- Banned
- #26
Re: North on the Brink
Are you really an auditor?
It seems you are struggling with some of the concepts here...
Are you really an auditor?
It seems you are struggling with some of the concepts here...
-
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North on the Brink of financial disaster - The Age
- Thread starter Goady138
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- Banned
- #27
- Banned
- #28
Re: North on the Brink
Oh, I get it, you mean coming from North's professional auditors.
That explains why you are struggling with this. Carry on.
Oh, I get it, you mean coming from North's professional auditors.
That explains why you are struggling with this. Carry on.
- Banned
- #30
Re: North on the Brink
So, because you auditors qualify their audit report every year, you reckon a qualified audit report is no big deal ...
So, because you auditors qualify their audit report every year, you reckon a qualified audit report is no big deal ...
Re: North on the Brink
The league will bail them out..
The league will bail them out..
- Banned
- #32
Re: North on the Brink
The auditors expressed uncertainty over North as a "going concern" due to Note 2(e).
Note 2(e) says that North's ability to meet its debts as the fall due is dependent on:
a. generating sufficient revenue from operating activities (i.e. matching 2010 membership and sponsorship revenue)
b. still getting the AFL competitive balance fund
c. success with other business initiatives
So, if membership is way under (currently tracking above 2010 and with an increase in the higher end memberships) or if the AFL pulls its funding (not going to happen) or our sponsors pull out (unlikely) we are in trouble.
This also does not take into account the newly signed Aegis sponsorship, which obviously improves our position.
Every year the auditors uncertainty over North as a going concern and will continue to do so with us and all other clubs that have debt.
I have no idea what's going on... I wouldn't mind someone coming out and telling us the real story... I'm just worried about my club
The auditors expressed uncertainty over North as a "going concern" due to Note 2(e).
Note 2(e) says that North's ability to meet its debts as the fall due is dependent on:
a. generating sufficient revenue from operating activities (i.e. matching 2010 membership and sponsorship revenue)
b. still getting the AFL competitive balance fund
c. success with other business initiatives
So, if membership is way under (currently tracking above 2010 and with an increase in the higher end memberships) or if the AFL pulls its funding (not going to happen) or our sponsors pull out (unlikely) we are in trouble.
This also does not take into account the newly signed Aegis sponsorship, which obviously improves our position.
Every year the auditors uncertainty over North as a going concern and will continue to do so with us and all other clubs that have debt.
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- #33
Re: North on the Brink
Im pretty sure an AFL bail out could only happen if the other clubs agreed (it will be there money the AFLs spending), i thnk they made a mistake by not relocating, we may be looking at a Tassie team sooner than we think. (I honestly hope they get through this FWIW)
Im pretty sure an AFL bail out could only happen if the other clubs agreed (it will be there money the AFLs spending), i thnk they made a mistake by not relocating, we may be looking at a Tassie team sooner than we think. (I honestly hope they get through this FWIW)
Re: North on the Brink
Remember when Cyclone Yasi was headed for QLD, and we were all told to brace ourselves for devastation? The news crews all flew up to towns that their presenters would otherwise never drive through, much less sleep in. Anyhow, there was all this kurfuffle, and then... not so much. Some houses were damaged and so on, but nothing anywhere near as bad as the media had told us (and probably hoped) would happen. Sensationalism sells papers, you see. Well, this is football's version. If you like drama and being in a tizz, then go ahead. But if you like reasoned analysis, then let me just point out:
*In Aegis Park, the club now owns an asset which takes Non-Current Assets (property, plant and equipment) to $15.7m and Total Assets to $16.3m. Even after deducting total liabilities (which incl employee benefits and provisions), the club has a Net Assets balance of more than $7.5m.
*Debt increased in order to finish Aegis Park. Money well spent. You have to spend money to make money, and investing in an elite training facility is smart business for a football club.
