List clean out is urgently needed

[Godfather32]

You are more than likely correct but there is a chance that NN might want to win a premiership and he will not win one with us. He may want to go?

Possible, but like the purple guy said, he's an out of contract unrestricted free agent so why would anyone trade anything to us for him?

 

[Chump Change]

Very close to being completely on the moment. Simpson has to go otherwise you can see him playing Shuey, Redden, Hurn, Kennedy forever. Needs to start transitioning now. He sacked Priddis, needs to not wait until the seas


No one is offering any pick lower than 30 for the names being thrown up for trade, that bird has flown. It's going to be a long rebuild relying on the draft e.g. finish bottom 4 3 years running which will be realistic combined with buying new players when the cash becomes available at the end of the long and pricey contracts given to Gaff, Yeo, McGovern, Kelly, Darling, Sheed - not sure what Shuey, Kennedy, NN and Hurn are on. Can't imagine anyone other than Duggan, Allen, Ryan, Barrass are on anything more than 250-300 per year (Rioli should be with next contract). Drop kick clubs like Melbourne, Essendon, Fremantle, North Melbourne, Gold Coast have been plundering top 10 picks for 5 years +, we are miles off overtaking their playing lists doing the same thing they've done.

Just to be clear, my position is we should rebuild through the draft....

BUT, if we can offload a player or two, then let's do that too.

The obvious choice for me is Gov (because he has real currency), but as others have pointed out, he has a few years on his contract. Ditto Darling - I think he has some currency but has years left on his contract.

As for Gaff - I doubt many clubs want him, but we need to change how we play and he plays exactly how we don't want to play. I would take a 3rd rounder for him on the small chance we get a 150 game flanker (who isn't a perennial fringe player).

NicNat - there may be a club who thinks he's the missing jigsaw piece.

Yeo - we wouldn't get his market value so I doubt I'd trade him.

Sheed - same as Gaff. I think he's worth somewhere between 30-40 and would take it.

What if someone come to the club and offers pick 14 for Liam Ryan? I would take it.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Possible, but like the purple guy said, he's an out of contract unrestricted free agent so why would anyone trade anything to us for him?

Yep forgot about that bit.

 

[Balls In]

Its critical to retain most of your good players through a rebuild, otherwise you are trying to build a whole new culture from the ground up. That is a bloody hard to do even with brilliant access to the draft. Ask GWS or the Sun's.

 

[Chump Change]

Its critical to retain most of your good players through a rebuild, otherwise you are trying to build a whole new culture from the ground up. That is a bloody hard to do even with brilliant access to the draft. Ask GWS or the Sun's.

Correct, but I don't think anyone is saying to trade out more than a few players. Saying "all these players are on the table" is not the same as "let's trade all these layers". Realistically if we put everyone on the table besides OA and Chesser, we'd be lucky to get a nibble at all.

 

[Carbine Chaos]

What if someone come to the club and offers pick 14 for Liam Ryan? I would take it.

100% would not.

 

[Chump Change]

100% would not.

He's going to sit on our list for 5 years while we're bottom 4. Potentially he's a shining light. Maybe he mentors young players - but other players can do that too. After 4-5 years we have a loyal one game player ready to retire and maybe we have a young list read to ascend....

Maybe that pick 14 is a bust. Maybe not half the player Ryan is, maybe not a player at all. But sacrificing one good player now will have limited affect on how we rebuild. That pick 14 however could be that diamond, or a solid 150 game player in our next flag side.

The more picks we have now, the more chance of find those players who will make up our next flag side.

 

[lusheslewis]

I had a look at our drafting since 2015, I think we've done an OK job given the picks we had.

Venables, Brander plus the Kelly Trade is what really thins it out.

 

[Goroyals22]

I think if Gaff and Darling can find form again they will command a good price come October but it's a big if especially from Darling who is really struggling to play 4 quarters.

No they wont.. one is a pea heart with a litany of brainfades and inconsistent performances who hasn’t played a four quarter game for that many years you would struggle to point one out… Richmond 2018 the last? Infact whens the last time he strung together two good quarters ?

And the other is a one paced plodder who loves to run onto his wrong foot to get a kick or just boots the ball over his shoulder hoping it falls into someones lap..

The ships sailed to trade either of them for anything decent.

 

[Tugga27]

No they wont.. one is a pea heart with a litany of brainfades and inconsistent performances who hasn’t played a four quarter game for that many years you would struggle to point one out… Richmond 2018 the last? Infact whens the last time he strung together two good quarters ?

And the other is a one paced plodder who loves to run onto his wrong foot to get a kick or just boots the ball over his shoulder hoping it falls into someones lap..

The ships sailed to trade either of them for anything decent.

I realise JD has become a whipping boy, but think you're being extremely unfair.

Over the past 6 seasons, has kicked 40 plus goals in all but 1 year.

