Mega Thread Non-Freo AFL Discussion 2022 - Part 2

[Fyfster]

Fair enough, I was just changing the subject for a moment. I didn't mean to diminish the severity of the horrible situation that has eventuated.

It's just me I have had zero interest in The GF sprint since I can't remember . Maybe because we as a club have never really bothered about it.

 

[Wray27]

Fair enough, I was just changing the subject for a moment. I didn't mean to diminish the severity of the horrible situation that has eventuated.

I think Worner running is more about him going home. Freddy will be home in SA one would think.

 

[Reynolds Number]

 

[Taylor]

I don't know how Ursula didn't kick the door down at Hawthorn and go full mumma bear over that. I'm livid just imagining it for my boy.

 

[Quazar]

For me personally it's very sad...I've been 'involved' in racist moments throughout my life. Firstly, growing up as a white young lad in England I worked a paper-round when I was about 14 for Pakistani owners of the shop and the young son (would have been in his early 20s at the time at a guess..) kept calling me "white boy" with a sneer which made me feel uncomfortable to the point where I left after about a month. Probably not the worst case scenario, but all the same it had an impact on me and enough for me to recall all these years on. Of course England was notorious for racism back in the '70s/80s, but this was early Nineties so I kinda figured I'd be "safe', it was possibly the first time I'd been exposed to something that didn't sit right with me that made me sit up and take notice of the outside world, so to speak.

In my early to mid Twenties I worked for Debenhams a big department store like a Myer store here for those that don't know. I befriended a guy called Rakesh Patel (to this day I wonder what happened to him as we lost touch after I left somewhat 'controversially', but that's ANOTHER story..). Rakesh worked as a line manager for another section on the floor below me, but was a shade younger so he was doing well and very respected there, we became pretty tight and because he didn't drink (which he told me was because he used to, but was beaten up by some racist thugs..) he used to kind of chauffeur me around, and drive me back home which was amazing as he lived miles away from where I did. He had a little crew that didn't work with us - although later some others from our workplace came into the fray - and we used to go out a lot back then because where the store was (Hanley) was quite a good little nightlife with bars and clubs dotted all around...

We'd often see a lot of other people we used to work with there too, mainly girls...but anyway, I digress...

In 2002, when the World Cup was on, a skirmish between Asians and whites broke out, I'm not sure what caused it - I think the BNP threatened to come out and start chaos or whatever, it's been some years, but I remember a number of Pakistani guys running around town and yelling with flags etc and I think police cars going past. I witnessed this from my bus stop which was just over the road from the Debenhams store. When the bus came and we eventually got going, in the Cobridge area just outside the 'Potteries' where Hanley is where a lot of the local Muslim community lived, a number of Asians started throwing rocks at the bus when it passed them, which was a bit alarming and when the bus stopped to let someone off I thought they were gunna try and get on, when it took off they sort of 'chased' us off....luckily no windows were damaged but it was a bit distressing and for some of the people on the bus who were a bit older.

Later that weekend (or possibly even the same night I can't quite remember..), when Rakesh and myself went out, we always went pretty much the same venue - The Place, and he was 'refused' entry because of the so-called 'race riots'. I remember just being utterly shocked - Rakesh was an Indian not a Pakistani (of which it was a minority anyway) and being utterly disgusted with the bouncers for tarnishing him with the same brush - I tried to argue would you refuse white guys that started fights outside the venue on a regular basis, but it was all met with deaf ears. I couldn't actually believe what had happened but that was perhaps my most shocking venture into this world of division and the ignorance surrounding it.

It really hurt Rakesh as he'd done so much to move past his previous racist experiences and he had a white girlfriend, so it's not like there was any racial tension from him in the aftermath of what had happened to him before. I don't know why, but it was just me and him that night...not sure where the others were.

