MsTopG
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She isn't ready for anything other than losing.
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AFLW 2024 - Round 2 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Opinion Matthew Nicks: Adelaide's Coach (Part 2) - Full Support of the Board
- Thread starter adelaidecrows
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- Sep 3, 2018
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We see how much players contribute to making good coaches each week. Simpson - premiership coach just got sacked, Clarkson - hasnt made finals for last 7 years as coach?
Even Brisbane - looked horrible early in the year, key players found form and now they are arguably second favourite to win it.
Essendon are into their 3rd coach in the last 6-7 years, and still haven’t made finals (and won’t this year)
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Slime Roy
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but make no mistake, Joe Biden is a huge part of our future.
As soon as I post, following an excellent win, either B1 or B2 arrive to troll me again.
I am reluctant to post because regardless of the merit of any idea expressed, I am attacked
.
Strangely since I joined Bigfooty, according to Elite Crow/George Kramer
- Gary Ayres was a clueless coach
- Neil Craig was a clueless coach
- Brenton Sanderson was a clueless coach
- Don Pyle was a clueless coach.
Apparently any coach that doesn’t win a flag is clueless. Phil Walsh was our only coach to escape the vitriol but I guess he only coached 12 games.
There are aspects of Nicks coaching that I disagree with, others that I support. I see no point taking a negative approach to everything that happens in the AFC.
For example;
“We keep playing the same group of spuds this year”
FACT : Only Richmond, the bottom team have given an AFL game to more players in their AFL Squad this year
“We keep playing the old guys”
FACT : Since Nicks started we have given LESS games to 30+ year old players than all of the other 17 teams”
“We never play the Kids”
FACT : Since Nicks started We have given more games to sub 50 games players than any of the other 17 teams.
As I outlined in the changes thread each week, I would have played Dowling and Taylor earlier in the season but overall we have made a dramatic change to our list.
Our list profile is currently
Yet to debut - 4 (Edwards, Ryan, Gallagher and T Murray
1-25 games - 9
26-50 games - 9
51-100 games - 13
100-199 games - 5
200+ games - 3
Do you know how this compares to our 2021 and 2022 lists?
Please post our best 15 players assuming everyone is fit. Is Bond on the list? Is Dowling on the list?
At the start of this season I believe every poster had Milera (pre injury) and Crouch in our best 22. I had Worrell as our second best tall defender, do you rank Keane and Butts above Worrell, I don’t.
My list of “definitely in our best 22” at the start of the season was
Michalanney, Murray, Worrell, Milera, Hinge, Dawson, O’Brien, Soligo, Crouch, Laird, Rachele, Walker, Keays, Rankine, Fogarty, Thilthorpe.
Did you have Sloane, Murphy, McHenry, Sholl, Himmelberg, Schoenberg, Berry, Borlase, Hamill on your list?
I didn’t think Pedlar qualified due to his poor pre-season and there was uncertainty over Jones coming back from injury. Our best 22 has obviously changed a bit with Sholl and Nankervis now in our best 22/23 but imho probably not in our best 15.
1. Rankine
2. Dawson
3. Fogarty
4. Murray
5. Soligo
6. Michalanney
7. Keays
8. Hinge
9. Laird
10. Rachele
11. Keane
12. Berry
13. Butts
14. Nankervis
15. Thilthorpe
Nankervis and Berry have produced way more than Milera has over the past 3 seasons.
Crouch has been ok to good, but again I'd argue Berry has shown what a difference it makes trying to go forward.
Worrell is borderline against Keane and Butts. Keane and Butts probably have the runs of the board. Not to say Worrell won't go past next year.
You can be best 22, and not be best 15. Which is the arbitrary number you chose.
But do, enlighten us with your woe is us, Nicks is great lecture.
