Review Game days suck - Carlton prevail

[BORIS332]

Exactly and he was still able to take a mark and hit the scoreboard. Wondering why Ollie seems to keep his spot despite having no excuse

Probably because he’s kicked 21 goals from 13 games.

 

[Footy_Fan2007]

Difference between Round 7 and Round 15 midfield is astonishing. No wonder we got spanked!

Outs - C. Guthrie (27 disposals), R. Stanley (a ruckman!), T. Bruhn (big body mid) - starting Followers! B. Parfitt (big body mid)

In: T. Stewart, T. Atkins, J. Clark, G. Rohan (sub)

The ins are good players but I’d play Parfitt over Atkins and Stewart isn’t the same player he was back in the early rounds.


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None of those players would have made any difference last night unfortunately.

 

[Seeds]

This seasons only marginally better then 99. And still on the downwrd trajectory phase.

Our best under 26 player looks like leaving (just like colbert did).

 

[BORIS332]

Apparently they did ALOT more running than ever before. A brutal amount.
Could be the cause of the early burn out.
We looked a million bucks in the first 7 rounds. Pressure was off the charts and we looked incredibly fit.
Now we look the opposite.

I agree, it feels like the change in preseason approach has hurt us. Our running numbers last night were fairly comparable to Carlton’s, though. The biggest thrashing we got on the stat sheet was clearances, contested possessions and inside 50s. They have less to do with fitness.

 

[Seeds]

Stanley not looking so bad now is he.

Always always play a ruck in the first ruck role.

 

[feelinfeline]

Hardie and Humphries were the emergencies, which suggests they’ll be first in, unless they have shockers in the VFL or someone else has a standout game.

I’m confident we’ll have at least one debut next week. Hopefully two.

 

[Seeds]

Exactly and he was still able to take a mark and hit the scoreboard. Wondering why Ollie seems to keep his spot despite having no excuse

Especially when we have rohan as sub who plays exactly the same role but with defensive pressure and is also probsbly our best foward at contesting the aerial ball and bringing it to ground. He aint the future but he offers more right now.

 

[Seeds]

What’s the obsession with Mannagh??

He kicked 1.2 against Adelaide and one of those points was from 50m when he had two Geelong players 20m out from goal and completely free. Those players were furious. I called it at the time that we wouldn’t see him for a long time after that selfish act. It was un-Geelong like. The coaches are rightly unforgiving. He might get a game later in the season but it has to burn so he doesn’t do it again.

Knevitt is the one for me. Get him in next week. Holmes in the midfield and Knevitt on a wing. Plus a ruckman… surely Parfitt comes back. Clark still needs to learn some of the basic rules - technically gave away a 50m at one point but the umpire applied the mercy rule and didn’t award it. Don’t get me wrong, Clark will be a bloody good player. He reminds me of a 19 year old Selwood. But at 19 years old Selwood was not holding up the midfield… we had guys like Kelly, Bartel, Ablett, Corey around him!







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Gees completely forgot about knevitt. Where is he? Looked so promising last year and one bad game and we never see him again.

 

[CHAWKTS]

His direct opponent was best on ground

re SDK. This is where we can choose to be hyper critical or see some (balanced) positives. Whereas most of the time this year in the ruck there was no balance really to be found given the dominance.

Granted TDK was amongst the best few for Carlton. A few comments…

1. He is probably now arguably the best in form ruckman in the comp (Grundy in mix)
2. He (‘obviously) has very similar traits to SDK but is a few years older and 5 years more experience in the ruck
3. This is the first week I remember where our ruckman (‘albeit still soundly beaten) gave us something back
4. SDK was dominated early but I think fought back well
5. We were pretty much neck and neck in centre clearances all game. Around the ground clearances we got smashed and that could be a ruck technique or strength thing (and lack of midfield!)


