He got the better of Ryder and Kreuzer when he played against them.
He got 5 more possesions than Ryder, 1 more mark, and 3 less tackles. Exact same hit outs.
We got smashed too, so he hardly beat Ryder.
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He got the better of Ryder and Kreuzer when he played against them.
... he hardly beat Ryder.
Mitch Clark had the better of Anzac Medallist Patrick Ryder
I dont think Ryder should even be in this thread. When Hill comes back, Ryder will go back to being essendon's CHB. He may pinch hit in the ruck every now and then but wont be a ruckman.
I think Natanui will go close to being the best. Carlton were going to take him before Kruezer before they realised he was a couple of days to young to be drafted that year.
With Carlton having Warnock and Hampson (slowly improving), wouldnt be surprised to see Kruezer being more of a CHF than ruckman
I agree to the extent that I will be PO'd if he goes back. I think he should rotate ruck and forward with Hille 50/50.He was never that good as a defender. Would be a waste of talent to put him back there again.
Why's that? He's arguably the best out of the lot at the moment.
That equates to dollars and don't tell me the clubs are not in need of sales from all quarters
People seem to forget how crap Paddy was in his first couple of seasons in the AFL, admittedly playing more at CHF, but if you compare his first 2 years with Kruezer, Carlton's no 1 draft pick is galaxies ahead of 'Paddy' and as such, has a much bigger upside.
Ryder wins more contested ball out of the 4, lays more tackles, kicks a goal or two aswell, so that's why I voted for Ryder.
Frankly Paddy Ryder is the most overrated player in the AFL ...
Took him at least 4 years before he actually started doing anything good at the AFL level, whereas Kruezer was actually decent/starring at times, in his first year in the AFL last year, and is just getting better and better this season ...
This question is a moot point, because eventually Carlton will play him more at CHF, once Warnock and Hampson develop more in the ruck, they will become eventually our no 1 and 2 ruckman.
People seem to forget how crap Paddy was in his first couple of seasons in the AFL, admittedly playing more at CHF, but if you compare his first 2 years with Kruezer, Carlton's no 1 draft pick is galaxies ahead of 'Paddy' and as such, has a much bigger upside.
And yeah eventually Leuenberger and Ty Vickery should be added to this poll IMHO, I'm not sure if the Lions will perist with Clark in the ruck, once Leuenberger returns and stays injury free.
Frankly Paddy Ryder is the most overrated player in the AFL ...
Took him at least 4 years before he actually started doing anything good at the AFL level, whereas Kruezer was actually decent/starring at times, in his first year in the AFL last year, and is just getting better and better this season ...
This question is a moot point, because eventually Carlton will play him more at CHF, once Warnock and Hampson develop more in the ruck, they will become eventually our no 1 and 2 ruckman.
People seem to forget how crap Paddy was in his first couple of seasons in the AFL, admittedly playing more at CHF, but if you compare his first 2 years with Kruezer, Carlton's no 1 draft pick is galaxies ahead of 'Paddy' and as such, has a much bigger upside.
And yeah eventually Leuenberger and Ty Vickery should be added to this poll IMHO, I'm not sure if the Lions will perist with Clark in the ruck, once Leuenberger returns and stays injury free.
He got 5 more possesions than Ryder, 1 more mark, and 3 less tackles. Exact same hit outs.
We got smashed too, so he hardly beat Ryder.
Plus 1Naitanui = promising first game and he can be anything, including nothing.
Kreuzer = played in the ruck from day one and has been crap for a number 1 pick.
Clark = is probably the best of the bunch atm. a real surprise packet and just like Ryder have proven that they can play and play WELL in any area of the ground.
Ryder = against us this year was his first full time rucking role. hes been a defender every other year where he was wasted but may benefit him in the end. in a few years he will be the best of the bunch.
atm Clark>Ryder>Kreuzer>Naitanui
future Ryder>Naitanui>Clark(i think hell end up a forward)>*********
celtic_pride ur a twat
no pride for ur own afl club?
