No Oppo Supporters General AFL discussion and other club news

[Ned Ryerson]

They are absolute vultures. I hope other teams just decide to treat them differently and won’t entertain dealing with them in the first place.

For Kelly they got two first rounders, 24 and 37 and gave back steak knives. This despite him being uncontracted and notably homesick with a family issue. They can't then turn around and say a late first rounder is fair for Bazsmith and a future likely late last round pick is fair for Oliver. Play the game correctly or get ****ed and lose Smith in the national draft.

 

[Dewnior]

For Kelly they got two first rounders, 24 and 37 and gave back steak knives. This despite him being uncontracted and notably homesick with a family issue. They can't then turn around and say a late first rounder is fair for Bazsmith and a future likely late last round pick is fair for Oliver. Play the game correctly or get ****ed and lose Smith in the national draft.

The Cats play on a completely different field when it comes to trade week and have the AFL backing. It's mind-blowing that the rest of the competition just sit back and allow it.

 

[extractasam]

Smith will get to Geelong no matter what happens tbh. Clubs are terrified of player managers and how it will affect future dealings with their guys. Do them over you lose access to their entire pool in the future and they’ll make life very difficulty for you. They basically run the show

 

[MasterSamurai]

Pick 17+ de koning or another first round pick. That's what the dogs should be asking for. Nothing less. The rhetoric on Fox trade show is disgusting. Saying pick 17 is enough for a 23 year old gun midfielder. Yea right, he's definitely worth less than a 29 year old defender ( a good one at that) with a bung back! Contract or no contract, the dogs should absolutely go to town on those farmers who look like tennis players.

 

[Cleavy]

trade period is too long. they could knock it all over in 1 week. it's just about keeping the AFL in the news. (because cricket is lousy at self promotion)

 

[kenneje]

Pick 17+ de koning or another first round pick. That's what the dogs should be asking for. Nothing less. The rhetoric on Fox trade show is disgusting. Saying pick 17 is enough for a 23 year old gun midfielder. Yea right, he's definitely worth less than a 29 year old defender ( a good one at that) with a bung back! Contract or no contract, the dogs should absolutely go to town on those farmers who look like tennis players.

It's amazing what a year, an ACL and the Geelong mafia will do to the value of a trade.

Remember the talk last year was we'd have to depart with our pick 5 PLUS something else.

 

[earthworms]

Surprised to see Sam Mitchell trending in the news, Just the NBA Sam Mitchell

 

[HawthornHawk]

Surprised to see Sam Mitchell trending in the news, Just the NBA Sam Mitchell

That was a wild clip

 

[lethalselbow]

trade period is too long. they could knock it all over in 1 week. it's just about keeping the AFL in the news. (because cricket is lousy at self promotion)

People complaining about the trade week length is far less interesting then trade week, but equally as long. Be happy there is AFL to talk about.

 

[lethalselbow]

Pick 17+ de koning or another first round pick. That's what the dogs should be asking for. Nothing less. The rhetoric on Fox trade show is disgusting. Saying pick 17 is enough for a 23 year old gun midfielder. Yea right, he's definitely worth less than a 29 year old defender ( a good one at that) with a bung back! Contract or no contract, the dogs should absolutely go to town on those farmers who look like tennis players.

Bulldogs need to be happy what they get. 17 and maybe a tiny sweetener is better than nothing.

 

[Buckemenico]

Garbage. At that price Bulldogs premiership hopes are better if they let smith walk to draft and play for north

 

[Mercy Seat]

Pick 17+ de koning or another first round pick. That's what the dogs should be asking for. Nothing less. The rhetoric on Fox trade show is disgusting. Saying pick 17 is enough for a 23 year old gun midfielder. Yea right, he's definitely worth less than a 29 year old defender ( a good one at that) with a bung back! Contract or no contract, the dogs should absolutely go to town on those farmers who look like tennis players.

Cats want to say on one hand he’s not worth that much in a trade, whilst also offering him a 6 year $800k (?) deal with added land packages and extended Cotton On sponsorship. Doesn’t quite add up.

 

[grumbleguts]

I must be a true outlier. I've been watching US sports for over 60 years and my two favorite sports overall are Hockey (Canadian) and AFL (Australian). Of all the sports you have mentioned here, these are the two where genetics (while still very important overall) are, by comparison, the least determining factor for greatness. Even the most gifted athlete would find it difficult to play either if they've not started at a young age. Probably the best examples I could give (which will absolutely date me) were the contrast between Wayne Gretzky and Hakeem Olajuwan. Hakeem didn't pick up the game of basketball until he was in his late teens, yet went on to become an all-time great. If Gretzky hadn't skated until he was 18, no way he'd have made it out of beer league.

This is a really long-winded way of saying my US bias still has me thinking AFL may very well be the most difficult to umpire, particularly when of the sports mentioned here, they are the only part-time "professional" umpires/referees.

It's ridiculous to think that anything in America could be remotely difficult. They can't spell, they can't even adapt to a massive world-wide unit change. And they have to crowd-fund staffing costs.

 

[FB19]

There’s no way Bailey Smith

6

Bailey Smith

Age

23

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

8.5

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

19.8

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

3.2

4star

D

14.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.4

5star

CL

1.6

4star

doesn’t get taken before 17. What’s he going to do sit out another year after missing this year? Careers are short call the bluff dogs and screw those campaigners over.

 

[extractasam]

I’m more interested to see Bailey smiths contract terms would be if a trade to Geelong is struck vs if he ends up having to go through the draft. Would it not be easy to tell what they are up to?

 

[KermitJagger]

I’m more interested to see Bailey smiths contract terms would be if a trade to Geelong is struck vs if he ends up having to go through the draft. Would it not be easy to tell what they are up to?

