News Lumumba's documentary and recent comments

[TW Sherrin]

So no one here has told a joke about an Irishman?

 

[PerthBoy87]

So no one here has told a joke about an Irishman?

The only joke i know is the "Luck of the Irish" as in someone saying:

"Luck of the Irish"

Apart from that - I dont know any Irish related jokes

 

[Adz]

He should be banned from the club forever. No premiership reunions for him.

Make no mistake, I will absolutely berate him if I see him on the street.

 

[TTRRAAVVIISS]

He should be banned from the club forever. No premiership reunions for him.

Make no mistake, I will absolutely berate him if I see him on the street.

Premiership players can do as they please. I hope you berate him on the street and H gives you both barrels like he did old Naffan.

Premiership players and coaches are always welcome at Collingwood. Mediocre Presidents and coaches not so much

 

[TW Sherrin]

Premiership players can do as they please. I hope you berate him on the street and H gives you both barrels like he did old Naffan.

Premiership players and coaches are always welcome at Collingwood. Mediocre Presidents and coaches not so much

So you'd welcome mick back?

 

[HeathySure]

As a person who has a foreign background I can say that the only racism I encountered was as a child by other children. And we are talking mid 70's here, Australia has changed a lot since then.
There are racist people in Australia, just like there are racist people in every country, but no way in the world could a generalization be made that Australians are racist. Very much the opposite. Australians in general are amongst the most accepting and inclusive people in the world.
Also, we should remember the larrikin character of Australians when looking at these things. My best friends would sometimes call me wog, but it is all about context. It was said affectionately, sort of like we are such good friends we can say anything to each other without offence being taken. And I reckon around football clubs this sort of thing would be amplified. I reckon from what you wrote about your dad some of the people calling him wog would have been doing so in that sense.
If you take offence to something that is not actually being said with offensive connotations in mind then the answer is really simple. Just politely tell the person. If I didn't like my friends sometimes referring to me as wog all I would have had to say is "hey guys, I know there is no bad intentions but please don't use that term with me". Done, finished.
........orrrr I could have waited 4-5 years and written a book about Australian racism in the hope of making some cash and getting some time in the limelight.

you had me til the last comment. I really dont think H is in it for the cash. I once saw him go around putting coins in expired parking meters, no reason why he just did it. There is absolutely no money made out of documentaries. Its on SBS for god sake, no one watches that. If you want to get a message across you need to be out there. H may not be perfect, but i do think his heart is in the right place

 

[Bad Horse]

Not sure the refugee issue is so much driven by racism as fear and ignorance.

I don't like the detention camps but a bit of a stretch to compare them to the concentration camps given the atrocities of those camps. That aside, the concentration camps of Nazi Germany were primarily an attack on the religious beliefs of a minority so I'm not too sure that actually constitutes racism either given that Jewish people were targeted irrespective of race or colour. That said, people of colour weren't overly popular in Nazi Germany either.

Interestingly the Nazis understood what they were doing absolutely in racial terms and were quite open about it.

A useful summary I guess is here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racial_policy_of_Nazi_Germany

Under Nazi racial theories, Aryans were at the top, and persecution of Jews as well as Romany, both of whom were sent to concentration camps were driven by underlying racial dimensions (in the case of Jews, the target was the Semitic peoples of Middle East origin, in the case of Romany, Indo-Aryans from the subcontinent) as much as religious or political. Their elimination was part of the more general racial purity and eugenics dimensions of the Third Reich, as much as any political dimension.

Interestingly application of the discriminatory laws was hampered precisely because of the issue you raise. What is a Jew, from a racial perspective, is not a simple question (as opposed to under Talmudic law).

I think there is a racial as well as fear and ignorance element in the refugee situation, and its hard to separate the two as always.

In the end, its always easy to find people willing to blame "The Other" for any woes, and find a willing audience whose actions can be steered towards a desired end by raising the bugbear of "The Other". All that changes is who "The Other" is in any given context. When "The Other" is from a different race and or religion, how do you split what is the motivator, and does it matter so much? What matters is Otherness and the willingness of the unscrupulous to utilise it in service of an agenda, not necesarily whether that is driven by religious or racial difference (or any other).

FWIW I kind of agree with Krak. Its common to find Australians being "casually racist" for want of a better term but I wouldnt say we are actually terribly racist. I think as a country we have a small minority of actual die hard racists and a wider pool of people who just havent got a clue, and see racial taunts as just another form of the typical Aussie banter though that pool is thankfully shrinking gradually (though I think, just like the USA, some of that is driving an increase in unapologetically racially motivated groups recruiting from people who feel affronted at being pulled up for their actions now.)

