Rumour Future of the club (Bevo, board, assistant coaches, football department)

[Next Waiting]

Earlier in the season there were murmurs of Bontempelli being discontent. Would love to know, if that was true at the time, whether this has also turned around.

If that we're true, however, who or what was the source of his discontent? More often than not, I watched some of those games last year in particular, and thought to myself ... and sometimes on here .... if I we're Bont or Libba, I'd be mightily p1ssed off with the lack of commitment, application and determination shown by too many of his team mates.

There is little, if any evidence, of that being a possibility or reality in recent matches.

 

[dogwatch]

I've have enjoyed, and will continue to enjoy, trotting out the "he's lost the players line" for all the rival coaches who lose badly during the year. Goodwin - he's lost the players. Kenny, ****...they've all lost the players. It's a catch all line that brain dead germalists will gravitate towards.

I think about Bevo and this very narrative that has been run against him from time to time over the last year or two. I think of pretty clear cut cases where a coach has actually lost the players. Neeld and Richardson in recent times. I think about this whole notion of losing and presumably keeping or finding players.

But I come to thinking about what is the role of the coach here. Does the coach need to keep or find the players, and vice versa, or does the coach need to facilitate the players finding each other.

It looks to me like this is what has happened to our team since the Hawks game. They have found each other. How many times I previously complained that Bont and Libba carried this team with a level of intensity and commitment that seemed beyond their colleagues. But I can't make that complaint recently. There has been a shift, but it looks like a shift in the commitment of the players to each other.

Contrast with Melbourne. It looks like it's gone the other way.

This is the prize given out in the coaching section of the AFL Razzies.
Useful for a coach who has lost his players.

 

[ScottyDogg]

I've have enjoyed, and will continue to enjoy, trotting out the "he's lost the players line" for all the rival coaches who lose badly during the year. Goodwin - he's lost the players. Kenny, ****...they've all lost the players. It's a catch all line that brain dead germalists will gravitate towards.

I think about Bevo and this very narrative that has been run against him from time to time over the last year or two. I think of pretty clear cut cases where a coach has actually lost the players. Neeld and Richardson in recent times. I think about this whole notion of losing and presumably keeping or finding players.

But I come to thinking about what is the role of the coach here. Does the coach need to keep or find the players, and vice versa, or does the coach need to facilitate the players finding each other.

It looks to me like this is what has happened to our team since the Hawks game. They have found each other. How many times I previously complained that Bont and Libba carried this team with a level of intensity and commitment that seemed beyond their colleagues. But I can't make that complaint recently. There has been a shift, but it looks like a shift in the commitment of the players to each other.

Contrast with Melbourne. It looks like it's gone the other way.

Theory:

We needed Libba out for a month, so the rest of the boys could realise that he (and Bont) aren’t the only players who can be the heart and soul barometers for the club. He’s been too ****ing heroic for too ****ing long.

In his absence Richards stood up and said I can be the man, then West and Garcia said so can we, then sanders and Darcy etc.

The question is whether all of the emerging kids and role players don’t just go back to expecting Libba, Bont and Treloar to carry the whole enterprise.

If we can continue to get serious contributions from the whole 22, while reintegrating Libba, Richards, Weightman and Naughts…bloody look out.

 

[dogwatch]

Theory:

We needed Libba out for a month, so the rest of the boys could realise that he (and Bont) aren’t the only players who can be the heart and soul barometers for the club. He’s been too ****ing heroic for too ****ing long.

In his absence Richards stood up and said I can be the man, then West and Garcia said so can we, then sanders and Darcy etc.

The question is whether all of the emerging kids and role players don’t just go back to expecting Libba, Bont and Treloar to carry the whole enterprise.

If we can continue to get serious contributions from the whole 22, while reintegrating Libba, Richards, Weightman and Naughts…bloody look out.

I like it. It's certainly a good narrative to spur them on for Friday. (Are you Bevo, by any chance?)

 

[Next Waiting]

Theory:

We needed Libba out for a month, so the rest of the boys could realise that he (and Bont) aren’t the only players who can be the heart and soul barometers for the club. He’s been too ****ing heroic for too ****ing long.

In his absence Richards stood up and said I can be the man, then West and Garcia said so can we, then sanders and Darcy etc.

The question is whether all of the emerging kids and role players don’t just go back to expecting Libba, Bont and Treloar to carry the whole enterprise.

If we can continue to get serious contributions from the whole 22, while reintegrating Libba, Richards, Weightman and Naughts…bloody look out.

