Review Round 19, 2023 vs Collingwood

[Cyclops]

Some reasonable points, but I'm not too sure comparisons between McRae and Hardwick are valid just yet, and as for the `choke' bit, your mob have been doing Bambi Woods impersonations in grand finals since Moses played full back for Jerusalem!

This year may be different and if it's not against us the very best of good luck, but that last game of the season has been chock a block full of broken dreams for wobbler supporters more often than not.

Indeed, we keep getting there but we lose more than we win. I believe it's a curse relating to RT he 1910 Grand Final but that's another story...

What would you call it when you dominate an opponent for two or so quarters, miss gettable goals and lose at home by 2 points? You had us on toast and didn't put it away.

I wasn't comparing McRae and Hardwick as coaches (theres literally no comparison ATM), I was comparing their lengthy multi-club apprenticeships with Carrs less extensive experience.

Sack in haste, repent at leisure.

 

[PJ Power]

The Farrell one was clear insufficient intent. We lost a preliminary final on an identical action in the exact same spot. He should've known better, it was plain dumb.

Agree. I hope our players take the learnings from Saturday’s game and make sure that those sorts of mistake’s don’t go repeated from here on.

 

[Jason K]

I don't necessarily disagree, but given some of the baffling Deliberates that had been called to that point, they had to pay that one. They had no choice. It would have looked like match fixing not to.

In the wet, they generally let a lot go. Yet in this game, they decided to pay more deliberates than they do even in dry weather games. Which is just crazy and not being spoken about anywhere near enough.

Outside the odd howler here and there (Marshall's throw, Butters being dragged off by Pendlebury), most of the stuff that was being let go was fairly standard for a wet weather game.

But the deliberate out of bounds calls were just insane imo.

Which deliberate out of bounds did you disagree with exactly?

 

[Expat power]

The loss is hard but anyone else pleased that we tried a few different things in the last quarter? Lycett coming off and having Findlayson and Charlie ruck, Drew goes to DeGoey, Rozee more attention on Daicos. I think we have a lot more to work with when reviewing the game.

 

[Handyandy]

The loss is hard but anyone else pleased that we tried a few different things in the last quarter? Lycett coming off and having Findlayson and Charlie ruck, Drew goes to DeGoey, Rozee more attention on Daicos. I think we have a lot more to work with when reviewing the game.

Lycett was cooked, he forced that move by not being able to run out the game, the ugly ruck contest style is too taxing

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Which deliberate out of bounds did you disagree with exactly?

In that weather?

Almost all of them

The first Daicos one in particular was crazy. The ball was almost already over the line and Daicos' momentum full steam in that direction. Unless he was being punished for how good he's been and they just expected him to do something miraculous?

Deliberates like that are generally let go even in dry weather. Let alone in the wet. What Daicos did there happens multiple times in games every week and never gets paid.

My issue wasn't that deliberate in isolation. It was the fact that it wasn't consistently applied across the entire game. There were others very similar later in the game that were let go. Drew was right behind him.

All of the above has to be considered within the context of the fact that it was a wet weather game. Unless we want to have a disingenuous discussion about it, we all know that in wet weather they generally let most things go. Yet somehow they paid more deliberate frees than they do in dry weather games.

 

[Expat power]

Lycett was cooked, he forced that move by not being able to run out the game, the ugly ruck contest style is too taxing

Agree he was cooked - I'm just pleased they took him off and tried something different than just reducing his time on field. I'm not sure Dyl Williams gave us anything extra though definitely not giving us extra speed. Nothng against Dyl he's been great all year but I'm not sure he's the perfect sub. To me Burton is a great sub as can go either end and fresh legs from him in the final quarter is a bonus.

 

[Interstater]

May I post in your forum?

This was a great game and a clear choke. We nailed hard shots from the boundary and 40+, your blokes missed gettables from 30-40 in the V. If you like to attribute blame, then the players and maybe the fitness people are to blame.

Hinkley out coached McRae for most of the night. He got bits of input from broken players like Lycett and Dixon, the tactics were perfect for the conditions, sensible match ups, the players were fired up exactly right. Stuff like using Rioli in bursts to expose Quaynor, the mix of blokes on Daicos, the patchwork ruck as fellas went down, it was a masterclass. The last two years we're used to seeing clubs exposed by Mcrae (eg Vossy repeatedly botching his midfield mix) but not this time.

