Toast Ross Lyon

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tek87 said:
fixing connolly mistakes? to date chris connolly has had the best record for the dockers. I think the injury to justin longmuir longterm really hurt his team. hoping ross lyon can improve on his record
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Depends how you measure best record.

Winning percentages at Freo:

Lyon - 65.2%
Connolly - 51.9%
 
yakka man said:
If a professional AFL player has no problems pigging out on junk food all the time then they wouldn't care about consuming alcohol. That is common sense Clay. Don't be naive. Any coach worth his salt could stop AFL players from excessive drinking.
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No evidence, just bullshit. Cheers.

You infer Walters turning up with high skinfolds after offseason as evidence of midweek drinking? Do you realise how stupid you sound?

yakka man said:
The fact that this is the main positive you can think of when it comes to Harvey's reign is bad enough.
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There were plenty of positives. We would not have made finals in 2010 had we not at least had a somewhat capable coach. Other positives:

Sandilands going from ordinary ruckman to best in the league.
Mundy going from soft half back flanker to top line clearance midfielder
Crowley becoming a top tagger.
Tarrant becoming a quality defender, which gave us something in return for the trade back (we were quite likely looking at nothing).

I'm sure you will attribute all of this to someone else, though.

yakka man said:
And to add to this do you have any factual proof that Harvey stopped the drinking binges? Do you know for sure that is wasn't the club administration? Or the players? Or Chris Scott? Or even that it did in fact stop.
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It was posted earlier:

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/dockers-drop-six/story-e6frf9if-1111114307498

None of the current admin, Chris Scott, or anyone else you attribute with the cultural change was at the club when this happened. It happened in the 2007 season. All the appointees you cite weren't at he club until after the 2007 season. Understand?

Question: how long have you supported the club? Since 2010? It certainly looks that way.

yakka man said:
Johnson was caught with Coke while Harvey was at the club or have you forgotten about that?
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Lulz. You forgetting what happened at St Kilda?


Ross Lyon was there when the following happened:

Andrew Lovett was accused of rape
The St Kilda school girl
The pictures of Riewoldt, Dawson and Dal Santo leaked.
Drafted Brett Peake who was kicked out of Freo because of his problems with alcohol

This all happened in the last two years of his reign, btw. By contrast, Harvey's squad was squeaky clean over the past two years, aside from Johnson.

You really want to compares off field culture? Harvey's record compares beautifully.

yakka man said:
I'm not making up lies. One of the first things Ross did when arriving was make most of the playing lose weight which is strong evidence that Mark Harvey had the playing list in pathetic shape from poor nutrition. And drinking alcohol falls under that category. This is unforgivable and it is why I am glad that he has gone. Because the club finally has standards.
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You're all over the place here. It's quite bizarre. How does drinking alcohol come under that category?

There's no evidence it was poor nutrition or bad discipline. It is just as likely Harvey wanted strong, solid players who could hold their own in contests, whereas Lyon prefers players that can run the full length of the ground all game in order to hold structure.

Essendon are suffering the same problem this year with players 'bulking up' and suffering injuries.

Bombers bulk up

“Everyone will get to see us this Sunday against Fremantle and West Coast in Perth so I think people will notice some guy’s body shapes have changed a bit.”

Monfries said third year players Travis Colyer and Jake Melksham have gained a lot - especially on a physical level - from the gruelling pre-season campaign.

“Jake and Trav are the two that have put on some decent size this summer,” Monfries told SEN radio.

“I think he (Melksham) has put on nearly five or six kilos over the summer, so I think people will notice he has a very different body shape when they see him on Sunday.”
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Or is this all 'bad culture'?
 

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Tarrant in an interview thanked Scott for helping turn him into a very good defender.
No mention of thanking harvs.

Sounds like Harvey might of been over training the players.
Lyon seems to have cut back on the training mid week and for away games, doesnt bother with flying over then training there.

I wont forget Harveys influence here, he did alot of good things and a few dumb things.

Had doubts even with a fully fit list he could ever get us to the top of the mountain.
Relied far too much on individuals, and made to many excuses.