It's a long time since we've been better placed to get just that IMO. There had to be a watershed game where this was so self evident to all the players that it had to addressed by them collectively.

I think history will show that was the Hawks game and the change occurred from the next week on. Ironically for the Hawks, it was the game before and the change was evident from our clash on.

Round 8 Dogs v Hawks 2024. History will record this an important game ... for 2 clubs.

 

[Sharpiesadog]

I heard a bit of Treloar on SEN on Saturday morning. I missed some of it, but I thought he said the players had a meeting after the Hawks game. I think he said the players felt they were letting each other and the coaches down, and they needed to do something about it. I could be wrong, I couldn’t listen properly. Something does seem to have changed in the last few weeks.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

I heard a bit of Treloar on SEN on Saturday morning. I missed some of it, but I thought he said the players had a meeting after the Hawks game. I think he said the players felt they were letting each other and the coaches down, and they needed to do something about it. I could be wrong, I couldn’t listen properly. Something does seem to have changed in the last few weeks.

I knew it! I was about to post in response to Scotty Dog (above) and say IMO if Bont looked peed off, then he knew it was up to him and Libba, as C and VC, to step up their leadership and galvanise the players to take responsibility and not leave it to a few.

 

[grassman75]

Gonna win it from 8th this year

Bevo wants to win it from 9th to prove a point

 

[Unorth]

Bailey Dale

31

Bailey Dale

Age

27

Ht

188cm

Wt

85kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.2

3star

K

7.6

3star

HB

5.6

4star

M

3.1

3star

T

1.6

4star

MG

117.4

2star

D

9.0

2star

K

5.1

2star

HB

3.9

3star

M

2.3

2star

T

1.7

3star

MG

117.4

2star

D

8.0

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

3.0

3star

M

1.4

2star

T

2.0

4star

has responded to his semi-drop by playing some of the best footy of his career. Macrae has been adjusting to a lesser midfield role and on Friday night was unusually aggressive towards goals, which is what he needed to be.

Caleb is kind of iffy still. I think there's a role for him pinpointing passes to our forwards, historically he's been a top 3 kick in the team, although we seem to prefer having all our talls (and sometimes smalls) converge on high balls, rather than methodically looking for targets/having our talls create space for each other. Aware that forward pressure is not a strength of Caleb's, but I also think there's value in a guy who can reliably deliver inside 50 without turning it over.

Coaches were definitely harsh on those 3 early. But they like others were part of a malaise that we've found ourselves in over the last few years and needed the kick up the backside. Those early reports of discontentedness may have been correct, it's always going to ruffle feathers when you make examples of well established senior players.

But in at least 2/3 cases it's been a good move. If Macrae can continue to diversify his game there's a place for him. Dale has probably returned to elite in his position. Caleb is still a piece of a puzzle that could improve us further if we can figure it out, although I'm not confident he's here in 2025. Wonder if the coaching structure shake up, and some fresher perspectives, helped with this shakeup.

 

[The Slitherin' Snake]

Bailey Dale has responded to his semi-drop by playing some of the best footy of his career. Macrae has been adjusting to a lesser midfield role and on Friday night was unusually aggressive towards goals, which is what he needed to be.

Caleb is kind of iffy still. I think there's a role for him pinpointing passes to our forwards, historically he's been a top 3 kick in the team, although we seem to prefer having all our talls (and sometimes smalls) converge on high balls, rather than methodically looking for targets/having our talls create space for each other. Aware that forward pressure is not a strength of Caleb's, but I also think there's value in a guy who can reliably deliver inside 50 without turning it over.

Coaches were definitely harsh on those 3 early. But they like others were part of a malaise that we've found ourselves in over the last few years and needed the kick up the backside. Those early reports of discontentedness may have been correct, it's always going to ruffle feathers when you make examples of well established senior players.

But in at least 2/3 cases it's been a good move. If Macrae can continue to diversify his game there's a place for him. Dale has probably returned to elite in his position. Caleb is still a piece of a puzzle that could improve us further if we can figure it out, although I'm not confident he's here in 2025. Wonder if the coaching structure shake up, and some fresher perspectives, helped with this shakeup.

Agree with all you've said, except i don't think the coaches were harsh on Dale or Daniel. Dale played very poorly the first part of the season and needed a rev up. Daniel hasnt been good this year and needs to find form. Macrae i think has been treated harshly

 

[Golden_6]

Agree with all you've said, except i don't think the coaches were harsh on Dale or Daniel. Dale played very poorly the first part of the season and needed a rev up. Daniel hasnt been good this year and needs to find form. Macrae i think has been treated harshly

There was still talk of Macrae having a more serious injury issue than they were letting on. Bevo alluded to stress related issue in Macrae's body but was very vague.

