Autopsy Hawks v Shockers

[Thaihawk]

My point wasn't based on who misses out. I'm talking about flexibility of the team. Each week raises new challenges. As Clarkson said, squads win premierships. The players mentioned when fit make our squad better. A better squad means a higher ladder position.

We have missed these players this season. Huge huge outs, irrespective of early season form.

My response to the post was based on the stupidity that they should be traded. These guys are starting 22 and have been during premiership years. Short memories for some...

KOLOKOTRONIS

Hence, who do you leave out?

 

[Bumpswithagrin]

Was out last night and have only just surfaced so haven't seen the match but good to hear we had a solid win Sounds like Glass had a decent debut. Look forward to watching a replay later (I think.... being a Freo match, maybe not so much).

 

[tige19]

He certainly wouldn't have had 11 shots at goal if Frawley was playing.

I think Burton would be the match up Clarko would go for if it occurred again, imo much better reader of play than Chip and size wise is very good.

 

[Thaihawk]

I wonder when Hardwick will miss his first target.

My guess is 2021

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Maybe when Langers gets his first set shot.

 

[tige19]

My main question on Chip is whether if we lost him we'd be back to that problem of being exposed to gorillas. Won't there still be at least some games where we need to deal with sides bombing it to a Hawkins, Mason Cox etc?

Do agree, he stuck out a bit compared to Lake, who had the strength but also the incredible positioning and reliable disposal. But that last piece of Lake's career was something to behold, so it's a bit like asking someone to be the next Hodge in the backline.

(Wouid say the next Mitchell, except that the new Mitchell is so friggen good I'm starting to think we got a pretty epic apple for our orange).

Chip is woefully undersized against Gorillas anyway, he is more of a 2nd/3rd tall defender. He gets beaten terribly in the air by any forward who has length, I can't see how his positives outweigh the negatives in terms of pulling someone out of the current crop and adding him.

 

[tige19]

Don't all break your arms patting yourselves on the back...

Clarkson should be thanking his lucky stars that injury forced him to replan his approach to this season. If only he had been smart enough to listen to the doomsdayers here ten it would have been cherry ripe in round 3 and we would be top of the ladder.

Clarkson is such an idiot. All this stress and work on his part when the answer was so obvious.

Yawn

 

[CD Xbow]

I agree.

I have thought the same about Gibbo all season, you could tell his heart and body wasn't up to the challenge anymore.

Chip I was less convinced about, and I will probably get smashed for saying this but how he plays frustrates the hell out of me. I think Chip he is a pure defensive player, who is slower than our current defenders. No doubt he is at AFL level and would get a game at most teams, but not sure that he fits in our new look team. With all the talk of possible trade currency he would be the one I would consider shopping around, I think he would have a fair amount of value on the market and our youngsters have him covered.

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I can't believe this talk of trading Frawley. We have a problem with the monster forwards without Frawley, who has in the past handled the best 'bigs' in the game very well. People also seem to forget his toe injury, which has been a long term chronic problem which he has been playing with. He'll be better now he has had it treated.

With Gibson & Hodge leaving and the potential of mid/forward rotations for our current backs then I don't think there will be to much trouble fitting them, especially as you usually have a few long term injuries affecting players through the year. We look like we will have a very strong squad for 2018, perhaps we could challenge again that soon.

 

[flinchfree]

Don't all break your arms patting yourselves on the back...

Clarkson should be thanking his lucky stars that injury forced him to replan his approach to this season. If only he had been smart enough to listen to the doomsdayers here ten it would have been cherry ripe in round 3 and we would be top of the ladder.

Clarkson is such an idiot. All this stress and work on his part when the answer was so obvious.

 

[Roddy]

Um, self flagellation...

You ok, Roddy?

Fine thanks, you?

 

[Thaihawk]

- Sicily is playing like Easton Wood.
- Gunston is playing a role that we've never seen before and it's finally clicking.
- Glass seems like a Stratton type who can match up on talls and smalls, but seems to have a bit more run and attack in him.

My thinking is that Gunners has been sent back on a more permanent basis to see if he could replace Hodge as our general in the back half. This would give the club a better idea of which defenders we may let go at years end.

Birch - stay.
Chip - stay for the gorillas, at least until Nash is ready.
Stratts and maybe Poppy may be traded.
Just my thinking, but there are going to be some very difficult decisions to be made at year's end.

 

[JustKickIt]

Maybe when Langers gets his first set shot.

Don't you just hate it when he has a set shot from 30m? I always assume a miss and am nearly always right....

 

[tige19]

People have been screaming to send Gunston back forward. Now we've had a win or two, he's a permenent defender, and we can start trading heaps of other defenders...

Hodge gone from back line, Burton more time in the middle...our existing defenders can do what they're doing now...compete for a position, and be there when required.

This stuff about "who does he replace" assumes we live in a magical world where we only need our best 22, who are available every week...

Gunston and Sic team up beautifully as floating defenders, they also provide a ton of cover for KB and Burton, that backline looks sublime at the minute.

Agree with LP about needing to ensure we have some marking forward, isn't this what we get though from a developing TOB? He has come on in leaps and bounds and you'd expect the development to continue to a point where he can dominate some matches with his hands ala Ben Brown?

I feel like adding another quality mid and with Cegs coming back, Schoey presenting well and TOB looking like he has the tools to be a 40-50 goal kicking forward who can take a grab we are in an ok position.

