Opinion Has this Carlton list already peaked?

[WalshistheGOAT]

The Blues are extremely reliant on Cripps.

Never in the history of footy has one team been so reliant on one player.

If Cripps plays an absolute blinder, Caltank can win any game at any time.

Richmond didn't build a dynasty centered pretty much entirely around Dustin Martin's heroics?

 

[Mr Meow]

Richmond didn't build a dynasty centered pretty much entirely around Dustin Martin's heroics?

Richmond had a way better defence, coach and gameplan though. They were hard to score against and generated lightning counter attacks Martin utilised.

Their bottom 10 players, while scrappers, were beautifully suited to a brand of chaos footy that especially worked well in finals.

Plus their midfield very ably supported Martin's destructive attacking capability by doing the dirty work.

I don't see the parallels with Cripps/Carlton.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Richmond had a way better defence, coach and gameplan though.

Their bottom 10 players, while scrappers, were beautifully suited to a dominant finals brand of chaos footy.

Plus their midfield very ably supported Martin's destructive attacking capability by doing the dirty work.

I don't see the parallels with Cripps/Carlton.

Richmond relied on Dusty just as much as Carlton do with Cripps. The only difference is their team was just better in general which lead to success but without Dusty there's every chance they never win a flag with that team.

Plus In 2023 we apparently relied entirely on Curnow, 2022 it was Cripps again, 2021 it was all Walsh. This year all we've heard is if Weitering goes down we're doomed...

Seems to just be the in vogue thing to say after last years Brownlow more than any sort of actual analysis.

I'd argue Collingwood rely more on N.Daicos than we do Cripps if I'm honest. Certainly last year at least.

 

[Mr Meow]

Richmond relied on Dusty just as much as Carlton do with Cripps. The only difference is their team was just better in general which lead to success but without Dusty there's every chance they never win a flag with that team.

Plus In 2023 we apparently relied entirely on Curnow, 2022 it was Cripps again, 2021 it was all Walsh. This year all we've heard is if Weitering goes down we're doomed...

Seems to just be the in vogue thing to say after last years Brownlow more than any sort of actual analysis.

I'd argue Collingwood rely more on N.Daicos than we do Cripps if I'm honest. Certainly last year at least.

Having the best defence in the league helped. That was an A+ group with the best structure/game plan possible.

They also had handier small/general forwards and utilities.

I'd say they had the best coach in the league during those years.

If Carlton replicated those three things then yes, you could say they are only as reliant on Cripps as Richmond were with Martin.

Anyway, let's agree to disagree on this one before it gets nasty.

 

[Fadge]

Are the Carlton folk really comparing their team to Richmond 2017-20, on the basis both teams have/had a top 5 player in the competition?

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Having the best defence in the league helped. That was an A+ group with the best structure/game plan possible.

They also had handier small/general forwards and utilities.

I'd say they had the best coach in the league during those years.

If Carlton replicated those three things then yes, you could say they are only as reliant on Cripps as Richmond were with Martin.

Anyway, let's agree to disagree on this one before it gets nasty.

In 2023 we made a prelim with Cripps having a fairly mediocre/down year by his standards. How did this happen if we rely on Cripps more than any team in the history of footy like what was claimed by the original post I responded to?

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Carlton are much the same as any team with a star player like Cripps. When the team is going poorly Cripps stands out as a gun player surrounded by spuds.

When the team is going well the reliance on Cripps seems irrelevant because the rest of the team is performing to their ability and Cripps doesn't seem as important.

In reality he just performs pretty much the same regardless of the rest of the team. The only difference is how the rest of the team is performing around him.

 

[Mr Meow]

In 2023 we made a prelim with Cripps having a fairly mediocre/down year by his standards. How did this happen if we rely on Cripps more than any team in the history of footy like what was claimed by the original post I responded to?

I'm talking about the last decade with Carlton. The latter half of 2023 I agree that it wasn't a Cripps carry job.

Richmond made top 4 2017-2020. They were a great team (especially in tough finals), with Martin the superstar to top it all off. A mentally strong side, hard to score against, in great synergy from player 1 to 22. I just don't see the parallel to this Carlton side.

If you take Martin out of that Richmond side and Cripps out of this Carlton side, then play them in a knockout final I'm confident Richmond would win by 10 goals.

 

[Fadge]

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

I'm talking about the last decade with Carlton. The latter half of 2023 I agree that it wasn't a Cripps carry job.

