Coach Hey 'Supporters', have some respect for Hardwick and all he has done.

[Phar Ace]

If 2016 tells us anything, it’s that - as good a bloke as Hardwick is/was - he can’t do much unless he has a crack team around him and some great players in the best form of their career. I don’t think he has those things now so merely celebrating what a good bloke is he is/was won’t get the job done.

By that rough rule of thumb we might even contend again next year, maybe even win it? All we have to do is move on most of these:


I hope this is not what our Richmond site really has today and it is some sort of cached version - all I did was google Richmond Coaching Staff and that took me to the RFC website. Could not simply find the Coaching Structure Tab under what was supposed to a Football tab according to the web address.

 

[Sir_Loin]

He’s getting a bit grumpy. Say it to my face and all that. Thought the weed was supposed to chill you out

 

[Area51]

Agree. That rule change was an attack on our game style and an attack on the type of player on our list.

I've said this before but Dimma's gameplan enabled us to play elite football with a lot of players that were Moneyball players. Yeah we had a group group of elite players Dusty, Cotch, Jack, Rance but getting value out of less skilled players meant we would could be less reliant on the draft to be competitive. It undermined the AFL's central equalisation tool - the draft. We basically found a hack. So they changed the rules and told the umps to do the equalising as well. Beating GWS to shit all over their one good chance to win a flag and boost numbers in Sydney wasn't in the script either. Of course they ****ing hate us.

 

[aislegi]

What I find amusing is the narrative that our flags werent won by Dimma but his assistants ... Failed head coaches like Leppa & Truck and champion assistants like Caracella who went on to big things at the bombers after 2017.

Maybe your irritation about the narrative should be directed at Dustin Martin, who pointed to “new assistants” as the reason for our improvement

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Maybe your irritation about the narrative should be directed at Dustin Martin, who pointed to “new assistants” as the reason for our improvement

Why would you bag Martin or Hardwick?

 

[aislegi]

Why would you bag Martin or Hardwick?

Where?

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Where?

Dusty talking about the new assistants. I don't think it's the new assistants fault either.
It's the inevitable consequences of the AFL's equilisation policies where premiers are penalised in the draft and the salary cap.
Once you get a few injuries , the list depth is exposed .
Also Hocking's anti-Richmond rule change doesn't help.

 

[aislegi]

Of course he had a good team. So did Jordan and Brock yet they’re still regarded individually as greats.
The attacks that many are showing are personal.
My view on Hardwick he has enough credits in the bank and proven to build the club and the list and deserves the right to do it again if he wants too.
I can also see the forest through the trees and can see what the club is doing. I don’t get wrapped up in a week by week result.
No one is above criticism but the attacks that have been displayed have been petty and personal

I find it hard to reconcile your comment that “No one is above criticism” with your comment that “he has enough credits in the bank”

 

[aislegi]

Dusty talking about the new assistants. I don't think it's the new assistants fault either.
It's the inevitable consequences of the AFL's equilisation policies where premiers are penalised in the draft and the salary cap.
Once you get a few injuries , the list depth is exposed .
Also Hocking's anti-Richmond rule change doesn't help.

I think you have the wrong end of the stick, old mate. Martin credited the new assistants that we picked up for the great improvement in our form from 2016 to 2017.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

I think you have the wrong end of the stick, old mate. Martin credited the new assistants that we picked up for the great improvement in our form from 2016 to 2017.

Roger that . Assistants are helpful but they are just implementing the coaches gameplan in the end.

 

[Coach_Required]

Maybe your irritation about the narrative should be directed at Dustin Martin, who pointed to “new assistants” as the reason for our improvement

No irritation on my part, you talk about Martin mentioning the assistants in 2017, half of those assistants then went on to do absolutely nothing at another club.

So you tell me, seems pretty clear that our senior coach had a lot to do with our success.

Dimma started coaching in 2010 after Wallace left us in complete shambles except for a couple of decent picks. In Dimma's time we have made finals in 8 out of those 13 seasons, prior to Hardwick you could count how many times we made a finals series with 2 fingers in nearly 30 years. (1995, 2001).

You can't down play that stat alone. In just half the time, Dimma's teams have made the finals 4 times over (4 x 2 = 8) what our club did in a generation.