Lyon on the other hand doesnt care about the individual and anyone is replaceable as all thats needed is someone who can come in and play that role.
Injuries will always happen and the best coaches dont rely on individuals, they rely on team roles.
 
Sman-21 said:
Tarrant in an interview thanked Scott for helping turn him into a very good defender.
No mention of thanking harvs.
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He has thanked Harvey as well, and also said that he himself came up with the idea.

It was also interesting to hear Tarrant’s recollection about his defensive remodelling during a four-season stint at Fremantle under then coach Mark Harvey.

There had been some suggestion that the move had initially been a form of punishment as Dockers officials suspected he was already considering a move back home to Melbourne with wife, Lauren. Not so, said the man himself.

‘‘I actually came up with the idea,’’ Tarrant said.

‘‘I approached Mark Harvey during the season. I was in a bit of a form slump and I approached him and said, ‘Why don’t we try myself down back?’’ Then I ended up coming back in as a forward and finished off the season quite well and stayed forward.

‘‘Then during the pre-season, we worked out a plan. There was a spot there opening up, they needed a centre-half-back and it worked out quite well.
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http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/breaking/14652218/what-the-butler-heard-round-22/
 
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh who cares............why can't everyone just let this all go.

Who gives a flying rats arse about who did what last season, or 2 seasons or 10 seasons ago. Whinging about it now won't change it and it sure is easy to be critical of all the moves past coaches have made. The club has changed now and the on-field performances are starting to reflect that. Leave all this crap where it belongs..............in the past.

Now back on topic -

I'm really liking what I'm seeing from the players and I'm excited for this finals campaign. Ross has really lifted the expectations of the players it's showing no matter where we play. Great work Ross i can't wait to see the improvement the squad gets out of a second preseason being fit and available.
 
freo84 said:
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh who cares............why can't everyone just let this all go.

Who gives a flying rats arse about who did what last season, or 2 seasons or 10 seasons ago. Whinging about it now won't change it and it sure is easy to be critical of all the moves past coaches have made. The club has changed now and the on-field performances are starting to reflect that. Leave all this crap where it belongs..............in the past.
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I agree. No one misses Harvey a bit, aside from the last remaining nutters at Dockerland. We have a much better coach now.

I'm just not sure why yakka man has to make up lies about a coach who was a reasonably good one for most of his time here and helped reform the club but was just superceded by one of the best in the business.

Harvey's game preparation were poor, his injury management was poor and his positioning of players was poor. But he turned around the playing group from being an undisciplined basketcase, that had problems with drinking, fighting, suspensions and training attendance.
 
Creg David said:
No evidence, just bullshit. Cheers.

You infer Walters turning up with high skinfolds after offseason as evidence of midweek drinking? Do you realise how stupid you sound?
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It's actually common sense and I made mention of others not just Walters. Quite simply if a player has really high skinfolds then he has a very unhealthy diet. The consumption of alcohol would very likely be part of that. Even if it wasn't piss poor nutrition is almost as bad as excess drinking.

Creg David said:
It was posted earlier:

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/dockers-drop-six/story-e6frf9if-1111114307498

None of the current admin, Chris Scott, or anyone else you attribute with the cultural change was at the club when this happened. It happened in the 2007 season. All the appointees you cite weren't at he club until after the 2007 season. Understand?

Question: how long have you supported the club? Since 2010? It certainly looks that way.
Click to expand...

That isn't proof. You have no idea who actually made the decision. It could have been the administration or a stand by the playing group. Anyway that is a seriously low expectation of a senior coach. Because you asked, I have supported the club my whole life and am 23 years old. I was a member in 2007 you ****.

The entire club, not just Harvey were keen to completely rebuild the club. When it comes to a complete rebuild the coach definitely does not make the whole decision. All of the upper management have to agree. Your claim that Mark Harvey fixed the discipline issues at Freo is laughable. Because there were many that still remained.

IMO the club only started to make proper inroads in 2009 at which point both the Steve's were at the club. And I am starting to feel that they deserve a lot of credit.

Creg David said:
You're all over the place here. It's quite bizarre. How does drinking alcohol come under that category?

