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greatwhiteshark said:
Honest opinion mate, do you think Adam Simpson can do a rebuild and take us to our next glory?
Click to expand...
Short answer:
With out significant changes to our game plan NO.

Long answer:
If he gets the right game plan in place then ……. a reserved maybe….. and I say that without seeing what influence Schofield and Knights make to the whole system.
He certainly can’t do it alone and will need good lieutenants to assist him.

I think Simpson is a good Coach but I also think he might need a change of scenery to reinvigorate himself.
Likewise a fresh set of ideas and a fresh approach at the Club could also be a good thing.

We seem to have gone stale- both Coach and Senior Players wise.

My two biggest concern are:

1. Can our drafting and recruiting team, deliver the cattle.

2. And of an even bigger concern is can this coaching mix, then develop them adequately.

We have previously been able to trade good players / missing pieces of the jigsaw in.
We draft talls as well as any Club in the League.
Not so good at drafting mids, I won’t rehash old gripes.

Our player development has been IMO, a real disappointment and it worries me greatly.

I consider we have under delivered for at least six years with not bringing on our draftees quickly or adequately enough.

More so I also believe we have let player who have developed to a certain point, become satisfied with where they are at and we have been neglectful of then getting, our top players to go the next step.

We have difficulty in extending players to go from …… good to great.

Examples IMO: Darling, Gaff, Barrass all three seem to have rested on their laurels and not been able to take the next step to become elite.

There is IMO, a unhealthy level of complacency that’s seems to be riddled with in most strata’s of the Club….. and I mean from the very top all the way down.

All organisations need, from time to time, to be revitalised and be challenged and stimulated to grow and develop.

The same people in the same roles year after year is both a blessing and a curse.

The + is that it give stability, but the - is that Clubs become static and antiquated in their views and work practices, which are neither challenged or advanced as quickly as needed to survive and stay at the top in a fast paced and changing industry.

I have worked in and seen a few organisations that have had their best years immediately after a new CEO is appointed, conversely I have worked in one company where their worst years were when a CEO / MD stayed on too long.

The trick is to get the innovative balance right.

Historically we as a Club have done this well and are good at reinventing ourselves.
Our number of years that we have made finals bears testimony to that, it’s a record that stacks up impressively well against all other Clubs.

Right at the moment, however, we are in a bit of a lull, which is not a good place to be in, particularly when a cliff is rapidly approaching.

What is never ideal is when a new:

President
CEO
Head Coach

All need replacing at the same time.

Change Management is always tricky , but that doesn’t mean that an organisation should shy away from it.

The cynic in me, thinks that we have let the whole Covid sideshow, be a bit of a smokescreen to hide the true depth of our woes.

We need changes and we need them implemented ASAP.

The longer we delay the necessary changes, the longer we languish at the bottom of the ladder.

Just my two cents worth.
And it may be a classic case of:

Old Man Yelling at Clouds.
 
Last edited:
Monocle said:
Short answer:
With out significant changes to our game plan NO.

Long answer:
If he gets the right game plan in place then ……. a reserved maybe….. and I say that without seeing what influence Schofield and Knights make to the whole system.
He certainly can’t do it alone and will need good lieutenants to assist him.

I think Simpson is a good Coach but I also think he might need a change of scenery to reinvigorate himself.
Likewise a fresh set of ideas and a fresh approach at the Club could also be a good thing.

We seem to have gone stale- both Coach and Senior Players wise.

My two biggest concern are:

1. Can our drafting and recruiting team, deliver the cattle.

2. And of an even bigger concern is can this coaching mix, then develop them adequately.

We have previously been able to trade good players / missing pieces of the jigsaw in.
We draft talls as well as any Club in the League.
Not so good at drafting mids, I won’t rehash old gripes.

Our player development has been IMO, a real disappointment and it worries me greatly.

I consider we have under delivered for at least six years with not bringing on our draftees quickly or adequately enough.

More so I also believe we have let player who have developed to a certain point, become satisfied with where they are at and we have been neglectful of then getting, our top players to go the next step.

We have difficulty in extending players to go from …… good to great.

Examples IMO: Darling, Gaff, Barrass all three seem to have rested on their laurels and not been able to take the next step to become elite.

There is IMO, a unhealthy level of complacency that’s seems to be riddled with in most strata’s of the Club….. and I mean from the very top all the way down.