 

[TTRRAAVVIISS]

So no one here has told a joke about an Irishman?

Interesting you mention the Irish. They are marginalised as a joke by the English for centuries.

You go to Dublin and say to an irish sportsmen that they should be used to advertise a musical production about a potato eating, Guinness slurping, IRA sympathising and kiddy fiddling catholic priest and see what reaction you get.

You know just the kind of stereotype Ed gleefully used about Goodes on radio.

That Irish sportsperson would most likely knock you on your arse.

 

[TW Sherrin]

Interesting you mention the Irish. They are marginalised as a joke by the English for centuries.

You go to Dublin and say to an irish sportsmen that they should be used to advertise a musical production about a potato eating, Guinness slurping, IRA sympathising and kiddy fiddling catholic priest and see what reaction you get.

You know just the kind of stereotype Ed gleefully used about Goodes on radio.

That Irish sportsperson would most likely knock you on your arse.

That was my point. They've been the butt of racist jokes for decades.

 

[doodles98]

When i was at school i was racially teased, i was called Burnt Chicken Nugget, Mars Bar, Abo, fellow and other names.

It hurts, it really hurts and I dont say that so that i get sympathy on here, I say because I have been racially abused in the form of verbal abuse.

Sometimes I would ask myself if being Aboriginal was a bad thin due to the racial abuse that I copped. But now days I stand tall. What Andy my cousin has said today was not a direct attack at Collingwood, he was only speaking about his experience and also society in general. As i said in an earlier post, i am comfortable how he has worded his responses, its up to people how they interpret it.

Shit people who thrive on running others down are never in short supply unfortunately. Andy did the right thing in bringing this up and Backing Lumumbas claims which had been largely ignored or minimised. I am angry/depressed to see our club involved in this stuff again.


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[ottoman]

you had me til the last comment. I really dont think H is in it for the cash. I once saw him go around putting coins in expired parking meters, no reason why he just did it. There is absolutely no money made out of documentaries. Its on SBS for god sake, no one watches that. If you want to get a message across you need to be out there. H may not be perfect, but i do think his heart is in the right place

Yeah your probably right. The last comment may have been a bit cynical regarding cash, but he does like getting on his soapbox and can be a tad self righteous.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

When i was at school i was racially teased, i was called Burnt Chicken Nugget, Mars Bar, Abo, fellow and other names.

It hurts, it really hurts and I dont say that so that i get sympathy on here, I say because I have been racially abused in the form of verbal abuse.

Sometimes I would ask myself if being Aboriginal was a bad thin due to the racial abuse that I copped. But now days I stand tall. What Andy my cousin has said today was not a direct attack at Collingwood, he was only speaking about his experience and also society in general. As i said in an earlier post, i am comfortable how he has worded his responses, its up to people how they interpret it.

I have a lot of respect for you, as I have expressed to you before on bigfooty. While I have been prepared to dismiss Lumumba's latest claims as just more Lumumba attention seeking behaviour, I cannot so easily dismiss your comments. I am not going to say that I now believe that Heritier was racially vilified - I haven't yet thought beyond your comments and have not read what Andrew said in support of Lumumba. However, you have at least stopped my scepticism in its tracks and provided a fresh angle from which to view the situation. I am glad you have chosen to hang around our board. I might still think that Lumumba is a bit of a w***er, though I will suspend judgement on that until I have done justice to him and watched the documentary. But I have no reason to question your sincerity or experience. Cheers for your input.

 

[PerthBoy87]

I have a lot of respect for you, as I have expressed to you before on bigfooty. While I have been prepared to dismiss Lumumba's latest claims as just more Lumumba attention seeking behaviour, I cannot so easily dismiss your comments. I am not going to say that I now believe that Heritier was racially vilified - I haven't yet thought beyond your comments and have not read what Andrew said in support of Lumumba. However, you have at least stopped my scepticism in its tracks and provided a fresh angle from which to view the situation. I am glad you have chosen to hang around our board. I might still think that Lumumba is a bit of a ******, though I will suspend judgement on that until I have done justice to him and watched the documentary. But I have no reason to question your sincerity or experience. Cheers for your input.

Cheers mate. All i want is for EVERYONE to be treated the same - love and respect and not be judged because we are all the same no matter what our nationality is. We are all human and should walk together as one. If we did that then the world would be a better place. We all have a role to play.

 

[peter9789]

This time 76WS I don't quite agree that she's nailed it.
Whilst important points are raised unfortunately she falls for the trap of running her personal agenda in tandem with her take on Krakouer / Lumumba.