Anyway, trips down memory lane; but it's there...it's always been there and it's extremely sad that we're here, in 2022 and the same old shit rears its ugly head, only this time I'm on the other side of the world. Same shit, different place. I hope it's thoroughly investigated, I hope it leads to widespread condemnation and rectification (whatever that is/entails..) and maybe all 18 clubs need a review and process to look at what the hactual f*** is happening to these people and if anything is awry that needs to be sorted pronto.

It shouldn't be happening, it shouldn't have ever happened, period. But alas, it's 2022 and yet, here we are...

Be kind folks, to everyone. Not just your 'own'. Peace be with all those affected by these situations

 

[Wilksyy]

Throughout all this I wonder if there was more we could have done for players like Josh Simpson.
I don't want to come across as placing blame or insinuate anything, more just thinking even a club like ours with a rich history of indigenous culture and support clearly has work to do to bridge the gap.
Mundy stated that Clayton Collard was one of the most talented players he'd ever seen on our list. Imagine if there was more done 30+ years ago that could've made progress more smoothly even 10-15(?) or so years ago when he was on our list.
Again, not placing blame or trying to start an argument. I just think this sort of stuff highlights just how far the AFL in general needs to get their sh*t together and support different people and cultures.

It’s a tough one. The West highlighted in bullet points the worst allegations and there was one where I could see (not condoning it and don’t know if it happens elsewhere) where other clubs might have done the same thing.

• Tried to dissuade a third player’s young family from moving to Melbourne, saying they couldn’t afford to rent a house.

That being said, Des Headland got support when he suffered from homesickness and helped his mother and father relocate to Brisbane. This was the late 90’s too but he was their number 1 pick.

Stephen Hill lived with Grover during his first seasons at Freo, I think our club always prefer indigenous players to live with other indigenous players but don’t quote me on that.

This isnt Freo related but what about the story of Clem Smith? Smith came from a rough background, would accept a scholarship to Wesley and lived with another family (white) to chase his AFL dream. Reports were he didn’t have the best influence of a girlfriend and lacked some discipline. Fell down the draft order but Carlton picked him up. Things looked to improve for Smith once he moved to Victoria but once he got back with his girlfriend and flew her east his football declined again and he was dropped. What do you do there? Should a club even offer advice? Personally, I don’t think any club should f**k with family so the onus is on the player to prioritise what he thinks is important. But I could see a club suggesting he should consider his relationship with so and so.

You can find a heap of examples elsewhere but it’s not easy to talk about.

 

[ImperialPurple]

This is ****ing despicable.

 

[mightymouse75]

It’s a tough one. The West highlighted in bullet points the worst allegations and there was one where I could see (not condoning it and don’t know if it happens elsewhere) where other clubs might have done the same thing.

• Tried to dissuade a third player’s young family from moving to Melbourne, saying they couldn’t afford to rent a house.

That being said, Des Headland got support when he suffered from homesickness and helped his mother and father relocate to Brisbane. This was the late 90’s too but he was their number 1 pick.

Stephen Hill lived with Grover during his first seasons at Freo, I think our club always prefer indigenous players to live with other indigenous players but don’t quote me on that.

This isnt Freo related but what about the story of Clem Smith? Smith came from a rough background, would accept a scholarship to Wesley and lived with another family (white) to chase his AFL dream. Reports were he didn’t have the best influence of a girlfriend and lacked some discipline. Fell down the draft order but Carlton picked him up. Things looked to improve for Smith once he moved to Victoria but once he got back with his girlfriend and flew her east his football declined again and he was dropped. What do you do there? Should a club even offer advice? Personally, I don’t think any club should f**k with family so the onus is on the player to prioritise what he thinks is important. But I could see a club suggesting he should consider his relationship with so and so.

You can find a heap of examples elsewhere but it’s not easy to talk about.

Advice if it's asked for ?
Not picking up players who are already making dubious decisions ??
Nothing is easy to talk about anymore.

 

[mike91]

If Hird gets the Essendon gig, Whitfield is a huge chance of requesting a trade to Essendon.

