GC & Carlton Given Priority Access to State League Players

[Harlequin Dream]

So have needles in haystacks.

From last years national draft 6/10 state league players would play round 1 for the Blues next year.

It isn't that much of a risk and there is plenty of reward available.

These picks are better than an end of first round priority pick.

 

[JackFlash]

Neither will State League players !!




He needs a better attitude and a significant weight loss campaign.

Looks alright to me?

 

[Gethelred]

All year long Carlton fans use the excuse of playing so many teenagers for their poor performances, then they get given a free opportunity to pick up some mature talent or to on-trade them whilst still keeping their draft picks and they are still complaining. Giving Carlton more draft picks only helps you in 4-5 years. It won't do anything for Carlton in 2019 which is what the AFL is concerned about.

Which is true, but something of a smokescreen.

Mature AFL players would definitively improve us, absolutely, but we're not talking about AFL players, are we? Players who are not drafted or are delisted are generally looked over for a reason. I'm hoping that we use these picks either to pick up a player with oodles of talent who got overlooked due to having poor work ethic and being overweight (if we can turn him around, could be a huge leg up) or that we use these picks to obtain mid/late second round picks, because this draft is rather deep as well as having a good top end.

 

[Suma Magic]

If they keep the picks, the draft will be diluted.

If they trade them, it won't be.

So I've got a good idea what 16 teams are hoping will happen.

 

[Gethelred]

Please can you show me your posts complaining about similar inequities when Port bottomed out, but lost all their picks to GWS and GCS?

Because your argument will be a lot stronger if you have said similar in previous years.

Fallacious argument.

Being self-interested isn't being wrong, and just because someone didn't argue on your behalf when this happened to you doesn't mean that it isn't unjust.

 

[master bate]

If they keep the picks, the draft will be diluted.

If they trade them, it won't be.

So I've got a good idea what 16 teams are hoping will happen.

Have they said whether they can be traded during the draft? Because I'm sure that's what all 18 teams would want. Get's to pick 30 and you'd rather the mature player than whichever kids on top of your list, you do the deal. Would make for a tense night for the mature age players but also provide a glimpse in to the future when live trading of players is allowed.

 

[Dave]

Did you forget you cheated the salary cap as well, we actually lost one out of it

No, but I’m not squealing about you getting rewarded for it.

 

[footyfan1978]

Can someone post a link to exact rules in how these picks work?
So far nothing on AFL gives any full details.
Like we get some access but is it an actual draft of Carlton and Gold Coast of 5 picks and an order for each pick?
Do Carlton gets extra spots on primary list and this has no effect on our last picks in national draft?
Are these Carlton pre-listings able to goto rookie list in addition to the ones we will have later on for actual rookie list?
Are these contracts players can negotiate for themselves ?
Are the AFL still making it up as the go along and not even worked the details out yet?
Why have I not seen details yet ?
So weird how this seems to be headlines but not much detail released on AFL site to answer these things.

 

[davis_756]

No, but I’m not squealing about you getting rewarded for it.

Rewarded with the biggest punishment ever received, logic not your strong point I'm guessing.

 

[Suma Magic]

Have they said whether they can be traded during the draft? Because I'm sure that's what all 18 teams would want. Get's to pick 30 and you'd rather the mature player than whichever kids on top of your list, you do the deal. Would make for a tense night for the mature age players but also provide a glimpse in to the future when live trading of players is allowed.

I'm not sure why Carlton or GC would want that, as it would introduce a risk that someone would draft the player they want, or wanted to trade.

If I was them I'd just set up an auction system for the picks and then work out if they want to trade them or keep them.

 

[Dave]

Rewarded with the biggest punishment ever received

That’s nice dear. How many #1 picks did you get in the years following?

