- Oct 7, 2008
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- #126
Why would they need to be invited. Its in Canberra they can just rock up on the day.
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NSW Scholarship Program
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Why would they need to be invited. Its in Canberra they can just rock up on the day.
one 4 the road
All Australian
You have to be invited to draft camp mate, you don't just "rock up".
Actually thought he had another year in the under 18's but got it wrong.. He's a superstar
I think I may have stumbled on to the answer to one of the mysteries of the AFL universe. The reason the ACT has been left out of the NSW scholarship program is that they don't know the ACT exists. Seriously, if you read this article, Draft Breakdown, Kevin Sheehan lists all the successful draftees against the Australian states and territories but omits the ACT. NSW gets a mention and a big fat zero but ACT doesn't even get listed.
Strangely in another article the myopia clears once they start talking about Western Sydney and the fact they are looking to schedule a
significant number of home-and-away fixtures at Manuka Oval in Canberra.
They only want us for our money and bums on seats. How dumb do they think we are?
Strangely in another article the myopia clears once they start talking about Western Sydney and the fact they are looking to schedule a
significant number of home-and-away fixtures at Manuka Oval in Canberra.
They only want us for our money and bums on seats. How dumb do they think we are?
fairgoCanberra
Draftee
Did you hear the one about the group of Tuggers (Sth Canberra) 17-18yrs kids who are secretly training in Gaelic football? They are planning to go to Ireland next year on working visas with the hope of making an Irish team.
They are hoping to attract the attention of Ricky Nixon. Apparently they reckon they have a better chance of being drafted into the AFL via International Scholarships than they do coming from Canberra.
True story.
They are hoping to attract the attention of Ricky Nixon. Apparently they reckon they have a better chance of being drafted into the AFL via International Scholarships than they do coming from Canberra.
True story.
Yeah, that sounds like canberra. Always going the longest, most difficult route to get something done.
so they're willing to move half way across the world to play a different game with the hope of being picked up, but they dont want to move down to victoria, SA or WA where kids are being drafted from more frequently and from the same game.
i think they just want a holiday mate, just sounds better this way
i think they just want a holiday mate, just sounds better this way
doona
SMFC
I spent a fair bit of time in Canberra and played junior football, the last season i played would of been about about 6 years ago. I also umpired AFL in Canberra. Therefore i know a bit about the ACT Junior AFL
I umpired several NSW/ACT trial games (the selection games for the NSW/ACT RAMS football teams). One game i can remember (as an example of how ACT juniors are not that good), i was umpiring an exhibition game at Manuka Oval, the teams that played were the U18 ACT team verse the U16 NSW team (The NSW/ACT Rams U16 team minus the ACT players). The U16 boys smashed the U18 ACT team even though physically they were under developed.
Although there are good players that have come out of canberra Craig Bolton, James Hird to name a couple, the canberra juniors barring a couple each year are not good enough to be selected in the NSW/ACT Rams team for the U16 or U18 National carnivals. Seeing as only a couple from the NSW/ACT Rams U18 get drafted or rookied each year it is not surprising that AFL recruiters dont mention Canberra in statistics.
On another note the Swans reserves play in the Canberra Competition (ACTAFL) and would be able to watch alot of ACT juniors that are playing seniors there. Seeing as Aaron Bruce (from Eastlake) has been the only player rookied from canberra since they entered the competition (from form in the ACT comp as opposed to carnivals) just shows that there are not juniors in canberra worth getting on a teams AFL list. And just to note Bruce was removed from the rookie list at the end of the 2008 season, although most swans fans think that was very unlucky and he deserved another season.
I umpired several NSW/ACT trial games (the selection games for the NSW/ACT RAMS football teams). One game i can remember (as an example of how ACT juniors are not that good), i was umpiring an exhibition game at Manuka Oval, the teams that played were the U18 ACT team verse the U16 NSW team (The NSW/ACT Rams U16 team minus the ACT players). The U16 boys smashed the U18 ACT team even though physically they were under developed.
Although there are good players that have come out of canberra Craig Bolton, James Hird to name a couple, the canberra juniors barring a couple each year are not good enough to be selected in the NSW/ACT Rams team for the U16 or U18 National carnivals. Seeing as only a couple from the NSW/ACT Rams U18 get drafted or rookied each year it is not surprising that AFL recruiters dont mention Canberra in statistics.
