Mick still bitter?

[Syrus]

Is this how things are done at Melbourne? No wonder everyone is leaving there at a rate of knots. You leave the recruiting to the recruiters, the list management to the list manager, the conditioning to the conditioning staff.

Everyone is aware of what is required at the club from a recruitment perspective, but you don't have the coach swanning in at the last minute to tell the recruiters how to suck eggs or telling the head of conditioning about training loads. Amateur hour.

Yeah, everyone is leaving our club at the same rate of knots as yours last year.

If the coach has no input into the list then i dont know why they are active in FA/trade/draft combine week. They might as well be on holidays and leave it to the powers that be to get it right to fit the game style/plan that the he wants. I cant think of an organisation where the manager has no say into the recruitment of the staff he employs.

 

[neroblack]

Yeah, everyone is leaving our club at the same rate of knots as yours last year.

If the coach has no input into the list then i dont know why they are active in FA/trade/draft combine week. They might as well be on holidays and leave it to the powers that be to get it right to fit the game style/plan that the he wants. I cant think of an organisation where the manager has no say into the recruitment of the staff he employs.

Carlton...

 

[Monkey King]

Won a flag the season after it was announced, so it has been a masterstroke

Funniest thing is that some you blokes have actually convinced yourselves of this.

Bet you also think Mick was gonna die if he kept coaching

Fact is the debacle of last year likely cost your club a flag. Just really bad management.

 

[neroblack]

Funniest thing is that some you blokes have actually convinced yourselves of this.

Bet you also think Mick was gonna die if he kept coaching

Fact is the debacle of last year likely cost your club a flag. Just really bad management.

I think a very good quarter and a half of football by Geelong cost us a flag.

 

[Monkey King]

I think a very good quarter and a half of football by Geelong cost us a flag.

I don't think so. I think Collingwood became somewhat derailed during the season. The playing group became distracted, the coaching group became distracted. That gave Geelong a window for a very good quarter and a half of football. Who really knows the sliding doors, but it seems pretty likely to me. Collingwood were a fair way in front of the pack, and during last season, they began their slide back, culminating in the GF loss.

 

[neroblack]

I don't think so. I think Collingwood became somewhat derailed during the season. The playing group became distracted, the coaching group became distracted. That gave Geelong a window for a very good quarter and a half of football. Who really knows the sliding doors, but it seems pretty likely to me. Collingwood were a fair way in front of the pack, and during last season, they began their slide back, culminating in the GF loss.

We were a fair way in front at one stage, but our last 6 weeks weren't much good last year. Much like your last 16 this year...(sorry, cheap shot). I don't see too much point in blaming that on things that can't be changed, best to blame it on the team losing form, and then make them work their arse off for the next season. Same thing we need to do this pre-season too. Kinda seems a soft excuse to blame it on the coaching situation last year or the cloke situation this year.

 

[Monkey King]

We were a fair way in front at one stage, but our last 6 weeks weren't much good last year. Much like your last 16 this year...(sorry, cheap shot). I don't see too much point in blaming that on things that can't be changed, best to blame it on the team losing form, and then make them work their arse off for the next season. Same thing we need to do this pre-season too. Kinda seems a soft excuse to blame it on the coaching situation last year or the cloke situation this year.

Just an outsiders observation. Look, no cheap shot, no troll ... I was worried at one stage because it looked like the Pies were a serious threat to getting up to 16 flags and perhaps beyond; as a Blues supporter, that would have sucked in more ways than I care to ponder. It's not something that concerns me greatly these days, as you've come right back to pack and from an outsiders point of view, it has a lot to do with what seemed like an unnecessary change in a coach that had the team running very smoothly.

Sure, don't get stuck in the past and don't get stuck in blame, both good philosophies to live by; however there's equally no point in pretending it was a masterstroke. If I was a Pies supporter, mostly it'd have me starting to look closely at Ed and the decisions he's making. Carlton made the mistake of letting a loud-mouthed president have it all his own way for too long and it cost us. Not saying that's what's happening here, but I would be wary all the same.

 

[neroblack]

Just an outsiders observation. Look, no cheap shot, no troll ... I was worried at one stage because it looked like the Pies were a serious threat to getting up to 16 flags and perhaps beyond; as a Blues supporter, that would have sucked in more ways than I care to ponder. It's not something that concerns me greatly these days, as you've come right back to pack and from an outsiders point of view, it has a lot to do with what seemed like an unnecessary change in a coach that had the team running very smoothly.

Sure, don't get stuck in the past and don't get stuck in blame, both good philosophies to live by; however there's equally no point in pretending it was a masterstroke. If I was a Pies supporter, mostly it'd have me starting to look closely at Ed and the decisions he's making. Carlton made the mistake of letting a loud-mouthed president have it all his own way for too long and it cost us. Not saying that's what's happening here, but I would be wary all the same.

Really, the only way it'll be viewed as a masterstroke is if we win the flag next year, and Carlton struggle. In saying that, people do forget that at the time, Mick agreed to the plan a few years out and was meant to remain involved. At some point in the last 6 months in the role as head coach, he changed his mind. That's fine, but everyone understood that it wouldn't mean he'd remain as coach just because he changed his mind. I haven't got a problem with Eddie's involvement either.