 

[Suma Magic]

Can someone post a link to exact rules in how these picks work?
So far nothing on AFL gives any full details.
Like we get some access but is it an actual draft of Carlton and Gold Coast of 5 picks and an order for each pick?
Do Carlton gets extra spots on primary list and this has no effect on our last picks in national draft?
Are these Carlton pre-listings able to goto rookie list in addition to the ones we will have later on for actual rookie list?
Are these contracts players can negotiate for themselves ?
Are the AFL still making it up as the go along and not even worked the details out yet?
Why have I not seen details yet ?
So weird how this seems to be headlines but not much detail released on AFL site to answer these things.

I imagine it's like the GWS pre-listing trades.

If they have already nominated for the draft then they can set their contract terms.

It's not confirmed, but you'd imagine that the players could reject a rookie list offer by the Blues/GC/others prior to the draft.

I think GC get two additional Cat A rookies spots, I don't think it was mentioned that Carlton get any.

I'd guess it would be an alternating 5 pick "draft". e.g. GC have pick 1, they pick someone or trade them. Then it's Carlton's turn and so on.

So for pick 1, whoever has it would just ask the other 17 clubs to put in their highest bid pick-wise and state who they want the team to draft/trade with that pick. Then GC/Carlton decide if they want to trade a player to the highest bidder or keep a player.

 

[footyfan1978]

That’s nice dear. How many #1 picks did you get in the years following?

We lost 5 important picks over those two years. Nothing will ever get them back. Thankfully 2019 we start afresh with the guys we were going to take with picks 1 and 2 we lost, about to end their careers.

Still not seen details of these access picks.
Anyone seen the fine details of it?

 

[footyfan1978]

I imagine..

It's not confirmed, but you'd imagine ...
I'd guess..

So none of us still know. Thanks AFL for making things up as go along and keeping us footy punters in the dark and guessing only.

 

[gbatman]

Please can you show me your posts complaining about similar inequities when Port bottomed out, but lost all their picks to GWS and GCS?

Because your argument will be a lot stronger if you have said similar in previous years.

I never commented on that so that comment is irrelevant. My opinion is the same for any club who hits rock bottom. Perhaps not the first season of bottoming out but after a couple sure. I think any assistance is warranted to any club under the same circumstances.

Lets consider this, Port may have risen back up in better shape and quicker. Same can be said for Essendon and clubs alike who have spent time down the bottom.

If it's not genuine draft pick assistance then it should be salary cap assistance to allow bottom clubs an equal opportunity to the top clubs with free agents and nearing free agent players.

There is no doubt that affected Port, it affected all clubs, Carlton too.

What I would like to see is if a club spends two years in the bottom 4. Their minimum total player payments drops to 85% until they next reach the top 10. This would allow bottom clubs to clear up around an extra $1.2M which means that those clubs don't have to take on so many salary dump type players, invest more in youth and be able to compete more with top clubs for top level mature age talent.

If the AFL want to make it a level playing field then something needs to be done in regards to equal access to free agency and trades.

But allowing AFL clubs to rebuild in an acceptable time frame from extensive rebuilds means giving a bit extra otherwise it just takes to long. The amount of talent required and the amount of talent which is accessible in the current environment does not equal an acceptable time frame for extensively rebuilding clubs and not all clubs are in the same circumstances. Some quite simple have more talent to find than others. Not all clubs who bottom out have the same amount of players to acquire and that's the tricky part when considering extra assistance.

I have not enjoyed seeing all these teams stuck to the bottom for such long periods. I'm happy for any of them to gain assistance.

 

[Suma Magic]

So none of us still know. Thanks AFL for making things up as go along and keeping us footy punters in the dark and guessing only.

I'd be surprised if it didn't work how I suggested it.

 

[davis_756]

That’s nice dear. How many #1 picks did you get in the years following?

Good luck champ, you need all the help you can get.

 

[Dave]

Good luck champ, you need all the help you can get.

Oooh I’ve been champed. Oh noes, however will I cope.

 

[davis_756]

Oooh I’ve been champed. Oh noes, however will I cope.