This is what I thought. It was my understanding that PSD you can set your salary but ND you're committed to a certain pay structure.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Cats want to say on one hand he’s not worth that much in a trade, whilst also offering him a 6 year $800k (?) deal with added land packages and extended Cotton On sponsorship. Doesn’t quite add up.

They're essentially trying to structure Oliver and Smith as free agents. i.e. give the host clubs nothing while paying high enough salaries to win their services ahead of all others.

It requires double speak but every club does it when trying to get A grade players. We're doing it with Barass saying he's a key missing piece of our premiership puzzle while also saying he's a busted up 29 year old who got dogged by his club.

 

[HairyO]

Every year it feels the draft is getting more and more compromised with contracted players dictating to their club where they want to go, academy picks, father son picks, crazy high draft picks as compo when restricted free agents move clubs, etc, etc.

And then to top it off Geelong could somehow manage to walk in Bailey Smith and Clayton Oliver through some pretty shady (although not technically illegal) deals.

I wonder just how much more compromised the draft can get before they have to either so a hard reset or just do away with it completely like the NRL did?

They are absolutely breaking the AFL rules. It is tampering and everyone knows it. The problem is, the AFL is gutless and hate any negative stories so will sign off on it.

The Demons and Dogs both need to call out Geelong publicly. Force the AFL to respond.

Look at what happened when St Kilda bitched about free agency. To shut them up they made sure they got pick 8 for Battle. Now the Saints have gone completely quiet.

 

[kazzooka]

We had renowned expert Adam Cooney on trade radio yesterday claiming that no-one would dare touch Bailey in the PSD to avoid annoying Paul Connors. If this was true and happened, there is no greater evidence that the player movement system is broken imo.

This is actually true, I think Buckley mentioned previously how powerful the player managers are.

You really can't play hardball on players and say you are going to keep a contracted player that wants out, or walk a player into the draft, or draft a player that has a preference elsewhere.

Say if West Coast were to refuse to trade Barrass, there is a real threat from his Manager that 1. he'll be getting other WCE players to request trades. 2. Will discourage other players they manage from requesting trades to WCE.

Conversely, if we were to not close the deal on barrass there would be the same threats to us.

 

[HairyO]

This is actually true, I think Buckley mentioned previously how powerful the player managers are.

You really can't play hardball on players and say you are going to keep a contracted player that wants out, or walk a player into the draft, or draft a player that has a preference elsewhere.

Say if West Coast were to refuse to trade Barrass, there is a real threat from his Manager that 1. he'll be getting other WCE players to request trades. 2. Will discourage other players they manage from requesting trades to WCE.

Conversely, if we were to not close the deal on barrass there would be the same threats to us.

Then WCE go to the AFL and the player manager gets banned for tampering.

Quite possibly illegal, not just against AFL rules. Player managers, much like the AFLPA, only have as much power as the AFL let them have. They wont bite the hand that feeds.

These guys sign up kids when they are drafted. That is 2 years where those kids get fixed rates where the managers cant do anything, but take their 5%. It is ridiculous.

 

[Spanish Sahara]

Then WCE go to the AFL and the player manager gets banned for tampering.

Quite possibly illegal, not just against AFL rules. Player managers, much like the AFLPA, only have as much power as the AFL let them have. They wont bite the hand that feeds.

These guys sign up kids when they are drafted. That is 2 years where those kids get fixed rates where the managers cant do anything, but take their 5%. It is ridiculous.

It's my understanding that the player managers don't get their 5% in the first two years and that only kicks in when they are on their second contract.

 

[Billyc]

I’ve always been surprised that contending clubs aren’t tighter when faced with trades that will strengthen a rival contender. At the moment we have:

• Port strengthening Collingwood if Houston gets there
• Dogs strengthening Cats if Smith gets there

That should be factored into those trades. Port and Dogs would see themselves as contending in the next 2-3 years and these trades strengthen our sides who will also be looking to challenge.

In Smith’s case, if he ends up in the draft and is picked by a weaker club, there’s something in that for dogs in not strengthening a top 4 side

 

[Mercy Seat]

I’ve always been surprised that contending clubs aren’t tighter when faced with trades that will strengthen a rival contender. At the moment we have:

• Port strengthening Collingwood if Houston gets there
• Dogs strengthening Cats if Smith gets there

That should be factored into those trades. Port and Dogs would see themselves as contending in the next 2-3 years and these trades strengthen our sides who will also be looking to challenge.

In Smith’s case, if he ends up in the draft and is picked by a weaker club, there’s something in that for dogs in not strengthening a top 4 side

That’s partly why the Lewis to Brisbane noise seemed ridiculous to me. Lions are going to be one of our biggest hurdles to potentially winning flags over the next few years, and them losing Joey D is great for us in that respect.

Handing them a ready made forward to replace him would be so counterproductive on a number of levels.

 

[HairyO]

I’ve always been surprised that contending clubs aren’t tighter when faced with trades that will strengthen a rival contender. At the moment we have:

• Port strengthening Collingwood if Houston gets there
• Dogs strengthening Cats if Smith gets there

That should be factored into those trades. Port and Dogs would see themselves as contending in the next 2-3 years and these trades strengthen our sides who will also be looking to challenge.

In Smith’s case, if he ends up in the draft and is picked by a weaker club, there’s something in that for dogs in not strengthening a top 4 side

Yep, is losing pick 17 worth a competitor not being better than they will be.

But also, does Smith ending up at Carlton make Carlton better than the Dogs? At the Roos I dont think anyone is worried for a year or 2.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

I think Carlton's first half of the year gave them a false confidence. When both key forwards are firing, and Weitering, they look great.

But that midfield is a one-man band. Way too vulnerable