Preview Ins and Outs v a promising EDFL club - RD 10, 23

[TheMase]

I’d agree EXCEPT:

(a) the blokes Sheldrick is beating in the VFL are no mugs. Marty Hore, for example is a hardened AFL experienced mid. He’s not up against kids.

He only played 14 AFL games… so not sure a failed AFL player is the greatest example to beat for a prospective AFL player, but agree at VFL level he is no mug.

Sheldrick is playing as the number one mid in the VFL. He isn’t going to get that in the senior side therefore has to be flexible as he won’t get 100% of time on the inside. Can only grow as a player with exposure to other positions and playing up forward in the VFL probably isn’t going to achieve that, hence he will get exposure at AFL, much to the distaste of many here….

 

[hairy biker]

I think the view that Longmire (and the MC) never selected Tom Mitchell is somewhat overstated.

Mitchell was selected in the Nov 2011 draft had a few injuries in 2012 and didn't play a game.
Mind you the team won a Premiership without him and among the players getting clearances in that game were;
ROK, Hannebery, McVeigh, JPK, Bird, Goodes, Bolton & K.Jack.

Decent midfield and I think it was clear that at least initially he was required to work on certain things in the reserves to break into the team.

Mitchell for the Swans - 2013 14 games, 2014 6 games, 2015 19 games and 2016 26 games (incl the GF).
In those years Sydney finished 4th (2013), 2nd (2014), 5th (2015) and 2nd 2016.
We also had multiple AA players rotating through the midfield at the time eg Hannebery, JPK, Parker.

Personally I never felt Mitchell was hard done by the Swans.

 

[TheMase]

I agree with (a) but not (b). When picked in the seniors, Mitchell was not played out of position as we claim that Sheldrick is. He was played in the mids but kept getting dropped back to work on his two-way running, which is quite different.

Mitchell spent a fair bit of time across half forward from my recollection.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

I think the view that Longmire (and the MC) never selected Tom Mitchell is somewhat overstated.

Mitchell was selected in the Nov 2011 draft had a few injuries in 2012 and didn't play a game.
Mind you the team won a Premiership without him and among the players getting clearances in that game were;
ROK, Hannebery, McVeigh, JPK, Bird, Goodes, Bolton & K.Jack.

Decent midfield and I think it was clear that at least initially he was required to work on certain things in the reserves to break into the team.

Mitchell for the Swans - 2013 14 games, 2014 6 games, 2015 19 games and 2016 26 games (incl the GF).
In those years Sydney finished 4th (2013), 2nd (2014), 5th (2015) and 2nd 2016.
We also had multiple AA players rotating through the midfield at the time eg Hannebery, JPK, Parker.

Personally I never felt Mitchell was hard done by the Swans.

After JPK he was our best player in the 2016 GF.

 

[bedford]

Refused to play him?
19 games in 2015 followed by 26 games in 2016 say otherwise.

And no doubt Tom has become a better player for not having been gifted a spot.

Why bother

 

[Dubai Quacker]

I agree with (a) but not (b). When picked in the seniors, Mitchell was not played out of position as we claim that Sheldrick is. He was played in the mids but kept getting dropped back to work on his two-way running, which is quite different.

It was pretty widely reported that one of the contributing factors to Mitchell leaving was that he was being asked to play forward, not in the mids (even though I think we all know if was purely because of $).

How Tom Mitchell became a trade bargain

Inside the week that saw the Hawks swoop on the ball-magnet mid

www.afl.com.au

So I do stand by my view that Horse can be pretty stubborn when it comes to his preferred midfield.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

He only played 14 AFL games… so not sure a failed AFL player is the greatest example to beat for a prospective AFL player, but agree at VFL level he is no mug.

Sheldrick is playing as the number one mid in the VFL. He isn’t going to get that in the senior side therefore has to be flexible as he won’t get 100% of time on the inside. Can only grow as a player with exposure to other positions and playing up forward in the VFL probably isn’t going to achieve that, hence he will get exposure at AFL, much to the distaste of many here….

A perfectly logical position TheMase.

What I do view as problematic, however, is a bloke like Sheldrick not even being given a taste of the mids when he is selected in the seniors.

Anyway - let’s see what transpires this week. I’ll reserve judgement until then!

 

[caesar88]

Re Sheldrick, the criteria for him getting a game in the mids is pretty simple - can he offer something that we need and don't already have?

He's got to have something to offer that makes him a better option than the mids we already have. I've seen nothing to suggest he'd be better than Rowbottom or Warner, and even Parker (who I have my gripes with.)

With Mills out and the potential replacements on the inside being the likes of Gulden (more effective on the outside atm), Heeney (ideally suited to the forward line), and Stephens (didn't set the world on fire in the VFL), I think Sheldrick may have a case to argue that he can offer more on the inside than these guys.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

Re Sheldrick, the criteria for him getting a game in the mids is pretty simple - can he offer something that we need and don't already have?

He's got to have something to offer that makes him a better option than the mids we already have. I've seen nothing to suggest he'd be better than Rowbottom or Warner, and even Parker (who I have my gripes with.)

With Mills out and the potential replacements on the inside being the likes of Gulden (more effective on the outside atm), Heeney (ideally suited to the forward line), and Stephens (didn't set the world on fire in the VFL), I think Sheldrick may have a case to argue that he can offer more on the inside than these guys.

