Review Round 19, 2023 vs Collingwood

[Jonts]

The lads were pissed off cause they knew they could win

Youre upset when you know you won't get that opportunity again

 

[Interstater]

One tactical move that McRae noted was the work we put into Noble and Quaynor preventing their overlapping run from half back. Those two don't get the publicity of some of the other Collingwood players and they are drivers of their game style.

Daicos's deliberate was a fair call as was Farrell's. Farrell had a mare in the last quarter.

Funny thing is Quaynor stood out to me as being their most important player.

On another topic, AO is 6m longer and 15m narrower than the MCG.
Material difference?

 

[Harlott]

I’ve only watched a replay of the last qtr after going to the game. Too many players let the circumstances get to them. Farrell, Jones are the obvious ones. Finlayson wanted to get the 45m snap away as soon as he could. Ended up a point. Francis didn’t want to kick his set shot and gave it off to Finlayson who snapped a goal. Unconvincing. Marshall couldn’t impact like we needed him to. We needed Boak and Wines as the experienced ones to deliver and they didn’t. Even though we were probably the better team on the night, I felt like we would have pinched it had we won as they seemed to play with more belief. We need to address this aspect if we intend to be in the running for the flag.

 

[Shaucob_Burjan]

I'm guessing Collingwood supporters think Collingwood at 70% beat Port going at 100%. Don't blame them.

To be honest though, Collingwood get more out of this game than we do because they can treat it as loss and have more flaws to fix up and still got the win.

Us? Oh kick straighter but minus 4 points.

 

[Harlott]

I agree with all of this but I think whoever plays Collingwood in the GF will go through the same pain of playing Richmond at the G - they'll be 80 thousand Collingwood supporters to push the team along. Whoever plays them will have to be mentally prepared. And before anyone comes at me saying that Collingwood had to deal with that on Saturday at AO..they didn't. There were so many could and proud Collingwood supporters there and they were loud.

I’m not sure how ticketing works but I doubt Collingwood would be allocated that many tickets.

 

[Interstater]

I'm guessing Collingwood supporters think Collingwood at 70% beat Port going at 100%. Don't blame them.

To be honest though, Collingwood get more out of this game than we do because they can treat it as loss and have more flaws to fix up and still got the win.

Us? Oh kick straighter but minus 4 points.

I'm going to assume that a lot of our younger players got some good learnings from that game which will hold them in good stead come September.

 

[Janus]

I agree with all of this but I think whoever plays Collingwood in the GF will go through the same pain of playing Richmond at the G - they'll be 80 thousand Collingwood supporters to push the team along. Whoever plays them will have to be mentally prepared. And before anyone comes at me saying that Collingwood had to deal with that on Saturday at AO..they didn't. There were so many could and proud Collingwood supporters there and they were loud.

Brisbane dealt with that in 2002 AND 2003.

Just remember, for all the advantages of having a parochial home crowd, there are just as many disadvantages if things don't go their way.

 

[Janus]

One tactical move that McRae noted was the work we put into Noble and Quaynor preventing their overlapping run from half back. Those two don't get the publicity of some of the other Collingwood players and they are drivers of their game style.

Daicos's deliberate was a fair call as was Farrell's. Farrell had a mare in the last quarter.

This is why the loss of Byrne-Jones in the front half cannot be underestimated. Darcy is a natural defender and as such would have put the screws on those players far more than Evans or McEntee.

 

[Cheesey Mac]

I'm still pretty livid about Saturday night (though I might be conflating the loss with my car being sideswiped 90 minutes later). We were the better side for the majority of the game but didn't have the killer instinct to put a team away when we had the better of it. We played well, stood up time and again when in the past we'd have wilted, and we should have won, but didn't, and because it was our own fault (again) I'm still annoyed.

Bad kicking is bad football, and if you don't take your chances and leave the door open for a quality opposition then they'll happily walk right through it. Collingwood are an excellent side, they're absolutely gettable, but they're not the sort of side you can afford to butcher chance after chance against when you're in the ascendency.

Ken isn't being sacked this week, and hE cAn'T kIcK iT fOr ThEm, but if the players have changed over 11 years, and we still haven't learned from one of the frailties that have plagued us and cost us games since coughing up the 2014 PF to Hawthorn then at what point does responsibility for this frailty land at his feet? Get in an expert to help the players learn to kick set shots, get that shonky hypnotist from the Simpsons, whatever, but 11 years of losing big games off our own boot is surely enough to perhaps think that something could be done to improve our conversion.

