Preview Round 10, 2023: GWS v St.Kilda - GIANTS Stadium, Sunday 21st May, 4:40PM AEST

[Saintbloke]

I don't agree. Melbourne have an elite midfield. Dogs close but the rest are pretty ordinary.

Not forgetting Brisbane, Adelaide and PA- a bit more than ordinary me thinks.

 

[gringo2011]

Not forgetting Brisbane, Adelaide and PA- a bit more than ordinary me thinks.

Port have Wines and JHF with a few guys running through like Butters. It looks pretty good but hardly elite.

Adelaide have Dawson who is having an incredible season, Rory Laird who I rate like Sinclair and old Rory Sloan who can still play good footy but a step off his past gun status with some rotations.

Brisbane's is very high end with Neale and Dunkley both top shelf and Ashcroft developing with plenty of depth and their outside brigade of McLuggage and Berry excellent.

Still not Bulldogs and Melbourne level though, both of them have elite star on-ballers. Carlton probably the next best as far as quality around the middle.

 

[Drop Kick]

Nearly every decent team forever in existence in any sport have form slumps during seasons ..... a bit of perspective ..... time to relax the fk out and step out of that fragile glass phone booth of emotion you frail brittle campaigners

The problem is the Saints have been in a slump since the day after the 1966 Flag win.

But yeah, chin up, we'll get there, one day.

 

[sunny3193]

Sunny’s Sightseeing Snippets #6

CursingFijian I stopped off in Snowtown yesterday, just for you.
If ever there was a town ideal for dumping bodies in barrels in banks, this is it.
Picture a dusty main street, flies buzzing lazily in the hotel entrance, dog lying in the sun outside the pub, no one to be seen except, in the distance, the local sub agency postman on his moped delivering the welfare cheques.

And just for you, because I know you would ask about it, below is a photo of the bank that stored the barrels.

 

[George]

Sunny’s Sightseeing Snippets #6

CursingFijian I stopped off in Snowtown yesterday, just for you.
If ever there was a town ideal for dumping bodies in barrels in banks, this is it.
Picture a dusty main street, flies buzzing lazily in the hotel entrance, dog lying in the sun outside the pub, no one to be seen except, in the distance, the local sub agency postman on his moped delivering the welfare cheques.

And just for you, because I know you would ask about it, below is a photo of the bank that stored the barrels.

View attachment 1689137

Legend has it that there's one left in there

Barrels , with his ball gag and gimp suit on xox

 

[PoppedCorn]

Trout would go back in time to re-pick from the draft and come back with a sandwich and a donkey.

Man i love the shit u come up with
Lol

 

[BrutThough]

That sounds easily done but you have to make it seamless or you go backwards. Selling another down year to the fans will not be easy. It will be 13 years since 2010 which was the last time we were truely competitive, selling another 4 years of rebuild isn't happening so they need to develop them and not lose ground. Last week they had guys like Phillipou and Owens get a run but they're not ready to take control yet.

Thats why I want us to start doing it now so we can feed them in there slowly and they can develop alongside the senior mids before they drop off. With Ross now 30 and Crouch 29, we need to start giving more mid time to the next crop so they have enough experience once those guys are gone.

And I dont think putting 1 of the younger guys in alongside two older mids would be committed to a rebuild and pain. We should be able to develop them in the middle while still having majority senior players in there.

 

[Saint Shags]

I think this is so important to remember.

Even looking at this year, every team still in finals contention has had a bad loss already this season expect Collingwood. And if Adelaide as accurately against Collingwood as they did against us (6.15 at 3/4 when they played Collingwood compared to 15.6 on the weekend), Pies likely would complete the list.

For me it's not just the Adelaide loss. Our last month has not been in any way shape or form great. The win against both the Blues and the Roos have allowed us to sugar-coat a few things.

In all 4 matches our mids have not been good. In fact the only match were they were somewhat competitive in terms of beating their direct opponents was the Roos.

We were lucky that the Blues had no clue what to do as their mids were extremely strong. Port had an 19 year old and a geriatric show our guys how it was done and Adelaide doesn't even need repeating.

I'm hopeful that they are able to turn things around but I just fear that other clubs are getting fitter and their game plans in check whilst we are being over taken. And the area that we have struggled in for a long period still seems to be our biggest issue and that's the midfield group.

 

[George]

Reckon we have had at least 2 off weeks now and maybe 3 with the port game

We should win 3 out of the next 5 hopefully 4 out 5

Lenny looks like a slimmer version of Ratts

Reckon you've had 2 off years now maybe 3 it's been a while

Win 3 of 5 perhaps 4 of 5, why not us Ratts why not us

 

[luca77]

Did Collingwood play bad because our system made them play bad?