*Revenues have increased markedly since 2007 (20m -> 26m) but instead of banking the cash, spending on the football department has increased 19% (11.9m -> 14.2m). In other words, this increased revenue could have been used to pay down debt, but the decision was made to spend money on the resources which will themselves bring in more money: the players. Smart business.
But dont expect the papers to let the facts get in the way of a bad story.
Remember when Cyclone Yasi was headed for QLD, and we were all told to brace ourselves for devastation? The news crews all flew up to towns that their presenters would otherwise never drive through, much less sleep in. Anyhow, there was all this kurfuffle, and then... not so much. Some houses were damaged and so on, but nothing anywhere near as bad as the media had told us (and probably hoped) would happen. Sensationalism sells papers, you see. Well, this is football's version. If you like drama and being in a tizz, then go ahead. But if you like reasoned analysis, then let me just point out:
*In Aegis Park, the club now owns an asset which takes Non-Current Assets (property, plant and equipment) to $15.7m and Total Assets to $16.3m. Even after deducting total liabilities (which incl employee benefits and provisions), the club has a Net Assets balance of more than $7.5m.
*Debt increased in order to finish Aegis Park. Money well spent. You have to spend money to make money, and investing in an elite training facility is smart business for a football club.
*Revenues have increased markedly since 2007 (20m -> 26m) but instead of banking the cash, spending on the football department has increased 19% (11.9m -> 14.2m). In other words, this increased revenue could have been used to pay down debt, but the decision was made to spend money on the resources which will themselves bring in more money: the players. Smart business.
But dont expect the papers to let the facts get in the way of a bad story.
ROSEMVP
Cancelled
Re: North on the Brink
JB get on the plane and get some rich investors.
JB get on the plane and get some rich investors.
Tassie19Cairns20
Team Captain
Re: North on the Brink
I don't think so. The AFL put $100 Million and a new city in front of them 3 years ago, and North turned it down. I don't think they AFL is going to help them out this time. They're going to have to recover on their own like the Dees did last year and like Hawthorn did in the late 90's. Based on what Melbourne did last year, I don't see it as impossible. But in reality if they don't fix this on their own, they'll end up like Fitzroy.
Re: North on the Brink
The AFL will want 18 teams and 9 games a week for the next TV deal.
They'll bail them out.
The AFL will want 18 teams and 9 games a week for the next TV deal.
They'll bail them out.
Moo
Premium Platinum
Re: North on the Brink
Yeah only 800 million dollars worth of damage - let's party down.
So you are in great shape ....cool no need to worry about the fact you are bleeding cash.
Yeah only 800 million dollars worth of damage - let's party down.
*In Aegis Park, the club now owns an asset which takes Non-Current Assets (property, plant and equipment) to $15.7m and Total Assets to $16.3m. Even after deducting total liabilities (which incl employee benefits and provisions), the club has a Net Assets balance of more than $7.5m.
*Debt increased in order to finish Aegis Park. Money well spent. You have to spend money to make money, and investing in an elite training facility is smart business for a football club.
*Revenues have increased markedly since 2007 (20m -> 26m) but instead of banking the cash, spending on the football department has increased 19% (11.9m -> 14.2m). In other words, this increased revenue could have been used to pay down debt, but the decision was made to spend money on the resources which will themselves bring in more money: the players. Smart business.
But dont expect the papers to let the facts get in the way of a bad story.
So you are in great shape ....cool no need to worry about the fact you are bleeding cash.
Re: North on the Brink
North are fine, there is nothing to worry about.
North are fine, there is nothing to worry about.
Re: North on the Brink
Correct!!! There is zero chance of the AFL not bailing them out if need be. It will cost the AFL more in not supporting North than it will to jump in even more than they currently do.
Correct!!! There is zero chance of the AFL not bailing them out if need be. It will cost the AFL more in not supporting North than it will to jump in even more than they currently do.
Beth
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Re: North on the Brink
But that wasn't quite as interesting as hammering North again I suppose.
But that wasn't quite as interesting as hammering North again I suppose.
