January 26

[Dan]

The protest is against the date. Change the date. lose the protest.

Not even you believe that

 

[Gavin Excell]

Went to Anzac Cove and the dawn service in 2014, not a single headstone talked about freedom or sacrifice or doing it for Australia or the King. Most of the ceremony was quite touching and heartfelt, based around reminding you that although it is now part of our collective national mythology, at the time these were just boys wanting to go home and hug their mums.

You wouldn't know it from the speech that the Liberal government Minister for Veterans Affairs gave though.

Some of the more modern WW1 films of recent times show the scared and crying young blokes in unimaginable horrific conditions.

 

[Gavin Excell]

My grandad ended up at Belsen after it was liberated and granny always said that took thirty five years to kill him.

Shit that's awful

 

[ferball]

The reasons for the outbreak of World War I have very little to do with "a ruling class family feud."

ok, if you insist....

 

[Roylion]

ok, if you insist....

Do you dispute it?

 

[Cap]

 

[Gavin Excell]

Do you dispute it?

I will say as a student I always struggled with the reasons for WW1 outbreak compared to the more obvious lead up to WW2. The assassination of the Archduke was just the tipping point but it seemed the key nations were frothing at the mouth for war

 

[Forward Press]

I will say as a student I always struggled with the reasons for WW1 outbreak compared to the more obvious lead up to WW2. The assassination of the Archduke was just the tipping point but it seemed the key nations were frothing at the mouth for war

Roylion may be typing up an essay right now but at high school level it's taught that it's a combination of factors - the increasingly complex set of bilateral alliances between European powers (which meant just one country being attacked could draw in every other country), increasing militarisation as technology went from swords to bullets, and nationalistic and imperialistic ideas taking hold whipping the population of the powers into a frenzy. The assassination was the tipping point indeed and many argue that WW1 would have happened anyway with another trigger event if not for Archduke Franz Ferdinand.

 

[Kram]

I'm not big on ww1 history but I thought that it was due to a multitude of factors and always pretty much inevitable.

 

[Gavin Excell]

The end of WW1 is also somewhat mysterious
Germany accepted defeat pretty quickly and the suggestion (later pushed hard by Hitler) was that it's ruling decision makers sold out the Army and indeed the country
The stab in the back story then evolved

 

[South of the Yarra]

Not even you believe that

Gee, now you are telling me what I think and believe. Every Aboriginal person I have spoken to in recent weeks would be happy with a date change and a celebration that encompasses everyone. There are other more important battles to be fought such as closing the gap in health, health literacy, education and life expectancy.

 

[Nuggs Bunny]

The end of WW1 is also somewhat mysterious
Germany accepted defeat pretty quickly and the suggestion (later pushed hard by Hitler) was that it's ruling decision makers sold out the Army and indeed the country
The stab in the back story then evolved

I don't know if there's much mystery behind it. After the spring offensive failed in 1918 it was obvious Germany wasn't going to win and once the allies broke through the Hindenburg line the outcome was inevitable. Can only speculate about how much the average German would have known about the military situation in 1918 however from today's perspective there's really no weight at all behind the stab in the back story.

But I digress...

 

[Gough]

s**t that's awful

Dropped dead in front of me in end, went to get out of bed to put his shoes on and didn't quite make it.

 

[Dan]

Gee, now you are telling me what I think and believe. Every Aboriginal person I have spoken to in recent weeks would be happy with a date change and a celebration that encompasses everyone. There are other more important battles to be fought such as closing the gap in health, health literacy, education and life expectancy.

Does the people you've spoken to equate to the thousands of people flooding to the city to protest?

 

[Roylion]

Roylion may be typing up an essay right now but at high school level it's taught that it's a combination of factors - the increasingly complex set of bilateral alliances between European powers (which meant just one country being attacked could draw in every other country), increasing militarisation as technology went from swords to bullets, and nationalistic and imperialistic ideas taking hold whipping the population of the powers into a frenzy. The assassination was the tipping point indeed and many argue that WW1 would have happened anyway with another trigger event if not for Archduke Franz Ferdinand.

Nice essay. I'll compare yours with the ones I'll be marking in about fortnight's time.

 

[Kram]

There are other more important battles to be fought such as closing the gap in health, health literacy, education and life expectancy.

This.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Dropped dead in front of me in end, went to get out of bed to put his shoes on and didn't quite make it.

He was part of the initial liberation of the Camp?

 

[Gough]

He was part of the initial liberation of the Camp?

No, his service record says he was posted there afterwards. He was only in his early thirties at the time and he never got over it.

 

[Gavin Excell]

No, his service record says he was posted there afterwards. He was only in his early thirties at the time and he never got over it.

It's hard to imagine

 

[Kram]

For us, the Great War is finito. A war which would have been a damn sight simpler if we'd just stayed in England and shot 50,000 of our men a week!

 

[South of the Yarra]

Does the people you've spoken to equate to the thousands of people flooding to the city to protest?

The Aboriginal people I have spoken to equates to representatives of tens of thousands of Aboriginals.

 

[Festerz]

 

[Gavin Excell]

Interesting pre match piece on Yvonne Goolagong Cawley

Amazing story

 

[South of the Yarra]

Interesting pre match piece on Yvonne Goolagong Cawley

Amazing story

Brilliant and a damn good lady

 

[Dan]

The Aboriginal people I have spoken to equates to representatives of tens of thousands of Aboriginals.

That's quite the reach.

If the government believed that a simple changing of the date would stop protests and allow Australians to have a national day to celebrate without any hijacking.....they would have changed that date long ago.

No the reality of it is that a change of date would be seen as some kind of moral victory by the mobs that participate in these protests. It would galvanise more people to not only continue the 26th protests and but to possibly hijack the 'new AD date'.