Are we good enough to beat them if our system is on and we don't fumble?

Yeah, true, we contributed - but I don't think it was just that. And yeah, I think we are - but they're clearly a much, much better team at this stage. I can't even hate the pies, except for maybe Ginnivan or however you spell his name. They're really good to watch, and their coach is likeable. Crazy times. Buckley was OK too, I guess.

 

[Sarcoidevo]

For me it's not just the Adelaide loss. Our last month has not been in any way shape or form great. The win against both the Blues and the Roos have allowed us to sugar-coat a few things.

In all 4 matches our mids have not been good. In fact the only match were they were somewhat competitive in terms of beating their direct opponents was the Roos.

We were lucky that the Blues had no clue what to do as their mids were extremely strong. Port had an 19 year old and a geriatric show our guys how it was done and Adelaide doesn't even need repeating.

I'm hopeful that they are able to turn things around but I just fear that other clubs are getting fitter and their game plans in check whilst we are being over taken. And the area that we have struggled in for a long period still seems to be our biggest issue and that's the midfield group.

So we are the only team that can't get fitter?

Our injury list in terms of best 22 players has been the longest in the league bar maybe West Coast for the majority of the year

There are numerous factors that need to be considered as to why teams have a drop in form or run of form ...... playing away, fixturing/short breaks between games, injuries, sickness, game day motivation, goal kicking & general skill breakdown (every team has their off days), training loads, weather conditions/hard slog from previous week, umpire competency & incompetency, opposition form & fixturing.

All teams have weaknesses that can be exploited and no good having a great midfield if your forwardline has been decimated or your backline is a bunch of spuds ..... no team is going to win every match they play

Our midfield may not be the best in league and could be improved but it hasn't stopped us from winning 6 games out of 9 and losing 2 games to 2 teams currently in the top 4 by a 1 goal margin.

With a few fresh gun players to return and the bye and our decent 2nd half of the season H&A fixture I am sure we can return to our winning ways again shortly.

 

[Jay Beast]

I have a theory:

Summary:
I reckon Ross has made a grey area out of when to give maximum effort in the last month and it's caused our system to crack.

I reckon if he goes back to demanding players throw everything they've got at every minute of every game (regardless of opponent quality and scoreboard)... we'll be back to playing like we were in the first month.


Long winded bit:
I reckon Ross 2.0 has overcorrected this year in the way that Ross 1.0 (2009 etc) used to demand the players "keep the foot to the floor" no matter the score- whether the game was close or we were up by 10 goals etc.

Ross has spoken about that several times this year- where he has said that his new approach is to not be so demanding of maximum everything, all the time.

It was most obvious a few weeks ago v the blues where he admitted telling them to take the foot off the gas in q4.

I reckon the players spent the first month throwing 100% of themselves into every second of every game- pushing themselves to their endurance limits in order to 'break' the opposition.

Then, with a bunch of wins on the board and the coach actively encouraging them to dial back the intensity at times (eg just doing 'enough' to squeeze past the roos etc)- they have lost their edge.

My hope is that my theory is right- because surely last week will be a massive jolt for the players (and Ross 2.0) that 'the system' only works when everyone is committed to going 100% no matter the scoreboard or the quality of opposition.

If we know anything about Ross it's that what he says publicly and privately are completely different.
Would be stunned if players weren't on notice.

 

[dudeintheswamp]

Well geez, just heard about Jones, 6-8 weeks

 

[Sarcoidevo]

Well geez, just heard about Jones, 6-8 weeks

He has been 9 weeks already .... what's another 6 to 8 .... time to put a fork in him

 

[gringo2011]

So we are the only team that can't get fitter?

Our injury list in terms of best 22 players has been the longest in the league bar maybe West Coast for the majority of the year

There are numerous factors that need to be considered as to why teams have a drop in form or run of form ...... playing away, fixturing/short breaks between games, injuries, sickness, game day motivation, goal kicking & general skill breakdown (every team has their off days), training loads, weather conditions/hard slog from previous week, umpire competency & incompetency, opposition form & fixturing.

All teams have weaknesses that can be exploited and no good having a great midfield if your forwardline has been decimated or your backline is a bunch of spuds ..... no team is going to win every match they play

Our midfield may not be the best in league and could be improved but it hasn't stopped us from winning 6 games out of 9 and losing 2 games to 2 teams currently in the top 4 by a 1 goal margin.