You got slightly the better of the umpiring (that's the way these days, the umps crucified you in round 2 over here) but there were howlers both ways, not sure if anything was decided by that.

These posts blaming Hinkley for the loss are unreal. Ken is wringing amazing performances from middle tier list. Imagine if you had the resources to lure in Jeremy Cameron or one of the Kings? Port's weakness is off field, the political and money stuff. Footy you do well.

Just on the coaching buzz, maybe Carr is the replacement you need but he's not exactly a Hardwick or McRae, stints at Freo and in a state league is half an apprenticeship these days.

Change the coach if he's damaging the club (you're second, very hard for a non-Vic club) or there's a better option (there isn't, on paper.). Don't just go for Carr because he was an excellent on field leader. We did that with Bucks and Tony Shaw and while both had their good points, neither was as successful as the fella before them who was a grumpy outsider (Matthews and Malthouse).

If Hinkley's time is up you're losing a major part of your success, I suspect you will go down for a bit. Maybe Carr's the one to take you down and up the ladder again with this brilliant young midfield group: in particular I can watch JHF all day, solid gold. The only subpar thing about him is that joke of a mo, he was going hard in the last, putting you in front, belting our toughest player and crashing just about every pack. Is he 20 yet? Love to see him on fire in a Grand Final, and it'll happen soon IMHO.

If this is Ken's last tilt he's going out with the old guard in bandages, the young bloods on fire and all guns blazing. There's a sense of "here and now" for Port (like us, we still rely so much on Pendles and Sidey for all the talk of Daicos). I think you have Brisbane covered, so likely you are grand Final bound. I hope we make it there too, would be another cracker.

I would have thought that to come onto our boards and start a choking narrative was below you.
I won't make that mistake again.

Slightly better of the umpiring, early on yes, in that last quarter, hell no.
Watch it with a neutral perspective if possible and see if you draw the same conclusion.
I'm sure that is what your media is telling you, but open your eyes and don't believe everything you are told.

There is a reason why you win the close ones, well there are four of them, you are "boxoffice", have to fill the coffers right.

Ken is gone, don't come here and attempt to create a 2024 narrative.
Play that game on your board if you like, but it is not appropriate here.

You are the master of half-truths mixed with suggestive slander.
Take it elsewhere thank you.

Granted you are not the beer swilling troglodyte that normally comes over after a win, but in many ways you are much worse.

Personally I'm taking it as a sign you are shit scared of us.

 

[PJ Power]

I don’t think we played a bad last quarter overall. It came down to individual moments of brilliance by them, a slack first five minutes by us and a couple of poor moments by our individuals (Jones OOF, Farrell x2, Finlayson rushing shots on goal that were well within his repertoire). For most of the last quarter it was an arm wrestle and we went toe for toe and had opportunities to score, most notably the Farrell dropped mark from a beautiful JHF clearance and pass.

I think we have plenty to work with.

All of King’s focus today was on the fact that we had everything go our way and still lost. DeGoey being sick, Daicos and Moore uncharacteristically quiet. But I think we can get more out of Marshall - at least in front of goal, Finlayson and Butters who faded notably in the last half. Similarly, JHF really got going after HT and I wouldn’t be surprised if that game helps hone his form for the run home.

We all know we should get more from Wines and Boak, but who knows if they have any shots to fire between now and the end of the year. Similarly, Duursma was a non-entity in the last quarter and needs to give us better gut running forward and back over four quarters - just as Josh Daicos

7

Josh Daicos

Age

25

Ht

178cm

Wt

77kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.6

4star

K

8.3

3star

HB

7.3

5star

M

3.3

3star

T

3.6

5star

CL

1.3

3star

D

16.2

4star

K

9.2

4star

HB

7.0

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

3.5

4star

CL

1.5

4star

D

13.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

6.2

4star

M

3.2

4star

T

4.2

5star

CL

1.2

4star

and Sidebottom did for them.

I don’t think there’s a magic solution needed. Most guys just need to tighten their games, either by doing more over the full game or not making such costly blunders. Then we need Lycett, Boak and Wines to actually contribute in a meaningful way.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

I couldn't believe how calm the Collingwood players were during the match and in the last quarter. I felt like they would never give a 50 away or belt a bloke. Just all in the zone.

It was so good to see a well coached team believe in themselves and the speed and good skills and great decision making. Attacking when the opportunity presented itself and defending like their life depended on it. Just so much confidence and skill errors on the lower end.

