Fremantle & Ross Lyon

[Bazza97]

No changes for Fremantle this week, Ross must be pretty confident with who he's got in the line-up currently....

Interesting that Ross didn't make any changes, I would've thought he'd make a couple at least. He probably wants to get another look at how the same lineup fares again this week to see if there's any change of form in the team. I guess if the Dockers put in another poor performance that's when he'll swing the axe.

 

[StCicatriz]

You really need to be looking at what your mob is saying in this thread then.

And then at what I actually said, which was, effectively, that there are more than a few saints supporters in this thread (and every Lyon thread anywhere) are trying to make it sound like Lyon inherited a great list at Freo and has done nothing with it, and I said that it'd be interesting to go back and see what they were saying in 2010 compared to what they're saying now.

The implicit point being, then, that if I were to go look, I'd probably find they thought our list was shit ... and only now are saying it was a "good list" because it reinforces their view that Lyon has destroyed it "like he did at St Kilda".

There isn't much bizarre about that - other than, perhaps, your comprehension skills.


I was also pointing out that you coming in here and saying Pav said "skills aren't important" is a little on the nose. Again, it comes down to your reading comprehension skills.
If one was to say "for now, water is more important than food", you'd be one to jump up and say "look! he said food wasn't important!".

See what happened there, or not?
Unfortunately, people like you are fairly common. Governments rely upon people like you to get elected.


Like I said, and like Igon said before me, Freo supporters do have their concerns with the club at the moment, and have had those concerns for a couple of years now. That much is true.

But don't for a moment think that there are very many falling for your bullshit.
Or at least... I hope not.

When did i say anything about what saints supporters are saying now? I was merely pointing out what the opinion was when Ross took over each of the sides...

 

[Proud SJW]

When did i say anything about what saints supporters are saying now? I was merely pointing out what the opinion was when Ross took over each of the sides...

I don't think I could have been much clearer about what I said and how you've chosen to misinterpret it.
Losing interest in you, either pick up your game or go away.

 

[StCicatriz]

I don't think I could have been much clearer about what I said and how you've chosen to misinterpret it.
Losing interest in you, either pick up your game or go away.

Look if you can't even answer a basic question then this really isn't going anywhere is it?

So again when did i say anything about what saints supporters are saying now?

 

[Proud SJW]

Look if you can't even answer a basic question then this really isn't going anywhere is it?

So again when did i say anything about what saints supporters are saying now?

Well, in all honesty I don't think I said anything about not liking the Saint's guernseys.
I find it bizarre you should think I did.

 

[StCicatriz]

Well, in all honesty I don't think I said anything about not liking the Saint's guernseys.
I find it bizarre you should think I did.

Huh? What are you on about? Who said anything about guernseys?

And you're taking shots over reading comprehension...righhhhhtttt

Oh the irony

 

[Proud SJW]

So, you don't like the away games much huh.

 

[sonnywalters]

Fremantle's struggles last year were well documented, but the excuse of injuries was accepted by most as an explanation for their swift descent down the ladder. This season, with new recruit Cam McCarthy and the return of Sandilands and Fyfe, they were supposed to be fit and primed for a crack on the eight.

Their shambolic display against Geelong suggests however that there are much deeper problems at the Dockers. Their skill levels were highly subpar for an AFL list, and they rely on the same few players to lift them. Sandilands is reaching the end and none of the Freo depth rucks look much chop out. Hogan re-signing with the Dees was a major blow as indications were that the Dockers made a major push to bring him back to WA to replace Pav. With no real KPF, limited goal scoring ability and a lack of run out of defence, Freo played like a team with a bottom four list.

So far Lyon has not indicated that Freo is in a rebuild mode,bringing in players like Hill, Kersten and Hamling who it was hoped would make an immediate impact. A look at their fixture would suggest that there are only four winnable games before the bye, at what stage does Ross Lyon's tenure become untenable for the Fremantle board, who extended his contract last year.

Rebuild?
Lyon refuses to play any young players.
They are the 3rd oldest side this week.
He made NO CHANGE to the same 22 from last week. He simply will not learn.
He refuses to play Balic, Logue etc etc
Instead he sticks with his tried and true hacks week in week out - Suban, Pearce, Dawson, Ibbotson etc.

The man is insane. a snake oil salesman.
The AFL is finally waking up to him.
Freo will have to learn the hard way about how he operates. And it wont be pretty.

 

[sonnywalters]

This thread is an overreaction for a poor performance on the weekend against a side who played in a prelim last year. We still have foot soldiers to phase out (Suban, Dawson, Eventually D.Pearce, Griffen etc) But you can't just field a side full of kids and expect to remain somewhat competitive. Our main issues are still transitioning out of the backline and our inability to to use the ball well going inside 50, The addition of Hill should help in both of those areas and if Bennell can ever get on the park he should be a mainstay at half forward for us. Hopefully some more youth is brought in this week such as Balic, but the players need time to grow. Can't expect McCarthy to be the saviour after missing a whole season of football.