There's no evidence it was poor nutrition or bad discipline. It is just as likely Harvey wanted strong, solid players who could hold their own in contests, whereas Lyon prefers players that can run the full length of the ground all game in order to hold structure.
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That right there axiomatic proof that you have no idea about proper nutrition. Bulking up is an essentia part of player development. But the idea is to add muscle weight while keeping skinfolds low. Do you understand now? Walters, Pearce and Johnson weren't given a directive to bulk up, it was simply poor discipline. No player is told to go and add weight in fat. That is one of the dumbest things I have read on BigFooty.

Thas has actually made me laugh Clay. Harvey couldn't get the basics right ans because of that he deserves criticism not praise. Citing him as the sole reason for where the club is at today is ridiculous.
 
Creg David said:
I agree. No one misses Harvey a bit, aside from the last remaining nutters at Dockerland. We have a much better coach now.

I'm just not sure why yakka man has to make up lies about a coach who was a reasonably good one for most of his time here and helped reform the club but was just superceded by one of the best in the business.

Harvey's game preparation were poor, his injury management was poor and his positioning of players was poor. But he turned around the playing group from being an undisciplined basketcase, that had problems with drinking, fighting, suspensions and training attendance.
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No he didn't. The playing group was almost completely delisted and rebuilt. That is complete nonsense.

Again as I said before good things started to happen while Harvey was at the club but there are others still at the club who also deserve a lot of credit for that. The faults you have listed for Harvey above are pretty awful. When you couple that with the poor fitness base of the playing group it makes you wonder why you are praising him so much.:confused:
 
Toast - Ross Lyon.

Not, speculate on the precise point in time our culture changed and whether it was under a previous coach/Assistant Coach/Board/boot studder or whether our culture changed in the span of minutes somehow in September last year.

Lyon has done an exceptional job with the team this year and we're not done yet.
 
Nickos66 said:
Toast - Ross Lyon.

Not, speculate on the precise point in time our culture changed and whether it was under a previous coach/Assistant Coach/Board/boot studder or whether our culture changed in the span of minutes somehow in September last year.

Lyon has done an exceptional job with the team this year and we're not done yet.
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Nickos mate, are you trying to suggest this thread has been slightly de-railed? :eek:
 

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Nickos66 said:
With a Subject line of Toast - Ross Lyon, this train never started on the rail. :p
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It's a disturbing trend with any thread where his name is in the title. :rolleyes:

On the subject of bulking up. I seem to recall a discussion on this forum that it was a directive by Harvey for players like Crowley because of the game plan Harvey wanted. Lyons is a different game plan that involves lots more getting around the field and hence the need to drop weight to do it.

Eg it was intentional for some not a culture thing. Walters was purely his own doing and admits to getting the wakeup call he needed when he was sent to the WAFL. Not culture related.

I don't remember reading about alcohol related indiscretions by Freo players in the paper for a few years now whereas prior to Harvey it seemed to be at least two or three times a year. I do think he changed that for the better.

Harvey did a lot of good things and moved the club well along the path from the old culture and positioned the club well for a shot...thanks for that. Sure he wasn't perfect but I guarantee none of us could do better.

Ross is a major piece of the puzzle that was missing that is required to go all the way.
 
I think Ross has been a breath of fresh air to this footy club, you guys can talk about player development, drinking cultures and skinfolds all you want but who here can say they're not impressed by the performance of Ross Lyon?

Ross doesn't make excuses. He doesn't dwell on our previous poor travel record. Ross demands total excellence as we are a 'no excuses' footy club. Do you think Harvey would have dropped Ibbotson, Duffield or Suban earlier in the year? Would we still see Zac Clarke running around the wing? Ryan Crowley would have been delisted - now many have lauded him as the best tagger in the competition after dropping a heap of weight and re-discovering the fire. Clancee Pearce the same - what about Michael Walters? Kid was out of shape - would Mark Harvey have had the same effect?

Honestly all the moo's on the board who keep banging on about Steves this, Harvey that need to take a dose of concrete. Like others I was surprised when Harvey was given the @rse but excited to see Lyon get appointed as I believed it was the right direction for the club to take with the playing group - refreshingly, I don't have to cringe anymore when watching post-match press conferences and listen to complaints about the wind, injuries, travelling, etc - professional outfits should have no excuses.