The speed of their tall backs was out of this world.

All I can say is what does a fully fit Zak Butters

9

Zak Butters

Age

24

Ht

181cm

Wt

77kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.3

4star

K

7.7

3star

HB

6.7

4star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.8

3star

D

14.7

4star

K

8.9

4star

HB

5.9

3star

M

3.9

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.1

3star

D

17.0

5star

K

9.0

4star

HB

8.0

5star

M

3.6

4star

T

1.6

4star

CL

0.6

3star

do for that game.
A decent ruckman.

 

[Interstater]

I don’t think we played a bad last quarter overall. It came down to individual moments of brilliance by them, a slack first five minutes by us and a couple of poor moments by our individuals (Jones OOF, Farrell x2, Finlayson rushing shots on goal that were well within his repertoire). For most of the last quarter it was an arm wrestle and we went toe for toe and had opportunities to score, most notably the Farrell dropped mark from a beautiful JHF clearance and pass.

I think we have plenty to work with.

All of King’s focus today was on the fact that we had everything go our way and still lost. DeGoey being sick, Daicos and Moore uncharacteristically quiet. But I think we can get more out of Marshall - at least in front of goal, Finlayson and Butters who faded notably in the last half. Similarly, JHF really got going after HT and I wouldn’t be surprised if that game helps hone his form for the run home.

We all know we should get more from Wines and Boak, but who knows if they have any shots to fire between now and the end of the year. Similarly, Duursma was a non-entity in the last quarter and needs to give us better gut running forward and back over four quarters - just Josh Daicos and Sidebottom did for them.

I don’t think there’s a magic solution needed. Most guys just need to tighten their games, either by doing more over the full game or not making such costly blunders. Then we need Lycett, Boak and Wines to actually contribute in a meaningful way.

Wouldn't waste my time listening to any of the McGuire Media commentary.
They know who butters their bread.

Eliot was out of bounds when he marked that ball.

Our problem was that we let them get close enough to allow the result to be influenced.
Too many poor shots for goal in the third.

I hope we don't make that mistake next time.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

I don’t think there’s a magic solution needed. Most guys just need to tighten their games, either by doing more over the full game or not making such costly blunders. Then we need Lycett, Boak and Wines to actually contribute in a meaningful way.

Great post and thoroughly agree with this part.

Tightening up their game, veterans doing more, natural improvement from the young guys.

And later, ditching some list clogged to give the younger guys a chance.

 

[bos10]

Poor kicking at goals cost us 3-4 goals plus poor inside 50 entries

Bad defensive errors 4 goals gifted. Farrell/ jones are very inexperienced so hopefully learn

Lycett smashed in ruck & lost inside midfield/ clearances. Our mids looked so dangerous on the outside, imagine how they would benefit from a good tap ruckman

Our old guys trying to carry injuries. You can’t play injured blokes at this level.

Agree with all of these points. And yet despite all of this - we still nearly won! What to make of this I don't even know myself!

 

[Handyandy]

The deliberates against

I couldn't believe how calm the Collingwood players were during the match and in the last quarter. I felt like they would never give a 50 away or belt a bloke. Just all in the zone.

It was so good to see a well coached team believe in themselves and the speed and good skills and great decision making. Attacking when the opportunity presented itself and defending like their life depended on it. Just so much confidence and skill errors on the lower end.

The speed of their tall backs was out of this world.

All I can say is what does a fully fit Zak Butters do for that game.
A decent ruckman.

Collingwood weren’t that great, their defence & straight kicking saved them, very strong defensive unit whilst ours is very green in areas by comparison

 

[thundercloud]

I would have thought that to come onto our boards and start a choking narrative was below you.
I won't make that mistake again.

Slightly better of the umpiring, early on yes, in that last quarter, hell no.
Watch it with a neutral perspective if possible and see if you draw the same conclusion.
I'm sure that is what your media is telling you, but open your eyes and don't believe everything you are told.

There is a reason why you win the close ones, well there are four of them, you are "boxoffice", have to fill the coffers right.

Ken is gone, don't come here and attempt to create a 2024 narrative.
Play that game on your board if you like, but it is not appropriate here.

You are the master of half-truths mixed with suggestive slander.
Take it elsewhere thank you.

Granted you are not the beer swilling troglodyte that normally comes over after a win, but in many ways you are much worse.