On another note the Swans reserves play in the Canberra Competition (ACTAFL) and would be able to watch alot of ACT juniors that are playing seniors there. Seeing as Aaron Bruce (from Eastlake) has been the only player rookied from canberra since they entered the competition (from form in the ACT comp as opposed to carnivals) just shows that there are not juniors in canberra worth getting on a teams AFL list. And just to note Bruce was removed from the rookie list at the end of the 2008 season, although most swans fans think that was very unlucky and he deserved another season.
- Banned
- #134
Has anyone seen Micheal Hartley play because he had massive wraps when we got him under scholarship and just wondering what you thought of him
If the ACT boys are so poor why would NSW/ACT AFL exclude them from the scholarship scheme? They should be no threat to the grand plan of having more Sydney players make the league.
Many players in the under 17/18 age group lose heart and don't even bother trying out for the zone competition because they know they are up against it making it any further with the favouritism shown to scholarship holders.
I think Craig Bolton and James Hird would be disappointed to know the full extent of what is going on.
fairgoCanberra
Draftee
In the year 2007, the prophet Holmesy visited the ACT and foretold that the ACT would become a great AFL land. Young men would be bestowed with glittering scholarships and be taken into the hallowed order of Western Sydney. He told his new disciples that although the pathway might become unclear and at times grim they would need to trust in the almighty AFL.
Sometime in the year 2009, the great god, Vlad, descended on Manuka Football Oval atop a great white cloud with his eight demigods genuflecting at his feet. Vlad alighted from the cloud and looked around. He tipped his head back and smelt the scent of precious metals wafting from the Deakin Mint and said, ‘It is good’. He tipped his head again and heard the feverish computer tappings and the hot air from those who dwelt in the Parliamentary Triangle. ‘It is doubly good,’ he said with a smile. ‘We shall rename this land, Greater Western Sydney.’
But the prophet Holmesy said ‘Oh great god, Vlad, with groveling respect, I’m not sure how the natives will take that. They are not as stupid as we first believed.’
Amid a rumbling of thunder, Vlad growled ‘What you mean, Holmesy? Didn’t you fix it? What are we paying you for? Go to the scribes of the Great Canberra Timesicus. Offer them trinkets to sing our praises.’
Holmsey quivered. ‘They can no longer be swayed. See this scroll:
Bids sign of the times
‘Oh great Vlad, don’t you remember? You reneged on the promise of the glittering scholarships. They never got anything of value here. The locals were ticked off ‘cause the Greater Sydney Kingdom received the selections, the scholarships, the love and praise. Don’t you remember the memo?’
‘Well fix it, Holmsey!’ fumed Vlad.
‘It’s a bit late, your greatness. The soccer infidels have raided the land. They have wiped out the lesser realms of the Raiderites and Brumbyites and Canberrans have turned their backs. They now worship at the Temple of the Round Ball.’
Vlad cocked his head. ‘The Riverina?’
Holmsey shook his head and mumbled, ‘I’m sorry but the Soccerites have smote them as well.’
Vlad shrugged his shoulders and mounted the cloud. He and the other eight turned inwards and closed their eyes and hummed in unison.
‘Tassie,’ proclaimed Vlad solemnly as the great cloud ascended into the stratosphere.
Sometime in the year 2009, the great god, Vlad, descended on Manuka Football Oval atop a great white cloud with his eight demigods genuflecting at his feet. Vlad alighted from the cloud and looked around. He tipped his head back and smelt the scent of precious metals wafting from the Deakin Mint and said, ‘It is good’. He tipped his head again and heard the feverish computer tappings and the hot air from those who dwelt in the Parliamentary Triangle. ‘It is doubly good,’ he said with a smile. ‘We shall rename this land, Greater Western Sydney.’
But the prophet Holmesy said ‘Oh great god, Vlad, with groveling respect, I’m not sure how the natives will take that. They are not as stupid as we first believed.’
