Preview PF Fremantle v Hawthorn (Hawks are welcome)

[Mitchell54]

Hope it's a great game guys. good luck.


And ohh... watch that #25, he's in for a bag
Start a Hashtag
#Schoeyforabag

 

[Lach72]

Hope it's a great game guys. good luck.


And ohh... watch that #25, he's in for a bag
Start a Hashtag
#Schoeyforateabag

Takes all sorts I guess

 

[Mitchell54]

Freo are too good!!
#yepconfirmed

 

[Tonga Bob]

Hope it's a great game guys. good luck.


And ohh... watch that #25, he's in for a bag
Start a Hashtag
#Schoeyforabag

Bag of what?

 

[Mitchell54]

Bag of what?

You being a Freo fan, you probably don't know what a bag of goals is.
It's when 1 individual player kicks the oval-shaped ball through the big sticks on the side of the ground your team is shooting towards 4-5 times.

 

[Tonga Bob]

You being a Freo fan, you probably don't know what a bag of goals is.
It's when 1 individual player kicks the oval-shaped ball through the big sticks on the side of the ground your team is shooting towards 4-5 times.

Bag of dicks it is then.

You may be right about Schoenmakers though... players usually do well when they're in the shop window. Good luck regardless...

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Came here for some discussion on the game from an opposition perspective. Bombarded with conspiracy theories, claims of corruption and moaning about umpiring..... Loser talk from a small handful of you...

IS MJ a genuine concern? Would be a massive out if so. Massive. The stirrer above me might be a little tongue in cheek about Shoenmakers, but if MJ is indeed out (and Gunston already missign) he is the guy who may slip through the radar. Opportunity to make a name for himself tonight.

I think its strange that Ross the Boss has gone with a tall forward line, its been the small forward lines that have troubled Hawthorn in the past few months as we've struggled to find something for both Frawley and Lake to do. Still, he's a brilliant coach so you gotta back him in.

 

[Tonga Bob]

Came here for some discussion on the game from an opposition perspective. Bombarded with conspiracy theories, claims of corruption and moaning about umpiring..... Loser talk from a small handful of you...

IS MJ a genuine concern? Would be a massive out if so. Massive. The stirrer above me might be a little tongue in cheek about Shoenmakers, but if MJ is indeed out (and Gunston already missign) he is the guy who may slip through the radar. Opportunity to make a name for himself tonight.

I think its strange that Ross the Boss has gone with a tall forward line, its been the small forward lines that have troubled Hawthorn in the past few months as we've struggled to find something for both Frawley and Lake to do. Still, he's a brilliant coach so you gotta back him in.

Haven't heard any MJ rumours apart from here, hope it's just nervous babbling.

At our best earlier this year we had three talls in the forward line: Pav, Taberner & the resting ruck (Sandi/Clarke) so I'm glad we're going that way.

 

[danstar]

ive being awake an hour it feels like I being awake for 4 this day is truly dragging cant wait to be at domain stadium tonight to lose my voice cheering my team to a win

 

[sproketman]

Came here for some discussion on the game from an opposition perspective. Bombarded with conspiracy theories, claims of corruption and moaning about umpiring..... Loser talk from a small handful of you...

You are certainly not a winner.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

You are certainly not a winner.

Is that you Dad? Leave me alone I'm doing my best.

 

[Byrons Firen]

C'mon Freo,give 'em the old heave ho. A lotta neutral fans want you to get up tonight.
Don't give them all these un-contested marks they thrive on with their dinky kicks.
Surely they'll start to tire in the 2nd 1/2. Stick with them in the 1st 1/2 and run over them in the 2nd.
This is not an anti hawks rant more a gee up for you guys.
Stick it up the melbourne footy mafia.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

C'mon Freo,give 'em the old heave ho. A lotta neutral fans want you to get up tonight.
Don't give them all these un-contested marks they thrive on with their dinky kicks.
Surely they'll start to tire in the 2nd 1/2. Stick with them in the 1st 1/2 and run over them in the 2nd.
This is not an anti hawks rant more a gee up for you guys.
Stick it up the melbourne footy mafia.

I think it would be a struggle to find one that isn't. Its all good, I would be the same if I weren't a Hawks fan.

#anyonebuthawthorn

 

[PapaJ]

Came here for some discussion on the game from an opposition perspective. Bombarded with conspiracy theories, claims of corruption and moaning about umpiring..... Loser talk from a small handful of you...

IS MJ a genuine concern? Would be a massive out if so. Massive. The stirrer above me might be a little tongue in cheek about Shoenmakers, but if MJ is indeed out (and Gunston already missign) he is the guy who may slip through the radar. Opportunity to make a name for himself tonight.

