List Mgmt. Ross Lyon - Sacked

Is Ross still the man for the job?

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What happen to freo new high performance coach Tom Morris , definitely need some input from him as freo currently struggle with on field performance
 

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need a new midfield coach? It was so good when kirk and sumich was in charge. After they left ,it gone down? Sumich is coaching well the under 18 WA side (a side was rated by many as the worst in the competition). we need some one like that?
Can have a new Thread" new midfield coach".
 
meima said:
What happen to freo new high performance coach Tom Morris , definitely need some input from him as freo currently struggle with on field performance
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He's been in the coach's box the last few games I've seen on TV.
 
imperial_oz said:
Its not so much about getting hysterical after a loss but often a case of having those losses reinforce a previously held opinion.

Frankly, I am not convinced he's the man for the job. He has flaws that prevent him from being the coach to take this team to the top and those flaws are on display week after week. No, he's not a complete incompetent like some coaches but he doesn't have what is needed to be better than all his peers.

People talk about his loyalty to the players. I fundamentally disagree with that assessment. He has favourites and there are others. Look at his time at St Kilda and the way he treated some players not on his favourites list. His treatment of Ball was poor. His publicly retiring several players after a GF loss without even talking to them first. Fisher, for one, hasn't forgotten that.

He often goes on, when referring to the new players who haven't been tried, about having to 'earn your way in', yet he constantly picks players who cannot be justified on merit. I'm looking at Sutcliffe, Pearce D, Spurr, even Griffin (and I was always a big fan of him). None of these players represents any kind of a future for Freo but they keep getting chosen, dropped and recycled where others have never had that level of opportunity even when they've shown more.

He is not going to re-invent this team unless he can fundamentally re-invent himself. It is an unarguable fact that the game has changed. The AFL intentionally set out to change it and this team simply has not adjusted to those changes. Unless he can change the way he does things, come up with a game plan that works under today's conditions and bring "every" player on board then we will continue as we are, some time a little up, sometimes a little down and sometimes pretty darn crap.

I don't see where he has ever demonstrated the capacity to do that.

Rather than doing another 'internal' review, the club should have embarked on an 'external' review and I think had they done that, we would have gone in a different direction.
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If we are to get a new coach, and I am not advocating we do, then I want us to clean out the medical and fitness teams at the same time. Clean slate.

Quite obvious that the last 3 games we have been playing injured, lethargic and disinterested players. Not sure what is going on but how we can turn it on against the Bulldogs and then serve up that tripe yesterday is mind boggling. Made the Lions look top 4.

Anyone notice it has been 3 years in a row that we have limped to the bye. It is a recurring issue and we need to look at our fitness regime because it's not working.

I would love to be able to judge Lyon with a professional medical and sports science team around him because I don't think he has them.
 
Okinakashi said:
He's been in the coach's box the last few games I've seen on TV.
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Thanks , I think all the coaches need to discuss their view and look through video of all the matches including peel. Something is wrong Ross should not be the only one to get the blame
 
Ross is a bloody good coach. If teams are 5% off with intensity then any one can be beaten.
The list is developing so inconsistency is expected.
Brisbanes midfield is elite Zorko, Beams,Rockliff feeding off Martin.
Nathan Fyfe has been out of the game for 12 months and as could be expected,has not been as influential/explosive as previous seasons but still serviceable. His marking is off and he probably down a bit on confidence but he is an A grader and will return to the elite category.
Sandilands influence on the team/midfield function is obvious - in his absence during the last 2 weeks, the midfield has been smashed. Adelaide midfield is their archilles heel particularly if Sloane is tagged but they still managed to smash Feo midfield.
McCarthy and Kersten are developing and are not going to get supply when the midfield is down. Liked the look of Ryan and Cox - Collins ok but may lack a yard of pace.
 
wehavethepassion said:
I was very surprised when at his after game presser V Lions he highlighted Luke Ryan's ability to kick the ball and that 'we need people in the side who can kick the ball" Well he's been here since Nov 2011. Why haven't been we drafting player who can kick the ball!!

the concern is that his mantra of effort over skills ie can excuse skill errors if effort is there doesn't hold anymore as Hawks have shown 2013-2015 with kicking skills and Wbulldogs with handball skills and fast transition and also foot skills.

Last couple of yrs I think we have drafted a couple of decent kicks ie 2015 tucker, balic, yarran(pity about him) and 2016 ryan Logue, cox darcy
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To be fair the rumours are heavy that Lyon has overridden Lloyd to draft in Simpson and Duffy because they had the x factor and could kick the ball. Both were total busts.
The problem really is he only trusts about six guys to kick it, and the rest he wants to be role players to "give effort" and "block space" and do all the other 1% stuff he rates over actually kicking the damn thing. And so these 16 role players go into their bloody shell, lose confidence and when they do need to kick it can't hit the side of a barn because they are thinking deep down the coach doesn't rate me.
 
Nightrain said:
If we are to get a new coach, and I am not advocating we do, then I want us to clean out the medical and fitness teams at the same time. Clean slate.