Amid a rumbling of thunder, Vlad growled ‘What you mean, Holmesy? Didn’t you fix it? What are we paying you for? Go to the scribes of the Great Canberra Timesicus. Offer them trinkets to sing our praises.’
Holmsey quivered. ‘They can no longer be swayed. See this scroll:
Bids sign of the times
‘Oh great Vlad, don’t you remember? You reneged on the promise of the glittering scholarships. They never got anything of value here. The locals were ticked off ‘cause the Greater Sydney Kingdom received the selections, the scholarships, the love and praise. Don’t you remember the memo?’
‘Well fix it, Holmsey!’ fumed Vlad.
‘It’s a bit late, your greatness. The soccer infidels have raided the land. They have wiped out the lesser realms of the Raiderites and Brumbyites and Canberrans have turned their backs. They now worship at the Temple of the Round Ball.’
Vlad cocked his head. ‘The Riverina?’
Holmsey shook his head and mumbled, ‘I’m sorry but the Soccerites have smote them as well.’
Vlad shrugged his shoulders and mounted the cloud. He and the other eight turned inwards and closed their eyes and hummed in unison.
‘Tassie,’ proclaimed Vlad solemnly as the great cloud ascended into the stratosphere.
one 4 the road
All Australian
Very funny fairgo
.
Holmes NEVER NEVER NEVER said that ACT would be part of the scholarships.
(I went to the first presentation of the scheme at Manuka Oval in November 2005).
Don't know why they don't just change the name to Sydney scholarships, thats what its all about, always has been always will, and if the AFL just came out and said that, then people "out of the zone" would let if die.
The AFL needs kids on lists from Sydney to help promote the game to Sydneysiders and kids in school.
I am interested to see how much further it will go now that the AFL has pulled the funding and each club has to foot the entire amount for each new scholarship.
. Holmes NEVER NEVER NEVER said that ACT would be part of the scholarships.
(I went to the first presentation of the scheme at Manuka Oval in November 2005).
Don't know why they don't just change the name to Sydney scholarships, thats what its all about, always has been always will, and if the AFL just came out and said that, then people "out of the zone" would let if die.
The AFL needs kids on lists from Sydney to help promote the game to Sydneysiders and kids in school.
I am interested to see how much further it will go now that the AFL has pulled the funding and each club has to foot the entire amount for each new scholarship.
The Scholarship program is a joke - if they were serious about promoting NSW footballers they would include everyone and Kade Klemke, Taylor Duryea, Josh Bryce and Dylan McNeill would all have been on scholarships and had a better chance of a rookie to an afl club.
I see where you are coming from. And I think Canberra should be part of it.
But those four boys had one opportunity that the scholarship eligible kids don't have - they got to play all year in the TAC Cup. Which is why the Riverina shouldnt be included in the scholarship program.
They also played U18 National Championships. And let's be honest aside from Klemke I doubt the other three would've gotten a gig in the Vic Country side.
They had opportunities, those four were under recruiters noses all year and simply were deemed not good enough. Klemke will land a rookie spot anyway, and McNeil and Duryea get another chance to show what they can do in 2009.
one 4 the road
All Australian
I can see where Murrayfan is coming from footyman.
The 5 scholarship boys who have been rookie listed:
Scott and Ranga - absolutely no arguements, both played major roles for the Rams this year (and last)
Will played a few games and was a reasonable contributer.
Blake and Chris couldn't get in the Rams side!!!!!!!!!!!
If the four mentioned above had scholarships then I reckon all 4 would be training with AFL clubs right now.
Kade makes AA and was the leader when Ranga was injured.
Dylan won the most clearances for the carnival (not just NSW) was also runner up B & F for the Rams.
Josh was very very good in every game, usually got the best forward and did a tremendous job, was the Rams B & F winner.
Taylor was given specific roles in the team every game and was a good contributer.
The events that are now happening IS the main reason that people "outside the zone" are upset, guys who didn't make the Rams side are now being put ahead of players (from the same state) onto lists. This is the greatest incentive that the scheme has to offer, not money, but the ability for a club to rookie list you (as a NSW scholarship holder) and then you are not counted on the list for your first year. Massive advantage, getting onto a list is the biggest battle and this is seen as an easier way.