So no problem pointing out the balance that his opponent was very good and had influence in the game, but balanced against for mine a postive offensive game for SDK first time really rucking and something Imho to work with. TBH I would stick with him over Blitz from what I saw (but I then don’t know what to do with Blitz given last two weeks he has matched up on Goulden and Cripps!)

 

[CHAWKTS]

I don’t think tuohy was unwilling to chase, he was simply unable. Physically done.

He had some mates in that regard in the last qtr.

It is what happens when you rely on players who are past their prime, or players who are not yet in their prime. Our team is a bit bipolar, we need to accept that.

I agree about 2E. My criticism all year has nothing to do with his attitude. And I do recognise that when he is in the contest he is still pretty strong. As you would expect from an experienced good player. He also does do the running when you look at tracker.

But he just can’t do the right running defensively. Wants to but can’t (any of us who have played any social sport and got old knows this feeling…you think you are in the right spot and you are not)

if it was just 2E then maybe you can cover but when you have 2E, Hawkins, Duncan, Rohan (even though fast in contests he doesn’t cover the ground consistently), blitz who are all just that split second off - adding to Jezza and Henry who don’t really defend - that is a third of the team creating small gaps for good opposition to slice through. The rest just can’t cover.

We are going to have to make those hard calls to improve our full field defence (but THEN we lose offensive experience and of course get slighter bodies so it will take time)

 

[Pure_Ownage]

I meant the end of this year.

Next year's list will look substantially different and may be a different situation for him entirely

It could be but he also may have one foot out the door by then anyway.

 

[BORIS332]

re SDK. This is where we can choose to be hyper critical or see some (balanced) positives. Whereas most of the time this year in the ruck there was no balance really to be found given the dominance.

Granted TDK was amongst the best few for Carlton. A few comments…

1. He is probably now arguably the best in form ruckman in the comp (Grundy in mix)
2. He (‘obviously) has very similar traits to SDK but is a few years older and 5 years more experience in the ruck
3. This is the first week I remember where our ruckman (‘albeit still soundly beaten) gave us something back
4. SDK was dominated early but I think fought back well
5. We were pretty much neck and neck in centre clearances all game. Around the ground clearances we got smashed and that could be a ruck technique or strength thing (and lack of midfield!)


So no problem pointing out the balance that his opponent was very good and had influence in the game, but balanced against for mine a postive offensive game for SDK first time really rucking and something Imho to work with. TBH I would stick with him over Blitz from what I saw (but I then don’t know what to do with Blitz given last two weeks he has matched up on Goulden and Cripps!)

TDK is only one year older than SDK.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

This seasons only marginally better then 99. And still on the downwrd trajectory phase.

Our best under 26 player looks like leaving (just like colbert did).

If youre talking about stengle hes not our best under 26 player holmes is (miers is also in that conversation).

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Hardie and Humphries were the emergencies, which suggests they’ll be first in, unless they have shockers in the VFL or someone else has a standout game.

I’m confident we’ll have at least one debut next week. Hopefully two.

Mannagh was the standby emergency the weeks before so we keep rotating that spot.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

What’s the obsession with Mannagh??

He kicked 1.2 against Adelaide and one of those points was from 50m when he had two Geelong players 20m out from goal and completely free. Those players were furious. I called it at the time that we wouldn’t see him for a long time after that selfish act. It was un-Geelong like. The coaches are rightly unforgiving. He might get a game later in the season but it has to burn so he doesn’t do it again.

Knevitt is the one for me. Get him in next week. Holmes in the midfield and Knevitt on a wing. Plus a ruckman… surely Parfitt comes back. Clark still needs to learn some of the basic rules - technically gave away a 50m at one point but the umpire applied the mercy rule and didn’t award it. Don’t get me wrong, Clark will be a bloody good player. He reminds me of a 19 year old Selwood. But at 19 years old Selwood was not holding up the midfield… we had guys like Kelly, Bartel, Ablett, Corey around him!







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There is no obsession-you are just not being objective.