A year out may well have helped Mick Malthouse to refresh his mind for another crack at coaching. I don't want Mick to fail, but I hope Carlton do!

 

[turbo44]

Just an outsiders observation. Look, no cheap shot, no troll ... I was worried at one stage because it looked like the Pies were a serious threat to getting up to 16 flags and perhaps beyond; as a Blues supporter, that would have sucked in more ways than I care to ponder. It's not something that concerns me greatly these days, as you've come right back to pack and from an outsiders point of view, it has a lot to do with what seemed like an unnecessary change in a coach that had the team running very smoothly.

Sure, don't get stuck in the past and don't get stuck in blame, both good philosophies to live by; however there's equally no point in pretending it was a masterstroke. If I was a Pies supporter, mostly it'd have me starting to look closely at Ed and the decisions he's making. Carlton made the mistake of letting a loud-mouthed president have it all his own way for too long and it cost us. Not saying that's what's happening here, but I would be wary all the same.

Eddie everywhere is ready to implode that gigantic cranium.
Bitter much is he?

 

[rhys_22]

I dont care anymore. I am wrapped with nathan buckley as coach.He has had mick mouthing off,trying to cause havoc,and he was nothing but all class.Hasn't said one bad word. I think maybe mick feels threatened because nathan buckley learnt from him how to coach. And i dont hate mick,i hate carlton.in saying that,i dont like how mick lies sometimes.Nathan did nothing but stick up for mick everytime questioned about his comments about collingwood. i think it will work and i dont see us sliding down the ladder,as some are suggesting, anytime soon.

 

[rhys_22]

And i love eddie, can never hate him,he helped us out when we were really struggling.More than anyone. I am wrapped and i think he is one of the smarter presidents out there who works in media to push his views and they come to fruition and do collingwood good. Thats all he is ever worried about,if you ask me ed is not sitting around having a cushy lifestyle like brayshaw.He works damn hard for collingwood,unpaid and i love and respect him for everything he has done. There is no question in my mind he knows what is best and if bucks is best in eds eyes,then he is best in my eyes too.

 

[laminex]

Won a flag the season after it was announced, so it has been a masterstroke

sure was and ****ed the 2 years after that, you guys really think small hey.

 

[laminex]

It's working out great, well that's good. As you say, aim low to avoid disappointment.

disappointment lol, what a club i support do has nothing to do with me at all. I have no say in what goes on, footy is nothing more than dancing bears mate. I watch it enjoy it and worry about thing in my like that control. So i could not give a flying **** what they do as long as they don't cost me Money.

 

[Sunshine Saint]

Some people are fans of the 'great man' view of history, I'm not one of them.

Mick's tenure at the Bulldogs was nothing much to shout about, let's be honest - 7th (1984), 3rd (1985), 8th (1986), 7th (1987), 8th (1988) and 13th (1989). Going to WC who had some of the best facilities in the land taught Mick something valuable, i.e. an imposing and well-resourced football infrastructure goes a long way.

It was for that reason he demanded of Ed a massive expenditure in the football department and Eddie did oblige him there. Mick did raise, or is it oversee, the level of the playing list in 2002, but where do you begin to seperate the infrastructure from the man?

Football fans are notoriously fickle and imagine because they have a mission statement to succeed, it must occur. Port Adelaide I think suffered this delusion under Mark Williams and burned him. It's been a pile ever since. You can look at Eade at the Bulldogs, or even Bailey at Melbourne. People like to think that they are not succeeding because their coach is the Ju-Ju man, not because their whole football department - recruiters, fitness and development staff, line coaches, revenue, morale - is in some parlous state.

A football club can skew the vision of the coach. An A grade coach gets dragged down to the level of the football department. Equally, an A+ football department can flatter a coach.

In any case, a better self-promoter than Mick you won't hope to find. Again, he's asked for and received his big spend, his Arizona wish while Ratten was told to go and suck lemons.

The problem with Mick is he's by nature a conservative. That shines through in his game-plan and his unwillingness to take a chance at trade week. He'd prefer to take on fat-arse wombats, ad infinitum, through natural picks than to chance his arm publicly on a risk that might succeed but also backfire. You don't last this long in the caper by taking the high-road.

At the end of the day, he may well think this is his final throw of the dice and throw caution to the wind, but he's just as likely to gently park the car in nowhere land.

Well done. Outstanding post.

 

[Sunshine Saint]

You guys just won a premiership with no "big names". Dont see how this is exactly a negative. He has 3 premiership medals as a coach. Find me another one of those thats still coaching.

Kevin Sheedy (4 Premierships - 1984, 1985, 1990, 2001)

See that wasn't so hard to find.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

A football club can skew the vision of the coach. An A grade coach gets dragged down to the level of the football department. Equally, an A+ football department can flatter a coach.

In any case, a better self-promoter than Mick you won't hope to find. Again, he's asked for and received his big spend, his Arizona wish while Ratten was told to go and suck lemons.