Richmond made top 4 2017-2020. They were a great team (especially in tough finals), with Martin the superstar to top it all off. A mentally strong side, hard to score against, in great synergy from player 1 to 22. I just don't see the parallel to this Carlton side.

If you take Martin out of that Richmond side and Cripps out of this Carlton side, then play them in a knockout final I'm confident Richmond would win by 10 goals.

I don't think you get what I'm saying. Anyway moving on.

 

[Mr Meow]

I don't think you get what I'm saying. Anyway moving on.

I do, you're saying that Carlton are no more reliant on Cripps to be a great team than Richmond were with Martin.

I disagree and have stated why. I agree that moving on now is a good outcome.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

View attachment 2255168

This the same Rocket Eade who has the all time record for most games coaches without a premiership?

Sounds like a guy id listen to!

 

[JustEatIt]

Richmond had a way better defence, coach and gameplan though. They were hard to score against and generated lightning counter attacks Martin utilised.

Their bottom 10 players, while scrappers, were beautifully suited to a brand of chaos footy that especially worked well in finals.

Plus their midfield very ably supported Martin's destructive attacking capability by doing the dirty work.

I don't see the parallels with Cripps/Carlton.

I agree with this. Hardwick made a gameplan that suited our current players and moved some pieces around.

I feel like Voss is trying to force an old gamestyle to players who don’t suit it. Blues look better when they go fast, not slow and chipping it around. When the ball hits the deck they seem to shit themselves too.

 

[VinnieB]

Charlie Curnow could never play finals footy again and still have 10x the career of Dan McSpud.

I think that’s what he’s hoping.

 

[VinnieB]

I agree with this. Hardwick made a gameplan that suited our current players and moved some pieces around.

I feel like Voss is trying to force an old gamestyle to players who don’t suit it. Blues look better when they go fast, not slow and chipping it around. When the ball hits the deck they seem to shit themselves too.

2003

 

[GC2015]

What happens with the more likely result, which is neither a Hawthorn landslide win or a Carlton upset? Let's say Hawthorn by 16 points in a competitive match.

You pretty much called it. Hawks win by 20 points.

 

[Fadge]

You pretty much called it. Hawks win by 20 points.

Perfect.

 

[nahnah]

Not that hard. 2 at each club. He's a pretty awful player. His stats flatter him with his little shit run arounds and one twos. He's completely ineffective and I don't care how "professional" he is or how good his diet is or his time trials. He's just not very good at football. Sorry

Here's my list club by club of (40) better midfielders:

Dawson Rankine Soligo
Neale Dunkley Ashcroft
Daicos x 2
Cripps Cerra (Smith)
Merrett
Serong Brayshaw Young Bolton
Anderson Flanders
Callaghan Green Coniglio
Holmes Smith Dangerfield
Newcombe Day Ward
Petracca Oliver
LDU
Butters Rozee JHF
Taranto
Steele
Gulden Warner
Bont Libba Richards
Kelly

Great call with Ward mate, didnt see it at the time but pretty obvious now

 

[Do_Beta_Rapport]

Time to start another rebuild and sack a coach.

Same old Carlton!

Da da da da da

 

[Atomboy]

View attachment 2255168

Are they advancing into, or retreating from, No Man’s Land ?

 

[Atomboy]

Time to start another rebuild and sack a coach.

Same old Carlton!

Da da da da da

How much leeway does Crazy Vossy get before the Blues pull the trigger ?.

0-5 if they lose to West Coast ?.

 

[Occidental]

Carlton’s finish to 2024 & start of 2025;

Lost GWS
Lost Western Bulldogs
Won North Melbourne
Lost Port Adelaide
Lost Collingwood
Lost Hawthorn
Won West Coast
Lost St Kilda
Lost Brisbane
Lost Richmond
Lost Hawthorn

2-9.
Only wins are North & Eagles.

 

[sexyhunk]

they actually could be in a more diabolical spot in terms of their list. They already have a top-heavy list in terms of the cap, thats not going away as they may not have choice and have to give TDK whatever it requires in length and dollars as he is by far their best players in their two games.

just a bad timing that TDK is ooc end of the year.

 

[Delisted]

Weitering looks very upset and disappointed in his teammates.

 

[doppleganger]

Matt Kennedy and Matt Owies were poor depth?

They were best 15 players!!