Scape Goat I've lost my faith in Ken Hinkley Part 2

[Tredz]

Both KH and CD have spoken today about the 5th-10th/10-14 wins window we've been stuck in for the past 6 years. Both acknowledged that it's not good enough and things have to change if we're going to improve. This is a small, small start.

 

[Killer Power]

Also - has to be someone who has previously posted here with that ripped logo as his avatar. I have a good idea of who it is, and they used to shill for it here. Their username started with the name of a military rank. Likely one of the purported people who left because of the supposed unwarranted negativity on the board.

Colonel Bathwater?

 

[tribey]

Oddly enough my critique of Hinkley is more to do with the off-field decisions. I don't think Hinkley has had the required support to be a successful coach. Issue is: I don't see this as anyone else's responsibility. The onus is on Hinkley to yell loudly enough to get the support. He has failed to do this so far.

The original Voss hire apparently going against his wishes is certainly food for thought, but I'd argue that save for Choco circa 2003/4 when Bucky backed him to the hilt and supplied him with a dream team (Walsh, Bailey, Clarkson, Pittman, Russell + Pelchen), no Port Adelaide coach has enjoyed greater on and off-field resources.

 

[HighBudget]

Does Ken Hinkley and or David Koch run this twitter account?

And if we beat Fremantle, Adelaide, West Coast and Essendon we would have made the top 4! We could've ended our year on 13 wins and still missed out on finals, it's all irrelevant bullshit! the only thing that matters is that we didn't make the finals when we should have made the top 4

 

[Steve Dore]

Oddly enough my critique of Hinkley is more to do with the off-field decisions. I don't think Hinkley has had the required support to be a successful coach. ...

What additional support do you think he needs?

Hinkley fails at the basics of being an AFL coach. If he needs so much more support to do the job he is well paid to do maybe, just maybe, he's not actually up to it.

How do you think the level of support Ken gets compares with the support Brad Scott gets at Norf? Norf finished above us with arguably an inferior list.

 

[B0ydmental]

I was of the belief that he should be given a fair go. He's had more then a fair go hasn't he?
In the absence of someone better, the solution for the next three years should be better assistants around him.
I also think some players need to go. The leadership group needs a change, to actual on field leaders and not fan favorites.
We need an on field general.

We're lacking a lot, sadly.

2013/14 we had top notch assistants around Hinkley. The AFL was abuzz with Port Adelaide.
Lost the quality assistants, replaced with their lesser..the likes of Voss and so on. We brought in mature recruits, seasoned players.

What's happened? **** all.

I had the belief Hinkley might be like our bomber Thompson of Geelong...setting the club up for the years ahead..but nothing's happened, we've stagnated and are no better then a middle table club. I'll admit when I was wrong, that I was wrong.

Hinkleys a nice bloke. The players love him.
Our leadership group is a bunch of fan favorites. Do they lead on game day? Do they take charge?

Kochie can talk about ruthlessness all he wants. But these two things right there, are an indication we don't have the Port Adelaide ruthlessness anymore.
He can talk about how we are going to be ruthless, but unless those two things change, then it's just more talk from mr sunrise.

I saw KT at the game after our loss on the weekend. He was all smiles. How the **** can you be all smiles when our season has collapsed the way it has, and our team didn't even put in a decent four quarter effort, even with the smallest chance of making the finals?

Serious problems at Alberton. I said in previous seasons it's locker room culture. Seems it's a whole club culture that's the problem with all these **** heads making a decent quid off our club.

1. Obviously we want "better assistants, but how would we know that the assistants we moved on aren't better than Ken or the new ones? We might now be worse off
2. Koch is a smug muppett. Fact. Proof how he shit his pants to re-sign Ken. It is not worth listening to a single word out of his mouth
3. Keith is a grown man who wears track suit pants to the 2016 failure review to finger wag at players we know who you are

There are at least 3 problems

 

[chickentendies]

What additional support do you think he needs?

Hinkley fails at the basics of being an AFL coach. If he needs so much more support to do the job he is well paid to do maybe, just maybe, he's not actually up to it.

How do you think the level of support Ken gets compares with the support Brad Scott gets at Norf? Norf finished above us with arguably an inferior list.