Quite obvious that the last 3 games we have been playing injured, lethargic and disinterested players. Not sure what is going on but how we can turn it on against the Bulldogs and then serve up that tripe yesterday is mind boggling. Made the Lions look top 4.

Anyone notice it has been 3 years in a row that we have limped to the bye. It is a recurring issue and we need to look at our fitness regime because it's not working.

I would love to be able to judge Lyon with a professional medical and sports science team around him because I don't think he has them.
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Not sure I agree with all of that. Our medical staff has been unchanged pretty much since the Harvey days, so why its a case of Lyon can't be judged now when it wasn't an issue before. Medical staff aren't responsible for lethargy or disinterest, the players are and the coach / match committee who train and select them. Attitude is a bigger issue than medical staff when it comes to disinterest.

I would agree there are issues outside the coach hence my earlier comment. I do not think that we are well managed off the field and I'd be looking at the performance of Chris Bond who is responsible for managing all of these areas - medical, fitness, coaching. The big review last season was Bond reviewing his own performance and the result was a high performance rowing coach who lost his job running the Canadian team because of historically poor Olympic results. Hey maybe he's a genius but I'm not seeing it on the field.

The medicos don't pick Sutcliffe, Spurr, Griffin etc each week and they are not responsible for the game plan or our lack of on field structure. I'm getting tired of seeing our blokes looking up and then kicking 40 meters back because there is nobody forward as a target. The medicos dont get our mid to bomb it forward to a 3 on 1 contest in our forward 50 and then watch come straight back out. The medicos dont instruct players to zone off and then watch it get picked apart every 5 minutes by opponents running into space at the last second while our defenders hold off and watch.

If our medicos are responsible for all this, what do the coaches do?
 

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Kenyan said:
Ross is a bloody good coach. If teams are 5% off with intensity then any one can be beaten.
The list is developing so inconsistency is expected.
Brisbanes midfield is elite Zorko, Beams,Rockliff feeding off Martin.
Nathan Fyfe has been out of the game for 12 months and as could be expected,has not been as influential/explosive as previous seasons but still serviceable. His marking is off and he probably down a bit on confidence but he is an A grader and will return to the elite category.
Sandilands influence on the team/midfield function is obvious - in his absence during the last 2 weeks, the midfield has been smashed. Adelaide midfield is their archilles heel particularly if Sloane is tagged but they still managed to smash Feo midfield.
McCarthy and Kersten are developing and are not going to get supply when the midfield is down. Liked the look of Ryan and Cox - Collins ok but may lack a yard of pace.
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Yes Ross is a good coach.

Brisbane's midfield is not elite. We made them look good. When you can go coast to coast with out even an opposition hand being laid on you, as the Lions did on more than one occasion, I think it is safe to say we were more than 5% off in intensity. I think the players thought they just needed to show up to win, but then again we have had 12 poor quarters in a row. Usually we would at least have one break-out qtr a game but this has been lacking the last 3 weeks. I can only assume the players are stuffed and/or injured.

Fyfe has an excuse but we can't rely on one player. We have had a number 32 playing out there the last couple of weeks but he does not resemble Stephen Hill. Was AA prior to hamstring injury. I saw Mundy at the shops just now playing with his kid and he showed more enthusiasm than yesterday.

We need to learn to play without Sandilands. Other teams manage to win without such an advantage in the ruck.

Not sure who put the curse on our forward line but it seems whoever we put in there turns into a spud over night and loses basic footy ability. And I'm taking into account the lack of or poor delivery into it.

Not excited about Cox. I would have hoped to have seen a bit more mongrel from him but he plays meekly and is more worried about getting in the way. Wish he would have taken the shot from the pocket in the 2nd qtr rather than handball to McCarthy who ended up having a brain fade. But yes we need to persist with him.
 
imperial_oz said:
Not sure I agree with all of that. Our medical staff has been unchanged pretty much since the Harvey days, so why its a case of Lyon can't be judged now when it wasn't an issue before. Medical staff aren't responsible for lethargy or disinterest, the players are and the coach / match committee who train and select them. Attitude is a bigger issue than medical staff when it comes to disinterest.

I would agree there are issues outside the coach hence my earlier comment. I do not think that we are well managed off the field and I'd be looking at the performance of Chris Bond who is responsible for managing all of these areas - medical, fitness, coaching. The big review last season was Bond reviewing his own performance and the result was a high performance rowing coach who lost his job running the Canadian team because of historically poor Olympic results. Hey maybe he's a genius but I'm not seeing it on the field.

The medicos don't pick Sutcliffe, Spurr, Griffin etc each week and they are not responsible for the game plan or our lack of on field structure. I'm getting tired of seeing our blokes looking up and then kicking 40 meters back because there is nobody forward as a target. The medicos dont get our mid to bomb it forward to a 3 on 1 contest in our forward 50 and then watch come straight back out. The medicos dont instruct players to zone off and then watch it get picked apart every 5 minutes by opponents running into space at the last second while our defenders hold off and watch.

If our medicos are responsible for all this, what do the coaches do?
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Have you forgotten about the injuries in 2010/2011? Some were saying that it was unfair to sack Harvey because he didn't have a healthy list at his disposal for those last few years.

