Review Game days suck - Carlton prevail

[catters_28]

Ollie Henry was another who is a concern. One trick pony. If he doesn’t mark the ball he provides sfa in defensive pressure.

Didn't Menzel get dropped for this exact issue?

 

[foxdog50]

Because mannagh is 26 and cant wait and a number of contending teams will take him. Hes a monty to get a trade.

Knevitt and clohesy i hope would stay but you never know.

I just posted the same thing in a round about way. And I didn't read this.. Good men think alike

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Because mannagh is 26 and cant wait and a number of contending teams will take him. Hes a monty to get a trade.

Knevitt and clohesy i hope would stay but you never know.

He's waiting to the end of the year either way

 

[Pure_Ownage]

We know your love of Mannagh, it’s rare for you to make a post not demanding his inclusion, but that’s a hyperbolic claim at best.

We got beat up around the ball last night and adding a small forward would have changed FA. The delusion that probably the smallest player on our list would help fix that is laughable.
I’m not against him getting a game, but what he brings to the team ain’t going to fix our problems.

We are small and lack creativity and power in the guts. Clohesy (small but a competitive animal) and Stevens aren’t silver bullets but are probably the best options to help address those concerns.

Also if Stengle leaves, he won’t be going anywhere unless there is a godfather offer IMO. He’s next cab off the rank. He would know that.

Adding someone that can hit a target going inside 50 would help a lot. Did you not watch the game last night?

Now admittedly our forwards refusal to lead at the ball carrier doesnt help but we are atrocious at delivering the ball to a forwards advantage and mannagh is good at that and therefore should be playing. Its quite obvious.

 

[Zouz Kitty]

Being there live it just stood out the gap in class and endeavor. We don’t compete hard enough around the contests. They continually walked out of tackles and were able to free themselves. When they forced us down the line we got out marked most of the time. Our defence has been given no time to set up because who ever we play atm gets in first chain the ball out and is able to separate our interceptors leaving lots of one on ones.

I guess pressure causes mistakes but our decision making when coming out of the backline was terrible as we consistently turned it over or kicked to an outnumber. We are not hard to play against and it has been a long time since that has been the case.

Very sad to see Hawk go off like that as he is a legend of our club and we have been so lucky to have him. Hopefully he gets back for a farewell but he was practically incapable of competing tonight.
Cripps torched us but he was afforded so much space and time. Hopefully the MC will see the need to change! Very hard right now to see the wheel turn but it will eventually!

An excellent observation Mancini, you nailed it.

In the Sydney game our backline zoning was spread across the wings, from half back to back line. Our guys were not on their oppo players. Sydney were able to take advantage of all that free area. As a result of the one on one contests, other backs had to scramble to the ball.

As you were at the game, do you think the lack of time to set up is compromised by the zoning spread + Carlton used that to advantage to separate our interceptors? Consequently, were Carlton forwards able to out body our defence?

Geelong had the best defence in the league for a few years, with mostly the same players, excepting Bews. May need to be corrected on that statement.

Considering our MF woes, is it reasonable to consider our former, stronger defence would have the ability to gain possession + move the ball to our forward line?

Now we must create a strategy + decide which players have the ability to either use the wings, or my favourite, a choreography of players streaming through the corridor.

Atm, I think our choices based on form + ability are:
Dangerfield
Zuthrie
Kolo
Holmes
Dempsey
Miers
Atkins
Close
Bruhn
Clark
Mannagh
Humphries
Knevitt
Clohesy
Rotating according to oppo team (Scott has to be more flexible) + getting games into under 50/100 game players

Cameron is allowed to roam a little, no more time in the backline. Use his strength from the centre heading towards goals.

With the addition of a return to form:
Cuthrie
Stewart
Bowes
SDK out of defence
Blitz ???
JHenry

'Some' of whom only need a slight improvement + for younger players, I think advancement + development will continue with games.

By choosing the above players, my intention is to provide a spread of talent through all areas: disposals, tackles, goals, marks etc.

Obviously, there are other players who will contribute, my focus is for the future + my philosophy is to get games to develop our potential guns. A bonus if we make finals.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

He's waiting to the end of the year either way

Mannagh? I doubt it he doesnt have that time til end 2025. His agent will be telling him to get out at the end of the year. Its just a matter of if we grant the request or not.

