Traded Patrick Dangerfield [traded w/ pick 50 to Geelong for 9, 28 and Gore]

[Art Vandelay_]

And we'll just pretend that the 2011 and 2014 premierships weren't won by teams who improved despite losing the league mvp in the off season

Difference being that both sides were great beforehand whilst the Crows were and still are merely above average.

Average being sides 9-12. So no, they can't win one without PD. Not this year.

Continued in Part 2:
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-to-geelong-for-9-28-and-gore-part-2.1142250/

 

[Ian Dunross]

Continued from part 1:
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-9-28-and-gore.1100937/page-335#post-45882730

If you do a quick search you'll find that you couldn't be further from the truth.

Dangerfield will make no difference to Geelong's fortunes, they'll still miss the 8 was the cry from bitter and jealous opposition supporters.

So yes, it was quite clearly a common theme.

I'll have a look

Provided you admit you or one your colleagues was adamant that Geelong wouldn't have to give anything up for him

 

[Ian Dunross]

Difference being that both sides were great beforehand whilst the Crows were and still are merely above average.

Average being sides 9-12. So no, they can't win one without PD. Not this year.

The question is not whether they can win a premiership, the question is whether they are a better side

The evidence shows they clearly are

 

[Art Vandelay_]

The question is not whether they can win a premiership, the question is whether they are a better side

The evidence shows they clearly are

Until they progress past SF week they are not. That's what constitutes better.

 

[Ian Dunross]

And there's a very good chance they'll do that

 

[Art Vandelay_]

And there's a very good chance they'll do that

Based on what?

Swans and GWS look most likely for 2nd/3rd so if they get 4th they'll get beat by the Hawks, which also puts them on the same side of the draw as the 5th v 8th game, 5th would be filled by us where a Crows straight sets awaits. Miss 4th and they'll likely run into the loser of Hawthorn v Geelong/Swans/GWS (all away from Adelaide) where they are llkely to lose also.

 

[Ian Dunross]

Based on what?

Swans and GWS look most likely for 2nd/3rd so if they get 4th they'll get beat by the Hawks, which also puts them on the same side of the draw as the 5th v 8th game, 5th would be filled by us where a Crows straight sets awaits. Miss 4th and they'll likely run into the loser of Hawthorn v Geelong/Swans/GWS (all away from Adelaide) where they are llkely to lose also.

FMD, cancel the finals then

 

[Ian Dunross]

I really can't tell whether you're arguing for arguments sake or whether you actually believe that garbage... Let's hope for your sake it's the former.

What garbage? They've won more games w a harder draw playing some of the best footy in the comp...

Does anyone - not a Geelong supporter - deny that the Crows are a better team this year than last? No

Were the Crows a genuine finals threat last season? Not really

Are they this season? Yes

 

[Ian Dunross]

...

That settles it then

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

What garbage? They've won more games w a harder draw playing some of the best footy in the comp...

Does anyone - not a Geelong supporter - deny that the Crows are a better team this year than last? No

Were the Crows a genuine finals threat last season? Not really

Are they this season? Yes

Just think about what a real force they'd be with Dangerfield in the side then, they'd realistically be sitting atop the AFL table heading into the last month... It's not unreasonable to assume that they'd have 2 wins against Geelong and not two losses.

So no, it's delusion to assume they're better of without the best player in the game based on comparing ladder positions and win/loss ratio in two different years... That's child's play.

I'm actually astonished people with any form of intelligence are running with it.

 

[Ian Dunross]

Google the Ewing effect and do some reading

Also, compare the Hawks in 2013 to 2014

Not to mention your own side in 2011

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Google the Ewing effect and do some reading

Also, compare the Hawks in 2013 to 2014

Not to mention your own side in 2011

Now you're comparing Adelaide to triple premiership winning teams in an entirely irrelevant timeframe.

Is it possible Adelaide's winning record could be attributed to the declining standard of the league? Declining in that there are less teams vying for a finals spot, a lot more 'poorer' sides so to speak. I mean the top 8 was set very early in the season... is there a chance you've overlooked others factors that come into play? I'll allow you to think for yourself if possible.

A new coach ? New recruits? New game plan, etc?

But to indicate the Crows are better off without Patrick Dangerfield (the best player in the league) is simply delusion and a lack of football intelligence on your behalf.

I'll leave you to ponder.

 

[Sloane4pm]

Just think about what a real force they'd be with Dangerfield in the side then, they'd realistically be sitting atop the AFL table heading into the last month... It's not unreasonable to assume that they'd have 2 wins against Geelong and not two losses.

So no, it's delusion to assume they're better of without the best player in the game based on comparing ladder positions and win/loss ratio in two different years... That's child's play.