This off-season is going to be vital to how we shape ourselves for the next 3-6 years.

Do we trade vets with some value EG Chip, Pop, Punky etc or do we have a commitment already in place with a FA or a RFA? Or are we looking to move future picks and mid tier to players to a club like GWS for a Hopper?

We are in a good position, we are immaculately coached, we have plenty of cash and our kids are better than anyone (including most of us) thought.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

Chief talking down our finals chances.

.....I see what you're doing Chief

You can always count on Chief for his realistic opinions on how the Hawks are travelling. He has never placed the cart ahead of the horse. Like many of us, he would be quietly confident the Hawks are travelling in the right direction, but no way will he be drawn into grandiose statements. If anything, he can be the other way, hard on the Hawks in order to get them to improve. Good man the Chief.

 

[flinchfree]

Chip is woefully undersized against Gorillas anyway, he is more of a 2nd/3rd tall defender. He gets beaten terribly in the air by any forward who has length, I can't see how his positives outweigh the negatives in terms of pulling someone out of the current crop and adding him.

Yeh, don't agree.
He might lose out once or twice a year, break even a few, and win the rest of those contests.
He's blue Chip.

 

[MacMace]

I can't believe this talk of trading Frawley. We have a problem with the monster forwards without Frawley, who has in the past handled the best 'bigs' in the game very well. People also seem to forget his toe injury, which has been a long term chronic problem which he has been playing with. He'll be better now he has had it treated.

With Gibson & Hodge leaving and the potential of mid/forward rotations for our current backs then I don't think there will be to much trouble fitting them, especially as you usually have a few long term injuries affecting players through the year. We look like we will have a very strong squad for 2018, perhaps we could challenge again that soon.

Fair call. I feel the same when I hear calls for Gunners and Punky to be traded. But in my mind I think Chip would have significant value and may allow us to improve our playing list. I'm also not convinced about his leadership/ability to direct players, etc.

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[QuietB]

I think Burton would be the match up Clarko would go for if it occurred again, imo much better reader of play than Chip and size wise is very good.

What about Stratton?

 

[threesixpio]

People have been screaming to send Gunston back forward. Now we've had a win or two, he's a permenent defender, and we can start trading heaps of other defenders...

Hodge gone from back line, Burton more time in the middle...our existing defenders can do what they're doing now...compete for a position, and be there when required.

This stuff about "who does he replace" assumes we live in a magical world where we only need our best 22, who are available every week...

Agree we need depth - spot on. But we also need something to trade in my view

At present we still have the following waiting in the wings:

Morrison - HB
Heatherly - Third Defender
Nash - FB/CHB
JOR (who could go back there as HB)
Miles - small defender
Duryea - can swing back as a small if we need him too

Last night we had

Gunner - HB
Sicily - HB
Hardwick - Small defender
Burton - CHB
Brand - FB

We are leaving out

Strats
Chipper
Birchall

I feel like we have nowhere near enough depth/future for insider midfielders, outside run and KPFs. It's possible that we may already have depth for defenders putting aside some of the vets

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Don't get too carried away about the defense. It's doing well for a bunch of kids but it still needs an extra two high quality players (hodge and Gunston) to provide leadership and protection.

 

[threesixpio]

Don't get too carried away about the defense. It's doing well for a bunch of kids but it still needs an extra two high quality players (hodge and Gunston) to provide leadership and protection.

Sure - but what if we got someone like Lever as well. Would look pretty crowded back there

 

[threesixpio]

Btw: I'm not suggesting trading multiple players necessarily but maybe one wouldn't be ... too outrageous.

 

[Simon Crawshay]

You can always count on Chief for his realistic opinions on how the Hawks are travelling. He has never placed the cart ahead of the horse. Like many of us, he would be quietly confident the Hawks are travelling in the right direction, but no way will he be drawn into grandiose statements. If anything, he can be the other way, hard on the Hawks in order to get them to improve. Good man the Chief.

I have always thought that Dunstalls legendary dislike for people in general has made him the best Head of Football we have ever had. He makes decisions purely based on logic not emotion. I mean would the great man have ever been sucked in my hero worship and hire someone like Buckley the way Eddie did?

 

[Messenger]

Most of us understand this

But whats the answer... send the experienced champions to Box Hill for an extended spell? Or send the depth players who are performing to Box Hill in lieu?

You pick the best 22 based on who is available and who is in form. Am I missing something?

Our recent premiership teams had 30 players who could step into the team "plug and play". We've perhaps got the start of regenerating something like that again. But it's only a start.

 

[Messenger]

Fine thanks, you?

I'm fine. Just put the cat of nine tails away.

 

[Messenger]

Agree we need depth - spot on. But we also need something to trade in my view

At present we still have the following waiting in the wings:

Morrison - HB
Heatherly - Third Defender
Nash - FB/CHB
JOR (who could go back there as HB)
Miles - small defender
Duryea - can swing back as a small if we need him too

Last night we had

Gunner - HB
Sicily - HB
Hardwick - Small defender
Burton - CHB
Brand - FB

We are leaving out

Strats
Chipper
Birchall

I feel like we have nowhere near enough depth/future for insider midfielders, outside run and KPFs. It's possible that we may already have depth for defenders putting aside some of the vets

Why do we need something to trade?

 

[tige19]

What about Stratton?

I like his versatility