Way too much about Ed, Ed, Ed, Ed.... yes, Ed plays a big role, but seriously is it really just about Ed?
This is far too an important and sensitive issue to just make it about Ed.

The other part I really disliked about the article is Wilson starts by saying what Ed would be saying.
That's not smart, far better to let Ed say something and then make commentary.

(Declaration: I think Ed has not been a beacon of light in this sensitive matter. I think Ed has been our head for too long. I think Ed and the Goodes matter has caused and likely continue to cause attention on Collingwood and him that does little to assist any party.)

No doubt Caro has been waiting for sometime to unload on Ed. she clearly has a major axe to grind with Ed and I understand she is going to let loose tonight again on Footy Classified as a follow up to her article.

I think she will be calling for Ed to step down.


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[PerthBoy87]

What makes me extremely upset is the comments on social media and people saying hurtful things about Andrew and his comments in the media. I cant believe how nasty still some people are. Just hurtful it is

 

[Rohan25]

Caro's article wasn't just about bashing Eddie. It was actually pretty balanced compared to some articles she's written about him.

She didn't have to mention that Eddie had helped Krakouer financially since his retirement, nor did she need to reveal McGuire had personally gone out of his way to assist Lumumba's siblings with their schooling.

I thought she did well to include some examples that didn't necessarily support her agenda.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

No doubt Caro has been waiting for sometime to unload on Ed. she clearly has a major axe to grind with Ed and I understand she is going to let loose tonight again on Footy Classified as a follow up to her article.

I think she will be calling for Ed to step down.


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Great shame, on such an important topic, she ruins any meaningful points by the personal vanetta.
Great shame.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Caro's article wasn't just about bashing Eddie. It was actually pretty balanced compared to some articles she's written about him.

She didn't have to mention that Eddie had helped Krakouer financially since his retirement, nor did she need to reveal McGuire had personally gone out of his way to assist Lumumba's siblings with their schooling.

I thought she did well to include some examples that didn't necessarily support her agenda.

I should have taken that on board.
But my beef is that it was too much Ed Ed Ed Ed.
I'm much more interested in ensuring issues like this become a learning and a positive way to make me and others better in how we treat people.
That's the important part for me.

 

[PerthBoy87]

Caro's article wasn't just about bashing Eddie. It was actually pretty balanced compared to some articles she's written about him.

She didn't have to mention that Eddie had helped Krakouer financially since his retirement, nor did she need to reveal McGuire had personally gone out of his way to assist Lumumba's siblings with their schooling.

I thought she did well to include some examples that didn't necessarily support her agenda.

I didnt know that Eddie helped Andy financially when he retired so thats news to me but its not my place to know...in fact its none of my business when it comes to Andy's money. What does concern me is that people may read the "Eddie helped Krakouer financially when he retired" and think that Andy is some helpless lazy person when clearly he isnt. He works just like most do so he is well and truly doing well for himself.

There are some things that journalists should never write about in the media....it really is none of thier business.

 

[barrackers]

What makes me extremely upset is the comments on social media and people saying hurtful things about Andrew and his comments in the media. I cant believe how nasty still some people are. Just hurtful it is

Just ask yourself how many of those keyboard warriors know him personally and that answer is how many thoughts you should give them.

 

[PerthBoy87]

Just ask yourself how many of those keyboard warriors know him personally and that answer is how many thoughts you should give them.

I agree. Its just human nature to feel upset and hurt when people say nasty things about family. I'll be ok mate. Cheers.

 

[Gungadin]

So no one here has told a joke about an Irishman?

An Irishman died and went to heaven, when he got to the pearly gates, St. Peter said 'piss of we're not making stew for one'

 

[TKiL]

Black in Australia = minority. Those who have aways been in the white majority have not had the experience of marginalisation and the sometimes subtle, sometimes not subtle reminders of "you don't quite fit". Maybe Heritier is dramatic at times - other times to me he seems quite eloquent.
PS Maxwell needs a new jacket - one he wore last night was a tad ordinary IMO.
Edit - but definitely better dressed than Robbo

 

[TW Sherrin]

I didnt know that Eddie helped Andy financially when he retired so thats news to me but its not my place to know...in fact its none of my business when it comes to Andy's money. What does concern me is that people may read the "Eddie helped Krakouer financially when he retired" and think that Andy is some helpless lazy person when clearly he isnt. He works just like most do so he is well and truly doing well for himself.

There are some things that journalists should never write about in the media....it really is none of thier business.

with respect it is relative to the story about racism and Eddie.

 

[TW Sherrin]

had to chuckle that Mick has said today that he is proud of Lumumba and it didn't happen during his time.

maybe he's getting old and his memory is going.