All organisations need, from time to time, to be revitalised and be challenged and stimulated to grow and develop.

The same people in the same roles year after year is both a blessing and a curse.

The + is that it give stability, but the - is that Clubs become static and antiquated in their views and work practices, which are neither challenged or advanced as quickly as needed to survive and stay at the top in a fast paced and changing industry.

I have worked in and seen a few organisations that have had their best years immediately after a new CEO is appointed, conversely I have and worked in one company where their worst years were when a CEO / MD stayed on too long.

The trick is to get the innovative balance right.

Historically we as a Club have done this well and are good at reinventing ourselves.
Our number of years that we have made finals bears testimony to that, it’s a record that stacks up impressively well against all other Clubs.

Right at the moment, however, we are in a bit of a lull, which is not a good place to be in, particularly when a cliff is rapidly approaching.

What is never ideal is when a new:

President
CEO
Head Coach

All need replacing at the same time.

Change Management is always tricky , but that doesn’t mean that an organisation should shy away from it.

The cynic in me, thinks that we have let the whole Covid sideshow, be a bit of a smokescreen to hide the true depth of our woes.

We need changes and we need them implemented ASAP.

The longer we delay the necessary changes, the longer we languish at the bottom of the ladder.

Just my two cents worth.
And it may be a classic case of:

Old Man Yelling at Clouds.
Click to expand...

Cheers for detailed response. Agree 100%.
 
ep2018 said:
Dangle Darling in front of the dogs and hope we can straight swap for English.

Trade pick 3/4/5 for two picks in the 10-15 range, combine our two second rounders for a pick in that range too.

Hit the draft with 10, 14, 17 etc
Click to expand...

Why would the Dogs trade English for Darling he’s one of the worst offenders in all of this.


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On Gaff -

Isn't Gaff on some ridiculous 850k a year deal? If we try trade Gaff out we will probably find that any other possible suitors will want us to eat half of his salary ourselves. Imagine the mutiny on the other clubs list of they brought Gaff in on that type of coin when they have better playwrs playing for half that already. I honestly think the best deal we would get is a pick somewhere in the 30's and we eat half the monster salary.Which would kind of partially negate the purpose of trading him out. We are not trading him out because we have a plethora of quality young wingmen to promote into the 22, we are trading him out to get his ridiculous salary off the books. That being said, i would still do it anyway. Shuey needs to go too. Given he is Captain of the club he must be on similar coin to Gaff and we are not getting a return on the massive expenditure. Clear those two out and we might clear $1.2 million off our cap.
 
My big fear is that the club will stick it's head in the sand and refuse to deal with reality. Now is the time we have to recognise how dire the situation is, admit our mistakes and take our medicine. Turn the list over, have a zero tolerance policy for lazy players and lazy bruise free football we are playing now, free up cap space, refuse the temptation to go and buy players from other clubs to plug the holes and sell hope to the supporters and prop things up. It will probably mean 3 years at the bottom. But if we do everything right, nail our draft picks, get the shitty attitude out of the playing list, get more organised on the field from a coaching point of view, get some cap space and maybe be able to get a free agent of the calibre of Luke Jackson or Logan McDonald in a year or two's time for nothing with that cap space etc then maybe we can be on the way back up in 3 years time. But very few clubs have the courage to do this. The people in charge don't want to admit their mistakes. Don't want to admit how poor decisions and management has been over several years that have led to this. They would rather believe that people are over reacting and if they just buy one or two more players from other clubs then it will all just magically turn around. Fremantle went down this road. How much better would they be now without all the shitty trades they did buying players over the last 5 years. I think that this is what might happen at our club too.
 
Monocle said:
a silver lining because we will now get access to better draft picks.
Click to expand...

Why does it matter on better draft picks when apparently there are a grade players available all the time at any draft pick location?

No need to reply!

Agree with other post on being stale. We dished out long term contracts to anyone that wanted one.
 
greatwhiteshark said:
Honest opinion mate, do you think Adam Simpson can do a rebuild and take us to our next glory?
Click to expand...
Sorry to jump in on your question to monocle.
Next glory, for that the best thing is to bottom out and grab the next Kerr, Judd or cousins. At this moment no one could be doing a better job on bottoming us out than Adam. A new coach could see us finish 6-10th, Fuxk that. Also a new coach would/should have to endure a bottom of the ladder two seasons to get some talent on the list, at that point they would be sacked. Why not let Adam hit the bottom of the ladder, fall on his sword and then move in a new coach. Bit of what Ken Judge did for us. Without Ken we would not have gained the talent for woosh to win in 06.
 