Personally I'm taking it as a sign you are s**t scared of us.

Perhaps the word choke was a bit strong for goal differential, but personally i find it interesting when posters from another club express a reasoned Non derogatory analysis. Lets face it regular posters slants from this board are predictable and so another voice can be refreshing.

 

[Alberton Proud]

Our players must get so pissed off at a boundary throw in knowing that they will never get a tap their way as Lycett refuses to get front spot.

Particularly considering 4 in every 5 boundary throw ins fell way short
Was glaringly noticeable

 

[Alberton Proud]

Thank you for the football analysis and appreciation of football in general. The port adelaide football forum sadly is unbalanced by a hard core of posters who have a clique mentality and by a moderator who provides tactic cover and support for the negative commentary of the team he professes to support or barrack for.

"it was a masterclass"

 

[Peninsula Boy]

The deliberates against

Collingwood weren’t that great, their defence & straight kicking saved them, very strong defensive unit whilst ours is very green in areas by comparison

That's the thing.

Do they have a rockstar player? Young Daicos and then...
I don't know if they get a heap of AAs this year.
But they don't have the Lycett, McEntee, McKenzie types either.
Super solid group all round. I miss good coaching with Hinkley having no idea and enjoyed watching it.
Really efficient team.

 

[Alberton Proud]

Indeed, we keep getting there but we lose more than we win. I believe it's a curse relating to RT he 1910 Grand Final but that's another story...

What would you call it when you dominate an opponent for two or so quarters, miss gettable goals and lose at home by 2 points? You had us on toast and didn't put it away.

I wasn't comparing McRae and Hardwick as coaches (theres literally no comparison ATM), I was comparing their lengthy multi-club apprenticeships with Carrs less extensive experience.

Sack in haste, repent at leisure.

We're just being too hasty folks !

 

[Bevoman]

In that weather?

Almost all of them

The first Daicos one in particular was crazy. The ball was almost already over the line and Daicos' momentum full steam in that direction. Unless he was being punished for how good he's been and they just expected him to do something miraculous?

Deliberates like that are generally let go even in dry weather. Let alone in the wet. What Daicos did there happens multiple times in games every week and never gets paid.

My issue wasn't that deliberate in isolation. It was the fact that it wasn't consistently applied across the entire game. There were others very similar later in the game that were let go. Drew was right behind him.

All of the above has to be considered within the context of the fact that it was a wet weather game. Unless we want to have a disingenuous discussion about it, we all know that in wet weather they generally let most things go. Yet somehow they paid more deliberate frees than they do in dry weather games.

Your view was different to mine (and the commentators who changed their minds after watching the replay).

Daicos clearly slapped the ball away from himself and over the line. He simply needed to grab the ball and wait for the tackle.

 

[Enviable Tradition]

I don't think it's going to happen but really need to thump them to gain a bit of momentum.

I can see it being very similar to the 2nd showdown last year.

On SM-G975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Janus]

I don’t think we played a bad last quarter overall. It came down to individual moments of brilliance by them, a slack first five minutes by us and a couple of poor moments by our individuals (Jones OOF, Farrell x2, Finlayson rushing shots on goal that were well within his repertoire). For most of the last quarter it was an arm wrestle and we went toe for toe and had opportunities to score, most notably the Farrell dropped mark from a beautiful JHF clearance and pass.

I think we have plenty to work with.

All of King’s focus today was on the fact that we had everything go our way and still lost. DeGoey being sick, Daicos and Moore uncharacteristically quiet. But I think we can get more out of Marshall - at least in front of goal, Finlayson and Butters who faded notably in the last half. Similarly, JHF really got going after HT and I wouldn’t be surprised if that game helps hone his form for the run home.

We all know we should get more from Wines and Boak, but who knows if they have any shots to fire between now and the end of the year. Similarly, Duursma was a non-entity in the last quarter and needs to give us better gut running forward and back over four quarters - just as Josh Daicos and Sidebottom did for them.

I don’t think there’s a magic solution needed. Most guys just need to tighten their games, either by doing more over the full game or not making such costly blunders. Then we need Lycett, Boak and Wines to actually contribute in a meaningful way.