Statistically this is the order of our players by player rating this season :
| Rank | Player | RatingPoints_Avg |
1 | Izak Rankine | 17.738 |
2 | Jordan Dawson | 13.444 |
3 | Rory Laird | 12.572 |
4 | Matt Crouch | 12.455 |
5 | Mitchell Hinge | 12.359 |
6 | Reilly O'Brien | 11.056 |
7 | Darcy Fogarty | 10.617 |
8 | Jake Soligo | 10.411 |
9 | Ben Keays | 9.9 |
10 | Mark Keane | 9.712 |
11 | Taylor Walker | 9.243 |
12 | Josh Worrell | 9.133 |
13 | Riley Thilthorpe | 9.05 |
14 | Josh Rachele | 8.783 |
15 | Chayce Jones | 8.607 |
16 | Harry Schoenberg | 8.45 |
17 | Sam Berry | 8.346 |
18 | Lachlan Sholl | 8.34 |
19 | Luke Nankervis | 8.053 |
20 | Billy Dowling | 7.6 |
21 | Lachlan Murphy | 7.542 |
22 | Elliott Himmelberg | 7.475 |
23 | Will Hamill | 7.114 |
24 | Jordon Butts | 6.98 |
25 | Kieran Strachan | 6.75 |
26 | Brodie Smith | 6.707 |
27 | James Borlase | 6.688 |
28 | Wayne Milera | 6.667 |
29 | Brayden Cook | 6.55 |
30 | Nick Murray | 6.2 |
31 | Max Michalanney | 5.794 |
32 | Hugh Bond | 5.55 |
33 | Zac Taylor | 5.5 |
34 | Ned McHenry | 4.28 |
35 | Luke Pedlar | 4.125 |
36 | Chris Burgess | 4.043 |
37 | Daniel Curtin | 3.7 |
38 | Lachlan Gollant | 2.8 |
39 | Patrick Parnell | -0.2 |
He's still playing Murphy and Smith, you can't genuinely compete for a flag if you continue to make such terrible decisions at selection. As I've posted numerous times now, I reckon Nicks is a decent coach. We're going ok, but we'll never win a flag because he remains wedded to seniority over actual performance. The only way a player gets to debut during the season is through injury. It doesn't matter how poorly the experienced guy is going, if they're dropped, they're replaced by other experience, it's never a debutant. And this is why he won't be able to develop a contending list nor put the actual best 22 on the park.
The thing with Crouch and Laird is that individually it can be argued that they're best 15, but when played in the midfield together our outcome is as if they're 28th and 29th.
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In fairness to Milera he has had lots of injuries. At his best he is CLASS.
Gotta say I fully agree on Worrell, he had become that all important intercept defender that can actually defend, well and truly in my first ten picked each week, the other 2 an argument can be made, and I think if Jnr had stayed fit there would be no argument, I think a lot of people forget that boy can play, just a pity his body keeps letting us all down.
Can I just question this idea that we have played the second most players in our squad thing I’m seeing everywhere?
We play our youth for a half and it counts the same as another team playing someone for the whole season. Quarters played in 2024 by experience stat perhaps?
I’d also love to see the number of quarters played by age this year by the subbed on / subbed off cf other sides - Feels like we do it badly.
We have not STUCK with our unproven youngsters like we have completely done with our proven out of form oldies AND most of the debuts / young ins feel like they only come about through injuries to old fellas.
I’m not sure what more evidence people need regarding the benefits of playing talent in the firsts. Continuity still feels more important to Nicks as what he sees as the defining stat to win games (I’d be shocked if he even has a plan to win a premiership).
I suppose it needs the club to admit that we still have a lot of work to do on the list for that to make any sense?
We play our youth for a half and it counts the same as another team playing someone for the whole season. Quarters played in 2024 by experience stat perhaps?
I’d also love to see the number of quarters played by age this year by the subbed on / subbed off cf other sides - Feels like we do it badly.
We have not STUCK with our unproven youngsters like we have completely done with our proven out of form oldies AND most of the debuts / young ins feel like they only come about through injuries to old fellas.
I’m not sure what more evidence people need regarding the benefits of playing talent in the firsts. Continuity still feels more important to Nicks as what he sees as the defining stat to win games (I’d be shocked if he even has a plan to win a premiership).