…. and at the very least, what better opportunity to blood a young inside mid?

 

[kickthething]

I’m a bit puzzled.

Do the Swans honestly believe that anyone thinks Buddy ISN’T retiring this year?

Surely no

 

[kickthething]

Re Sheldrick, the criteria for him getting a game in the mids is pretty simple - can he offer something that we need and don't already have?

He's got to have something to offer that makes him a better option than the mids we already have. I've seen nothing to suggest he'd be better than Rowbottom or Warner, and even Parker (who I have my gripes with.)

With Mills out and the potential replacements on the inside being the likes of Gulden (more effective on the outside atm), Heeney (ideally suited to the forward line), and Stephens (didn't set the world on fire in the VFL), I think Sheldrick may have a case to argue that he can offer more on the inside than these guys.

I’m prepared to give Stephen’s the benefit of the doubt, not many could shine in that company…

 

[Ticky009]

Preview threads are free for Carlton, Eagles & Richmond upcoming games - pop over to the thread and put your name down

Toast - PREVIEW THREAD NOMINATIONS 2023

Right then, lets kick this off with some appreciation of the great previews we had last year, which spanned the length and depth of variety and reached its height in Banyo Bloods brilliant comic preview for our Norf game:hearteyes: Some little quirks in this draw overall: Us playing the Magpies...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[SwansProudly]

I'd play Fox in the mids

or put Will Gould in there - played great 4th quarter for VFL a few weeks back.

 

[Wolftone]

I bet Gus plays small forward lol

This is the best time to obviously play him in middle though

Yeah that's Horse for you. Consistent. In fact predictable. If he comes in he must be in the mids. PLAY GUS IN MIDS HORSE, YOU IDIOT

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[Wolftone]

I'm not sold on Sheldrick in the mids, but it does seem a logical inclusion given the situation we're in.

Horse loves his defensive mid role so I wouldn't be surprised if Sheldrick plays that role, could be a good way to ease him into the mids.

Where would you play Gus then? He was drafted because he toweled up Horne-Francis and every other mid he played on. What is the point of playing him forward? He is obviously not a forward. Play them where they can have the most impact

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[Wolftone]

Heeney will probably get hurt next

I think both him and Paps are both carrying niggling injuries.

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[TheMase]

A perfectly logical position TheMase.

What I do view as problematic, however, is a bloke like Sheldrick not even being given a taste of the mids when he is selected in the seniors.

Anyway - let’s see what transpires this week. I’ll reserve judgement until then!

I generally agree that it would be ideal to have him spend some time in there, if only 4-5 mins a quarter, as it is the role he is most suited to.

In the context of the GWS game with our season effectively on the line, I can understand why we didn’t turn to a 19 year old to do it for us against the likes of Coniglio, Kelly etc. If we were up by 30 points maybe a different story.

Looking him up he is a November birthdate too, so he is on the younger side of draftees from that draft.

 

[Wolftone]

Elsewhere I suggested something similar. He needs time off.

He needs new ideas. This lot are old and jaded.

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[caesar88]

Where would you play Gus then? He was drafted because he toweled up Horne-Francis and every other mid he played on. What is the point of playing him forward? He is obviously not a forward. Play them where they can have the most impact

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Literally said I'd probably play him in the midfield this week with Mills out.

Just that I don't have a problem with him not playing in the mids previously. He was never going to be a factor with all of our first-choice mids available.

 

[dosser]

Where would you play Gus then? He was drafted because he toweled up Horne-Francis and every other mid he played on. What is the point of playing him forward? He is obviously not a forward. Play them where they can have the most impact

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Are you suggesting we play him as a defensive mid because of what he did to JHF? If so, it could release Rowbottom more.

 

[Wolftone]

Horse might accidentally get selection right this week

It's not just selection. It's match ups. I wonder just how much he watches our blokes play? Some of the match ups have been Puzzling. Parker on fast mids. No. Due to the backs going down he has had to t week. I know that but the match ups were wrong, wrong, wrong.



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[dosser]

It's not just selection. It's match ups. I wonder just how much he watches our blokes play? Some of the match ups have been Puzzling. Parker on fast mids. No. Due to the backs going down he has had to t week. I know that but the match ups were wrong, wrong, wrong.



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That may not have been Horse's preferred matchup, but rather the result of the opposition coach trying to engineer that? Either way, it is up to the coaches to juggle the personnel to combat it.

 

[Nuggetz]

rather stephens than sheldrick get first crack at inside mid mins

 

[Dubai Quacker]

Are you suggesting we play him as a defensive mid because of what he did to JHF? If so, it could release Rowbottom more.

In the referenced U/18 game, Gus was certainly not playing a defensive role. JHF just couldn’t get near it because Gus constantly took first possession.

He’s not a forward. He’s not a tagger. He’s a ball winner.

I know Parker isn’t the flavour of the month here - but that is the type of player Gus is.

And worth noting - at the same age Parker was fringe best XXII - he played as the sub in the 2012 GF.

 

[dosser]

In the referenced U/18 game, Gus was certainly not playing a defensive role. JHF just couldn’t get near it because Gus constantly took first possession.

He’s not a forward. He’s not a tagger. He’s a ball winner.

I know Parker isn’t the flavour of the month here - but that is the type of player Gus is.

OK, that's really good to hear