Ross lyon apologist.
You are brain washed.
You sound like someone who purchased a whole shed full of of snake oil. "Just wait a little longer and it will work'.


You will learn the hard way. The snake oil wont work and Lyon is no good.

 

[sonnywalters]

Interesting that Ross didn't make any changes, I would've thought he'd make a couple at least. He probably wants to get another look at how the same lineup fares again this week to see if there's any change of form in the team. I guess if the Dockers put in another poor performance that's when he'll swing the axe.

But he wont. He is pathologically incapable of changing his ways.
He is still trying to play the 2005 'Bloods' game plan.
He wont change.
He cannot bring himself to play younger players. He just cant do it.

 

[sonnywalters]

Have a go at Lyon all you like, but overall the Freo club is definitely not stagnant.

If Freo admin had just sat on their hands and refused to be aggressive with the draft & trades, I would agree that they were in a comfort zone and satisfied with life & their pay cheques. The drafts & trades have been made, we await ( end of season ? ) to make a judgement on these moves.

To people not in WA, please note that the Freo "Reserves" ( Peel ), are doing ok with 2 wins out of 2 games. Beating the Eagles "Reserves" ( East Perth ), showing that their youngsters are doing ok.

Not all doom and gloom.

Please advise who is the best "new" candidate for a coaching role ?.

You could draft Barry Cable, Polly Farmer and Lance Franklin and Lyon would leave them to rot in the WAFL until they either moved clubs or turned 25.

 

[Herne Hill Hammer]

I've been posting it on these boards for a few years now that Ross's style of game plan has a limited lifespan, 2 to 3 years when he has it up and fully running.

Both St Kilda and Freo blew their chances.

 

[Duskfire]

If freo have another bad year the other teams will be circling Fyfe like horny sharks.

 

[Mat Mann]

give the team a chance, its only been 1 game. If they start the season 0-9 then I reckon even the staunchest Docker fan would be calling for the head of Lyon.

If Rnd 1 was any form guide, Rnd8 vs Carlton would be their most likely 1st win.

I swear you're actually a closet WCE supporter

anti-Freo, which makes him Pro WC.

The similarities between Ross at Stkilda and Freo are pretty fascinating.
I think you will find Saints supporters are disappointed at the way Ross left, not that he left, He did some shitty things in retiring players who hadn't even had that conversation with the club at his last game of 2011, then snuck out the back door.

As far as recruiting goes, both clubs have failed to recruit well under Ross, and even the players we ( Saints ) did find, most would find themselves played out of position in the games and struggled to show promise as a result. Freo has made the same crap trading of crap players from other clubs that the Saints made, the Failure to get a functioning Forward line from 2012 onwards, and then the same ageing superstars to no replacements, Freo has done a bit better drafting wise than the Saints, but you still find yourselves in the same position of ageing superstars/C grade players and largely untried kids.

Injuries effecting results are merely a reflection of your lists depth, Extremely hard to replace the likes of Sandilands and Fyfe, but surely the sheer amount of injuries should have serious questions of your clubs Fitness/Medical dept. I remember we had a lot of soft tissue injuries ( hard to find references ) ~ 2006-2008 ), and had to significantly boost our medical/fitness dept ( went as far as re turfing Morrabbin ), is Ross's demanding gameplay a co-incidence?

and then we've got the continual playing of players like Dawson, who have really only 1 use ( negative ), it just doesn't cut it anymore, teams need 22 players who can defend and attack

 

[clivenator26]

Rebuild?
Lyon refuses to play any young players.
They are the 3rd oldest side this week.
He made NO CHANGE to the same 22 from last week. He simply will not learn.
He refuses to play Balic, Logue etc etc
Instead he sticks with his tried and true hacks week in week out - Suban, Pearce, Dawson, Ibbotson etc.

The man is insane. a snake oil salesman.
The AFL is finally waking up to him.
Freo will have to learn the hard way about how he operates. And it wont be pretty.

Fair points except for;

Who are the etc etc? Brady Grey? Should we send Sandi to the glue factory and let Sean Darcy ruck? Should we let opposition key fwds feast on Sam Collins?

I heard the argument last year we were tanking because Mzungu & DeBoer were playing WAFL and Ross was crazy for dropping Barlow - the reason being to allow Blakley some time on ball where he went alright.

FYI - Suban, Dawson & Ibbotson were 3 of our better players in Rd 1 - no they shouldn't be in our best 22 come Rd 22, 2017 except perhaps Ibbo who has shown quality at times during his career. Logue has shown next to nothing in the WAFL, he is an athlete but will get games later in the year.

Sutcliffe played his 100h game last week and imo has not become a better player since the end of 2013 when he played a GF as a 2nd year player. He has been a mainstay since his 2nd year as has Neale who is up around 75 games, played in a GF in his 2nd year and won a B$F last year, polled 20 Brownlow votes.

Weller & Blakely have been in the 22 since Rd 2, 2016. They're 3rd year now.