Knevitt is a different situation due to age but if i was him id be filthy.

 

[Commando]

Chris Scott - "we're not going to say, oh well, now we're 8 and 6, we're going to be rebuilding... We haven't done that for 14 years, not going to start now. "

look at the next month.. all tough games
Have to keep going to the well
I agree a rebuild is due but we aren't quite at the play the kids stage .. yet

Maybe the Hawkins injury means we set up differently? At the end of it all we are probably destined to be that mid table team we all thought we would

The worrying part is the downward trajectory

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Rookie-listed players are not eligible to play in AFL home-and-away or finals matches unless they are elevated to the senior list, either to replace a retired player or a player with a long-term injury.

We played dempsey off the rookie list last year without an LTI. That rule doesnt exist anymore.

 

[Seeds]

The decision to not play a ruck when we have options, vs a red hot in form TDK needs to be questioned

Scotts been making these ruck decisions every since 2013. It wasnt questioned then. It will never be questioned.

 

[RegHickeyStand]

Save yourself the torture. I'm a replayaholic and am refusing this one unless armed with a swear jar and six bottles of shiraz.

I hear you. But I'm going to have a another look at SDK to see to see if there is any promise at all in the ruck.

 

[Seeds]

Didn't Menzel get dropped for this exact issue?

While providing far more offensively.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

I think I read somewhere that Hardie is a rookie, and they can't play him in the AFL side unless there's a long-term injury he can be nominated to replace. But I may be wrong on that score.

It's not correct. An old rule that was changed years ago

 

[Footy_Fan2007]

Tuohy escaping some criticism here.
That play in the last quarter where he actually stopped chasing the opposition letting them stroll into a goal was completely unacceptable.

 

[year of the cat]

Didn't Menzel get dropped for this exact issue?

Menzel had 4 recos as an excuse.

 

[catters_28]

Menzel had 4 recos as an excuse.

Exactly and he was still able to take a mark and hit the scoreboard. Wondering why Ollie seems to keep his spot despite having no excuse

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Mannagh? I doubt it he doesnt have that time til end 2025. His agent will be telling him to get out at the end of the year. Its just a matter of if we grant the request or not.

Knevitt is a different situation due to age but if i was him id be filthy.

I meant the end of this year.

Next year's list will look substantially different and may be a different situation for him entirely

 

[feelinfeline]

Difference between Round 7 and Round 15 midfield is astonishing. No wonder we got spanked!

Outs - C. Guthrie (27 disposals), R. Stanley (a ruckman!), T. Bruhn (big body mid) - starting Followers! B. Parfitt (big body mid)

In: T. Stewart, T. Atkins, J. Clark, G. Rohan (sub)

The ins are good players but I’d play Parfitt over Atkins and Stewart isn’t the same player he was back in the early rounds.


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Bruhn is a big body mid?

 

[Footy_Fan2007]

This is a good observation.

The pre-season reports were that we were working on the running capacity sprint sessions and fewer sessions over all so that we could play a back half rebound and effectively flood back and Joe the goose everyone on the rebound. Was apparently a Rahilly brain child I think.

Makes sense we'd be struggling to move away from that model if that's what we did all pre-season

Apparently they did ALOT more running than ever before. A brutal amount.
Could be the cause of the early burn out.
We looked a million bucks in the first 7 rounds. Pressure was off the charts and we looked incredibly fit.
Now we look the opposite.

 

[kcattatac]

Rookie-listed players are not eligible to play in AFL home-and-away or finals matches unless they are elevated to the senior list, either to replace a retired player or a player with a long-term injury.

That was the old system with supp lists. Nowadays they can all play. Dempsey and chloesy both played in first year while on rookie list. Hardie was emergency so obviously eligible to play

 

[TheCattery2007]

What’s the obsession with Mannagh??

He kicked 1.2 against Adelaide and one of those points was from 50m when he had two Geelong players 20m out from goal and completely free. Those players were furious. I called it at the time that we wouldn’t see him for a long time after that selfish act. It was un-Geelong like. The coaches are rightly unforgiving. He might get a game later in the season but it has to burn so he doesn’t do it again.

