Analysis Hawthorn rebuild: are they tanking?

[The Cryptkeeper]

Fairly certain you are deliberately more terrible than you needed to be.

Which is fine by the way. I don't see that as tanking.

Screw being the new St Kilda mate. I mean, they don’t even try to improve their lot.

Being slightly less bad than a few others is their MO. Well Hawthorn aren’t interested in that approach.

 

[demondavey]

Hawthorn offloaded good players and purposely made themselves a weaker team.
They knew full well that they were going to be holding up the ladder by doing that but winning a few games wasn't the most important thing to them.
Some can see this as "tanking" but all Hawthorn players that enter the field will be trying just as hard as every other team to win.
The players would not tank!!
Hawthorn couldn't care less about the results for this year, or next, as they have one eye on the future.
Their plan is obvious, get as many early picks and good kids in as we can and grow them together as a team.
Hawthorn supporters are patient because they know when they are ready to challenge for a flag, they usually get it (and then some).

Four years from now, this could be a masterstroke, getting a bunch of highly rated kids each year is one way to build a great team.

GWS and GC, will tell you it doesn't always work though.

Hawthorns upside is that they typically have an excellent off field team that organises the culture and structure. That culture may be a bit questioned of late, but it’s vastly different to the two expansion clubs.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Hawks beat North this week (a genuine possibility), a lot of the current media spotlight and heat drops off
Wins cure all

 

[The 747]

Hawks beat North this week (a genuine possibility), a lot of the current media spotlight and heat drops off
Wins cure all

Yep and there will be a much bumping of this thread by our Hawk friends if that happens.

They are a good chance IMO, hard to beat them at home.

 

[#23 Hill]

Tanking or no, when Hawthorn experience their third 100 point thrashing for the season Mitchell will be under the pump.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Tanking or no, when Hawthorn experience their third 100 point thrashing for the season Mitchell will be under the pump.

Ummm….

 

[#23 Hill]

Ummm….

That's what he'll be saying when the board wants answers.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

The death riding of the Hawks in here is just too funny.

Have at it minnows.

 

[SSSSSS]

Board disharmony and instability, allegations of the ex-coach and his disciples being racist pricks which could have very long-lasting consequences (sanctions?), a lack of on-field leadership, poor list, and at least a full season of getting absolutely pumped by every other club in the AFL.

As a Dees supporter this sort of stuff doesn't really phase me tbh, not sure the average Hawks supporters has the necessary character to see the other side of it tho.

Our supporters actually voted no on the merger...

 

[Blackhawk42]

That's what he'll be saying when the board wants answers.

If there was ever a coach and a football club to be given time to establish new standards and rebuild a playing list from scratch it's Sam Mitchell and Hawthorn.

Even the board is new.

Parts of the rebuild started a little earlier (I'd argue it was when we drafted Will Day then kicked into next gear Dylan Moore became a best 22 player) but it's year one from multiple perspectives. There is also a new home-base in the near future which will help facilitate the goals Sam and the board have outlined.

It would be a mind-numbingly stupid and inept group of people running the club to consider his position to be in jeopardy until, at a minimum, mid 2025.

 

[hawkman]

Hawks beat North this week (a genuine possibility), a lot of the current media spotlight and heat drops off
Wins cure all

It will go to Geelong after they lose to Gold Coast.

Or more likely the Dogs after a loss to Brisbane

 

[jakson68]

That's not really patience. That's hubris.

Ok, sadly i had to google that
And yes you may be right

 

[Whiskers]

Good for you sport.

We aren't "deliberately terrible." We are just terrible.

I mean, we are damned by the simple whatever path we take. We keep JOM, Mitchell and Shiels and are told that we should be cutting them loose in favour of the kids. Cut them loose so we can get games into the kids and we are accused of tanking.

Explain to me what other avenues were available to us.

Keep them around for some leadership or go and get other players with more experience.

Going to the bottom to get some nice picks is a cheap way out. Much like how your fans are cheap, just jumping onto a bandwagon of a team with success and disappear in the leaner years.

Who was it that said hawks fans are patient? What alternate universe is that poster living on?
Hawthorn fans choose their club during Grand Final week or straight after they have won a flag.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Keep them around for some leadership or go and get other players with more experience.

Going to the bottom to get some nice picks is a cheap way out. Much like how your fans are cheap, just jumping onto a bandwagon of a team with success and disappear in the leaner years.

Who was it that said hawks fans are patient? What alternate universe is that poster living on?
Hawthorn fans choose their club during Grand Final week or straight after they have won a flag.

