News Hawthorn in the media 2023

[Strapping Young Lad]

Please don’t bring Barrett’s sliding doors rubbish here. That’s not the Hawthorn footy club in the media.

That’s a desperate article, trying to get clicks every week.

 

[Brant]

I think Reeves is being underrated here. His delivery to our mids is first class as I am sure they would testify. To date that is his strength and he does it well. He may improve other parts of his game and we all hope he does. However credit where it is due, he was competitive against Gawn and English last year and they are the elite ruckmen.
Over my time of watching the Hawks most of our ruckmen have been competitive rather than “elite” and we have won 13 flags in that time.
Off the top of my head Salmon was probably the only ruckman with the most all round talent and unfortunately he never won a premiership with the Hawks.
I would be looking at improving other parts of our list such as KPPs not ruckmen.

I'm not as enamoured with the 'around-the-ground' Ruckman as most.

Gawn - sure - the guy is 'all time'. But I'd much rather Reeves work on his fitness, play more minutes & be able to win an extra 5-6 taps per game than get an extra 2-4x possessions per game. Realistically, why would I want a Ruckman getting the ball any more than they absolutely have to anyway? There's ~22 other guys for that, but only 1x that can really impact EVERY stoppage.

If Reeves can give good service to our players at stoppages helping us win the clearance battle, whilst nullifying opponents around the ground (like I feel he did with Gawn + English in 2023), then I'm happy.

 

[peetoo]

This ruckman discussion underlines what an absolute gift out of the blue bigboy was from st kilda at around age 25.

 

[Yardie]

This ruckman discussion underlines what an absolute gift out of the blue bigboy was from st kilda at around age 25.

I legit thought he was 30 for some reason (he looks older) and I was, and still am, head****ed on why St Kilda gave him to us at the start of his prime.

 

[peetoo]

91 games a saint. Not even f-s qualified

 

[Simon Crawshay]

This ruckman discussion underlines what an absolute gift out of the blue bigboy was from st kilda at around age 25.

Big Boy was almost the exact opposite of Reeves/Meek in that his versatility allowed him to play pretty much anywhere on the ground.

And this allowed the team to play pretty effective ruck combos like Cegs and Big Boy (actually Cegs wasn't a bad forward option either).

Reeves and Meek it's ruck or nothing essentially the high limits the teams flexibility somewhat.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Even you would concede he’s our clear Number 1 ruck.

Yeah Reeves clearly is.

I didn't see Simon Crawshay suggesting otherwise either. He just said that if Meek improves in other areas then the he will be making up the ground between them.

 

[The hands of stone]

If your comparing Reeves to Gawn to be fair your really just setting the guy up to fail.

We need him to be a solid plus AFL ruck and he is on the way to that . Any more thats great .

 

[FB19]

A hit and miss article has really added spice and traffic to this thread hasnt it! What a disappointment to see so many differing views expressed on an opinion site!!!

 

[TylerDurden]

If your comparing Reeves to Gawn to be fair your really just setting the guy up to fail.

We need him to be a solid plus AFL ruck and he is on the way to that . Any more thats great .

Exactly.

I've got Gawn as the best ruckman I've seen, and that includes Dean Cox.

 

[Simon Crawshay]

Yeah Reeves clearly is.

I didn't see Simon Crawshay suggesting otherwise either. He just said that if Meek improves in other areas then the he will be making up the ground between them.

Exactly right.

The fact that Reeves has some pretty obvious limitations means that to me the gap between Meek and Reeves isn't as big as a lot of posters think.

I'd still pick Reeves for round 1 but I don't have him as a lock in our 22 all year like say Sicily or Lewis.

Who is our starting ruckman next year will all depend on how far and how quickly Reeves and Meek can improve in their specific areas of weakness.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

I legit thought he was 30 for some reason (he looks older) and I was, and still am, head*ed on why St Kilda gave him to us at the start of his prime.