I'm thinking a la Dimma or Buckley. I personally think that the assistant coaches are as important as the head coach nowadays, and its the head coaches responsibility to hire appropriately and voice when things aren't going correctly in a certain area. Hinkley has failed in this regard.

So again, its on Hinkley/senior management to make these appropriate decisions and I'd almost argue these recruitments are one of, if not their most important duty. I also believe that in a hypothetical world where this wasn't Hinkley's responsibility and we had good support, we'd be chugging along nicely. Hinkley has a silver tongue and appears to be above average in that area.

Again, not trying to say that we should keep Hinkley. I think that he was a fantastic assistant coach and its obvious that players as a general rule of thumb love him. I don't think these are the #1 assets we need in a senior coach.

 

[B0ydmental]

We need more of this, and less of Kochie and KT and Hinkley dribbling shit.

So true

1. Ken, Loser, True no-hoper. In the glory days our club would laugh at people like him and pity the Panthers that had him as their try hard coach. Can't walk his talk. No results, turns gold into leather. 3 more years FML
2. Koch. Holy **** words do not even come close to. Imagine him in a room with a Hayes, Quinn, Webber, Boyd, Williams. They wouldn't let him cut the grass. Or maybe I am naive

 

[Steve Dore]

I'm thinking a la Dimma or Buckley. I personally think that the assistant coaches are as important as the head coach nowadays, and its the head coaches responsibility to hire appropriately and voice when things aren't going correctly in a certain area. Hinkley has failed in this regard.

So again, its on Hinkley/senior management to make these appropriate decisions and I'd almost argue these recruitments are one of, if not their most important duty. I also believe that in a hypothetical world where this wasn't Hinkley's responsibility and we had good support, we'd be chugging along nicely. Hinkley has a silver tongue and appears to be above average in that area.

Again, not trying to say that we should keep Hinkley. I think that he was a fantastic assistant coach and its obvious that players as a general rule of thumb love him. I don't think these are the #1 assets we need in a senior coach.

I can't even name one of the assistant coaches at Norf.

I agree, Ken seems to make a great assistant coach. Unfortunately he's the head coach at Ports.

 

[Power Girl]

Oddly enough my critique of Hinkley is more to do with the off-field decisions. I don't think Hinkley has had the required support to be a successful coach. Issue is: I don't see this as anyone else's responsibility. The onus is on Hinkley to yell loudly enough to get the support. He has failed to do this so far.

I completely disagree. I think Hinkley has enjoyed an embarrassment of riches in terms of personnel support, programs, player list, fitness (people and equipment), media support. And yet still he manages to grossly underachieve.

The only way imo Hinkley will ever be successful as an AFL coach is if he has an amazing AFL coach in waiting as his assistant that he actually listens to (and that is a big if). He is not up to it as he has shown but since we can't move him on let's pray that Jarrod is as good as purported as it is our only hope.

 

[chickentendies]

I can't even name one of the assistant coaches at Norf.

I agree, Ken seems to make a great assistant coach. Unfortunately he's the head coach at Ports.

The key assistant coaches I rate highly at North are Tudor and Brown. Tudor has been a coach in 3 successful systems (Geelong, Sydney and IIRC Saints when they weren't shit house) and Brown I've heard is rated extremely highly internally. ****ed if I know anything about the rest of them. Honestly though I actually rate Brad Scott fairly highly compared to most others.

I wasn't trying to make a big statement, just a general observation. I haven't rated our assistant coaches since the end of 2014 and also think we've held onto some for far too long when change was sorely needed (as with any org IMHO). We appear to be making a few changes in the assistant coaches, but its not enough for me. I want to see Hinkley gone, purely because across 4 seasons he hasn't placed enough emphasis on the management of this area.