The year when Kennedy was injured for a large part of the year, he dominated the first 9 or 10 rounds.

There's a heap of sides who would love to have him.
Bulldogs, Freo, GC, Collingwood, Essendon etc.

Players who kick 40 goals a year don't grow on tree's.

 

[Goroyals22]

I realise JD has become a whipping boy, but think you're being extremely unfair.

Over the past 6 seasons, has kicked 40 plus goals in all but 1 year.

The year when Kennedy was injured for a large part of the year, he dominated the first 9 or 10 rounds.

There's a heap of sides who would love to have him.
Bulldogs, Freo, GC, Collingwood, Essendon etc.

Players who kick 40 goals a year don't grow on tree's.

So he dominated 9 or ten games in a 240 game career?? yes until he hurt his ankle his 2018 was outstanding.. he has never recaptured anywhere near that form since and now never will at his age..
Last year he kicked 42 goals… 26 of those came in the first 9 games.. 5 of those goals came in 1 quarter against Adelaide… 3-4 came in a quarter against Collingwood..
thats the pattern of his career. Few 4 quarter games just a few bursts once in a while then he disappears.

 

[Godfather32]

I realise JD has become a whipping boy, but think you're being extremely unfair.
Over the past 6 seasons, has kicked 40 plus goals in all but 1 year.
The year when Kennedy was injured for a large part of the year, he dominated the first 9 or 10 rounds.

There's a heap of sides who would love to have him.
Bulldogs, Freo, GC, Collingwood, Essendon etc.

Players who kick 40 goals a year don't grow on tree's.

God I hope so, 1st round pick for him sounds good

 

[Tugga27]

So he dominated 9 or ten games in a 240 game career?? yes until he hurt his ankle his 2018 was outstanding.. he has never recaptured anywhere near that form since and now never will at his age..
Last year he kicked 42 goals… 26 of those came in the first 9 games.. 5 of those goals came in 1 quarter against Adelaide… 3-4 came in a quarter against Collingwood..
thats the pattern of his career. Few 4 quarter games just a few bursts once in a while then he disappears.

It doesn't really matter what quarter he kicks them or in what games.

He might not be as consistent as you like, but the bottom line is he generally kicks 40 plus a year.

That's hard to replace and not to be sneezed at.

 

[Carbine Chaos]

While Geelong's ageing list is basically a meme, it's worth noting that we fielded the second oldest 22 this weekend.

Bodes well for the future.

 

[Goroyals22]

It doesn't really matter what quarter he kicks them or in what games.

He might not be as consistent as you like, but the bottom line is he generally kicks 40 plus a year.

That's hard to replace and not to be sneezed at.

Well it actually does… he flat tracked goals against the bottom sides at home…

 

[Chump Change]

Darling has maybe 4 seasons and 150 goals left. He's not a long term prospect. Like many of our decent players, he's a potential "final piece in the flag puzzle". That's not even considering his current contract, or salary.

Who would want him? Swans replacement for buddy? Brisbane maybe? Bulldogs?

Let's say the Swans think they are in the window and Buddy and Reid retire. Would they think Darling and McDonald can take them to a flag inside two years? It's a big if, but if it's a yes and all other planets align, we're probably talking pick 15-25.

 

[Tugga27]

Well it actually does… he flat tracked goals against the bottom sides at home…

I'll take 40 goals a year no matter who and when he kicks them.

To say he wouldnt be worth anything as a trade is ludicrous.

 

[Tugga27]

Darling has maybe 4 seasons and 150 goals left. He's not a long term prospect. Like many of our decent players, he's a potential "final piece in the flag puzzle". That's not even considering his current contract, or salary.

Who would want him? Swans replacement for buddy? Brisbane maybe? Bulldogs?

Let's say the Swans think they are in the window and Buddy and Reid retire. Would they think Darling and McDonald can take them to a flag inside two years? It's a big if, but if it's a yes and all other planets align, we're probably talking pick 15-25.

Freo would love to have him.
He's not going anywhere so it's a moot point.

What was your previous username?

 

[BeornJ]

This is the way I see it... another flag push is at a minimum another 3 years away, therefore...let's take a look at DA YOOF.

As in...our players 25 and under. Is there talent there that just isn't getting the opportunity because older players that won't feature in our next Premiership are keeping them out of playing at AFL level?
Is there enough talent? Is there enough talent at all lines?

Obviously people can differ in their opinions of each player, try not to get bogged down in whether a player should be considered C or B... just take an overall look.

I think it's clear that this is not a list that just needs a player or two poached from other teams to round off. This is a list that is desperate for regeneration from the draft.

In the midfield we have no obvious A graders coming through. We hope SPS can fulfil his potential through the middle, we hope L. Edwards and O'Neill can continue to develop, we hope West can be a solid back up for us, but none of these are projecting as A grade midfielders at this stage.