Don't tell me it's mainly because of his assistants. That's a cop out excuse to try and fit your narrative because we have been poor this year.

 

[domin8]

I find it hard to reconcile your comment that “No one is above criticism” with your comment that “he has enough credits in the bank”

Not surprised you can’t see the difference

 

[U2tigers]

Roger that . Assistants are helpful but they are just implementing the coaches gameplan in the end.

Was it Hardwicks gameplan in 2017 and beyond?

I guess benifit of the doubt may be needed.

But also looked at what happened in 2016.

Dimma admitted he didn't share the workload and put faith in his assistants.

The Club instead of Sacking him, got in more/new assistants around him.

He learns to allow others to do their roles, bang we have a new game plan and Premiership.

Of course Credit goes to Dimma, but thank god he had that intervention on him.

 

[domin8]

No irritation on my part, you talk about Martin mentioning the assistants in 2017, half of those assistants then went on to do absolutely nothing at another club.

So you tell me, seems pretty clear that our senior coach had a lot to do with our success.

Dimma started coaching in 2010 after Wallace left us in complete shambles except for a couple of decent picks. In Dimma's time we have made finals in 8 out of those 13 seasons, prior to Hardwick you could count how many times we made a finals series with 2 fingers in nearly 30 years. (1995, 2001).

You can't down play that stat alone. In just half the time, Dimma's teams have made the finals 4 times over (4 x 2 = 8) what our club did in a generation.

Don't tell me it's mainly because of his assistants. That's a cop out excuse to try and fit your narrative because we have been poor this year.

Na as previously mentioned Wallace started the dynasty by gifting us Cotchin Rance Dusty and Jack. Dimma was fortunate for Terrys foresight.
Then it was the assistants that won us those flags. They undercut Dimma when he went OS by implementing a new game plan without his knowledge and snuck it in and trained the players up whilst he was away.

Dimma is just the front man that just speaks to the media. Talks to the players about climbing mountains whilst putting gridiron jerseys and rocks in their lockers. He doesn’t do any coaching just sips lattes with Benny and puts the speccy bag on at training

 

[domin8]

Was it Hardwicks gameplan in 2017 and beyond?

I guess benifit of the doubt may be needed.

But also looked at what happened in 2016.

Dimma admitted he didn't share the workload and put faith in his assistants.

The Club instead of Sacking him, got in more/new assistants around him.

He learns to allow others to do their roles, bang we have a new game plan and Premiership.

Of course Credit goes to Dimma, but thank god he had that intervention on him.

Of course it’s Dimmas game plan he was the ****ing coach. Like it or not the buck whether wins or losses sticks with him

 

[Nebular]

Sorry but that's rubbish.

Everyone loves, respects, adores and appreciates what Hardwick and Cotchin and the rest have done for this club.

That doesn't mean in a professional sports environment they are immune from critique and a sense that change is required to move forward.

If there's signs that change and transition might help move the club forward, which there are plenty of those signs, you can't just avoid that conversation and decision because "Hey we love that we won 3 flags a few years ago".

Just a reminder that the bottom three on the ladder right now have won 7 of the last 10 flags.

Gravity/ equalisation is a thing.

 

[U2tigers]

Of course it’s Dimmas game plan he was the ******* coach. Like it or not the buck whether wins or losses sticks with him

Officially it was maybe.

In practice and with how it actually happened, I and a lot of others aren't so sure it was all his.

 

[domin8]

Officially it was maybe.

In practice and with how it actually happened, I and a lot of others aren't so sure it was all his.

Nobody says it was all his. If you read my posts I have consistently said it’s a collaboration of all their skills. But you and many others are essentially saying he had nothing to do with it.

hypothetically speaking. As you say the assistants invented and implemented the game plan in 17. Dimma had nothing to do with it.
But the team doesn’t win the flag and has another year like 16. Who cops it in the neck first?

 

[SplintWhisky]

You can have respect for what Hardwick has done but also call for him to not be extended or to have the discussion on him moving on. We are in a performance based industry that has little time for sentimentality. If you want to reminisce then do it in the on someone else's time.

Hardwick is a fantastic people manager. Hell the review that occurred back in 2016 showed that one of the issues we had was that Hardwick was a "jobs for mates" type person. Well it could be that we are moving back to that. It could be that we need someone above him to come in and get rid of the assistants and put in a fresh voice.