Perhaps it was simply a loading issue and they needed Macrae to prove he was covering enough of the ground in the VFL for them to be confident to select him in an AFL game.

 

[4Seasons]

Yes. End of the year, regardless.

Some people complain that they think Beveridge is stubborn

 

[DiamondDogs8]

Daniel hasnt been good this year and needs to find form.

I can’t see a way that CD carves out a specific role in this team long-term to find any sort of continuity or rhythm. His days as a back half distributor are seemingly over and doesn’t possess the physical traits to play a pressure forward role. Is he best 23 when everyone is fit? Where do we go from here?

 

[SonOfScray]

Gonna win it from 8th this year

10th

 

[scratchie]

To the naked eye and my amateur analysis, Beveridge has reverted and gone all-in on a high press game plan. The same game plan that we had in 2016. The same game plan Richmond has started to use and did so successfully last night against Adelaide.

I think the reason we are having so many upsets this year is that some sides have reverted back to the high press, whilst others are continuing with the rebound/turn-over game. Or some balance in-between.

During 2022 and 2023 Collingwood set the benchmark game plan: flood back, but then rebound rapidly with numbers and ballistic pace. And Collingwood's Macrae has them rebounding daringly straight thru the corridor. Kingsley's implemented his own version of it last year - capitalizing on the pace he has on his list.

That game plan is no longer as effective as it was. Teams are defensively better organized and ready. As a result, the Pies have had to adapt and GWS is not finding it as easy as they did late last year.

3 Game Plans - are much like in soccer

A- High Press with heavy retention, repeat stoppages locked in forward 50:
B- Flood back, Rebound, turn-over, absorb pressure, charge forward
C- Total Football both A & B

In soccer all three methods have been successful
A- Barcelona under Guardiola
B- Chelsea under Mourinho, Leicester City 2016
C- Real Madrid consistently, Alex Ferguson's MU, Current Manchester City Team

Only the most talented teams can play C - you need quality all over the park.

The least talented teams generally choose B - you protect your defender's but you need something special and unique to score enough

A - is the most reliant on retaining possession so you need a gun midfield and very organized team defense

This year, I believe Sydney, Carlton and GWS have the most talented lists, and rightfully both of them are play total football.
We and most teams can't. Our list still has some severe deficiencies: no natural wingers, only one quality key defender, no dangerous crumbing forward and a few too many slow players. When everyone is fit and available we do now have a very dangerous forward line.

Bev has tried to have us playing total football and it got us close in 2021 when we arguably had a more even quality list. But once Bruce did his knee, we were never going to win it playing total football.

This high press game suits us. Rebound quickly where you can but from defensive 50, move forward systematically with high possession and lock it in by covering all the exits. What this also means is high congestion around stoppages as it covers some of our pace issues and enables Macrae and Caleb to add value.

 

[dogwatch]

To the naked eye and my amateur analysis, Beveridge has reverted and gone all-in on a high press game plan. The same game plan that we had in 2016. The same game plan Richmond has started to use and did so successfully last night against Adelaide.

I think the reason we are having so many upsets this year is that some sides have reverted back to the high press, whilst others are continuing with the rebound/turn-over game. Or some balance in-between.

During 2022 and 2023 Collingwood set the benchmark game plan: flood back, but then rebound rapidly with numbers and ballistic pace. And Collingwood's Macrae has them rebounding daringly straight thru the corridor. Kingsley's implemented his own version of it last year - capitalizing on the pace he has on his list.

That game plan is no longer as effective as it was. Teams are defensively better organized and ready. As a result, the Pies have had to adapt and GWS is not finding it as easy as they did late last year.

3 Game Plans - are much like in soccer

A- High Press with heavy retention, repeat stoppages locked in forward 50:
B- Flood back, Rebound, turn-over, absorb pressure, charge forward
C- Total Football both A & B

In soccer all three methods have been successful
A- Barcelona under Guardiola
B- Chelsea under Mourinho, Leicester City 2016
C- Real Madrid consistently, Alex Ferguson's MU, Current Manchester City Team

Only the most talented teams can play C - you need quality all over the park.