Obviously we have won away from Perth a number of times previously and some will point to this to argue a point that 'any team, any time, anywhere' is not a new thing - any team, any time, anywhere is a belief borne from the high standards that have been set for the playing group, the investment of the playing group in the gameplan, and their committment to each other.
 
chibbingus said:
I think Ross has been a breath of fresh air to this footy club, you guys can talk about player development, drinking cultures and skinfolds all you want but who here can say they're not impressed by the performance of Ross Lyon?

Ross doesn't make excuses. He doesn't dwell on our previous poor travel record. Ross demands total excellence as we are a 'no excuses' footy club. Do you think Harvey would have dropped Ibbotson, Duffield or Suban earlier in the year? Would we still see Zac Clarke running around the wing? Ryan Crowley would have been delisted - now many have lauded him as the best tagger in the competition after dropping a heap of weight and re-discovering the fire. Clancee Pearce the same - what about Michael Walters? Kid was out of shape - would Mark Harvey have had the same effect?

Honestly all the moo's on the board who keep banging on about Steves this, Harvey that need to take a dose of concrete. Like others I was surprised when Harvey was given the @rse but excited to see Lyon get appointed as I believed it was the right direction for the club to take with the playing group - refreshingly, I don't have to cringe anymore when watching post-match press conferences and listen to complaints about the wind, injuries, travelling, etc - professional outfits should have no excuses.

Obviously we have won away from Perth a number of times previously and some will point to this to argue a point that 'any team, any time, anywhere' is not a new thing - any team, any time, anywhere is a belief borne from the high standards that have been set for the playing group, the investment of the playing group in the gameplan, and their committment to each other.
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The people on this board banging on about Harvey now include you.

I too am very optimistic about what RTB brings to the club, the rest is history but some people can't seem to leave it there.
 
Creg David said:
No evidence, just bullshit. Cheers.

You infer Walters turning up with high skinfolds after offseason as evidence of midweek drinking? Do you realise how stupid you sound?


There were plenty of positives. We would not have made finals in 2010 had we not at least had a somewhat capable coach. Other positives:

Sandilands going from ordinary ruckman to best in the league.
Mundy going from soft half back flanker to top line clearance midfielder
Crowley becoming a top tagger.
Tarrant becoming a quality defender, which gave us something in return for the trade back (we were quite likely looking at nothing).

I'm sure you will attribute all of this to someone else, though.


It was posted earlier:

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/dockers-drop-six/story-e6frf9if-1111114307498

None of the current admin, Chris Scott, or anyone else you attribute with the cultural change was at the club when this happened. It happened in the 2007 season. All the appointees you cite weren't at he club until after the 2007 season. Understand?

Question: how long have you supported the club? Since 2010? It certainly looks that way.


Lulz. You forgetting what happened at St Kilda?


Ross Lyon was there when the following happened:

Andrew Lovett was accused of rape
The St Kilda school girl
The pictures of Riewoldt, Dawson and Dal Santo leaked.
Drafted Brett Peake who was kicked out of Freo because of his problems with alcohol

This all happened in the last two years of his reign, btw. By contrast, Harvey's squad was squeaky clean over the past two years, aside from Johnson.

You really want to compares off field culture? Harvey's record compares beautifully.


You're all over the place here. It's quite bizarre. How does drinking alcohol come under that category?

There's no evidence it was poor nutrition or bad discipline. It is just as likely Harvey wanted strong, solid players who could hold their own in contests, whereas Lyon prefers players that can run the full length of the ground all game in order to hold structure.

Essendon are suffering the same problem this year with players 'bulking up' and suffering injuries.

Bombers bulk up



Or is this all 'bad culture'?
Click to expand...


Solid rebuttal.

Just a pity that Harvey couldn't coach or man manage.
 
Nickos66 said:
I don't read newbs posts.
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My dreams dashed by another professional keyboard warrior!

Reginald Perrin said:
The people on this board banging on about Harvey now include you.


I too am very optimistic about what RTB brings to the club, the rest is history but some people can't seem to leave it there.
Click to expand...

Have to disagree on your first point but agree on the second - time to focus on beating the Crows!
 

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Toast Ross Lyon

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