I agree with all that. But the Riverina boys do get to play TAC Cup and are under the noses of recruiting officers every week. And to be blunt none of those four were good enough this year.
It gets messy when you start offering a small portion of TAC Cup listed players an opportunity others dont get. To me those four Rams boys have had every single opportunity that Victorian kids get - and arguably more.
Getting onto an AFL list is a big battle I agree. But why should they get a safety net that 98% of other TAC Cup players dont have? Those Riverina guys are essentially Victorian in my eyes. Kids from Broken Hill or Sydney or Coffs Harbour - they're another story. They are not developed footy areas. They do not have high quality junior programs in place week in, week out.
I'd like the program ditched altogether, but I'm happy enough with the current zones. I'd like Canberra to be part of it, but under no circumstances do I think the Riverina should be included. Imagine having families move across the border to Albury just so they could have their son on a scholarship. Or worse have the richer AFL clubs pay for them to move across the border. No thanks.
one 4 the road
All Australian
Don't disagree with anything you raised footy.
But unless they have changed the rules (which is quite possible) you have to live in the area for 3 years before you qualify, therefore they would have to be moving people when the boys are 15 (at the oldest) for them to qualify.
There is also nothing stopping the Rich clubs on moving a boy to Sydney for school (another way to qualify). Moving kids to schools in Vic is done on scholarships isn't it?
Guys would then have to decide whether they wanted to play for Vic Country or NSW because they would have to play for NSW if they were on a scholarship and I am sure the prestige of playing for Vic is a fair bit greater than playing for NSW.
Looking back through the last 10 years I'd say there has been more guys drafted from Vic C than NSW so that would be a major disincentive.
I'm with you though, scrap the lot.
But unless they have changed the rules (which is quite possible) you have to live in the area for 3 years before you qualify, therefore they would have to be moving people when the boys are 15 (at the oldest) for them to qualify.
There is also nothing stopping the Rich clubs on moving a boy to Sydney for school (another way to qualify). Moving kids to schools in Vic is done on scholarships isn't it?
Guys would then have to decide whether they wanted to play for Vic Country or NSW because they would have to play for NSW if they were on a scholarship and I am sure the prestige of playing for Vic is a fair bit greater than playing for NSW.
Looking back through the last 10 years I'd say there has been more guys drafted from Vic C than NSW so that would be a major disincentive.
I'm with you though, scrap the lot.
fairgoCanberra
Draftee
Dear Mr Hird
My name is Jake and I’m the captain of the under 13s Ainslie footy team.
All the boys want to play AFL in 2013 but don’t reckon it’s gunna happen cause we come from the ACT.
Me and me teammates were wondering if you’d like to adopt us all?
Dad reckons Essendon could take us under the father-son rule.
There are 18 of us and we’ve all got signed permission notes.
Dad said to add that we’re housebroken, have our own teeth and have no police records.
In anticipation we’re wearing long sleeved jerseys and dyeing our hair blonde so there’ll be no questions asked.
Your ‘hopeful son’
Jake
My name is Jake and I’m the captain of the under 13s Ainslie footy team.
All the boys want to play AFL in 2013 but don’t reckon it’s gunna happen cause we come from the ACT.
Me and me teammates were wondering if you’d like to adopt us all?
Dad reckons Essendon could take us under the father-son rule.
There are 18 of us and we’ve all got signed permission notes.
Dad said to add that we’re housebroken, have our own teeth and have no police records.
In anticipation we’re wearing long sleeved jerseys and dyeing our hair blonde so there’ll be no questions asked.
Your ‘hopeful son’
Jake
Perhaps a small point, but Broken Hill doesn't belong in the above list. It's a very firmly established Aussie rules town. The biggest rort of the scholarship program is that Broken Hill is included in it; which allowed Taylor Walker to go to Adelaide for essentially no draft-pick cost to that club. (There are probably other BH scholarship boys, but he's the most prominent to date.)
It's all swings and roundabouts with any exception to the 'purity' of the draft, though. The Crows can view Walker as compo for getting dudded on the father/son rule.
Hi SimonH
Had a look at the 'Aussie Rules Town' link and came to the conclusion that Broken Hill is a lot like Canberra. Had a bit of AFL history - once.