That's because King's lips are welded firmly around Magpie ****. He has been going on and on this year about how no team can get close to Collingwood when they are on - when Adelaide pushed them it was because Adelaide had the freedom of no one expecting them to win and being an up and coming good team with guys like Rachele and Rankine rah rah rah. So when his narrative is blown out of the water, it has to be because Collingwood did something wrong, rather than Port doing something right. The campaigner even had the nerve to drop us to four in his rankings which he's been itching to do since forever below Brisbane and ****ing Melbourne (because they won against Adelaide who King also has a hardon for) after a game like that.

At the game I was expecting to see from Collingwood what I saw from Adelaide circa 2017 - this well drilled, well oiled machine that was like the Roman army in it's ruthless efficiency moving the ball forward of center. That's what I have been sold by King and everyone else. What I got was a team that looked like Richmond 2017 with a few tweaks - a good team, granted, but not this unstoppable behemoth that the media loves to talk up. I'm firmly of the opinion that half of Collingwood's belief actually stems from clowns like King in the media talking them up.

Daicos was quiet because Drew had 16 ****ing tackles for the game. Double the next best player on the ground that was Houston with 8. Moore was quiet because we have enough threats up forward that make it impossible for him to zone off like he normally does and we kept our forwards back instead of having them push up the ground.

Port should have won that game, and it had nothing to do with Collingwood having a case of the Roger Federer's. Port had two rushed behinds to Collingwood's 3 - that means they had 17 genuine scoring shots (13.4) to Port's 21 (12.9)...and that's not counting the shots that went out on the full.

Guys like Butters and Houston were pissed off after the game because they knew the bullshit narrative around Collingwood would continue. The margin between the teams in the top four is wafer thin, and I think when it comes to finals it's anyone's premiership.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

One tactical move that McRae noted was the work we put into Noble and Quaynor preventing their overlapping run from half back. Those two don't get the publicity of some of the other Collingwood players and they are drivers of their game style.

Daicos's deliberate was a fair call as was Farrell's. Farrell had a mare in the last quarter.

 

[Expat power]

Its a massive issue that doesn't get enough discussion. Wines is a plodder and is dead to us on the wing. He has zero impact for breaking lines and delivering the ball by foot, Ollie is the worst kick in the side, just in front of Bergman who again butchered the ball soooo many times Saturday night. He and Jones SHOULD not be allowed to kick the thing, all 3 cost us significantly. There is an old footy saying, if you cant kick you cant play!!

Are you suggesting Jones and Bergman shouldn't play?

 

[Expat power]

That's because King's lips are welded firmly around Magpie utensil. He has been going on and on this year about how no team can get close to Collingwood when they are on - when Adelaide pushed them it was because Adelaide had the freedom of no one expecting them to win and being an up and coming good team with guys like Rachele and Rankine rah rah rah. So when his narrative is blown out of the water, it has to be because Collingwood did something wrong, rather than Port doing something right. The campaigner even had the nerve to drop us to four in his rankings which he's been itching to do since forever below Brisbane and ******* Melbourne (because they won against Adelaide who King also has a hardon for) after a game like that.

At the game I was expecting to see from Collingwood what I saw from Adelaide circa 2017 - this well drilled, well oiled machine that was like the Roman army in it's ruthless efficiency moving the ball forward of center. That's what I have been sold by King and everyone else. What I got was a team that looked like Richmond 2017 with a few tweaks - a good team, granted, but not this unstoppable behemoth that the media loves to talk up. I'm firmly of the opinion that half of Collingwood's belief actually stems from clowns like King in the media talking them up.

Daicos was quiet because Drew had 16 ******* tackles for the game. Double the next best player on the ground that was Houston with 8. Moore was quiet because we have enough threats up forward that make it impossible for him to zone off like he normally does and we kept our forwards back instead of having them push up the ground.

Port should have won that game, and it had nothing to do with Collingwood having a case of the Roger Federer's. Port had two rushed behinds to Collingwood's 3 - that means they had 17 genuine scoring shots (13.4) to Port's 21 (12.9)...and that's not counting the shots that went out on the full.

Guys like Butters and Houston were pissed off after the game because they knew the bullshit narrative around Collingwood would continue. The margin between the teams in the top four is wafer thin, and I think when it comes to finals it's anyone's premiership.

I agree with all of this but I think whoever plays Collingwood in the GF will go through the same pain of playing Richmond at the G - they'll be 80 thousand Collingwood supporters to push the team along. Whoever plays them will have to be mentally prepared. And before anyone comes at me saying that Collingwood had to deal with that on Saturday at AO..they didn't. There were so many could and proud Collingwood supporters there and they were loud.