My source, not a media article

 

[mightymouse75]

If Hird gets the Essendon gig, Whitfield is a huge chance of requesting a trade to Essendon.

My source, not a media article

Hird getting his job back speaks volumes for vfl integrity

 

[FreoRicci]

Hardly scandalous.
Tim Minchin, the Freo fanatic, has his dog named after Walters, SonSon or Sonny.

 

[gaskin]

Hardly scandalous.
Tim Minchin, the Freo fanatic, has his dog named after Walters, SonSon or Sonny.

There is a difference between naming your family pet after your favourite football player and naming a Golliwog (what a lot of people see as an extremely racist toy) after an Indigenous player.

 

[King Huskii]

Hardly scandalous.
Tim Minchin, the Freo fanatic, has his dog named after Walters, SonSon or Sonny.

What Gaskin said

 

[FreoRicci]

There is a difference between naming your family pet after your favourite football player and naming a Golliwog (what a lot of people see as an extremely racist toy) after an Indigenous player.

Legit thought was a dog. That's why I said that. Thought was a chihuahua at first. That's my bad. Thats awful

 

[CapitalA]

Hardly scandalous.
Tim Minchin, the Freo fanatic, has his dog named after Walters, SonSon or Sonny.

Moron.

 

[nurries]

For the love of all that is sacred, why couldn't Freddy be running in the Grand Final Sprint?!!!!
Can somebody speak to Karl Worner's chances?

Freddy said he has Clark over 20m but Jordan would catch him in 100m

 

[Stinky Lomax]

This is quite ironic really, I named my wanger Jeff Kennett.
Old, wrinkly, long, one eyed & a complete f*ckstick.

(The long bit is to make me feel good sbout myself, may or may not be true)

 

[Reynolds Number]

Just went onto Facebook to read an in-depth explanation from a man who has spent years working with indigenous communities in Australia and PNG.

Then to learn that his opinion is laughable from old white conservatives who think they are basically causing trouble and 'should have spoken out to Burgoyne', oh I didn't know that these issues were just so simple to sort out lol.

 

[MadEyeEmmy]

Am I imagining things or did yesterday Chris Fagan say he ‘couldn’t recall’ if he was involved in all of this? And today he is categorically denying it?

 

[Quazar]

This is quite ironic really, I named my wanger Jeff Kennett.
Old, wrinkly, long, one eyed & a complete f*ckstick.

(The long bit is to make me feel good sbout myself, may or may not be true)

you don't deserve a laugh for such a cringe attempt at 'comedy' (this is bad comedy Starscream, for those that know!)....but because I legit "lolled", it's only fair.

Hahaha, you bloody spanner

 

[Kram]

Just lol at the denial from fans on the Norf board.

 

[masai tu]

If Hird gets the Essendon gig, Whitfield is a huge chance of requesting a trade to Essendon.

My source, not a media article

Whitfield will probably find it easier to score at Essendon.

 

[Grape Bear]

I

Just went onto Facebook to read an in-depth explanation from a man who has spent years working with indigenous communities in Australia and PNG.

Then to learn that his opinion is laughable from old white conservatives who think they are basically causing trouble and 'should have spoken out to Burgoyne', oh I didn't know that these issues were just so simple to sort out lol.

It’s hard for people who have never been on the wrong end of a power dynamic to understand the realities of being on the weak side of that equation.

Apart from the racial aspect of this horrific episode, it’s also worth highlighting the underlying misogyny here as well.

 

[Stinky Lomax]

you don't deserve a laugh for such a cringe attempt at 'comedy' (this is bad comedy Starscream, for those that know!)....but because I legit "lolled", it's only fair.

Hahaha, you bloody spanner

Don’t worry I agree. But this has really pissed me off & I've spent the last 24 hours going over my own footballing history hoping not to come up with anything that has offended players I’ve coached & played with.
It really makes you look in the mirror & want to be better for it.
The joke was to try & lighten my day up to be honest as I’ve had some tough conversations with ex teammates (indigenous & not)last night & today in regards to their experiences.
Fortunately they’ve all taken my call & I wish I knew then what I know now.