I don't know what is funnier, that your initial response is “top up” or that you’re so unaware that Hawthorn have broken their membership record in something like 11 of the last 13 years, that you’re going to call us bandwagoners that disappear?

 

[theiaofseed]

Keep them around for some leadership or go and get other players with more experience.

Going to the bottom to get some nice picks is a cheap way out. Much like how your fans are cheap, just jumping onto a bandwagon of a team with success and disappear in the leaner years.

Who was it that said hawks fans are patient? What alternate universe is that poster living on?
Hawthorn fans choose their club during Grand Final week or straight after they have won a flag.

Probably explains why we have such a massive membership base.

 

[peetoo]

Keep them around for some leadership or go and get other players with more experience.

Going to the bottom to get some nice picks is a cheap way out. Much like how your fans are cheap, just jumping onto a bandwagon of a team with success and disappear in the leaner years.

Who was it that said hawks fans are patient? What alternate universe is that poster living on?
Hawthorn fans choose their club during Grand Final week or straight after they have won a flag.

Martyr complex.

Hawks were actually the worst * team 1997-2004 but membership increased most of those years.

* but the period is embedded in the best team 1975-2015. By so much it’s laugable

 

[The 747]

Martyr complex.

Hawks were actually the worst * team 1997-2004 but membership increased most of those years.

* but the period is embedded in the best team 1975-2015. By so much it’s laugable

Not to downplay the Hawks there but I don't think they were the only clubs that increased membership.

 

[The 747]

Probably explains why we have such a massive membership base.

Why do the crowds not reflect that?

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Why do the crowds not reflect that?

Geelong and Hawthorn had roughly similar crowd numbers attend their games last year. Hawthorn was dogshit, yet Geelong the premier.

Maybe the more relevant question is why aren’t more people interested in watching Geelong play?

 

[Gavin Excell]

It will go to Geelong after they lose to Gold Coast.

Or more likely the Dogs after a loss to Brisbane

Yep setting up a big Easter Monday clash

 

[Mr Chuckles]

No issue with opposition supporters laying the boot in on Bigfooty, it’s the circle of life. When your club’s going well, you ridicule the rubbish teams who can only talk up how good they MIGHT be in a few years time.

I do, however, get a little frustrated with the standard of “analysis” from a large section of the footy journos. Based on what we’ve seen in the first 2 rounds, I really don’t see how much positive difference one or both of Mitchell and JOM would have made to our performance, let alone the results.

Our midfield has been performing reasonably well around the coalface, particularly against the Swans. The main issue we have is that we severely lack talent up forward with Gunston gone and Lewis injured, and as soon as the opposition takes possession in defense they are easily able to waltz it down the length of the ground due to the whole team structuring up terribly on defense. This includes the midfield obviously, but I wouldn’t say Mitchell and JOM were renowned as two way running defensive beasts who would instantly fix that issue.

We had no control over the departures of McEvoy and Gunston - not as sure on Shiels, but he certainly wasn’t a key part of the team last season either way. We decided to move on from Mitchell and JOM, but we also added Amon and Meek who are immediately best 22 players who fill positions of need.

We’re shit and we’re going to be shit for quite a while by the looks of things, but the “THEY CUT TOO DEEP!!!” narrative is being way overcooked in the media.

 

[HairyO]

Geelong and Hawthorn had roughly similar crowd numbers attend their games last year. Hawthorn was dogshit, yet Geelong the premier.

Maybe the more relevant question is why aren’t more people interested in watching Geelong play?

Even Geelong supporters are disgusted at the dodgy off field finances used to entice players there.

 

[Cursed Cat]

Geelong and Hawthorn had roughly similar crowd numbers attend their games last year. Hawthorn was dogshit, yet Geelong the premier.

Maybe the more relevant question is why aren’t more people interested in watching Geelong play?

Relevant?

This is the Hawthorn are Tankers thread; go bump a Geelong related thread If you’re concerned about being ‘relevant’.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Relevant?

This is the Hawthorn are Tankers thread; go bump a Geelong related thread If you’re concerned about being ‘relevant’.

Again, it was your mate who decided to take the conversation down this path.

But don’t let that fact get in your way.

 

[Cursed Cat]

Again, it was your mate who decided to take the conversation down this path.

But don’t let that fact get in your way.

My mate? Not sure you’d know my mates; again, hardly relevant to the issue of Hawthorn tanking.
Good to see you removed your abusive posts though; mature decision.