With a few fresh gun players to return and the bye and our decent 2nd half of the season H&A fixture I am sure we can return to our winning ways again shortly.

The midfield broke even in clearance and contest but their defensive set up was too slow to get back. We lost our zone, part of which was the ball moving too fast to get us set up behind the ball.

I reckon we learnt how they'll play us next time and have a blueprint to work off.

 

[George]

Jones the new Hannebery

 

[Saint Shags]

So we are the only team that can't get fitter?

Our injury list in terms of best 22 players has been the longest in the league bar maybe West Coast for the majority of the year

There are numerous factors that need to be considered as to why teams have a drop in form or run of form ...... playing away, fixturing/short breaks between games, injuries, sickness, game day motivation, goal kicking & general skill breakdown (every team has their off days), training loads, weather conditions/hard slog from previous week, umpire competency & incompetency, opposition form & fixturing.

All teams have weaknesses that can be exploited and no good having a great midfield if your forwardline has been decimated or your backline is a bunch of spuds ..... no team is going to win every match they play

Our midfield may not be the best in league and could be improved but it hasn't stopped us from winning 6 games out of 9 and losing 2 games to 2 teams currently in the top 4 by a 1 goal margin.

With a few fresh gun players to return and the bye and our decent 2nd half of the season H&A fixture I am sure we can return to our winning ways again shortly.

Why is it seen as an attack when you point out areas of concern?

Let's go through a couple of points.
Last year we started the year pretty darn well. In fact we ran and ran and ran and it seemed that our players especially early on were fitter than everyone else. By the half way mark we were 8-3 and well on the way to finals.

Fast forward to this year. Again started really well. Our team seemed to be able to outlast and outrun our opponents. See in particular Essendon and WB where they came back and we were able to put the foot down and run away with the wins. If all goes to plan we should be 8-3 again but with a better fixture in the second half of the year. And I'd nearly suggest that if we were to miss finals from 8-3 this year considering our fixture it would be worse if that's even possible!


But and this is key here, there have been signs in the past 4 weeks that our run isn't as strong as it may have seemed. Do I hope that to continue? **** no. But there are concerns.

Our two losses to Port and the Pies whilst looking good from the outside if you dig deeper in terms of injuries to their best 22 and ours when we faced them. One would argue that both of those teams had their own injury concerns (pies more so when you look at how many best 22 were out when they faced us.)

On injuries how many of our best 22 do you see as being out due to injury in the last 4 rounds. I'd wager that it isn't as much as we would think. And I'm talking absolute walk-ins. There aren't that many at present. King, Gresham?
Coff hasn't played in nearly 2 years.
Hayes had only played 3 games?
Jones hasn't played for what 9-10 months?
DMac since Round 13 last year?
Billings is stuck in the VFL.

Not saying that injuries haven't played a role but for the last month perhaps a tad overplayed?

Opposition teams have been able to get to work on our game plan. Stop the quick switch and either force us long or into the middle. That's not to say there isn't a Plan B but at the moment we haven't necessarily seen it. Plenty of time to go though.

Our mids are too similar. Crouch, Ross and even Steele throw the ball on the boot blindly. And it seems instead of the old throw Carlisle forward its let's put Sinclair in the middle. But he is best coming off that Half back line. We end up robbing Peter to pay Paul.
If you put our mids up against the rest of the Top 8 I'd suggest we probably have more deficiencies than most. That's not attacking the club. That's just pointing out the obvious.

Do I hope that things change and we get back into gear? Hell yes. I like winning.
But I'm allowed to be a bit concerned with current form. Especially since we've just been touched up by Adelaide and we now travel to Sydney to take on the Giants who will be no easy beat.

 

[PostmanBish]

GWS by 11 billion ... King to kick 14.5 in 3 quarters before being subbed to rest up for the Hawks.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Feel like I’ve seen this story many times before. Just don’t have the resilience anymore. Better play Windy at least.

 

[moirae42]

Its all good fam.

We just flogged GWS on AFL23 by 27 goals.

Its in the bag. Caminiti kicked 12.

 

[Max the great]

Port have Wines and JHF with a few guys running through like Butters. It looks pretty good but hardly elite.

Adelaide have Dawson who is having an incredible season, Rory Laird who I rate like Sinclair and old Rory Sloan who can still play good footy but a step off his past gun status with some rotations.

Brisbane's is very high end with Neale and Dunkley both top shelf and Ashcroft developing with plenty of depth and their outside brigade of McLuggage and Berry excellent.

Still not Bulldogs and Melbourne level though, both of them have elite star on-ballers. Carlton probably the next best as far as quality around the middle.