 

[CHAWKTS]

Does he have the tools to be a long term ruckman?
I note his brother has been a spare parts sort of player until this season where his ruck work has gone up a level

By the look of them SDK has very similar tools to TDK. Don’t have to go back too far where TDK was “useless” and “soft” and playing VFL…cats were real shot of getting him due for that reason. Now he is in best 2 or 3 rucks in the comp and the “prototype”.

I can’t see why SDK can be exact same prototype to be honest. 3 years younger and no ruck training. I would persist while getting Toby in and out until he gets afl ready

 

[thejester]

Our mids are cursed with having an historically poor ruck setup. I remember Sandilands for Freo. So dominant. And I remember Nat Fyfe's golden years. And Fyfe's drop-off form straight after Sandilands retired.
Goggin would not let a rover come in for him when Farmer was playing. He guarded his position with Farmer jealously. Well known. Mids are heavily dependant on their rucks. We need to acknowledge our mids are always at a disadvantage.
When is the last time you saw Atkins et al get an easy ball and clearance from good ruckwork?

I mean clearly our ruck situation could be better but I don't think there's any real evidence to suggest this is true in the modern game, and TBH I think it often gets it backwards. Because I'm an idiot and I have too much time on my hands, I looked up Freo's 2013 season. Fyfe averaged 5.9 clearances a game that year. Sandilands played 10 games; Fyfe played in 9 of those games. In those 9 games, Fyfe averaged 5.4 clearances. I'm sure Freo as a whole benefitted from having Sandilands rather than the mighty Jonathan Griffin in the side but it seemed to not matter to Fyfe.

 

[Play it Sam]

Apparently they did ALOT more running than ever before. A brutal amount.
Could be the cause of the early burn out.
We looked a million bucks in the first 7 rounds. Pressure was off the charts and we looked incredibly fit.
Now we look the opposite.

Perhaps it's all relative. You can run your arse off and there's always someone else can do that as well as bring skills to the party, which we are bereft of. Can't run with it if you havent got the ball. Carlton were so fast around the ball and intuitive for each other.

 

[CHAWKTS]

I think it's about time that we just realise that statistically, over the last 5 games, we are easily the worst side in the competition. 18th in disposal efficiency?

Yes, Clark is a disaster. 40% disposal efficiency is not AFL standard. Dropping him won't make a bit of difference. Hardie could easily do his role, IMHO, but it wouldn't change the team's chances at all.

Yes, we have a small, underweight team now, and the midfield just gets monstered.

Yes, it is clear that the selectors and coaches took a huge risk in searching for plan B and gambled by not playing a dedicated ruck, but it was remarkably stupid and everyone knew it would never work.

Yes, we would easily lose every game from here until season's end.

But Carlton are definitely the better team, by far, with a premiership window in front of them. Their fans are sooks though, and let's hope karma strips them of any chance to hold the cup.

I have spoken.

I found myself immediately switching my 2024 allegence to Swans - for the sole reason that someone has to put Carlton in their place. Of all the teams I dislike no one gets close to Carlton. Not just fans but a fair amount of their players!

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Because the mc have shown no interest in them so why hang around

The mc is about to show a lot of interest in them end of year

 

[feelinfeline]

Mannagh was the standby emergency the weeks before so we keep rotating that spot.

True but unfortunately he now hasn’t played for a month.

He’s in the mix too if he has a good one.

 

[00VicWard001]

Reward some VFL lads.

Won’t play finals, currently a bottom 2 team and have consistently performed like one for over 2 months, major issues everywhere.

Let’s hope we actually get the reward of being a bottom 2 team!!!

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Stanley not looking so bad now is he.

Always always play a ruck in the first ruck role.

I think Stanley would have looked worse

 

[00VicWard001]

Yes, it's mad. That kid has his future in front of him and he's fearless.

The way he took that hit to get a free kick near goal showed a lot of nous. Put his legs up so he had to be infringed. Love how he goes about it.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

It could be but he also may have one foot out the door by then anyway.

Tbh we're probably his best shot