That’s nice dear. How many #1 picks did you get in the years following?

Lol, like I said before good luck

 

[JohnnyFontane90]

That’s nice dear. How many #1 picks did you get in the years following?

those number 1 picks got us back to square 1. we made our own bed so we have to sleep in it, but carlton didn't gain the same advantage from those priority picks that collingwood, hawthorn, richmond and west coast all did. those clubs were rebuilding, we were clearing debris.

That's why in that period where were were kinda okay from 08-13 we had 4-5 good players, then there was 50 feet of crap then the rest of the squad.

 

[master bate]

I'm not sure why Carlton or GC would want that, as it would introduce a risk that someone would draft the player they want, or wanted to trade.

If I was them I'd just set up an auction system for the picks and then work out if they want to trade them or keep them.

I mean that GC and Carlton pick the 5 guys they want now, but instead of limiting them to trade these players in trade week/s they have the option of waiting until the draft.

Depending on which players they select there will probably be clubs coming to them with trade offers with picks in the 20's-50's in trade week, but in many ways it would be better for everyone to keep the trade window open all through the draft.

The AFL is yet to allow live trading of players during the draft - clearly because it's a tough process for established AFL players to be sold off live as the draft happens. But they get a unique opportunity now because these 5 prelisted players aren't really owed the same security. Established players have to agree to trades. I assume these guys are entering the draft just like any other player and are all open to going to any of the 18 clubs.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Not Carlton, different rules for different clubs

Who did you lose to FA that didn't grant you a compo pick? I can't believe Carlton if all clubs complaining they get stiffed by the AFL. The club who gets handouts through extremely generous fixtures every year. The club who was allowed to pay Judd under the table through Visy for years. The club who was never investigated for tanking even though one of your coaches admitted it on two separate occasions.

Give me a spell.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

OK mate, there was no financial assistance proovided to hire Roos.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/...e/news-story/d1a6ed54de7f3cab5b8f619c9055879d

They didn't help out in the same way they didn't punish you for tanking.
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/sp...g/news-story/b64f96ba348c3bb592cd3b80ad386293


You have also had 3 start of first round draft picks (a joint record).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priority_draft_pick


But sure, what have the AFL ever done for you.

Ok so you admit the AFL didn't pay for or recruit Roos and we didn't receive any priority picks after 2009 when the rules were changed. Glad we could clear that up.

 

[replicant]

So have needles in haystacks.

This is a bit defeatist i think. Here's a list of guys we've picked as rookies:
Ben Ronke
Lewis Melican
Jake Lloyd
Dane Rampe
Harry Cunningham
Heath Grundy
Nick Smith
Daniel Robinson
Kieren Jack
Tom Papley
Callum Sinclair (Rookie drafted by Eagles)

All best 22 except maybe Robinson. All except Robinson would be in your best 22 as well (or would in their prime). There are good quality players out there. If you expected the AFL to give you pick 3, or pick 12 and get another star, then sure, you can be disappointed. But if you just need good players who are going to be best 22, then there are many, many state league players who are better than the players you have on your list already. Maybe not a gun like Kelly, but there are lots who will make you better then you are, you just need to identify them.

 

[Suma Magic]

I mean that GC and Carlton pick the 5 guys they want now, but instead of limiting them to trade these players in trade week/s they have the option of waiting until the draft.

Depending on which players they select there will probably be clubs coming to them with trade offers with picks in the 20's-50's in trade week, but in many ways it would be better for everyone to keep the trade window open all through the draft.

The AFL is yet to allow live trading of players during the draft - clearly because it's a tough process for established AFL players to be sold off live as the draft happens. But they get a unique opportunity now because these 5 prelisted players aren't really owed the same security. Established players have to agree to trades. I assume these guys are entering the draft just like any other player and are all open to going to any of the 18 clubs.

Yeah good point, I’m not sure what they will do.