 

[simba_]

We need more of this, and less of Kochie and KT and Hinkley dribbling shit.

that's too rough n tough for a family friendly AFL franchise. we the supporters were crying out to be respected more by the competition, unfortunately the club took this as turning us into the infamous "everyones second favorite team". i remember posters getting ahead of themselves, excitedly watching our numbers go up, going "at this rate by 2018 we'll be an AFL Powerhouse!! Woo Hoo!" as though being an AFL Powerhouse is something to aspire to. the club needs to be the best version of itself, not this fantasy idea of a universally respected and admired "Super Club". there are clearly not enough Port people in high positions at the club or we wouldn't have such lowly aspirations

 

[1954]

that's too rough n tough for a family friendly AFL franchise. we the supporters were crying out to be respected more by the competition, unfortunately the club took this as turning us into the infamous "everyones second favorite team". i remember posters getting ahead of themselves, excitedly watching our numbers go up, going "at this rate by 2018 we'll be an AFL Powerhouse!! Woo Hoo!" as though being an AFL Powerhouse is something to aspire to. the club needs to be the best version of itself, not this fantasy idea of a universally respected and admired "Super Club". there are clearly not enough Port people in high positions at the club or we wouldn't have such lowly aspirations

Agreed, the `everyones second favourite team' BS had bells on it, and showed how naïve the bloke who made that statement was, and it appears still is.
That, his comment re wanting to make Kern a 10 year coach, (which was based on who the f*** knows ) and a number of other head shaker moments during his tenure, unfortunately epitomise what the club has become, a middle or lower ranking team that is there to make up the numbers!

 

[Smithy7]

Don't forget ..
Ken Hinkley will be on 5AA this afternoon

 

[badbeats]

Tudor has been a coach in 3 successful systems (Geelong, Sydney and IIRC Saints when they weren't shit house)

Tudor walked into St Kilda after they finished 20-2. They then went 15-6,12-9-1 and 12-10 with him there.

 

[David Puddy]

Don't forget ..
Ken Hinkley will be on 5AA this afternoon

Do we know what time?

 

[Smithy7]

Do we know what time?

Not sure ... either after 4 or 4.30 will post when I know

 

[Smithy7]

Ken Hinkley live 5AA 4.30

 

[OneGreatClub]

Don't forget ..
Ken Hinkley will be on 5AA this afternoon

If only they would ask some serious questions

 

[elee]

>> Hinkley has a silver tongue and appears to be above average in that area. <<

.. i cringed everytime i hear the WHYYYYYYYYYs and the WWWWWWWWHattts

 

[charcolechaddy]

Blah, blaming everyone but his stupid system and structure.

 

[PA88]

So we can infer that Hinkley seriously thinks the game plan suits our players. That's deflating.

 

[Moo87]

I completely disagree. I think Hinkley has enjoyed an embarrassment of riches in terms of personnel support, programs, player list, fitness (people and equipment), media support. And yet still he manages to grossly underachieve.

The only way imo Hinkley will ever be successful as an AFL coach is if he has an amazing AFL coach in waiting as his assistant that he actually listens to (and that is a big if). He is not up to it as he has shown but since we can't move him on let's pray that Jarrod is as good as purported as it is our only hope.

I'm not disagreeing that Hinkley has underachieved, but that our football department is basking in riches is a myth big footy certainly perpetuates. We have certainly made massive inroads from having skype or stats guy as assistants and one part time physio, but we still sit in the lower end of clubs in terms of football department spending, and we certainly haven't been able to retain quality senior assistants etc. Yes its an upgrade from where we came from but it seems to be commonly assumed here that we're now one of the more resource rich clubs, which is false.

 

[PA88]

I'm not disagreeing that Hinkley has underachieved, but that our football department is basking in riches is a myth big footy certainly perpetuates. We have certainly made massive inroads from having skype or stats guy as assistants and one part time physio, but we still sit in the lower end of clubs in terms of football department spending, and we certainly haven't been able to retain quality senior assistants etc. Yes its an upgrade from where we came from but it seems to be commonly assumed here that we're now one of the more resource rich clubs, which is false.

I think Hinkley's biggest fail is the shaping of the team. It's hard to compare to our player list when we joined the afl but from 97 to 2002 when we should've made the gf we could see a good side evolving. We didn't persist with players that couldn't cut it. Under Hinkley we are at the point where our list looks like it's closer to another overhaul than a flag.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Both KH and CD have spoken today about the 5th-10th/10-14 wins window we've been stuck in for the past 6 years. Both acknowledged that it's not good enough and things have to change if we're going to improve. This is a small, small start.

Talk is essentially cheap on a cost effective basis.