 

[Purple Jesus]

For me personally it's very sad...I've been 'involved' in racist moments throughout my life. Firstly, growing up as a white young lad in England I worked a paper-round when I was about 14 for Pakistani owners of the shop and the young son (would have been in his early 20s at the time at a guess..) kept calling me "white boy" with a sneer which made me feel uncomfortable to the point where I left after about a month. Probably not the worst case scenario, but all the same it had an impact on me and enough for me to recall all these years on. Of course England was notorious for racism back in the '70s/80s, but this was early Nineties so I kinda figured I'd be "safe', it was possibly the first time I'd been exposed to something that didn't sit right with me that made me sit up and take notice of the outside world, so to speak.

In my early to mid Twenties I worked for Debenhams a big department store like a Myer store here for those that don't know. I befriended a guy called Rakesh Patel (to this day I wonder what happened to him as we lost touch after I left somewhat 'controversially', but that's ANOTHER story..). Rakesh worked as a line manager for another section on the floor below me, but was a shade younger so he was doing well and very respected there, we became pretty tight and because he didn't drink (which he told me was because he used to, but was beaten up by some racist thugs..) he used to kind of chauffeur me around, and drive me back home which was amazing as he lived miles away from where I did. He had a little crew that didn't work with us - although later some others from our workplace came into the fray - and we used to go out a lot back then because where the store was (Hanley) was quite a good little nightlife with bars and clubs dotted all around...

We'd often see a lot of other people we used to work with there too, mainly girls...but anyway, I digress...

In 2002, when the World Cup was on, a skirmish between Asians and whites broke out, I'm not sure what caused it - I think the BNP threatened to come out and start chaos or whatever, it's been some years, but I remember a number of Pakistani guys running around town and yelling with flags etc and I think police cars going past. I witnessed this from my bus stop which was just over the road from the Debenhams store. When the bus came and we eventually got going, in the Cobridge area just outside the 'Potteries' where Hanley is where a lot of the local Muslim community lived, a number of Asians started throwing rocks at the bus when it passed them, which was a bit alarming and when the bus stopped to let someone off I thought they were gunna try and get on, when it took off they sort of 'chased' us off....luckily no windows were damaged but it was a bit distressing and for some of the people on the bus who were a bit older.

Later that weekend (or possibly even the same night I can't quite remember..), when Rakesh and myself went out, we always went pretty much the same venue - The Place, and he was 'refused' entry because of the so-called 'race riots'. I remember just being utterly shocked - Rakesh was an Indian not a Pakistani (of which it was a minority anyway) and being utterly disgusted with the bouncers for tarnishing him with the same brush - I tried to argue would you refuse white guys that started fights outside the venue on a regular basis, but it was all met with deaf ears. I couldn't actually believe what had happened but that was perhaps my most shocking venture into this world of division and the ignorance surrounding it.

It really hurt Rakesh as he'd done so much to move past his previous racist experiences and he had a white girlfriend, so it's not like there was any racial tension from him in the aftermath of what had happened to him before. I don't know why, but it was just me and him that night...not sure where the others were.

Anyway, trips down memory lane; but it's there...it's always been there and it's extremely sad that we're here, in 2022 and the same old s*t rears its ugly head, only this time I'm on the other side of the world. Same s*t, different place. I hope it's thoroughly investigated, I hope it leads to widespread condemnation and rectification (whatever that is/entails..) and maybe all 18 clubs need a review and process to look at what the hactual f* is happening to these people and if anything is awry that needs to be sorted pronto.

It shouldn't be happening, it shouldn't have ever happened, period. But alas, it's 2022 and yet, here we are...

Be kind folks, to everyone. Not just your 'own'. Peace be with all those affected by these situations

I need to know about this controversial exit from Debenhams now. Did you steal a candle or something?