'As late as the 1970s Broken Hill could realistically lay claim to still being one of the genuine hotbeds of the game, but one is forced to wonder whether that is still the case. For example, a glance at The 'AFL Record' Guide To Season 2005 reveals that only two players currently on AFL club lists (Essendon's Dean Solomon, and Brent Staker of West Coast) actually hail originally from the city which could arguably, at one time, lay claim to being the per capita capital of Australia's only indigenous sport. Of course, it may simply be that football is undergoing a temporary slump, and that all will be well once more in a few years time, but somehow this is hard to accept. Football today, for both participants and observers, is increasingly perceived as providing just one among many potential ways of utilising the leisure dollar, and in country Australia, once the heart and soul of the game, it is all too easy nowadays to choose alternative spending outlets.'
Most regions at least have a kid or two to wonder about in tomorrow's Rookie Draft. Articles are written about their journeys, difficulties, talents etc The draft hasn't even rated a mention in the local papers here because the local kids don't even get a chance to be one of the rookie hopefuls.
At the AFL Commissioners meeting today they put off their decision about the GC licence and haven't even discussed WS.
So when exactly does the 'WS exclusion zone' for come into effect for Canberra and the Riverina? There were promises last year about the opportunities that would open up for kids in this region. So I presume with the delay the kids and their development here are going to placed further into limbo and they are going to fall further behind compared to those in Sydney, especially the schoalrship holders?
It is discrimination.
Had a look at the 'Aussie Rules Town' link and came to the conclusion that Broken Hill is a lot like Canberra. Had a bit of AFL history - once.
'As late as the 1970s Broken Hill could realistically lay claim to still being one of the genuine hotbeds of the game, but one is forced to wonder whether that is still the case. For example, a glance at The 'AFL Record' Guide To Season 2005 reveals that only two players currently on AFL club lists (Essendon's Dean Solomon, and Brent Staker of West Coast) actually hail originally from the city which could arguably, at one time, lay claim to being the per capita capital of Australia's only indigenous sport. Of course, it may simply be that football is undergoing a temporary slump, and that all will be well once more in a few years time, but somehow this is hard to accept. Football today, for both participants and observers, is increasingly perceived as providing just one among many potential ways of utilising the leisure dollar, and in country Australia, once the heart and soul of the game, it is all too easy nowadays to choose alternative spending outlets.'
Most regions at least have a kid or two to wonder about in tomorrow's Rookie Draft. Articles are written about their journeys, difficulties, talents etc The draft hasn't even rated a mention in the local papers here because the local kids don't even get a chance to be one of the rookie hopefuls.
At the AFL Commissioners meeting today they put off their decision about the GC licence and haven't even discussed WS.
So when exactly does the 'WS exclusion zone' for come into effect for Canberra and the Riverina? There were promises last year about the opportunities that would open up for kids in this region. So I presume with the delay the kids and their development here are going to placed further into limbo and they are going to fall further behind compared to those in Sydney, especially the schoalrship holders?
It is discrimination.
Sorry, I agree that Broken Hill is an AFL town.
However, some Riverina kids have the chance to play Murray Bushrangers, guys around Wagga and Canberra play in the NSW/ACT's strongest league. I have less of a problem with people in areas that are remote or areas that do not have access to a very strong football competition being eligible for scholarships. That's the point I was trying to make.
In saying that Broken Hill does seem to have been a target area for scholarship players, particularly the Hawks.
It’s pretty convincing that you won’t get to the AFL if you come from Canberra.
No ACT recruits were included in the rookie or main draft and Aaron Bruce, the lone ACT rookie, was dropped by the Swans without playing a senior game. The Swans preferred to pass on their last three picks instead of choosing locals. Yet on the AFL NSW-ACT website they congratulated Phil Davis, a player that left Canberra as a 14 yr old for Adelaide and didn’t even play for the NSW Rams. If that was Canberra’s only connection to the draft that’s sad.
Hawks and Bombers swoop on Breust, Klemke
I don’t think it is enough these days to just get someone over the line as a rookie. If Aaron Bruce had received more attention earlier so that he was developed and hardened like Craig Bird, the Swans scholarship holder, from an early age there might have been a different outcome for Aaron. I think it’s too late to try and do it at 18.