Naitanui = promising first game and he can be anything, including nothing.
Kreuzer = played in the ruck from day one and has been crap for a number 1 pick.
Clark = is probably the best of the bunch atm. a real surprise packet and just like Ryder have proven that they can play and play WELL in any area of the ground.
Ryder = against us this year was his first full time rucking role. hes been a defender every other year where he was wasted but may benefit him in the end. in a few years he will be the best of the bunch.
atm Clark>Ryder>Kreuzer>Naitanui
future Ryder>Naitanui>Clark(i think hell end up a forward)>*********
celtic_pride ur a twat
no pride for ur own afl club?
HA Judge his career on the worst game he's ever playedKruezer's first two years in the AFL have totally crapped over Patricia Ryder's first 2, nah 3 years in the AFL, and anyone who watches footy closely would agree with that ...
BTW Kruezer spends less then 50 percent of the time in most games in the ruck, are you aware of that nit -wit ...
Nick-Nat will end up the best ruckman and perhaps best overall player of the lot, but Kruezer will be the best and most effective tall/roaming foward and pinch-hitting ruckman in that lot ...
Poor old Potato Patty can only seem to play in one position, and that is ruck.
He was a total disaster as a backman, did u see him get totally destroyed last year at Phone Dome by a very average Adelaide foward, in Nick Gill ?
BTW I could have bloody beaten Josh Fraser in the Ruck on Anzac Day FFS, and i'm only 6'1, Josey Fraser is a little talent plodder, and has the heart the size of a pea, and perhaps the 2nd worst no 1 draft pick in the last 15 years (after Des Headland)
Poor old Potato Patty can only seem to play in one position, and that is ruck.
Kruezer's first two years in the AFL have totally crapped over Patricia Ryder's first 2, nah 3 years in the AFL, and anyone who watches footy closely would agree with that ...
People seem to forget how crap Paddy was in his first couple of seasons in the AFL, admittedly playing more at CHF
I know this isn't the exact question being asked, but on current form (since round 5, 2009) these are the stats for Kreuzer, Clark & Ryder. I picked round 5 because it was prodominately when Clark and Ryder became their team's main ruckman.
Kreuzer:
Kicks: 5.75
Handballs: 8.75
Marks: 2.38
Hitouts: 18.13
Tackles: 3.88
Goals: 0.63
Clark:
Kicks: 6.25
Handballs: 8.63
Marks: 5.25
Hitouts: 21.38
Tackles: 4.38
Goals: 0.25
Ryder:
Kicks: 5.14
Handballs: 8.86
Marks: 2.71
Hitouts: 23.14
Tackles: 7.00
Goals: 0.29
Based on these stats, (yes, i know they are only stats), but IMO Ryder may only just be the smallest bit of almost nothing in front of Clark while Kreuzer is trailing both by a bit. As i have stated, they are only stats so don't criticise me too badly . *cough* Carlton supporters *cough*
EDIT: Yes, it is their current form and not actually on topic but... oh well!
Not to mention their respective birthdates:
Kruezer: June 89
Ryder: March 88
Clark: Oct 87
So yes, it is quite a revelation to see that Clark and Ryder, who are 1-2 years older than Kruezer and get significantly more rucktime, have slightly better numbers.
If anything, all your stats do is support those who suggest Kruezer will be better than either Clark or Ryder.
Wow, a whole 1 year aye? That's massive.
Just face facts, Ryder started playing ruck this year after 2 years down back and he is showing more than Kruezer who started playing ruck last year, both are young, both a raw, except one thing Ryder has shown more, and that is fact.
So yes, Ryder has been impressive. But compare Paddy Ryder (and Mitch Clark) after 18 months in the AFL to Matt Kruezer after 18 months in the AFL, and it would be absolutely no contest whatsoever. And even the most one-eyed Carlton hater would have to acknowledge that.