Deplorable trumpster said:
My big fear is that the club will stick it's head in the sand and refuse to deal with reality. Now is the time we have to recognise how dire the situation is, admit our mistakes and take our medicine. Turn the list over, have a zero tolerance policy for lazy players and lazy bruise free football we are playing now, free up cap space, refuse the temptation to go and buy players from other clubs to plug the holes and sell hope to the supporters and prop things up. It will probably mean 3 years at the bottom. But if we do everything right, nail our draft picks, get the shitty attitude out of the playing list, get more organised on the field from a coaching point of view, get some cap space and maybe be able to get a free agent of the calibre of Luke Jackson or Logan McDonald in a year or two's time for nothing with that cap space etc then maybe we can be on the way back up in 3 years time. But very few clubs have the courage to do this. The people in charge don't want to admit their mistakes. Don't want to admit how poor decisions and management has been over several years that have led to this. They would rather believe that people are over reacting and if they just buy one or two more players from other clubs then it will all just magically turn around. Fremantle went down this road. How much better would they be now without all the shitty trades they did buying players over the last 5 years. I think that this is what might happen at our club too.
Click to expand...
I agree totally
 
Monocle said:
Short answer:
With out significant changes to our game plan NO.

Long answer:
If he gets the right game plan in place then ……. a reserved maybe….. and I say that without seeing what influence Schofield and Knights make to the whole system.
He certainly can’t do it alone and will need good lieutenants to assist him.

I think Simpson is a good Coach but I also think he might need a change of scenery to reinvigorate himself.
Likewise a fresh set of ideas and a fresh approach at the Club could also be a good thing.

We seem to have gone stale- both Coach and Senior Players wise.

My two biggest concern are:

1. Can our drafting and recruiting team, deliver the cattle.

2. And of an even bigger concern is can this coaching mix, then develop them adequately.

We have previously been able to trade good players / missing pieces of the jigsaw in.
We draft talls as well as any Club in the League.
Not so good at drafting mids, I won’t rehash old gripes.

Our player development has been IMO, a real disappointment and it worries me greatly.

I consider we have under delivered for at least six years with not bringing on our draftees quickly or adequately enough.

More so I also believe we have let player who have developed to a certain point, become satisfied with where they are at and we have been neglectful of then getting, our top players to go the next step.

We have difficulty in extending players to go from …… good to great.

Examples IMO: Darling, Gaff, Barrass all three seem to have rested on their laurels and not been able to take the next step to become elite.

There is IMO, a unhealthy level of complacency that’s seems to be riddled with in most strata’s of the Club….. and I mean from the very top all the way down.

All organisations need, from time to time, to be revitalised and be challenged and stimulated to grow and develop.

The same people in the same roles year after year is both a blessing and a curse.

The + is that it give stability, but the - is that Clubs become static and antiquated in their views and work practices, which are neither challenged or advanced as quickly as needed to survive and stay at the top in a fast paced and changing industry.

I have worked in and seen a few organisations that have had their best years immediately after a new CEO is appointed, conversely I have worked in one company where their worst years were when a CEO / MD stayed on too long.

The trick is to get the innovative balance right.

Historically we as a Club have done this well and are good at reinventing ourselves.
Our number of years that we have made finals bears testimony to that, it’s a record that stacks up impressively well against all other Clubs.

Right at the moment, however, we are in a bit of a lull, which is not a good place to be in, particularly when a cliff is rapidly approaching.

What is never ideal is when a new:

President
CEO
Head Coach

All need replacing at the same time.

Change Management is always tricky , but that doesn’t mean that an organisation should shy away from it.

The cynic in me, thinks that we have let the whole Covid sideshow, be a bit of a smokescreen to hide the true depth of our woes.

We need changes and we need them implemented ASAP.

The longer we delay the necessary changes, the longer we languish at the bottom of the ladder.

Just my two cents worth.
And it may be a classic case of:

Old Man Yelling at Clouds.
Click to expand...
I recall Rick Charlsworth speaking at a conference some years ago, while he had a role at the Dockers.

In summary - many are happy to have a contract and the cudos of being an AFL player, Executive etc.. They have no motivation to do more. He made the point that there are about 1000 so called elite AFL players, but by comparison about 6 cricketers in the country that are called elite. I suspect the Eagles are very comfortable.
 