We lucked out, a supposed generational talent came up (can't remember his name, longer?)
We were fighting with the saints for the services of that kid and he picked stkilda. Stkilda cast mceboy aside like Sundays leftovers to make space. An actual sliding doors moment

 

[Sixpence]

Yeah Reeves clearly is.

I didn't see Simon Crawshay suggesting otherwise either. He just said that if Meek improves in other areas then the he will be making up the ground between them.

This discussion started from that article questioning whether Reeves was our number 1 ruck, SC agreed with that query. That is absolutely suggesting otherwise.

Even if Meek becomes Tim English around the ground (which is extremely unlikely), I can't see him displacing Reeves given the service he provides to our mids.

 

[Bugs1977]

We lucked out, a supposed generational talent came up (can't remember his name, longer?)
We were fighting with the saints for the services of that kid and he picked stkilda. Stkilda cast mceboy aside like Sundays leftovers to make space. An actual sliding doors moment

Yeah that's right Billy Longer chose the Saints and with that they decided to trade us Big Boy. Pretty sure Chris Pelchin was at the Saints when that move was made. Not sure who their list boss was at the time though.

Hawks got:
McEvoy + pick 24 (picked Billy Hartung) + pick 59 (picked Jon Ceglar)

Saints got:
Shane Savage + pick 18 (picked Luke Dunstan) + pick 19 (picked Blake Acres)

Yeah I think we won that one

 

[Judd2Sewell]

I'm not as enamoured with the 'around-the-ground' Ruckman as most.

Gawn - sure - the guy is 'all time'. But I'd much rather Reeves work on his fitness, play more minutes & be able to win an extra 5-6 taps per game than get an extra 2-4x possessions per game. Realistically, why would I want a Ruckman getting the ball any more than they absolutely have to anyway? There's ~22 other guys for that, but only 1x that can really impact EVERY stoppage.

If Reeves can give good service to our players at stoppages helping us win the clearance battle, whilst nullifying opponents around the ground (like I feel he did with Gawn + English in 2023), then I'm happy.

It's not necessarily the possessions IMO, it's taking marks and impacting the game around the ground. I don't think he's ever going to be a possession winner, he's not athletic or mobile enough.

But one thing he could possibly do is become a ruckman that takes marks when he sits in the hole, on bail out kicks and when he rests forward. He has to add that to his game, and if does he'll naturally get more touches by doing this.

I'm speaking for myself here - if they aren't the elite of elite rucks like Gawn, English, Grundy (pre-trade) or Goldy (peak years) then I think rucks that are strong, bullock, are physical, take contested marks and can have an impact around the ground are worth their weight in gold - Nankervis, Big Boy, Marshall, Mumford, etc. Of all the recent premiers over the last dozen years there hasn't really been any tap-only ruckmen.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

This discussion started from that article questioning whether Reeves was our number 1 ruck, SC agreed with that query. That is absolutely suggesting otherwise.

Even if Meek becomes Tim English around the ground (which is extremely unlikely), I can't see him displacing Reeves given the service he provides to our mids.

Sorry I missed that, I had read the comment about if Meek improved he would make up ground between them.

If Meek became Tim English around the ground he would absolutely be playing. If we had Big Boy he would be playing.

 

[Simon Crawshay]

Sorry I missed that, I had read the comment about if Meek improved he would make up ground between them.

If Meek became Tim English around the ground he would absolutely be playing. If we had Big Boy he would be playing.

Yeh I'm pretty sure English would get a gig in our current side!

 

[Simon Crawshay]

It's not necessarily the possessions IMO, it's taking marks and impacting the game around the ground. I don't think he's ever going to be a possession winner, he's not athletic or mobile enough.

But one thing he could possibly do is become a ruckman that takes marks when he sits in the hole, on bail out kicks and when he rests forward. He has to add that to his game, and if does he'll naturally get more touches by doing this.