I think its strange that Ross the Boss has gone with a tall forward line, its been the small forward lines that have troubled Hawthorn in the past few months as we've struggled to find something for both Frawley and Lake to do. Still, he's a brilliant coach so you gotta back him in.

Changes thread has some chat about MJ. I think there is something in it only because he hasn't quite looked right since coming back from the long layoff. Having said that, they'll get him on the park. It's finals and if he's near enough he's the sort that coaches put out there regardless. Not a fan of such policies, but that's what the vast majority, including Ross, will do.

Agree on the moaning of umps. Yeah we statistically cop it, but that's not really here nor there as far as this particular game is concerned. There's a big game between two heavyweight teams. These unique sorts of games that the rest of the comp would give their proverbials to be in, lets just keep it focused on the good stuff I say.

 

[Wundo]

My "analysis and conclusions" that I have posted have consisted of statistical samples/evidence that supports a scenario of umpiring bias. Where did I make any conclusions? I think you maybe the one who has made inferences/conclusions from my data and because they do not adhere to what you believe, you possibly find comfort in making tin foil references. I could easily find labels for you, but that contributes nothing to any discussion regarding startling free kick statistics now does it?

You've gathered a heap of raw data and leapt to a conclusion that enforces your own cognitive bias. Correlation does not imply causation.

 

[sproketman]

Is that you Dad? Leave me alone I'm doing my best.

Yes it is me. You are a disappointment.

 

[kingswood71]

Haven't heard any MJ rumours apart from here, hope it's just nervous babbling.

At our best earlier this year we had three talls in the forward line: Pav, Taberner & the resting ruck (Sandi/Clarke) so I'm glad we're going that way.

AFL site reporting it as "late mail"... http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-25/late-mail-live-finals-week-three
Hopefully its just that all the reporters reporting it read it on here !!

 

[PurpleEyes]

You've gathered a heap of raw data and leapt to a conclusion that enforces your own cognitive bias. Correlation does not imply causation.

Again, what is my conclusion? You tell me.
I have theories and beliefs which change in direction and strength depending on what data I find to support them. For example, prior to studying the statistical data, I used to think Dean Margetts was terribly biased against Fremantle, the worst of all the umpires, now I am less convinced.
"Correlation does not imply causation" ... that statement could also be used when looking at the correlation of goals scored by a team and winning the game. Just because a team kicks more goals than it's opponents, does not necessarily mean they win the game. ... But it's a darn good indicator and the correlation is high.
I would suggest the Free Kick statistics and umpiring bias would also have a pretty good correlation. That doesn't mean that one is 100% effected by the other, but I have never inferred nor claimed anything of the sort. If I did, I would simply quote Fremantles Frees For vs Against and then stand on my soap box and yell conclusion, end of story, corruption and feel no need to provide further statistics or arguments. You may like to paint a picture that I am doing that, but that is not the case.
I have studied, grounds, opponents, umpires, all types of team and player statistics, club memberships, AFL laws, seasons, etc... and I present the statistics that I find unlikely to be totally random without some causation. 14 Free Kicks in a row to a Fremantle opposition is an unlikely random statistic. Umpiring bias is a reasonable causation for that, especially for Western Bulldogs at Docklands.

It's amazing how any possibility of umpiring bias is ridiculed and yet your main argument against that, is that I am biased.

 

[Piesnchess]

Just on the umps, you should do ok i reckon with frees, its at Subi, and i think the umps get a bit gun shy going against home crowds, going berserk in the stands LOL, i have fond memories of games with my Pies at ol Vic Park, we did very nicely out there. LOL Anyway, good luck tonight Freo, please do us all a favour and knock the piss and poo out, could not stand them in yet another GF, boring as watching paint dry. Hit em hard, tag hodge and mitchell constantly, pressure, pressure, stilfe them and crowd their space, as the eagles did. Goodluck Dockers, time to step up, just do it.

 

[jusjoshin]

Just on the umps, you should do ok i reckon with frees, its at Subi, and i think the umps get a bit gun shy going against home crowds, going berserk in the stands LOL, i have fond memories of games with my Pies at ol Vic Park, we did very nicely out there. LOL Anyway, good luck tonight Freo, please do us all a favour and knock the piss and poo out, could not stand them in yet another GF, boring as watching paint dry. Hit em hard, tag hodge and mitchell constantly, pressure, pressure, stilfe them and crowd their space, as the eagles did. Goodluck Dockers, time to step up, just do it.

