Based on participation rates Football slaughters AFL (and that's without taking into account that AFL includes those who attend auskick once & once only)
But since I am 'biased' ask a neutral with knowledge on the subject
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But since I am 'biased' ask a neutral with knowledge on the subject
Lawn bowls is equally big in every state as well. Maybe that is bigger than Aussie Rules, LOL
Just because Aussie Rules is bigger in some parts of the country than others doens't mean that it's not the number one sport. It is. Easily. The closest sport in popularity is Rugby League.
Soccer and Union fluctuare between 3rd and 4th depending on whose World Cup has been the most recent.
Aussie Rules has the biggest crowds, the highest TV ratings, the largest print space in the media, the biggest memebrship, the biggest cultural following.
Is Soccer the biggest game in ANY state? Even one state? No. Soccer might have an "even spread" of support, but that does not make it number one in any state.
Even in Aussie Rules development states the Lions and Swans still have memberships of 30,000 each and huge crowds, and these two clubs have competed in the last 6 Grand Finals, generating TV audiences of around 4 million when regionals are included. Those figures are a pipedream for the Foxtel driven A-League.
Soccer is just a sport that attracts alot of haters. Some people seem to think because you like something other than what they like then you're insular. Upside down world or what?
That doesn't prove anything. Soccer has more participants than Gridiorn in the USA. Big deal?
Basketball has more participants than Gridiorn and Soccer in the USA yet the NBA is the 3rd biggest league behind the NFL, and Major League Baseball.
Apparently, the most highly participated sports are things like Swimming and even netball. Does that means we are all huge swimming fans and Netball watchers? Of course not.
Aussie Rules is by far the most dominant sport in the country, Rugby League is next...... then there is daylight. There is a massive massive gap between 2nd and 3rd. Soccer probably occupies 3rd at the moment, but no sport will even get close to Rugby League for that second spot, and no sport is close to Aussie Rules hold on the number one spot.
That's simply the pecking order in this country.
You are comparing apples & oranges. The A-League is about a third tier league on a world scale, the AFL is the top tier on a world scale (for obvious reasons).
That's true, but the sport of Aussie Rules is by far the biggest and most popular football code in this country. The only code that could mount a challenge to that would be Rugby League.
Soccer is not in the same ball-park. It doesn't get the miedia attention, the TV exposure, or the level of interest among the general public that Aussie Rules and Rugby League get.
(Oh my goodness it doesn't get in - deep breath...) Once again the MLS is around a third or fourth tier league on a world scale. NFL is top tier on a world scale for Gridiron. NBA is the top tier on a world scale for basketball. MLB is top tier, etc
So to put it in your terms (of having to look at a country's own national league to determine popularity) if the English Premier League/La Liga/Serie A was in the USA, it would probably be the no.1 sport. Marketing dollars would do that, like it does for the AFL in Australia.
Just give up, admit that soccer is the biggest sport in Australia. It's only the stubborn minority who refuse to admit it and they're mostly white trash.
WhoAteAllThePies
Debutant
The naming thing should be a non-issue to footy fans. If you get worked up over the semantics, you're really a bit sad and should probably get away from this forum for a little while.
Football (soccer) fans are doing it because it deserves respect - to many 'Soccer' might as well be said while spitting in their eye given the past and depending on who says it.
Its a shame that this debate brings out the stupids on both sides.
You MV forum lot, grow the fuck up, represent the game with a bit of clarsh.
Football (soccer) fans are doing it because it deserves respect - to many 'Soccer' might as well be said while spitting in their eye given the past and depending on who says it.
Its a shame that this debate brings out the stupids on both sides.
You MV forum lot, grow the fuck up, represent the game with a bit of clarsh.
It's strange that they take the name of their own sport as an insult. Are they ashamed? Show some pride boys and girls, if you really love the sport then learn to love what it really is.
I think Football can definitely overtake Rugby League in this country in the next few years. Average attendence figures are already very close:
NRL>>16,485
A-League>>14,042
{http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sports_attendance_figures}
Obviously the NRL is far ahead in terms of TV and media coverage, but the A-League has a larger participation rate, is a national competition, and the added bonus of being a global sport.
Once the other A-League teams start breaking even, (MVFC is the only one so far), expect an expansion in the league in terms of teams and salary cap (and hence better quality players). This will in turn increase A-League team's competitiveness in the Asian Champions League and bring in more money and world coverage.
Football in Australia has definitely been a sleeping giant.