Mcluggage is the most overrated player in the comp. As soft as they come and probably the dumbest footballer I've seen in a long long time.

Sent from my SM-S908E using Tapatalk

 

[Max the great]

Well geez, just heard about Jones, 6-8 weeks

No way should he be playing anyway. He's not good enough.

Sent from my SM-S908E using Tapatalk

 

[Sarcoidevo]

Why is it seen as an attack when you point out areas of concern?

Let's go through a couple of points.
Last year we started the year pretty darn well. In fact we ran and ran and ran and it seemed that our players especially early on were fitter than everyone else. By the half way mark we were 8-3 and well on the way to finals.

Fast forward to this year. Again started really well. Our team seemed to be able to outlast and outrun our opponents. See in particular Essendon and WB where they came back and we were able to put the foot down and run away with the wins. If all goes to plan we should be 8-3 again but with a better fixture in the second half of the year. And I'd nearly suggest that if we were to miss finals from 8-3 this year considering our fixture it would be worse if that's even possible!


But and this is key here, there have been signs in the past 4 weeks that our run isn't as strong as it may have seemed. Do I hope that to continue? * no. But there are concerns.

Our two losses to Port and the Pies whilst looking good from the outside if you dig deeper in terms of injuries to their best 22 and ours when we faced them. One would argue that both of those teams had their own injury concerns (pies more so when you look at how many best 22 were out when they faced us.)

On injuries how many of our best 22 do you see as being out due to injury in the last 4 rounds. I'd wager that it isn't as much as we would think. And I'm talking absolute walk-ins. There aren't that many at present. King, Gresham?
Coff hasn't played in nearly 2 years.
Hayes had only played 3 games?
Jones hasn't played for what 9-10 months?
DMac since Round 13 last year?
Billings is stuck in the VFL.

Not saying that injuries haven't played a role but for the last month perhaps a tad overplayed?

Opposition teams have been able to get to work on our game plan. Stop the quick switch and either force us long or into the middle. That's not to say there isn't a Plan B but at the moment we haven't necessarily seen it. Plenty of time to go though.

Our mids are too similar. Crouch, Ross and even Steele throw the ball on the boot blindly. And it seems instead of the old throw Carlisle forward its let's put Sinclair in the middle. But he is best coming off that Half back line. We end up robbing Peter to pay Paul.
If you put our mids up against the rest of the Top 8 I'd suggest we probably have more deficiencies than most. That's not attacking the club. That's just pointing out the obvious.

Do I hope that things change and we get back into gear? Hell yes. I like winning.
But I'm allowed to be a bit concerned with current form. Especially since we've just been touched up by Adelaide and we now travel to Sydney to take on the Giants who will be no easy beat.

A little perspective re: the 8-3 start last year

We were rarely putting together 4 quarters of decent football (maybe 1 against the Hawks) - many also mentioned that there was no coherent gameplan and as we now know Ratten got found out as the season progressed - we were also playing with close to a full quota of players during those first 11 rounds unlike this year where we have been missing King, DMac and also Membrey, Webster and Steele for big chunks and not forgetting Paddy Ryder.

So yeah we won games but not due to a solid game plan but moreso brilliant 15 minute bursts of effort and some individual brilliance.

This year though we have won games using a clear highly structured gameplan with loads of best 22 players missing and a some young forward kp talent with barely 20-30 games of experience and apparently a misfiring mid set up

It's been mentioned elsewhere but we have lost to 2 current top 4 teams by 1 goal and a full strength Adelaide team at a ground where we have a 3 - 13 record

I agree that the last few games haven't been pretty but given the coaching group we have and with players to come back I doubt we are going to fall off the cliff like last year ..... some supporters need to stop being so reactive and have a bit of faith that we can work through this minor form slump and learn from our losses

I have faith that we can get back to our winning ways

 

[saintsrfreak]

Its all good fam.

We just flogged GWS on AFL23 by 27 goals.

Its in the bag. Caminiti kicked 12.

Does he have a face scan though?

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

Yeah, true, we contributed - but I don't think it was just that. And yeah, I think we are - but they're clearly a much, much better team at this stage. I can't even hate the pies, except for maybe Ginnivan or however you spell his name. They're really good to watch, and their coach is likeable. Crazy times. Buckley was OK too, I guess.

It’s funny I thought they were the main team aside from Adelaide out of our losses so far that actually outplayed us. Port and Adelaide looked like just pressure and skill difference but Collingwood looked like a systematic dismantling and considered effort to destroy our game plan. We tried to play well but fell to pieces as opposed to us playing like shit vs Port and Adelaide