I'm actually astonished people with any form of intelligence are running with it.

There's not a day that goes by that crows supporters think what if we still had dangerfield.... And tippet.... And gunston.... And Davis... Why do you think we are all so jumpy when another star comes out of contract

 

[Ian Dunross]

Now you're comparing Adelaide to triple premiership winning teams in an entirely irrelevant timeframe.

Is it possible Adelaide's winning record could be attributed to the declining standard of the league? Declining in that there are less teams vying for a finals spot, a lot more 'poorer' sides so to speak. I mean the top 8 was set very early in the season... is there a chance you've overlooked others factors that come into play? I'll allow you to think for yourself if possible.

A new coach ? New recruits? New game plan, etc?

But to indicate the Crows are better off without Patrick Dangerfield (the best player in the league) is simply delusion and a lack of football intelligence on your behalf.

I'll leave you to ponder.

So let me guess this straight, all of Adelaide's improvement is down to the fixture, or the pack coming back to the mean, or improvement of other players or other players stepping up

But all of Geelong's improvement is down to Dangerfield

Seems about right

Has about the same intellectual integrity as the rest of your posts

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

There's not a day that goes by that crows supporters think what if we still had dangerfield.... And tippet.... And gunston.... And Davis... Why do you think we are all so jumpy when another star comes out of contract

And rightly so too.

 

[NTRabbit]

It's good for Geelong that they finally managed to get a success out of copying Hawthorn's recruitment strategy, after several years in pursuit of them they were due for one

 

[RippaRiley43]

Nope, try again.

You were the one who ludicrously assumed the Crows were a better team without the game's best player, remember?

Simple question.

Why do you care?

Crows fans are just trying to move on and be positive. But no. It's not enough that you took our best player, you have to put the rest of our team down.

 

[TwentyNine]

Adelaide 2016 are better than Adelaide 2015
Hypothetical Adelaide 2016 with Dangerfield would be better than current Adelaide 2016

No need to bitch over it

 

[JD Tomahawk]

Crows 16 are better than 15 but if they had danger they would be even better. Geelong are the same, better this year than last. If we didn't have danger we would still be better than last year

 

[Mahlepi]

Simple question.

Why do you care?

Crows fans are just trying to move on and be positive. But no. It's not enough that you took our best player, you have to put the rest of our team down.

and there is a dinner party to attend

 

[DangerSloane]

The bitterness is palpable even after almost a year on... Crows supportes still think they're better off without him... A comfort mechanism for those still struggling to come to grips with his departure. Well either that or delusion.

But alas, I heard talk all pre-season how he wouldn't be the difference and we'd still miss the top 8, now those same people are trying to tell us that we're a one man band.

Guess what Crows supporters, if you're better off without him you'd have posed more of a challenge in both games you attempted to play against he and Geelong this year.

Ignorance is bliss.

Dangerfield is a great player, no arguments there....but...
The ladder and statistics say that we are better off without him, but hey keep pulling the same old crap out every month or two.

All I heard pre-season is that we would be 10th or below without Danger.
All I heard pre-season was how Geelong are flag favourites.

Fast forward 18 rounds and bang theres 0.1% in it.

Sounds like you're the bitter one that we can function better without your great white hope.

 

[DangerSloane]

I really can't tell whether you're arguing for arguments sake or whether you actually believe that garbage... Let's hope for your sake it's the former.

Or he's right and you're just blinded once again by your love of Geelong?

Whats your excuse when a neutral says it. You cant say its bitterness? Whats your excuse this time?

 

[DangerSloane]

So let me guess this straight, all of Adelaide's improvement is down to the fixture, or the pack coming back to the mean, or improvement of other players or other players stepping up

But all of Geelong's improvement is down to Dangerfield

Seems about right

Has about the same intellectual integrity as the rest of your posts

The fixture which we had the 2nd hardest of in the entire league.

If only this guy used his brain.

 

[Ian Dunross]

Nope, try again.

You were the one who ludicrously assumed the Crows were a better team without the game's best player, remember?

Then what is your position?

Do you deny that Adelaide have improved?

 

[Ian Dunross]

This isn't fantasy football where if you select the best 22 footballers you automatically have the best team

This way of thinking is truly high school kick to kick stuff

Hawthorn are a harder to beat side without Franklin, Sydney are more predictable with Franklin

Dangerfield is one of those individualist players like Franklin or Ablett Snr

He doesn't necessarily make players around him better, in fact often times he puts them in the shade, because his way is to win games off his own boot

And he's terrific at it

But to deny that a TEAM might function better without a player like that is so uncontroversial it's baffling it requires explanation