We don't usually get much love from the maggots, even at home. Hopefully it is a fairly adjudicated game.

 

[FreoRicci]

Came here for some discussion on the game from an opposition perspective. Bombarded with conspiracy theories, claims of corruption and moaning about umpiring..... Loser talk from a small handful of you...

IS MJ a genuine concern? Would be a massive out if so. Massive. The stirrer above me might be a little tongue in cheek about Shoenmakers, but if MJ is indeed out (and Gunston already missign) he is the guy who may slip through the radar. Opportunity to make a name for himself tonight.

I think its strange that Ross the Boss has gone with a tall forward line, its been the small forward lines that have troubled Hawthorn in the past few months as we've struggled to find something for both Frawley and Lake to do. Still, he's a brilliant coach so you gotta back him in.

We've gone tall but don't forget still have the smalls around them. Will stretch you both ways regardless. Think it's more of trying to get Hawthorn to worry about the contested marking in Sandi/Griffin that Ballas and Walters can do what they are known for.

 

[Wundo]

Again, what is my conclusion? You tell me.

I have studied, grounds, opponents, umpires, all types of team and player statistics, club memberships, AFL laws, seasons, etc... and I present the statistics that I find unlikely to be totally random without some causation. 14 Free Kicks in a row to a Fremantle opposition is an unlikely random statistic. Umpiring bias is a reasonable causation for that, especially for Western Bulldogs at Docklands.

It's amazing how any possibility of umpiring bias is ridiculed and yet your main argument against that, is that I am biased.

Your assumption is that the umps are cheating and awarding free kicks to Freo's opposition, to help make Freo lose. Your bias is such because you viewing the data with purple eyes, in order to confirm your assumption. Your conclusions is that there is a statistical, measureable, non insignificant free kick bias
favouring other teams that Freo play. You reached this conclusion because you wanted to, and interpreted the data as such.

In order to make a case for which your are stating, you would need to analyse, at depth, all free kicks in all games for many many years, to see what constitutes "normal" These "outliers" like the 14 free kicks in a row mightn't actually be that significant.

Only once you have crunched an enormous amount of data could you then begin to apply it to individual umpires. But again, just because Freo appears to you to be on the receiving end of a string of calls from certain umpires, it does not mean there is anything untoward going on.

I'd pretty sure if I trolled a large free kick data set, with brown and gold glasses on, I could find similar instances going against Hawthorn.

Lastly, you have presented no statistics, just raw data, which you then see what you want to see in it, to confirm what you want to believe.

True stats don't lie, but they can be misleading.

 

[PurpleEyes]

Your assumption is that the umps are cheating and awarding free kicks to Freo's opposition, to help make Freo lose. Your bias is such because you viewing the data with purple eyes, in order to confirm your assumption. Your conclusions is that there is a statistical, measureable, non insignificant free kick bias
favouring other teams that Freo play. You reached this conclusion because you wanted to, and interpreted the data as such.

In order to make a case for which your are stating, you would need to analyse, at depth, all free kicks in all games for many many years, to see what constitutes "normal" These "outliers" like the 14 free kicks in a row mightn't actually be that significant.

Only once you have crunched an enormous amount of data could you then begin to apply it to individual umpires. But again, just because Freo appears to you to be on the receiving end of a string of calls from certain umpires, it does not mean there is anything untoward going on.

I'd pretty sure if I trolled a large free kick data set, with brown and gold glasses on, I could find similar instances going against Hawthorn.

Lastly, you have presented no statistics, just raw data, which you then see what you want to see in it, to confirm what you want to believe.

True stats don't lie, but they can be misleading.

Other than your opinion, you present nothing to counter the data I present.

I can tell you now that if you troll 2015 for all Hawthorn games, with brown and gold glasses on, the most Frees against Hawthorn that you will find in a row is 7 ... so good luck trying to find 14 or more and until you do, discussing this with you is pointless.

I think it is now appropriate for me to reciprocate and be as dismissive of your posts, as you are with my statistical data.

 

[Kingfish73]

Looking forward to game. If you can contain hawks early pressure then a chance. But too many injury concerns for me to be confident. Just hope it's not a game where 10 goals win.

 

[PremierCatAttack]

Gday Dockers - I haven't always been a fan of yours but tonight I think its time for you to begin a history making week. A derby GF is just as interesting for us eastern staters if not more so than a normal GF with out our team in it - this could have some serious spice.

Hopefully RTB has you primed and your famed pressure is on display - aka the 2013 prelim pressure. After so much success in the last few years I don't think the Hawks could walk away from this game humiliated, but it would be really nice of you to try!!!