When you watch the bottom placed team chip it around the ground, then forward into their 50 for a mark or goal, and with every possession a Dockers player is caught 5 metres behind their marking player, then it tells me the guys are burnt. Even a defensive Ross Lyon coached team would have his players up their bums when the ball crossed the half way line and definitely into our 50.
 
wild side said:
My opinion is that he shouldn't dismiss ideas so high & mightily. He has had conservative selection policy for a fair while now!
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He is the head coach, he is put there for his opinion of how things should be run not to listen to someone else that has no idea of what happens inside the club and give their opinions at the end of a loss but are never seen after a win!

If you think the 10 or so assistant coaches Ross has behind him are there just to hold the white board at the breaks then you need to get a clue. He put them there to give their opinions and share their knowledge, so why the **** should he listen to the outside world, because they know better?
 
Nightrain said:
Have you forgotten about the injuries in 2010/2011? Some were saying that it was unfair to sack Harvey because he didn't have a healthy list at his disposal for those last few years.

When you watch the bottom placed team chip it around the ground, then forward into their 50 for a mark or goal, and with every possession a Dockers player is caught 5 metres behind their marking player, then it tells me the guys are burnt. Even a defensive Ross Lyon coached team would have his players up their bums when the ball crossed the half way line and definitely into our 50.
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No I haven't forgotten about the injuries we had back then and I haven't forgotten that Harvey was held responsible for playing unfit player coming back from injury.

You seem to have forgotten that bit. So who do we blame this time for playing guys you are now saying are unfit? If they are, why are they getting selected?

I do not think that we are playing so shit because our medicos and fitness staff are no good. Other teams have been chipping around our zones for years now. Geelong did it in round 1 this year so unless you';re saying the JLT games wore our playing group down before round 1 then I'd suggest you don't have much of an argument that fitness is our issue.

Disinterest is not fitness, its attitude. we looked disinterested and played that way which is more likely to be caused by something other than our fitness. If it was some the kids falling away, you might have a point but it was just as obvious with our older hands. Everybody in that game was well beaten by the lowest ranked team in the league.

Sooner or later you just going to have to admit that Lyon has responsibility for the game plan, coaching and team selections and that those are the areas we know are failing.
 
Ross could have taken the soft option and played Dawson, Ibbo, Suban ,Pearce and probably would have beaten Brissie. He didn't and stuck with Ryan, Collins, Grey and Cox. Hopefully the club is looking long term and will bring in more youth over the coming weeks. Its hard to take at the minute but as Keating said its a recession we have to have.
 
Maybe look beyond Ross, although the sooner he goes the better and with a big fat cheque in his wallet, look at the board shall we an ex bricky a couple of accountants two career public servants and some other guy who for the life of me I have no idea why he is there, got rich selling his mediocre Telco. Freo never learnt the lessons of Rick Hart, yes if I wanted a cheap arse toaster he's the man, well if I want a house I may look at Alcock but probably not I'd prefer something well built. When will we get board chairs who actually have a clue about managing a football club and not some government failures or project builders who live off directorships. Hard to buy passion and for a fee they can be as passionate as you want, signing Lyon on for an extended contract was a fail and proof of their lack of commercial knowledge and skills and will cost the club dearly
 
WalterBB said:
Maybe look beyond Ross, although the sooner he goes the better and with a big fat cheque in his wallet, look at the board shall we an ex bricky a couple of accountants two career public servants and some other guy who for the life of me I have no idea why he is there, got rich selling his mediocre Telco. Freo never learnt the lessons of Rick Hart, yes if I wanted a cheap arse toaster he's the man, well if I want a house I may look at Alcock but probably not I'd prefer something well built. When will we get board chairs who actually have a clue about managing a football club and not some government failures or project builders who live off directorships. Hard to buy passion and for a fee they can be as passionate as you want, signing Lyon on for an extended contract was a fail and proof of their lack of commercial knowledge and skills and will cost the club dearly
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Hey Walter which club do you follow.;)
 
Kram said:
I think culturally Australians traditionally love to blindly pin it mostly all on the coach compared to Yank sports fans who seem to be more forgiving. Which is funny because the coaches is basketball and especially gridiron have a lot more influence on a team on gameday.
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The yanks are also fine with the concept of you having a good year if you finish in the top half of a ladder - whereas here, it's grand final winner or the year was a complete and utter waste and the coach should be sacked.
 
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FreoMonocle said:
The yanks are also fine with the concept of you having a good year if you finish in the top half of a ladder - whereas here, it's grand final winner or the year was a complete and utter waste and the coach should be sacked.
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Thats not entirely a fair summary. There is only one prize here.

Premiership.

People don't plan just to play finals as an end result. You plan to play finals as a build up to a shot at a flag. Anything less is silly.

So when it comes to choosing a coach, the only question is "Will he get us to a flag" If the answer is maybe then stay the course ands re-evaluate. If the answer ever becomes no or not likely, then it is clearly time to move on. There is no point in hanging on to somebody who won't get you there. No point at all
 

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List Mgmt. Ross Lyon - Sacked

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