Chesser is the unknown, but even if (and this is a big if) he turns into a genuine midfield star, he will need support.

Aside from a few exceptions, A grade midfielders are found in the first rd of drafts.
Therefore...no matter the temptation.... we must NOT trade away any of our first rd picks for the next few years (unless we are getting first rds back)

There is no good using up first rd picks to get a Jackson or an English, in a few years they will have no one to tap the ball down to!

Established A Grade Player
Ryan


Established B Grade Player
Duggan
Witherden
Allen (We hope he can take it to the next level)


Established C Grade Player
Petrevski-Seton (change of club may unlock his potential)
Cole
Rotham
Waterman
Jones
Naish
Petruccelle


Established D or lower
West
Clark



Developing (Hopefully A or B Grade)
Foley
H. Edwards
L. Edwards
Hough
Chesser
J. Williams
Bazzo

Developing (Probably C or lower)
Winder
Trew
Strnadica
Jamieson
Joyce
B. Williams
O'Neill

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

There is no good using up first rd picks to get a Jackson or an English, in a few years they will have no one to tap the ball down to!

Developing (Probably C or lower)
Winder
Trew
Strnadica
Jamieson
Joyce
B. Williams
O'Neill

Can see the appeal (to the match committee anyway) if our worst players are our entire ruck cohort.

 

[ziad]

Its critical to retain most of your good players through a rebuild, otherwise you are trying to build a whole new culture from the ground up. That is a bloody hard to do even with brilliant access to the draft. Ask GWS or the Sun's.

The draft isnt enough as we only get one real high pick every year at very best. 1-5 for a professional recruiter is a top player, 5-20 brings in an element of chance. We also need to trade in competative winners to support a build.
As for retaining the clulture - the club culture is what must absolutely be changed now.

 

[Goroyals22]

I'll take 40 goals a year no matter who and when he kicks them.

To say he wouldnt be worth anything as a trade is ludicrous.

Thanks for your input adam.
We can see why our side is so mediocre then and below par performances accepted..

Who is going to take on his stupid salary? He wouldnt be worth anymore than a late second at best…

 

[ziad]

This is the way I see it... another flag push is at a minimum another 3 years away, therefore...let's take a look at DA YOOF.

As in...our players 25 and under. Is there talent there that just isn't getting the opportunity because older players that won't feature in our next Premiership are keeping them out of playing at AFL level?
Is there enough talent? Is there enough talent at all lines?

Obviously people can differ in their opinions of each player, try not to get bogged down in whether a player should be considered C or B... just take an overall look.

I think it's clear that this is not a list that just needs a player or two poached from other teams to round off. This is a list that is desperate for regeneration from the draft.

In the midfield we have no obvious A graders coming through. We hope SPS can fulfil his potential through the middle, we hope L. Edwards and O'Neill can continue to develop, we hope West can be a solid back up for us, but none of these are projecting as A grade midfielders at this stage.

Chesser is the unknown, but even if (and this is a big if) he turns into a genuine midfield star, he will need support.

Aside from a few exceptions, A grade midfielders are found in the first rd of drafts.
Therefore...no matter the temptation.... we must NOT trade away any of our first rd picks for the next few years (unless we are getting first rds back)

There is no good using up first rd picks to get a Jackson or an English, in a few years they will have no one to tap the ball down to!

Established A Grade Player
Ryan


Established B Grade Player
Duggan
Witherden
Allen (We hope he can take it to the next level)


Established C Grade Player
Petrevski-Seton (change of club may unlock his potential)
Cole
Rotham
Waterman
Jones
Naish
Petruccelle


Established D or lower
West
Clark



Developing (Hopefully A or B Grade)
Foley
H. Edwards
L. Edwards
Hough
Chesser
J. Williams
Bazzo

Developing (Probably C or lower)
Winder
Trew
Strnadica
Jamieson
Joyce
B. Williams
O'Neill

Overly generous. Duggan and Witherden are C grade back flankers that occasionally play as a B grader. After many seasons in they have shown their cards and rose coloured glasses dont help. The Developing A-B graders listed, well Harry would be absolutely dominating the WAFL with his physical atributes if he was A or B grade. L Edwards is ok but slow, the others havent played enough to say either way.

 

[ziad]

Can see the appeal (to the match committee anyway) if our worst players are our entire ruck cohort.

Jamo aside who is too young, given their physical attributes - they should be tearing WAFL games apart if they were ever going to be competative AFL ruckmen. Is it them, coaching or culture?

 

[Tugga27]

Thanks for your input adam.
We can see why our side is so mediocre then and below par performances accepted..

Who is going to take on his stupid salary? He wouldnt be worth anymore than a late second at best…

Ok

4 times leading goalkicker, All Australian, premiership player and will end up playing 250 games and kicking 500 plus goals for us.

Yep, he's a spud.