I'm speaking for myself here - if they aren't the elite of elite rucks like Gawn, English, Grundy (pre-trade) or Goldy (peak years) then I think rucks that are strong, bullock, are physical, take contested marks and can have an impact around the ground are worth their weight in gold - Nankervis, Big Boy, Marshall, Mumford, etc. Of all the recent premiers over the last dozen years there hasn't really been any tap-only ruckmen.

Exactly

I shouldn't have compared Reeves to Gawn that was not the best way to illustrate my point.

Nankervis is a much better touchstone. A decentish tap ruckman who is also a physical presence around the ground and also gets his 15 disposals and 3 marks a game.

I don't think it was a coincidence that the Tigers started winning flags the moment they got Nank the Tank across from the Swans.

I reckon you would have to go all the way back to when Justin Madden was ****ing for the Blues back in 1995 when a pure tap only ruckman won a premiership.

And although I was disappointed overall with Meeks season there were glimpses here and there that he could become a Nankervis/Mumford style ruckman (if he could just harness some aggression).

 

[naysayer]

I legit thought he was 30 for some reason (he looks older) and I was, and still am, head*ed on why St Kilda gave him to us at the start of his prime.

Nick Riewoldt said before Big Boy's last game that when the Saints leadership group heard the club had just traded out Ben McEvoy they couldn't believe it.

On Reeves: Brett Ratten mentioned in his TH interview that when he coached against Hawthorn this year, the two facets that they couldn't match were our outside run and Reeves' dominance in the centre bounces.

 

[VandoHawk]

We lucked out, a supposed generational talent came up (can't remember his name, longer?)
We were fighting with the saints for the services of that kid and he picked stkilda. Stkilda cast mceboy aside like Sundays leftovers to make space. An actual sliding doors moment

Longer actually nominated us. St. Kilda thought they were being smart by dangling the readymade McEvoy so they could swoop on Longer who they thought had bigger upside.

 

[wahawk]

Longer actually nominated us. St. Kilda thought they were being smart by dangling the readymade McEvoy so they could swoop on Longer who they thought had bigger upside.

So st Kilda just saint kilda’d

Again

 

[wahawk]

Exactly.

I've got Gawn as the best ruckman I've seen, and that includes Dean Cox.

I really don’t think you’ve thought that through Tyler

I know you aren’t 20 years old.
There has been many good ruckman over the years. Many

 

[Judd2Sewell]

I really don’t think you’ve thought that through Tyler

I know you aren’t 20 years old.
There has been many good ruckman over the years. Many

I'm 37 and Gawn is the best I've seen.

Granted I don't remember much of Salmon.

 

[Randy Campbell]

But one thing he could possibly do is become a ruckman that takes marks when he sits in the hole, on bail out kicks and when he rests forward. He has to add that to his game, and if does he'll naturally get more touches by doing this.

I'm 37 and Gawn is the best I've seen.

Granted I don't remember much of Salmon.

I'm 47 and what excities me the most about Reeves is what he could possibly do.

If he can learn to influence the marking contest, as well as he can already influence the centre square contest, it could be possible for him to become better than both.

 

[dermott]

I'm 47 and what excities me the most about Reeves is what he could possibly do.

If he can learn to influence the marking contest, as well as he can already influence the centre square contest, it could be possible for him to become better than both.

I am 77 and have seen a lot of ruckmen in that time. Some that spring to mind who dominated in their eras include Nichols, Farmer, Simon Madden, Dempsey, Cox and Gawn. Salmon in fact played full forward at Essendon because he was good enough and Madden was first choice ruck.
I probably have overlooked some good ruckmen that deserve mention.
However if I had to nominate the best I have seen it would probably be the great Polly Farmer who revolutionised the game with his unmatched hand balling…

 

[peetoo]

Shaun Rehn worth a mention. His best at Adelaide but he did help a fairly challenged hawks team to a prelim in 2001