 

[U2tigers]

Nobody says it was all his. If you read my posts I have consistently said it’s a collaboration of all their skills. But you and many others are essentially saying he had nothing to do with it.

hypothetically speaking. As you say the assistants invented and implemented the game plan in 17. Dimma had nothing to do with it.
But the team doesn’t win the flag and has another year like 16. Who cops it in the neck first?

thats fair enough to.

I think we both agree the buck stops, and also the credit goes to Dimma (it s the way it is)

I think we can also agree that an 'Intervention' (whatever you want to call it) occurred after 2016, in which Dimma rightly took a lot of responsibility for, he even said he was poor himself.


Maybe its time we have another one of those Interventions, because things aren't real great right now.

 

[lumpinee]

All coaches and players have an expiry date,if its next week so be it,if its at seasons end thats ok too.

 

[takethepowerback]

Some of you are as bad as the footy media..get an idea and repeat it for eternity even if proven false.

Dimma has proven many wrong, many a time. Probably will again.

I back ya in Dimma.

 

[Coach_Required]

You can have respect for what Hardwick has done but also call for him to not be extended or to have the discussion on him moving on. We are in a performance based industry that has little time for sentimentality. If you want to reminisce then do it in the on someone else's time.

Hardwick is a fantastic people manager. Hell the review that occurred back in 2016 showed that one of the issues we had was that Hardwick was a "jobs for mates" type person. Well it could be that we are moving back to that. It could be that we need someone above him to come in and get rid of the assistants and put in a fresh voice.

You realise your second paragraph is a back handed compliment to your opening line right? I dont see any respect for Hardwick in your comments.

This isn't about asking for him to be extended either, this thread is about acknowledging what he has achieved for the club in his time here. No coach other than Hafey has given us the success he has. However, in his time here the naysayers like to tell us it was all these wonderful assistants that made us and not Dimma LOL yeah right.

Also your take on the changes after 2016 is pretty narrow minded.

News - Revealed: The nine key points of Richmond’s internal review that turned the Tigers around

Revealed: The nine key points of Richmond’s internal review that turned the Tigers around IT’S the document that propelled Richmond towards one of the game’s most unlikely premierships. With the footy world drastically closing in on the Tigers last year, 30 pieces of paper helped set the club...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[SplintWhisky]

You realise your second paragraph is a back handed compliment to your opening line right? I dont see any respect for Hardwick in your comments.

This isn't about asking for him to be extended either, this thread is about acknowledging what he has achieved for the club in his time here. No coach other than Hafey has given us the success he has. However, in his time here the naysayers like to tell us it was all these wonderful assistants that made us and not Dimma LOL yeah right.

Also your take on the changes after 2016 is pretty narrow minded.

News - Revealed: The nine key points of Richmond’s internal review that turned the Tigers around

Revealed: The nine key points of Richmond’s internal review that turned the Tigers around IT’S the document that propelled Richmond towards one of the game’s most unlikely premierships. With the footy world drastically closing in on the Tigers last year, 30 pieces of paper helped set the club...

www.bigfooty.com

You have the mental fortitude of a 9 year old. You seem to think that if someone likes/holds someone in high regard they can't have any negative opinions about said person or if they notice the flaws in someone they are somehow disrespecting them. There are more nuanced opinions than "Duh, he win flags so he have no flaws"

I have respect for what he has done. To be able to change leadership and management styles so massively is admirable. To let go of something that you have been controlling and creating an environment and situation where he was more hands off takes massive balls. I can only imagine how hard he wanted to regress back to taking control when we had those three losses. Additionally, his fierce loyalty to the players and staff is also highly admirable. However, I am not ****ing brain dead and can't look past the fact that that loyalty cant be a double edged sword. It could well be that this style helps get the best out of people and maybe Hardwick relies on other people when the cracking the whip when the standards slip.

The whole point of this thread is that the sycophantic branch of the supporter base think that, because of his history, Hardwick is immune from criticism or questions about moving on and getting a fresh voice and direction into the club.

We are in a performance based industry and that performance this year is lacking majorly from a game plan and fitness capability. Questions have to be asked.

 

[Livonski]

Hell the review that occurred back in 2016 showed that one of the issues we had was that Hardwick was a "jobs for mates" type person.

Really? Where did it say that?