The point is, that regardless of the "league size" Australin Rules Football is the nations biggest sport. MLS in the USA is a 3rd tier league also, that doesn't mean that Soccer is number one in the USA does it, just because they don't have a top Soccer League, with the hypothesis that if they did, the sport would be number one. They don't have one, so it's not. They have a population 6 times bigger than England so why isn't everyone going to the USA to play Soccer? Because they don't care about Soccer over there and the players want to go where the game is BIG, that's why! That's why they will never have a league as big as the EPL, nor will Australia, because Soccer in the USA is not big enough to generate a league of that popularity. Nor is it big enough in Australia.
The facts are we don't have a top league here in Australia, the sport does not have the same cultural followings as Aussie Rules even at levels far below the AFL. The lower Aussie Rules leagues, and suburban leagues get far more exposure than anything Soccer has.
It's pointless in saying stuff like, "Well, if we had a top tier league like the EPL In Australia..." Yeah well we DON'T."If" this and "if" that.
We have roughly the same population as the Netherlands who have a strong domestic Soccer League, so how come their league is stronger than ours? Because all the good players want to move away from Australia to play in European Leagues because Soccer is NOT the biggest game here and they want to play in a country where it is!
Couldve's, wouldn've, should've.
Soccer is 100 years behind Aussie Rules and Rugby League in Australia.
Rugby League is number 2... then there is daylight.... then more daylight. Then there is Soccer at number 3 in this country.
Australian Rules Footbal has never ever had a challenger to the number one spot.
Again, soccer people, football in this country denotes Aussie Rules or Rugby League. You can call soccer 'football' until you're blue in the face, but don't expect others who have grown up on Aussie Rules and League to start doing the same. It's a bit much to say, "well, that's what they call it in England, Brazil, etc, etc." and then expect that to mean we should apply the same rules here, with different cultural norms and traditions.
We'll call our own sports football and that is the way it is. The media get sucked in so that they can be politically correct, but the average fan will always call soccer, soccer. Don't expect this to change.
We'll call our own sports football and that is the way it is. The media get sucked in so that they can be politically correct, but the average fan will always call soccer, soccer. Don't expect this to change.
Azzballz Deluxe
All Australian
I dont know why all the soccer lovers cant accept that people call it soccer in Australia.
I like soccer myself, but all this "futbol" ******** is really turning me off the game.
Dont push your beliefs on me!!!!
BTW, GO VICTORY!!!!
I like soccer myself, but all this "futbol" ******** is really turning me off the game.
Dont push your beliefs on me!!!!
BTW, GO VICTORY!!!!
- Banned
- #115
So I will ring you up and ask if you want to go the football. Will you know which game I want to go see?
Will it be AFL,VFL or Ammos?
All the AFL is doing is branding their product , so when I ask you '' do you wanna go see an afl game'' you will know exactly what I am talking about. Nothing more nothing less
Exe Gesis
Kylo was here
- Sep 6, 2005
- 148,231
- 98,266
- AFL Club
- Tasmania
1. The AFL is shamelessly selling out the integrity of the sport, its traditions, its rules, etc. People like AD etc should be sued and stripped of their positions. An independant AR body is needed that truly looks after the integrity of the sport. Much like the Players Association makes sure the AFL abides by certain guidelines. This AR Body should consist of HOF-type people, acting as stewards of the game/history.
2. For Soccer in Australia to push and demand they be called Football is not so much absurd but unreasonable. In AssocFootball dominant nations, most of the world, they are known as Football. But that doesn't mean they should be called that here. It will only create confusion between the dominant code, Australian Football. In turn, this will allow the AFL to lick their lips as they seek to have an umbrella AFL prefix on all the state leagues, junior leagues, amateur leagues, etc. Such that the corporation/league itself becomes known as the code for the sake of dollars. It seems the AFL are ok with Soccer doing this as it allows the AFL a marketing angle. It's not sickening that Soccer starts being referred to as Football, or doesn't have a right to be called that, it's just that it's going to clash so much with the dominant reference of Australian Football or Football meaning Australian Rules. AR has more right to be called Football than a lot of other codes like Rugby or American Football. Especially if Soccer here wants to similtaneously take the name Football and strip AR from being also called Football. Soccer being allowed to share the name Football will only hasten the AFL rewriting its own history to call the code of AR to be referred to as AFL.
2a. Quick example...imagine AR pushed to call itself Soccer or Rugby. It would just create confusion. Football has always been AR in Australia, and should remain so. Rugby and Rugby League have always been the more prevalent terms for those codes too. Football is just a generic term but officially Soccer should remain being called Soccer here.
3. What's worse than Soccer assuming the name football is how the AFL is slowly but surely turning Australian Football into a soft and boring sport like Soccer. This is very saddening as it had and still has the potential to become more physical and tough like Hockey, as both sports share that same blind-sidedness of body contact. It's becoming more like Basketball, Soccer, Gaelic Football where the rules restrict the contestability of the ball regardless of whether the ball is in possession or not.