Knevitt is the one for me. Get him in next week. Holmes in the midfield and Knevitt on a wing. Plus a ruckman… surely Parfitt comes back. Clark still needs to learn some of the basic rules - technically gave away a 50m at one point but the umpire applied the mercy rule and didn’t award it. Don’t get me wrong, Clark will be a bloody good player. He reminds me of a 19 year old Selwood. But at 19 years old Selwood was not holding up the midfield… we had guys like Kelly, Bartel, Ablett, Corey around him!







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[Zouz Kitty]

I agree 100% with you that Bowes probably needs some role clarity to be able to flourish.

But I’m also a little concerned. His 2 good games in the midfield have been against north and Richmond, the two worst sides. Maybe he just isn’t quite good enough to play as a full time mid against the better quality teams? Aside from those games he’s looked more like a solid enough role player most of the time. Maybe that’s all he’ll be.

We have to remember we're no longer in the 'Era' (remind me of the proper term), which ended with Selwood's retirement.

If Bowes is playing out of position, it means sacrificing of game style, not playing to strengths. So yes, he definitely needs role clarity. It seems Scott uses this strategy to develop players, perhaps a little different for a player of Bowes age? Or he thinks Bowes can develop to effectively play another role.

The following not aimed at you moond0g

Criticism of young players like Clark only serves as a lack of awareness, especially expecting him to be a Selwood replacement. Selwood was a once in a generation player of extraordinary talent. As cats_09 wisely stated:

The biggest difference I see between the 2 situations is that Selwood walked into a midfield rotation that included Ablett, Bartel, Corey & Kelly all coming into their peaks

Clark has walked into a midfield rotation that includes, Dangerfield in the latter stages of his career, Bruhn who's starting his career in the hoops & as a member of the midfield rotation himself, Holmes who's establishing himself as a player, plus Atkins, Blicavs who are the support roles. And don't forget, if all was going well then C. Guthrie would be part of that rotation, but we've barely seen him since 22

The Club persevered with Zuthrie, who many decried for years. Now the team is reaping the rewards. I think realistically, Clark critics + those who denounce other young players, should consider development managers + coaches' knowledge + experience. Frankly, we still maintain our motto: 'In Wells We Trust'.

 

[kickazz]

Which I agree with you. They haven't recruit him to play in 3 years time, they have recruit him to play now.. And they haven't yet done that for him. Yes I'd say 80% on here thinks Mannagh should be playing and I'm one of them. But if they don't play him rite now we scratch our heads in asking why recruit Mannagh.

And honestly if I was Mannagh at season's end I'd be asking the coaches where do I fit in your plans going forward? And if they don't know I'd be asking for a trade, as there would be plenty of clubs that are contending would want him. And we would be lucky to get his value back

The only thing I can think of is insurance in case Stengle leaves?

 

[BORIS332]

Which I agree with you. They haven't recruit him to play in 3 years time, they have recruit him to play now.. And they haven't yet done that for him. Yes I'd say 80% on here thinks Mannagh should be playing and I'm one of them. But if they don't play him rite now we scratch our heads in asking why recruit Mannagh.

And honestly if I was Mannagh at season's end I'd be asking the coaches where do I fit in your plans going forward? And if they don't know I'd be asking for a trade, as there would be plenty of clubs that are contending would want him. And we would be lucky to get his value back

It’s even worse that we used pick 36 on him. Perhaps the coaching staff don’t rate him as highly as the recruiting staff did.

 

[Footy_Fan2007]

We know your love of Mannagh, it’s rare for you to make a post not demanding his inclusion, but that’s a hyperbolic claim at best.

We got beat up around the ball last night and adding a small forward would have changed FA. The delusion that probably the smallest player on our list would help fix that is laughable.
I’m not against him getting a game, but what he brings to the team ain’t going to fix our problems.

We are small and lack creativity and power in the guts. Clohesy (small but a competitive animal) and Stevens aren’t silver bullets but are probably the best options to help address those concerns.

Also if Stengle leaves, he won’t be going anywhere unless there is a godfather offer IMO. He’s next cab off the rank. He would know that.

Mannagh can play midfield. He’s not just a small forward.

 

[kcattatac]

Why would they request trades? 4 of your 5 are likely in the Rd 1 team next year. The other will get delisted and won't be picked up elsewhere

Because the mc have shown no interest in them so why hang around