I suppose it needs the club to admit that we still have a lot of work to do on the list for that to make any sense?
| Mark Keane | Adelaide | 93.882 | 24 | 17 | 9.712 |
| James Borlase | Adelaide | 93.5 | 22 | 8 | 6.688 |
| Izak Rankine | Adelaide | 87.538 | 24 | 13 | 17.738 |
| Hugh Bond | Adelaide | 87.5 | 20 | 2 | 5.55 |
| Reilly O'Brien | Adelaide | 86.25 | 29 | 16 | 11.056 |
| Ben Keays | Adelaide | 86.111 | 27 | 18 | 9.9 |
| Max Michalanney | Adelaide | 85.5 | 20 | 18 | 5.794 |
| Darcy Fogarty | Adelaide | 85.278 | 25 | 18 | 10.617 |
| Jordon Butts | Adelaide | 85.067 | 25 | 15 | 6.98 |
| Chayce Jones | Adelaide | 84.857 | 24 | 14 | 8.607 |
| Taylor Walker | Adelaide | 83.857 | 34 | 14 | 9.243 |
| Jordan Dawson | Adelaide | 83.611 | 27 | 18 | 13.444 |
| Elliott Himmelberg | Adelaide | 82.75 | 26 | 8 | 7.475 |
| Josh Rachele | Adelaide | 82.111 | 21 | 18 | 8.783 |
| Mitchell Hinge | Adelaide | 81.765 | 26 | 17 | 12.359 |
| Josh Worrell | Adelaide | 81.556 | 23 | 9 | 9.133 |
| Lachlan Sholl | Adelaide | 80.8 | 24 | 15 | 8.34 |
| Will Hamill | Adelaide | 79.143 | 24 | 7 | 7.114 |
| Brodie Smith | Adelaide | 78.933 | 32 | 15 | 6.707 |
| Billy Dowling | Adelaide | 77.667 | 20 | 6 | 7.6 |
| Patrick Parnell | Adelaide | 76 | 22 | 1 | -0.2 |
| Luke Nankervis | Adelaide | 75.867 | 21 | 15 | 8.053 |
| Rory Laird | Adelaide | 74.611 | 31 | 18 | 12.572 |
| Chris Burgess | Adelaide | 73.286 | 29 | 7 | 4.043 |
| Wayne Milera | Adelaide | 72.333 | 27 | 3 | 6.667 |
| Jake Soligo | Adelaide | 72 | 21 | 18 | 10.411 |
| Nick Murray | Adelaide | 72 | 24 | 5 | 6.2 |
| Matt Crouch | Adelaide | 70.727 | 29 | 11 | 12.455 |
| Brayden Cook | Adelaide | 70.286 | 22 | 14 | 6.55 |
| Lachlan Murphy | Adelaide | 69.917 | 26 | 12 | 7.542 |
| Kieran Strachan | Adelaide | 68 | 29 | 2 | 6.75 |
| Harry Schoenberg | Adelaide | 66.75 | 23 | 4 | 8.45 |
| Ned McHenry | Adelaide | 58.5 | 24 | 10 | 4.28 |
| Riley Thilthorpe | Adelaide | 57.5 | 22 | 2 | 9.05 |
| Lachlan Gollant | Adelaide | 55.667 | 23 | 3 | 2.8 |
| Sam Berry | Adelaide | 50.077 | 22 | 13 | 8.346 |
| Daniel Curtin | Adelaide | 47 | 19 | 2 | 3.7 |
| Luke Pedlar | Adelaide | 46 | 22 | 4 | 4.125 |
| Zac Taylor | Adelaide | 45 | 21 | 4 | 5.5 |
Not got the time or patience to do what you're suggesting but this is the avg TOG (3rd column). Dowling averages nearly as much TOG as Smith etc. I would assume we would be youngest by the stat you are suggesting given we only have 3 players over 30 on our list
We agree on 11 of our best 15 players.
1) I think Worrell is clearly our best third tall/intercept defender. Murray is our best key defender and I have Butts and Keane fighting it out for the other key defender spot. I have always been a big fan of Keane but he has had a few poor games (not surprising for a 27 game player) and he isn’t a certain best 22 player imho if everyone is fit.