That's very true. You only have to look at Gary Buckenara at Sydney. The club gave him nothing to work with, and then they replaced him the "saviour" Ron Barassi who was suddenly given everything he asked for in term of off-field support.

I see Mick a little bit like a modern day Barassi. Yes, they've had success, but on their own terms. More skilled coaches have come and gone without success, hung out to dry by clubs who were unable to support them.

 

[GoldyJr]

That's very true. You only have to look at Gary Buckenara at Sydney. The club gave him nothing to work with, and then they replaced him the "saviour" Ron Barassi who was suddenly given everything he asked for in term of off-field support.

I see Mick a little bit like a modern day Barassi. Yes, they've had success, but on their own terms. More skilled coaches have come and gone without success, hung out to dry by clubs who were unable to support them.

Hmmmmm...I wonder who will play Mick in the stage production about his "stellar"coaching carreer. I'm tipping Mick will play himself.

 

[Sunshine Saint]

Hmmmmm...I wonder who will play Mick in the stage production about his "stellar"coaching carreer. I'm tipping Mick will play himself.

You will have to think that if Mick was convinced to go into acting, he would do so for only two roles:

- the life and times of Mick Malthouse

- Jesus Christ Superstar

 

[Monkey King]

And i love eddie, can never hate him,he helped us out when we were really struggling.

It's great to love Eddie, but loving the prez blindly is not a great idea. Accepting every decision he makes as being the best decision, just because he has the best interests of the club at heart, is not a great idea. After a long time in office, a prez can surround himself with like minded people who lose sight of what's really in the best interest of the club, despite their best intentions. I'm not saying this is where Eddie's at, but I after the events of last year I'd sure as hell be taking my Eddie is Awesome glasses off for a more considered look at club decisions.

I dont care anymore. I am wrapped with nathan buckley as coach.He has had mick mouthing off,trying to cause havoc,and he was nothing but all class.Hasn't said one bad word.

I've got to say, while the team has gone a backwards a bit under Buckley IMO, this is bang on the money. The way Buck's handled himself throughout all the drama has been top notch & better either Mick or Eddie, who could both learn a thing or two about grace under fire from the younger man.

 

[Monkey King]

Really, the only way it'll be viewed as a masterstroke is if we win the flag next year, and Carlton struggle.

Just winning a flag full-stop might be enough IMO, but if you can't do that, I agree that Carlton would need to struggle for it to be seen a decent decision. Collingwood had a young premiership list and if it can't win another under Buckley's tenure, I can't see it being looked back on as a good decision unless Mick turns out useless at the Blues.

In saying that, people do forget that at the time, Mick agreed to the plan a few years out and was meant to remain involved. At some point in the last 6 months in the role as head coach, he changed his mind.

To be fair, I think they all changed their minds mate. I just reckon once the flag was won, continuing with the succession plan wasn't a great move. You blokes were dominant and it's so hard to get that kind of winning formula in footy, I just think if Buckley loved the club, he should have backed off for a year or two. Instead, ambition got in the way; for Mick too I guess.

 

[neroblack]

Just winning a flag full-stop might be enough IMO, but if you can't do that, I agree that Carlton would need to struggle for it to be seen a decent decision. Collingwood had a young premiership list and if it can't win another under Buckley's tenure, I can't see it being looked back on as a good decision unless Mick turns out useless at the Blues.



To be fair, I think they all changed their minds mate. I just reckon once the flag was won, continuing with the succession plan wasn't a great move. You blokes were dominant and it's so hard to get that kind of winning formula in footy, I just think if Buckley loved the club, he should have backed off for a year or two. Instead, ambition got in the way; for Mick too I guess.

Other teams have been as dominant as we have over the last few years, only Geelong was good enough to win more than one flag. Saint Kilda didn't win any..they're pretty hard to win, I'm still hopeful we can win another with this group though.

 

[Monkey King]

Other teams have been as dominant as we have over the last few years, only Geelong was good enough to win more than one flag. Saint Kilda didn't win any..they're pretty hard to win, I'm still hopeful we can win another with this group though.

I don't agree. The only team over the last 5 years to had sustained dominance comparable to the Pies was Geelong.

And yes, they're very hard to win, which is why I was ... well delighted I guess ... that the Pies were so willing to mess with a winning formula while in the midst of a period of dominance. I just didn't think it all that flash an idea.

 

[DangerSloane]

Kevin Sheedy has 4.

Kevin Sheedy is a figurehead now not a coach. We all know that.

 

[HFF]

I think this needs a little bit of editing....

Meh.

He came for Cloke, he failed.

He went for Lynch, he failed.

He went for Tippett, he failed.

He went for Shane O'Bree, he failed.

Welcome to Mick Malthouse post season- where he throws his hat in every ring and comes up short all the time.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Kevin Sheedy (4 Premierships - 1984, 1985, 1990, 2001)

See that wasn't so hard to find.

Kevin Sheedy over staying his welcome at Essendon by about 6 years was one reason Collingwood opted for a succession plan. We didnt want to go throught that rubbish.