Bosk
Brownlow Medallist
Re: North on the Brink
It's ironic that after turning their nose up at the AFL's extremely generous offer to move to the GC, North's board may now be headed into a situation where the club's only chance of survival is to beg the AFL to bail them out.
It's ironic that after turning their nose up at the AFL's extremely generous offer to move to the GC, North's board may now be headed into a situation where the club's only chance of survival is to beg the AFL to bail them out.
Re: North on the Brink
and dont think for a moment brayshaw & crew dont like to enhance the books either. it can happen both ways.
in regards to these 'assets' their value is based on what ? cost to develop ? cost to buy the same elsewhere ?
what about their realisable value in a sale ? what worth are they to any potential buyer ? what worth are they to the banks ? thats their true worth.
bordered 25% by suburbia, the rest by old factories, warehouses, distribution centres, and the things hidden within these areas (im deliberately not naming them), plus a road used by thousands to avoid tolls on the concrete expressway nearby - all very unattractive to any buyers of your 'assets'. the assets are simply in the wrong location to see their true value being realised. yet another mistake.
sorry to say again & again but north simply fail to recognise that even in great times (the 90's) they do not generate sufficient cash to run their club adequately, let alone keep up with the joneses.
how many more chances are they gonna get to once and for all plant themselves in a location and prosper, rather than is their want of hanging on for some ideal that 'we have lived here for 100 years'.
dare i say the only real assets they have is their brand - the kangaroo - very very marketable. the brand north melbourne itself isnt worth a pinch and is proving to be the weight around their neck.
*In Aegis Park, the club now owns an asset which takes Non-Current Assets (property, plant and equipment) to $15.7m and Total Assets to $16.3m. Even after deducting total liabilities (which incl employee benefits and provisions), the club has a Net Assets balance of more than $7.5m.
*Debt increased in order to finish Aegis Park. Money well spent. You have to spend money to make money, and investing in an elite training facility is smart business for a football club.
*Revenues have increased markedly since 2007 (20m -> 26m) but instead of banking the cash, spending on the football department has increased 19% (11.9m -> 14.2m). In other words, this increased revenue could have been used to pay down debt, but the decision was made to spend money on the resources which will themselves bring in more money: the players. Smart business.
But dont expect the papers to let the facts get in the way of a bad story.
and dont think for a moment brayshaw & crew dont like to enhance the books either. it can happen both ways.
in regards to these 'assets' their value is based on what ? cost to develop ? cost to buy the same elsewhere ?
what about their realisable value in a sale ? what worth are they to any potential buyer ? what worth are they to the banks ? thats their true worth.
bordered 25% by suburbia, the rest by old factories, warehouses, distribution centres, and the things hidden within these areas (im deliberately not naming them), plus a road used by thousands to avoid tolls on the concrete expressway nearby - all very unattractive to any buyers of your 'assets'. the assets are simply in the wrong location to see their true value being realised. yet another mistake.
sorry to say again & again but north simply fail to recognise that even in great times (the 90's) they do not generate sufficient cash to run their club adequately, let alone keep up with the joneses.
how many more chances are they gonna get to once and for all plant themselves in a location and prosper, rather than is their want of hanging on for some ideal that 'we have lived here for 100 years'.
dare i say the only real assets they have is their brand - the kangaroo - very very marketable. the brand north melbourne itself isnt worth a pinch and is proving to be the weight around their neck.
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Re: North on the Brink
One logical conclusion would be that if they don't fix their finances, the AFL may offer another deal like they did previously for the GC, but this time with Tassie.
Notwithstanding Hawthorn's new deal, you could assume Tassie would be receptive to North moving down there.
One logical conclusion would be that if they don't fix their finances, the AFL may offer another deal like they did previously for the GC, but this time with Tassie.
Notwithstanding Hawthorn's new deal, you could assume Tassie would be receptive to North moving down there.
- Banned
- #46
Re: North on the Brink
I asked the same question in another thread and was shouted down, well now the revelation is they tried to organise 8 games in tassie per season, that sounds like an attempt to relocate by the pres and eug.
they are using the old shell trick
Relocation by stealth, im sure all the north supporters are happy about the keep north at north.