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Deplorable trumpster said:
On Gaff -

Isn't Gaff on some ridiculous 850k a year deal? If we try trade Gaff out we will probably find that any other possible suitors will want us to eat half of his salary ourselves. Imagine the mutiny on the other clubs list of they brought Gaff in on that type of coin when they have better playwrs playing for half that already. I honestly think the best deal we would get is a pick somewhere in the 30's and we eat half the monster salary.Which would kind of partially negate the purpose of trading him out. We are not trading him out because we have a plethora of quality young wingmen to promote into the 22, we are trading him out to get his ridiculous salary off the books. That being said, i would still do it anyway. Shuey needs to go too. Given he is Captain of the club he must be on similar coin to Gaff and we are not getting a return on the massive expenditure. Clear those two out and we might clear $1.2 million off our cap.
Click to expand...
We'd have to eat half of his salary which I'm fine with. I just want a) to throw the dice at a mid 30s pick. Maybe/probably a bust but could jag a 150 game non-fringe player, and b) He holds the ball up every time he gets it. It's not a direction we need to be going in and he's only getting slower and shitter.
 
langdon19 said:
Next glory, for that the best thing is to bottom out and grab the next Kerr, Judd or cousins. At this moment no one could be doing a better job on bottoming us out than Adam. A new coach could see us finish 6-10th, Fuxk that. Also a new coach would/should have to endure a bottom of the ladder two seasons to get some talent on the list, at that point they would be sacked. Why not let Adam hit the bottom of the ladder, fall on his sword and then move in a new coach. Bit of what Ken Judge did for us. Without Ken we would not have gained the talent for woosh to win in 06.
Click to expand...
Spot on.

I wanted him gone mid 2020. Have a look at Mitchell and Macrae - both can coach but I can't help but feel the timing is wrong and when they do get to top 8 or top 4 they just won't have the cattle - i.e. the 2 or 3 game breaker, bull or power fwd types needed. So now I'm, "just sit there and bottom out for us please Adam". Then you can **** off, or reinvent yourself (not confident on the latter).

I posted somewhere the last 6 flag teams. One thing they all had in common - their best 2-3 players are top 5 draft picks. There's other teams who have 2-3 top 5 draft picks who haven't won a flag, but none who don't have 2-3 top 5 picks (as their best players) who haven't.

Play the percentages (unwittingly) please Adam.
 
Chump Change said:
Spot on.

I wanted him gone mid 2020. Have a look at Mitchell and Macrae - both can coach but I can't help but feel the timing is wrong and when they do get to top 8 or top 4 they just won't have the cattle - i.e. the 2 or 3 game breaker, bull or power fwd types needed. So now I'm, "just sit there and bottom out for us please Adam". Then you can **** off, or reinvent yourself (not confident on the latter).

I posted somewhere the last 6 flag teams. One thing they all had in common - their best 2-3 players are top 5 draft picks. There's other teams who have 2-3 top 5 draft picks who haven't won a flag, but none who don't have 2-3 top 5 picks (as their best players) who haven't.

Play the percentages (unwittingly) please Adam.
Click to expand...
Perhaps there is more than we know going on in the background. Adam is bottoming us out. It’s hard to win a flag from the west, he have to be head and shoulders above the pack to win on the G if we get a Victorian opponent, cough cough Collingwood
 
The Passenger said:
There's legitimate reasons for moving simmo on at the end of this season.

But wanting a premiership coach gone 18 months after lifting a flag? Let's live in the real world for just a moment.
Click to expand...
People on here wanted him gone in 2029.

He'll, one bloke said just after we'd won that he still wanted him gone prior to 2018 and the flag hadn't changed his mind about that and thought he shouldn't have been there, even in 2018.

There's no pleasing blockheads.
 
The Passenger said:
There's legitimate reasons for moving simmo on at the end of this season.

But wanting a premiership coach gone 18 months after lifting a flag? Let's live in the real world for just a moment.
Click to expand...
The real world is that history has shown my intuition to be correct.
 
Chump Change said:
The real world is that history has shown my intuition to be correct.
Click to expand...
Three years out of the finals....No eagles coach would survive that

last year no finals ...this year no chance.......next year gone if we are not finals bound.. Eagles supporters are not patient and demand success so does the club . Three years with no finals ....yeah gone for me
 

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