for many years to come. If we were to add in a Dunkley to the above side to off set the loss of Zorko/Lyons we may not fall at all and can complete a mini reset on the run!
If Wilmot and Lohmann can emulate Starcevich and Bailey(In their own unique playing styles of course but playing similar roles) and Ashcroft can have a similar rise to McCluggage's start to his career we are well and truly on for future success!
Edit: Should mention depth including Lester, Answerth, Fort, Cockatoo, Mathieson, Fullarton, B.Coleman, Lyons, Gardiner., Carter. Some real experienced depth in that list to compliment our younger guys.
HB Madden Andrews Wilmot
C Berry Robertson McCluggage
HF Rayner Hipwood Bailey
F McCarthy Daniher Cameron
R McInerney Neale Starcevich
I Lane Ah Chee Ashcroft Prior
S Lohmann
Big change up obviously with an injection of youth. Move Starcevich into the midfield alongside Dev to add some grunt, contested ball winning and a defensive edge. Rayner to spend more time on ball, Ashcroft and McCluggage to rotate through the midfield and on the wing. Berry and Prior to spend time off the wing with Ah Chee playing off half back and wing. Madden to replace Answerth, additional speed to cover players like Kosi Pickett and Shai Bolton. Wilmot can provide plenty of run out of the backline but I also rate his defensive work and believe he can play the Starcevich lockdown role.
Kalin Lane to back up in the ruck and O to spend time forward. Lohmann to play plenty of games right on the edge of the 22.
Massive change with regulars such as Zorko, Rich, Lyons, Robinson, McStay and Gardiner out plus Mathieson being overtaken by Dev/Ashcroft.
Potential for a best 22 trade in to slot in somewhere as well. I like the balance of this side a lot better than our current line up. I like the idea of playing two genuine rucks, Fort probably starts over Lane but hoping Lane pushes for senior games next season. I'd say we will drop off a little replacing experienced veterans with younger prospects such as Lane, Madden, Wilmot, Ashcroft and Lohmann, however, it won't take us long to move back up, particularly if those younger guys reach their potential, plus I can see Rayner, Payne and Bailey really hitting their straps next season and we still have the likes of Neale, Cameron, Daniher, Andrews, Adams, McInerney ect. in their prime.
Been a disappointing season(Albeit not yet over), however, seeing the above team live at the Gabba next season would excite me greatly, we still have a really promising young squad with the potential to play finals and compete for premierships for many years to come. If we were to add in a Dunkley to the above side to off set the loss of Zorko/Lyons we may not fall at all and can complete a mini reset on the run!
If Wilmot and Lohmann can emulate Starcevich and Bailey(In their own unique playing styles of course but playing similar roles) and Ashcroft can have a similar rise to McCluggage's start to his career we are well and truly on for future success!
Edit: Should mention depth including Lester, Answerth, Fort, Cockatoo, Mathieson, Fullarton, B.Coleman, Lyons, Gardiner., Carter. Some real experienced depth in that list to compliment our younger guys.
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Lane is a long way off being a consistent contributor at AFL level with very little upside IMO
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This is a big fork in the road moment this off season.
Do we go younger and regenerate on the run?
Positives - start a process for the next 5 years, add speed, keep young guys getting games.
Negatives - won’t win a flag or make top 4, could still be a finals team.
Do we roll the dice on this line up one more time for Fagans last season of his current contract?
Positives - we might get a good year out of sone older guys, might find sone form, might get lucky a make a prelim.
Negatives - if it backfires another wasted year, where young guys don’t get a run.
I think Fagan will want to go again, no way is he going to play Lyons in the ressies, Rich and Zorko will get another year if they are keen - grounds arnt really there to retire them.
We won’t put anyone on the trade table.
What we need?
Another established mid, same issue as last year, our midfield sucks and we need mature help. Dunkley perfect but unlikely.
KPP young talent, what young keys bar Fullerton and Panye do we have?
What I would like to do?
I think I want to regenerate on the run, tough calls would need to be made but we need a shake up.
Starc, Andrews, Payne
Coleman, Adams, Bailey
Prior, Neale, Berry
Rayner daniher McCarthy
Cameron Fort, Hipwood
mcinerney, mccluggage, Ashcroft, NEW MID
Ahchee, wilmot, Lohmann, Robertson
Tough chats - dizz, rich, Zorko,
Depth matho (get he is passionate but not good enough at the level), answerth (not showing enough), the rest
Do we go younger and regenerate on the run?
Positives - start a process for the next 5 years, add speed, keep young guys getting games.
Negatives - won’t win a flag or make top 4, could still be a finals team.
Do we roll the dice on this line up one more time for Fagans last season of his current contract?
Positives - we might get a good year out of sone older guys, might find sone form, might get lucky a make a prelim.
Negatives - if it backfires another wasted year, where young guys don’t get a run.
I think Fagan will want to go again, no way is he going to play Lyons in the ressies, Rich and Zorko will get another year if they are keen - grounds arnt really there to retire them.
We won’t put anyone on the trade table.
What we need?
Another established mid, same issue as last year, our midfield sucks and we need mature help. Dunkley perfect but unlikely.
KPP young talent, what young keys bar Fullerton and Panye do we have?
What I would like to do?
I think I want to regenerate on the run, tough calls would need to be made but we need a shake up.
Starc, Andrews, Payne
Coleman, Adams, Bailey
Prior, Neale, Berry
Rayner daniher McCarthy
Cameron Fort, Hipwood
mcinerney, mccluggage, Ashcroft, NEW MID
Ahchee, wilmot, Lohmann, Robertson
Tough chats - dizz, rich, Zorko,
Depth matho (get he is passionate but not good enough at the level), answerth (not showing enough), the rest
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Bucking Beads
Brownlow Medallist
Andrews Adams Ah Chee
Wilmott Payne Coleman
McLuggage Starceivich Berry
Lohman Hipwood Cameron
Prior Daniher Fort
Oscar Neale Rayner
Ashcroft, McCarthy, Mathieson , Rich
Wilmott Payne Coleman
McLuggage Starceivich Berry
Lohman Hipwood Cameron
Prior Daniher Fort
Oscar Neale Rayner
Ashcroft, McCarthy, Mathieson , Rich
mpal6
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Playing them consistently this year (Lyons in particular) is a clear admission winning isn't our number 1 priority this year.
dlanod
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No, it's a clear indication that our idea of what constitutes a winning team and what the coaching staff thinks constitutes a winning team is different.
We can disagree on the wisdom of that opinion/call, but using it to claim that they're not trying to win because of it is a really dumb position to take.
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If Lyons had played as well this year as he did last year I think we wouldve been top 2.
I can only assume the club thought he could get back close to that level
You kind of hope with him and Andrews it's injuries holding them back but their output has been nowhere near as good as it has been
I can only assume the club thought he could get back close to that level
You kind of hope with him and Andrews it's injuries holding them back but their output has been nowhere near as good as it has been
mpal6
Norm Smith Medallist
Well the original post claimed us trying to move past older players is a sign of not interested in winning. If that's true, then playing out of form players with some pre-decided sense of best team finding form together (hoping really) is a sign of not interested in winning too. We can agree to disagree on that one.
- Aug 21, 2013
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thats the part that annoys me
Yes give him 1-2 weeks to get better.. I defended him when the mob came
Although just pretending it not a problem
I feel the senior fav players know they do not have to put in as they never get dropped.
if your in the VFL no matter how well you play you have to wait for a injury to get a game.