2) In the second half of last year Milera was playing very well. I love Nankervis but he is yet to have the same influence as Milera at his best. I was one of the first posters to jump on board the Nankervis train, he is projecting very well but he is yet to have the influence of Milera at his best (as you would expect for a 19 game player)
3) Berry started in the AFL last year, struggled and then spent most of the season in the Twos. He has worked his way back into the Ones and his recent form has been good, but still well below the output of Crouch since he returned to the AFL late last season.
4) ROB is not a great ruckman but are you proposing that we play without a ruck. It has been proven that Strachan is not AFL standard so if not ROB then who?
My point was that we will be missing a lot of best 22 players this week. Murray, Butts, Worrell, Milera, Dawson, Crouch and Rankine. I hope I am wrong but I doubt that our replacements will be good enough to beat Hawthorn.
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Just for reference - Murray, Worrell, Milera and Rankine didn’t play against Hawks at the G in Round 12.
Crouch and Laird were in the middle and we know that doesn’t work. Dawson only had 15 touches.
The following players were in the side and probably aren’t this week - Jones, Burgess, Borlase and Schoenberg.
We have added the likes of Taylor, Dowling and Thilthorpe. We are definitely stronger.
Reckon we might do ok.
Slime Roy
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Finally just braved Nicks presser after the Dons match (it's been four days, so my BS Detector has had a rest)
Did he legit say we had to dig deep as B.Smith was dealing with some soreness??
Cmon' Chromey...(as Feenix said so well on Crow Cast) You played the man in TRACTION earlier in the year!
Don't you dare add that to your '2024 Excuse Olympics'
Did he legit say we had to dig deep as B.Smith was dealing with some soreness??
Cmon' Chromey...(as Feenix said so well on Crow Cast) You played the man in TRACTION earlier in the year!
Don't you dare add that to your '2024 Excuse Olympics'
jenny61_99
Premium Platinum
Seems to me what he mismanaged here was the balance. He absolutely needed to strengthen our defence (also bearing in mind our inexperience) across the ground, but he went too far and did it at the expense of our attacking flair that we’d been developing last year under Rahilly. That he couldn’t get a handle on the need for both is such a rookie error.
He got flattened early in the first quarter, they had him on the bench at the time Muz was being assessed. He wasn’t well but basically had to play once Muz was counted out.Finally just braved Nicks presser after the Dons match (it's been four days, so my BS Detector has had a rest)
Did he legit say we had to dig deep as B.Smith was dealing with some soreness??
Cmon' Chromey...(as Feenix said so well on Crow Cast) You played the man in TRACTION earlier in the year!
Don't you dare add that to your '2024 Excuse Olympics'
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The problem with that Jenny is he isn’t a rookie coach tho - he is 5 years into the top job with the previous 9 years being an assistant. Not bloody good enough.
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that was clearly sarcasm. read all 50000 posts of mine. I was merely trying to keep it positive for a change.
Below are two experience "QR"codes for first 17 rounds of this season and last season. The rows are the the players listed by experience from most experienced at the top to least experienced at the bottom. Note that some of the bottom ones may not be in perfect games experienced order. The columns are the rounds from left =1 to right = 17. The squares are coloured black if the player played.
Which one do you think is the 2024 season and which is the 2023 season?
(I know the top rows arent level on the pics, why this is is a thing I'll write off to the vagaries of the seven pieces of software involved in the process).
Which one do you think is the 2024 season and which is the 2023 season?
(I know the top rows arent level on the pics, why this is is a thing I'll write off to the vagaries of the seven pieces of software involved in the process).
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I guess to put the continuity question into context.
Swans have used 30 plays this year - 6 of those have played 3 games or under
We have played 39 players of which 11 have played 5 or less
Sydney are quite dominant it the continuity stakes - and funnily enough are still a couple of games clear on top
Most teams have played between 24 and 29 players as their core (played more than 5 games)
We have 28 in that category, as do North, Essendon and Port
Bulldogs, Richmond, Collingwood and StKilda have used 29 players more than 5 times
The rest have used less
Take out of that what you will
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Michael Voss did the exact same thing at the start of last season with Carlton. And he is on his second go round
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