Langdon & Tucker have been regulars since mid 2016.

Taberner has racked up 40+ games yet "playing the kids" hasn't helped him, he is inept at football and dropping easy marks is the only thing he has improved over time! Should we play him another 100 games so Jesse White doesn't feel sonbad about himself?

Sheridan & Crozier, both top 20 picks have played 50-60 games and been given opportunities in finals and in various roles/positions but haven't locked down a spot. They should be embarrassed with themselves they're not in the team.

Top pick from 2012 Josh Simpson is gone. I remember fondly when Ross called his name on draft day, and also when Ross ran to him after his debut as water boy and also when he was strapping his ankle pre-game as team physiotherapist.

Top pick from 2013 Michael Apeness has played 7 AFL games and 28 WAFL league - games of a possible 70 odd - we've thrown him in pretty much any time he has strung a few WAFL games together - arguably he was a reach during his draft, the result of forgetting Pavlich was aging but selfish Ross kept all birth records in his secret dungeon.

Top picks from 2010-11 (Morabito & Pitt) should be peaking now but I don't think either are playing serious footy. Sad and god knows why we didn't take Darling over Pitt but thems the breaks.

All this hurts, as does neglecting to replace Pav, now imagine our position had we got the McCarthy deal done for 2016 - effectively we wouldn't have Hamling, Logue or Tucker!

Balic has played 2 games this year in the WAFL, one decent hitout against east Perth and a big possession game against a pathetic east freo - he will play but he is an inside mid behind Fyfe, Neale, Mundy & Blakely. He played the last 5-6 games last year in the WAFL due to injury.

I'd have liked some changes this week - but it's hardly the first time a coach has backed his players in after a dud effort. If we get pumped and no changes are made in week 3 I'll lead the chorus of dissent. Logue, Balic, Grey, Crozier, Sheridan, Taberner all will be a chance at a game but the latter 4 imo won't show more than they already have at AFL level.

 

[Docker Alyssa]

The man is insane. a snake oil salesman.
The AFL is finally waking up to him.
Freo will have to learn the hard way about how he operates. And it wont be pretty.

Cheap salt on special. Dollar store salt. Get it while it's salty (forever?)

Awww. Saints supporter with no success since Lyon left and beaten by Melbourne round 1 against all history and odds and predictions of the season to come. No wonder so salty. You'd think some self awareness might creep in on the mainboard how transparent the source of this opinion is.

BTW the claim of AFL Coach "selling snake oil" has to go to Hardwick fives times over compared to Lyon who's made semi's, prelim's, GF's with his team and got everything out of each list and availability of opportunity smack in the middle of the hawks dominant era. Whereas Damien has not and is still considered unsackable lol

 

[Freomaniac]

When did i say anything about what saints supporters are saying now? I was merely pointing out what the opinion was when Ross took over each of the sides...

Just another gutless troll post here. Enjoy the weekend. You will be 0-2 just like freo

 

[Freomaniac]

You could draft Barry Cable, Polly Farmer and Lance Franklin and Lyon would leave them to rot in the WAFL until they either moved clubs or turned 25.

wait... your telling me Freo didn't play youth under ross Lyon in 2016? Weller, Blakely and Langdon are our 1st, 2nd and 4th round picks of 2014 and they played lots of games last year. They played last week, they will play vs Port in round 2. How many games did Roo play in his 1st year? It wasn't 20.

Look I know your trolling. If Richardson doesn't get you guys in finals, he should be under the microscope as well.

 

[Randomizor]

wait... your telling me Freo didn't play youth under ross Lyon in 2016? Weller, Blakely and Langdon are our 1st, 2nd and 4th round picks of 2014 and they played lots of games last year. They played last week, they will play vs Port in round 2. How many games did Roo play in his 1st year? It wasn't 20.

Look I know your trolling. If Richardson doesn't get you guys in finals, he should be under the microscope as well.

You mean when Richardson doesn't get them into finals. Bottom 6 this year at best for the Saints I reckon.

 

[igon value]

There's no guarantee we'll get a better coach when Lyon goes, and our list won't be any better shape than St Kilda's was

 

[Herne Hill Hammer]

Lyon's plan. Always the same.

 

[sonnywalters]

There's no guarantee we'll get a better coach when Lyon goes, and our list won't be any better shape than St Kilda's was

You couldnt get a worse coach.

 

[sonnywalters]

You mean when Richardson doesn't get them into finals. Bottom 6 this year at best for the Saints I reckon.

You will be bottom 1.
With an old side.
Worst of both worlds.
If you are going to finish bottom you might as well get games in to kids. But Lyon will insist on finishing bottom with an old side.
Insanity.
Will take you a decade at the bottom to recover from his obduracy.
Dont say you werent warned. The bloke is poison.

 

[estibador]

You couldnt get a worse coach.

You guys managed to after he left.

 

[sonnywalters]

Lyon's plan. Always the same.

He has never changed his game plan from this day.