Umpiring wasn't the reason we lost, there were dodgy calls and non-calls both ways.

Not having a ruckman hurt again, Lycett was ok in patches but really wish we'd have put 20-40 more games into Hayes so we had an actual second option. Could well prove costly in a month or so.

A few of our players had multiple moments they wish they could do over (Marshall, Farrell, Jones among them), but plenty to be learned by the entire group.

We're absolutely good enough to beat Collingwood, Brisbane or Melbourne at the end of the season, but we need to fix our conversion and silly mistakes, anyway, we'll see, though I do feel like I've seen this movie before...

 

[Schulzenfest]

The Farrell one was clear insufficient intent. We lost a preliminary final on an identical action in the exact same spot. He should've known better, it was plain dumb.

Wasn't even 'insufficient intent', he just pushed the ball directly out of bounds. Would've been a clear cut deliberate out of bounds 20 years ago, let alone in the current climate. Stupidity.

 

[Janus]

Personally I think Farrell was kind of ****ed no matter what he did. Wasn't he more than 9 meters away from the goal line regardless? If so, even if he pushed it through for a point it would have been called deliberate.

I actually think he did the best thing he could possibly do and make the shot at goal as difficult as possible.

 

[Interstater]

Wasn't even 'insufficient intent', he just pushed the ball directly out of bounds. Would've been a clear cut deliberate out of bounds 20 years ago, let alone in the current climate. Stupidity.

I wonder how the bump on the knee affected this error.
Forgivable.

 

[Powertron]

Funny thing is Quaynor stood out to me as being their most important player.

On another topic, AO is 6m longer and 15m narrower than the MCG.
Material difference?

Length no but the width is. The pockets are a lot wider than AO which provides more room when exiting D50 so locking the ball in your F50 at the G is much harder than at AO.

 

[Playthekids76]

Are you suggesting Jones and Bergman shouldn't play?

Did I say that?? Please re read.

Both players should be under scrutiny for their disposal. Jones was OK Sat night however the x2 spoil attempts that cost goals were poor. (Especially when you look at the final margin) Defending 101 don't let the ball get over the back and if you are going to impact the contest make sure you win the footy. Both times he didnt.

Miles by foot is sub-par, his kicking eff is 63%. He butchered the footy again Saturday night and needs to be called out. Yes, he's a nice intercept but if you give it straight back by foot most times, I don't care how many times you mark it.

 

[PJ Power]

This is why the loss of Byrne-Jones in the front half cannot be underestimated. Darcy is a natural defender and as such would have put the screws on those players far more than Evans or McEntee.

I also think he would have made the most of some half chances that Evans had when he took possession of the ball in our congested forward line.

I didn’t mind Evans’ game overall and suspect that he could play some good AFL minutes if given another go. I reckon he’s worth perseverance but not sure if he gets in ahead of Narkle this week, given that DBJ has to come back in and Rioli is out.

 

[Duckimus Prime]

The Farrell one was clear insufficient intent. We lost a preliminary final on an identical action in the exact same spot. He should've known better, it was plain dumb.

Hartlett's one was nothing like Farrell's. Hartlett's was a handball that missed Rockliff by a foot.

Farrell needed to more to disguise it, try and push the ball away from goal more instead of straight at the line and escort the ball over the line more.

And the narrative from the commentary was rubbish as well, there's no way Farrell was knocking that ball through for a point and not getting called deliberate.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Personally I think Farrell was kind of ****ed no matter what he did. Wasn't he more than 9 meters away from the goal line regardless? If so, even if he pushed it through for a point it would have been called deliberate.

I actually think he did the best thing he could possibly do and make the shot at goal as difficult as possible.

Push it through the behinds so the umpire at least has to make a decision rather than it being obvious. Or dive on the ball and try not to get pinged HTB. Or sweat off and wait for the Collingwood player to take possession and try to tackle him. Or try to shepherd and wait for reinforcements.

I realise this is easy to say from the stands, but short of just grabbing the ball and handing it to the Collingwood player, he picked about the worst option he could possibly have picked. He gave the ump absolutely no choice but to pay the free.

