How has Collingwood managed to be so successful since 2001 while Carlton and Essendon have not?

[Corn Cobbers]

Nothing wrong with buying players, any club could have that was the landscape in those days and Carlton done it best and the question marks over 1995 are just that.

Yeah we bought players too, but these days it's CULTURE that separates the top sides from the duds.

 

[Pistol Night]

Yeah we bought players too, but these days it's CULTURE that separates the top sides from the duds.

Carlton, Hawthorn and even North did well out of the Form 4s where you could sign interstate players

 

[Corn Cobbers]

The question should be over losing to StKilda and Sydney that year to fund the footy trip.

So THAT was it...

Never got my head around those big losses from nowhere

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Only 1995 was subject to a salary cap, while there are question marks over that one I was referring to earlier flags where you bought the best players in the country. Nothing wrong with that but it's a different landscape now and unfortunately your mob hasn't adjusted.

Complete BS that they were found to have made salary cap breaches (does not mean going over) in 93,94,96,97 and 98.

Funny how an investigation after the fact done by the AFL finds nothing to see here for 95. Not like they tried to sweep Essendon’s drugs under the rug either…

1995:

Blues busted over secret payments to Williams

www.smh.com.au

Carlton secretly paid star player Greg Williams $200,000 by funnelling money through a construction company to beat the AFL salary cap, according to a report yesterday.
The payments, made between 1993 and 1995, were authorised by Carlton chiefs Ian Collins and James Sutherland as ground maintenance, although no work was done, Melbourne's Herald Sun reported yesterday.

The company used to conceal the payments was Amigo Constructions Pty Ltd, which had Victoria's Sports Minister, Justin Madden, on board as a director until July 1994.
Documents relating to the scheme outline the arrangement was the brainchild of Collins and Williams's manager, Peter Jess, who was also a director of Amigo Constructions.
In 1993, Carlton breached the salary cap by $42,226 and were fined $50,000 the following year.

And before any Carlton fan wants to throw mud about our cap breaches we owned up to. It was a miscalculation of GST on player management fees. Very different to knowingly and willingly paying players outside the cap.

 

[Pistol Night]

So THAT was it...

Never got my head around those big losses from nowhere

The best team in the comp loses to the bottom 2 teams in successive weeks. Even Jayden Stephenson wouldn't get on that kind of obviousness

 

[Robertio]

The question should be over losing to StKilda and Sydney that year to fund the footy trip.

Probably guilty on that one.

 

[WillHayward]

They've won 1 flag in that time....

Very almost two (2018) and back up with another decent shot this year.

Face facts.

The Pies have been very well run for twenty years.

Nobody can deny this fact.

 

[Pistol Night]

Probably guilty on that one.

Brilliant move. You'd need some serious coin to fund Sticks beer invoice on a footy trip

 

[Robertio]

Yeah we bought players too, but these days it's CULTURE that separates the top sides from the duds.

Yep.

 

[WillHayward]

The Pies have been around the mark and have played in a few GF but the reality is they have won only one of them in 21 years and you need to go back to 1990 for their previous one.
How do you define success. Are flags no longer the mark?

Flags are a mark but not the only mark.

Making finals is another.

Making a GF (winning a prelim) another.

Lack of scandals is another.

Avoiding the Spoon is another.

Crowds is another.

TV ratings is another.

Membership is another.

Pies have done well on all of the above.

Only the most miserable prick can deny the Pies have been very professional in recent times.

 

[Corn Cobbers]

Brilliant move. You'd need some serious coin to fund Sticks beer invoice on a footy trip

They should have gotten Sticks to record a cover of "Stand By Your Man" and flogged it off to fund the trip

 

[Pistol Night]

They are a mark but not the only mark.

Making finals is another.

Making a GF (winning a prelim) another.

Lack of scandals is another.

Avoiding the Spoon is another.

Crowds is another.

TV ratings is another.

Membership is another.

Pies have done well on all of the above.

Scandals maybe a little pass..

 

[Corn Cobbers]

Flags are a mark but not the only mark.

Making finals is another.

Making a GF (winning a prelim) another.

Lack of scandals is another.

Avoiding the Spoon is another.

Crowds is another.

TV ratings is another.

Membership is another.

Pies have done well on all of the above.

Not sure about the scandals but the rest is pretty accurate

 

[Robertio]

Brilliant move. You'd need some serious coin to fund Sticks beer invoice on a footy trip

He should never drink,

 

[JyeDye]

Very almost two (2018) and back up with another decent shot this year.

Face facts.

The Pies have been very well run for twenty years.

Nobody can deny this fact.

Yes, an absolute powerhouse of the modern century standing alongside Port Adelaide with accolades such as 1 flag and some finals wins

 

[Pistol Night]

He should never drink,

As much as i have to hate Carlton i absolutely love Sticks. Great bloke, great footballer, great piss drinker.

 

[Pistol Night]

Yes, an absolute powerhouse of the modern century standing alongside Port Adelaide with accolades such as 1 flag and some finals wins

1 flag is pretty good compared to..

 

[JyeDye]

1 flag is pretty good compared to..

It's mediocre, I've already mentioned 9 teams in the competition have 1 or more in this timeframe. That's half the teams. Carlton have been below mediocre no doubt, but Collingwood have not been 'so successful'.

 

[Corn Cobbers]

He should never drink,

Legendary stuff, went to Naughtons with some mates later that week to re-enact that scene

 

[Fadge]

Periods of 16 years or more without a Grand Final win in their history:

Collingwood 3

Essendon 3

Carlton 3

Richmond 2

Let's keep it real Fadge.

Periods of 35 years or more without a Preliminary Final victory:
Richmond 1
Collingwood 0
Carlton - well on their way to 1.

 

[Robertio]

Legendary stuff, went to Naughtons with some mates later that week to re-enact that scene

Hope you had a better voice or more beer.

 

[Corn Cobbers]

Hope you had a better voice or more beer.

Probably yes to the first one and no to the second

 

[Freomaniac]

6 consecutive years outside of finals, the lowest point in Collingwood's 130 year history.

teams go up and go down... Yep Collingwood played finals in 1994. Didn't make finals in 1995-2001.

could of made finals in 1997 and taken Brisbane's 8th spot had they beat either Carlton or crows late in the season.

could of made finals in 2001 and taken crows 8th spot. They lost to Hawks, Essendon, Richmond and North Melbourne narrowly in the 1st 6 or 7 rounds. win one of those 4 and that's finals for Collingwood in 2001.

Saying that, Collingwood has made grand finals in 2002-3, 2010-11 and 2018.

 

[Freomaniac]

West Coast finished 5th in 2020.
9th in 2021 and been down for two years now.

We aren't talking the 90's, it's the 00's and Collingwood have been consistently making finals.

West coasts longest streak of not making finals is 3 years in a row of 2008-10 and this current 2021-23 streak. Eagles are likely to break that streak.

Collingwood has had their share of ups and downs. they did miss out on finals from 2014-17, then made a grand final in 2018.

 

[Tiger2709]

Coterie groups with lots of cash and pull are one of the big issues at the Blues and Essendon.