The least talented teams generally choose B - you protect your defender's but you need something special and unique to score enough

A - is the most reliant on retaining possession so you need a gun midfield and very organized team defense

This year, I believe Sydney, Carlton and GWS have the most talented lists, and rightfully both of them are play total football.
We and most teams can't. Our list still has some severe deficiencies: no natural wingers, only one quality key defender, no dangerous crumbing forward and a few too many slow players. When everyone is fit and available we do now have a very dangerous forward line.

Bev has tried to have us playing total football and it got us close in 2021 when we arguably had a more even quality list. But once Bruce did his knee, we were never going to win it playing total football.

This high press game suits us. Rebound quickly where you can but from defensive 50, move forward systematically with high possession and lock it in by covering all the exits. What this also means is high congestion around stoppages as it covers some of our pace issues and enables Macrae and Caleb to add value.

Good analysis.

We are also cutting diagonally a lot more. Even to the point where players with the ball near the defensive arc are clearly trying to follow instructions to do that but if they look 3-4 times and can't find a target they are reluctantly forced to go down the boundary line.

We are also trying to use the corridor more but not as a default strategy on every play.

So some elements of the "C" game there, perhaps?

 

[Freshwater]

Agree with all you've said, except i don't think the coaches were harsh on Dale or Daniel. Dale played very poorly the first part of the season and needed a rev up. Daniel hasnt been good this year and needs to find form. Macrae i think has been treated harshly

It probably wasn’t a ‘rev’ up he needed, but a rest. I spoke with one of his junior coaches who is still in regular contact with him, and they rolled the dice with playing him injured, and he just couldn’t be the dynamic player he is at the moment. He went into round one not nearly right. He is one of our most important and influential and consistent players now.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

It probably wasn’t a ‘rev’ up he needed, but a rest. I spoke with one of his junior coaches who is still in regular contact with him, and they rolled the dice with playing him injured, and he just couldn’t be the dynamic player he is at the moment. He went into round one not nearly right. He is one of our most important and influential and consistent players now.

Yep easily forgotten now but Dale was touch and go for weeks leading up to R1. Not fit at all and it was actually a surprise to many when he was named.

 

[hutchy31]

Thread will be interesting this week. That was about as poor a performance as it gets.

Team selection didn’t work, no material in-game adjustments.

The players can take a decent chunk of blame. But not all of it.

 

[F6Typhoon]

Can see Sanders spending more time in VFL… His decision making is woeful..

 

[Freshwater]

The players can definitely take some blame. But they were playing a team just off their second bye! How this is fair in a close professional sport is beyond me? There is a very very young list out there. And Libba wasn’t himself, Daniel looks finished. Bailey Williams does what Bailey Williams does and drops simple chest marks. None of this on Bevo.
Sure I’d have liked Cleary in this weeks team. But with Naughts, Ed, and even Sam Darcy (who is going past Jamarra faster that rapid set concrete) we lack that talent and X factor.
I like this newer old Bevo of recently and I think we are moving in right direction.

 

[bresker]

I’m trying not be reactive week to week. But with every loss the chances of making the eight dwindle .

We have injuries , but our injured list isn’t extreme or even unusual in this attritional sport .

It’s two steps forward , one step back . Two or three wins, one loss. That won’t be enough .

 

[_Mike_]

The players can definitely take some blame. But they were playing a team just off their second bye! How this is fair in a close professional sport is beyond me? There is a very very young list out there. And Libba wasn’t himself, Daniel looks finished. Bailey Williams does what Bailey Williams does and drops simple chest marks. None of this on Bevo.
Sure I’d have liked Cleary in this weeks team. But with Naughts, Ed, and even Sam Darcy (who is going past Jamarra faster that rapid set concrete) we lack that talent and X factor.
I like this newer old Bevo of recently and I think we are moving in right direction.

EG Daniel , JOD, Baker, Lobb, English shouldn’t be playing but they are because there’s no one else

Combination of list management and on field performance

 

[W W Biscuit]

I’m trying not be reactive week to week. But with every loss the chances of making the eight dwindle .

We have injuries , but our injured list isn’t extreme or even unusual in this attritional sport .

It’s two steps forward , one step back . Two or three wins, one loss. That won’t be enough .

Problem is, we rely so heavily on our top end talent playing well. We don't pull off wins with a reliable system. Take 3-4 of our best players out and it hurts us more than most teams.

 

[MaxiBont]

Regardless of the improvement of the last 4 weeks, I don’t see how he should/does stay as coach if we don’t make Top 8.

Not making top 8 two seasons in a row is a disaster