 

[MrMeaner]

Push it through the behinds so the umpire at least has to make a decision rather than it being obvious. Or dive on the ball and try not to get pinged HTB. Or sweat off and wait for the Collingwood player to take possession and try to tackle him. Or try to shepherd and wait for reinforcements.

I realise this is easy to say from the stands, but short of just grabbing the ball and handing it to the Collingwood player, he picked about the worst option he could possibly have picked. He gave the ump absolutely no choice but to pay the free.

The obvious thing was to take the ball and let momentum take him out when he was tackled.

In the end, he is not a natural defender, so he panicked. I'm not going to write him off for that. He'll learn from it. I'm also not writing him off for the dropped mark. I think his arms were chopped. He could have done more to protect the ball with his body but, again, it's not his natural game.

 

[edgie]

It wasn't until the mid 2000s that the vic advantage really came to the fore.

2007, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2019, 2022.

The exceptions in 2012 and 2018 being very small margins.

In 2016 and 2017 it can definitely be argued the non vic team was the better team throughout the season and favourites. In 2013, 2014 it can be argued the teams were even.

Even against other vic teams one wonders the impact it has.

St Kilda lost two grand finals in 2009 and 2010 as a permanent docklands playing against MCG sharing teams.

 

[Stryke]

I am pretty sure everyone had the same conversation at 3/4 'Game should be over and we know they will come'

We sh!t the bed massively. All Farrell had to do was attack the ball and contest it either over the line or boundary. Highly doubt he would have been caught HTB. We had made half a dozen schoolboy errors that cost us the game.

That Allir throw in call is disgusting. It reeks of that knobhead boundary umpire reading the rule book while sipping his camomile tea during the week, looking for a rule that displays his astute knowledge. Send him back to Noarlunga.

I actually thought they looked timid and scared in the third quarter. We had them on the ropes and just failed to land the knockout blow. Giving up two goals in the first 3 minutes of the 4th gave them that belief back.

They are very very beatable. It took an astonishing display of clutch kicking from Collingwood combined with an time piss blasting performance from us for that result.

But in saying all that, this would be my top nomination if I had to show an example of a Hinkley style loss. Even down to the 3 minutes to get the lead back.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

The obvious thing was to take the ball and let momentum take him out when he was tackled.

In the end, he is not a natural defender, so he panicked. I'm not going to write him off for that. He'll learn from it. I'm also not writing him off for the dropped mark. I think his arms were chopped. He could have done more to protect the ball with his body but, again, it's not his natural game.

Pick the pill up and run the boundary line. Find a guy, boot it long or get tackled over the line.

Overall Farrell did well enough but Aliir should have marked the ball in the play before. He had it and lost it.

 

[Janey]

I'm going to assume that a lot of our younger players got some good learnings from that game which will hold them in good stead come September.

I heard Connor say after the game that they had got a lot of confidence from the game even though the loss was disappointing. They played well enough and lost by a small enough margin to know that they are capable of beating Collingwood and with a thorough review they would be able to identify where they fell short. I'm sure the coaches tried a few things tactically as well and can see what worked and what didn't. The improvements needed to beat them next time are not huge so they should be able to go into a next game still feeling confident.

 

[ibd77]

I heard Connor say after the game that they had got a lot of confidence from the game even though the loss was disappointing. They played well enough and lost by a small enough margin to know that they are capable of beating Collingwood and with a thorough review they would be able to identify where they fell short. I'm sure the coaches tried a few things tactically as well and can see what worked and what didn't. The improvements needed to beat them next time are not huge so they should be able to go into a next game still feeling confident.

Probably one thing that Collingwood doesn't do is physically intimidate the opposition. They play Harlem Globe Trotter football which does scare anyone.

I reckon you could put them off them game with a bit of rough stuff and in a GF, all bets are off.

 

[Janey]

Probably one thing that Collingwood doesn't do is physically intimidate the opposition. They play Harlem Globe Trotter football which does scare anyone.

I reckon you could put them off them game with a bit of rough stuff and in a GF, all bets are off.

Rough stuff in a GF is OK to a degree, you don't give a toss if you get suspended for your next couple of games, but it's a fine line these days, in a close one you definitely don't want to be giving up free kicks or 50 metre penalties.

 

[manureid]

Coaches votes interesting. Either Drew or Elliott got 5 votes from one coach and none from the other.