The league in Canberra is not strong enough in the 13-18 yrs bracket, which is what you should be examining to see why kids aren’t being drafted here (not the men’s A grade comp). In these age groups the
skills and development are not advanced in Canberra. Like Sydney, the majority of kids here do not have fathers that played the game, which seems to be a significant factor for many that achieve success in the draft.
How about AFL NSW-ACT sit down with the Murray Bushrangers coaches and find out how to design a development program that works for this region? The MB’s record of success speaks for itself. They must be good at what they do. They must be doing something better, harder, smarter, whatever. Is it skills, tactics, fitness or what?
I can’t believe that after 10 yrs or so since Craig Bolton that not one draftable talent has come from this region with the ability to make an AFL team and stay there for a few years like Bolton. Perhaps scholarships need to be given to Canberra for a while to bring some local kids up to the standard of those who were drafted. If a few got drafted it would also help the younger kids believe that it’s not an impossible dream.
Isn’t NSW-ACT AFL employed to try and help ALL of its players get to the draft? If they can’t help Canberra, then it’s time for a Country NSW team or a TAC team consisting of Canberra and Southern NSW so we can become independent of Sydney and maybe play some games in the Victorian competition.
I’m pretty sure there would be some local boys fired up enough to play the Sydney scholarship boys in a Country Vs Metro competition!
No ACT recruits were included in the rookie or main draft and Aaron Bruce, the lone ACT rookie, was dropped by the Swans without playing a senior game. The Swans preferred to pass on their last three picks instead of choosing locals. Yet on the AFL NSW-ACT website they congratulated Phil Davis, a player that left Canberra as a 14 yr old for Adelaide and didn’t even play for the NSW Rams. If that was Canberra’s only connection to the draft that’s sad.
Hawks and Bombers swoop on Breust, Klemke
I don’t think it is enough these days to just get someone over the line as a rookie. If Aaron Bruce had received more attention earlier so that he was developed and hardened like Craig Bird, the Swans scholarship holder, from an early age there might have been a different outcome for Aaron. I think it’s too late to try and do it at 18.
The league in Canberra is not strong enough in the 13-18 yrs bracket, which is what you should be examining to see why kids aren’t being drafted here (not the men’s A grade comp). In these age groups the
skills and development are not advanced in Canberra. Like Sydney, the majority of kids here do not have fathers that played the game, which seems to be a significant factor for many that achieve success in the draft.
How about AFL NSW-ACT sit down with the Murray Bushrangers coaches and find out how to design a development program that works for this region? The MB’s record of success speaks for itself. They must be good at what they do. They must be doing something better, harder, smarter, whatever. Is it skills, tactics, fitness or what?
I can’t believe that after 10 yrs or so since Craig Bolton that not one draftable talent has come from this region with the ability to make an AFL team and stay there for a few years like Bolton. Perhaps scholarships need to be given to Canberra for a while to bring some local kids up to the standard of those who were drafted. If a few got drafted it would also help the younger kids believe that it’s not an impossible dream.
Isn’t NSW-ACT AFL employed to try and help ALL of its players get to the draft? If they can’t help Canberra, then it’s time for a Country NSW team or a TAC team consisting of Canberra and Southern NSW so we can become independent of Sydney and maybe play some games in the Victorian competition.
I’m pretty sure there would be some local boys fired up enough to play the Sydney scholarship boys in a Country Vs Metro competition!
RussellEbertHandball
Flick pass expert
Port's 3 scholarship kids Simon O'Brien, Harrison Cumming and Jordan Johns are all from Broken Hill. With it being 6 hours drive from Adelaide compared to 12 from Sydney it has always been an Aussie Rules town. It is on the SA/Australian Central Standard time zone.
I like it. You have a good wit.
What about those from Wagga/Narrandera and Griffith? ok - that is traditional footy territory in principle, but they don't get to play for the Murray Bushrangers (which is centred on Albury-Wodonga area), so technically I think they deserve the same rights as the Sydneysiders in terms of scholarships.
From what I have been told, Griffith is crying out for proper funding and support and Griffith has a reasonable sized population too.