I guess Launceston iis in NORTH tassie.
I asked the same question in another thread and was shouted down, well now the revelation is they tried to organise 8 games in tassie per season, that sounds like an attempt to relocate by the pres and eug.
they are using the old shell trick
Relocation by stealth, im sure all the north supporters are happy about the keep north at north.
I guess Launceston iis in NORTH tassie.
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Re: North on the Brink
I totally agree.
Gus mentioned earlier about Footscray being in a similar situation and now they are ok, so North will be too.
All I can say is 1. I'm yet to be convinced that Footscray have got their shit together on a long term basis at this stage, and 2. At least Footscray have a vast region of untapped potential that they are only now starting to make use of.
North has bugger all fans, and bugger all chance to generate any. They've tried all kinds of things over the years to try to boost support, and none of them have worked. Hell, even having powerhouse periods in the last 35 years and having some of the most marketable superstars of the game running around for them hasn't helped.
And no matter what spin you try to put on it, if you don't have the support, you can't make any money.
North supporters can put a fatwa out on me if they want for saying this, but the hard facts are, once it's no longer in the AFL's best interest to keep propping them up, and they pull the plug on the financial life support, the Roos are screwed.
I totally agree.
Gus mentioned earlier about Footscray being in a similar situation and now they are ok, so North will be too.
All I can say is 1. I'm yet to be convinced that Footscray have got their shit together on a long term basis at this stage, and 2. At least Footscray have a vast region of untapped potential that they are only now starting to make use of.
North has bugger all fans, and bugger all chance to generate any. They've tried all kinds of things over the years to try to boost support, and none of them have worked. Hell, even having powerhouse periods in the last 35 years and having some of the most marketable superstars of the game running around for them hasn't helped.
And no matter what spin you try to put on it, if you don't have the support, you can't make any money.
North supporters can put a fatwa out on me if they want for saying this, but the hard facts are, once it's no longer in the AFL's best interest to keep propping them up, and they pull the plug on the financial life support, the Roos are screwed.
vonn
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Re: North on the Brink
Three grand of cash on hand but $201,268 in overdraft would imply they have enough owners equity to fund that? Overdraft is a short term loan they probably have more then three grand in current assets but its more likely their means to acquire that fund is probably the AFL
If this wasnt a football club theyd be long gone. Surely it's common sense at the kangas you dont let your debt, espescially short-term with a crap cash flow be, well, 15x your cash at hand... And if they dont have a means to fund that debt- Hello potential debt spiral!
Situation is looking shocking. You have to wonder how long the AFL can step in.
Three grand of cash on hand but $201,268 in overdraft would imply they have enough owners equity to fund that? Overdraft is a short term loan they probably have more then three grand in current assets but its more likely their means to acquire that fund is probably the AFL
If this wasnt a football club theyd be long gone. Surely it's common sense at the kangas you dont let your debt, espescially short-term with a crap cash flow be, well, 15x your cash at hand... And if they dont have a means to fund that debt- Hello potential debt spiral!
Situation is looking shocking. You have to wonder how long the AFL can step in.
- Banned
- #49
Re: James Brayshaw , we were damned if we did, damned if we didn't.
I have a soft spot for North Melbourne and truly hope they pull themselves out of this, but on hindsight I now wish they had've accepted the AFL's $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ offer to move their base to QLD.
I reckon that they will somehow get through this, however long-term I think relocating (perhaps Tassie?) may be their only chance for long-term viability.
Tough times ahead for a few Victorian clubs not just North.
I have a soft spot for North Melbourne and truly hope they pull themselves out of this, but on hindsight I now wish they had've accepted the AFL's $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ offer to move their base to QLD.
I reckon that they will somehow get through this, however long-term I think relocating (perhaps Tassie?) may be their only chance for long-term viability.
Tough times ahead for a few Victorian clubs not just North.
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