4. It would seem that nothing's going to change, the AFL is here to stay, Soccer is set to grow, the codes are modernizing unstoppably towards mass-corporatization, becoming softer, etc....but I believe that in time people will eventually tire of worms in an apple. When a beautiful thing slowly degrades into ugliness, at some point everything reacts to tip the imbalance back the other way. Renaissances do happen. Revolts. Backlashes. Even Nature itself when there's imbalances.
2. For Soccer in Australia to push and demand they be called Football is not so much absurd but unreasonable. In AssocFootball dominant nations, most of the world, they are known as Football. But that doesn't mean they should be called that here. It will only create confusion between the dominant code, Australian Football. In turn, this will allow the AFL to lick their lips as they seek to have an umbrella AFL prefix on all the state leagues, junior leagues, amateur leagues, etc. Such that the corporation/league itself becomes known as the code for the sake of dollars. It seems the AFL are ok with Soccer doing this as it allows the AFL a marketing angle. It's not sickening that Soccer starts being referred to as Football, or doesn't have a right to be called that, it's just that it's going to clash so much with the dominant reference of Australian Football or Football meaning Australian Rules. AR has more right to be called Football than a lot of other codes like Rugby or American Football. Especially if Soccer here wants to similtaneously take the name Football and strip AR from being also called Football. Soccer being allowed to share the name Football will only hasten the AFL rewriting its own history to call the code of AR to be referred to as AFL.
2a. Quick example...imagine AR pushed to call itself Soccer or Rugby. It would just create confusion. Football has always been AR in Australia, and should remain so. Rugby and Rugby League have always been the more prevalent terms for those codes too. Football is just a generic term but officially Soccer should remain being called Soccer here.
3. What's worse than Soccer assuming the name football is how the AFL is slowly but surely turning Australian Football into a soft and boring sport like Soccer. This is very saddening as it had and still has the potential to become more physical and tough like Hockey, as both sports share that same blind-sidedness of body contact. It's becoming more like Basketball, Soccer, Gaelic Football where the rules restrict the contestability of the ball regardless of whether the ball is in possession or not.
4. It would seem that nothing's going to change, the AFL is here to stay, Soccer is set to grow, the codes are modernizing unstoppably towards mass-corporatization, becoming softer, etc....but I believe that in time people will eventually tire of worms in an apple. When a beautiful thing slowly degrades into ugliness, at some point everything reacts to tip the imbalance back the other way. Renaissances do happen. Revolts. Backlashes. Even Nature itself when there's imbalances.
Hooray for global sporting homogenisation
Don't expect it to see it anytime this century.
Dan, what do you think will happen in these states when the success drops off for several years in a row? Brisbane is apparently down 20 percent on membership and corporate sales ( according to Mike Sheahan on page 77 of the Herald Sun). That is after last playing in a grand final in 2004. Do you think that the Swans will maintain their crowds if they have 3 or 4 years outside the eight?
frankc
Club Legend
Soccer still has a long way to go, however the sport is definately on the right track. Amazing what happens once a sport is run by people who have more business acumen than sporting prowess.
In saying this, I hope the A-league don't have expansion has there number one priority. I think it is important that each club be sustainable first. and then some expansion would be appropriate.
frankc
Club Legend
What about the if the Victory have a few years in the doldrums? The true indication of a teams strength is its ability to be profitable even during difficult times.
What about Sydney FC and all their trouble? At the end of the day a strong swans side will be much stronger than their soccer counterpart and similarly and weak swans side will be better.
- Banned
- #123
Of course, Soccer isn't a blow in sport in Australia. It is part of our rich culture in Australian sport. That is why, Australia have dominated the sport for almost a century. Are you really that sad? Soccer is pathetic, end of story. I'd rather watch Rugby than Soccer at least Rugby scores over 10 points per game. Hell, I'd rather watch American Football than Soccer. Why, did you ask? It's because Soccer is boring!
What sort of crowds were the Swans getting in the early to mid nineties? Sydney FC crowds dropped off this year after poor form and off field instability. Sydney crowds have a very big bandwagon element. Most Sydney people acknowledge that. With the AFL's primary focus being the expansion of the game into NSW and QLD can it afford to have these teams struggling?
If Victory does experience a couple of poor years, crowds will drop off like they would for a Victorian AFL club. With a strong membership culture (i.e buy a membership to support your club) the drop off will not be as big. It will be a big surprise if 20k-25k members don't sign up next year. Members tend to be fairly loyal to the club.
The fact that Victory is even being compared to AFL clubs is an amazing achievement after only existing for two years.
Basketball and ten pin bowling are so much better than AFL because they score more often. I can't get my brain around any sport that doesn't score as often as possible.
