Review Round 23, 2024 - Collingwood vs. Brisbane Lions

[dlanod]

Anyone having a slapfest with other posters have a high chance to have a day's break to cool down.

 

[martinson]

I thought it was a reportable action and that suspension was a very real outcome.

But hey..... Collingwood ,so nothing to see here from Christensen except we're docking your pocket money next week

That's the second time Joe's been deliberately tripped with a fine both times.

Coincidence ? I don't think so. Clubs know he's an easy target to infringe against.

 

[Grasshopper17]

Just saw Joe burning Charlie running back towards goal in the third quarter come up on Clangers on Bounce (I'm only watching cos I'm impatiently waiting for First Crack ).

This happened at the end we were sitting at the game. I actually thought Joe made the right decision at the time. My impression was he was trying to draw Charlie's opponent back towards him, flip the handball over the top for Charlie to run in unmarked.

Joe probably didn't count on the fact that he had a guy chasing him, perhaps a fraction closer than he realised, and he certainly didn't count on making such a mess of that fatal bounce.

The kick to a team mate running away from you with an opponent anywhere in the vicinity is fiendishly difficult to nail. You not only have to get the direction absolutely spot on but you also have to 100% nail the distance. Put it too short and it gets picked off by a taller opponent. Put it too long and it dribbles through for a behind or out of bounds and, again, everyone's potting Joe for being selfish or some such.

If we're gonna be dark on Joe for anything, let's be dark on him for fluffing the bounce the way he did, not for his decision making in that moment. Yet another example of us doing so much right in-game with regards to strategy and playing the game on our terms for most of the day, but failing to nail the fundamentals, like goal kicking, finishing games as well as we start them, and how to bounce the god damn f*cking Sherrin.

It also accurately demonstrates why pressure from behind is so much more valuable than the "come forward pressure" which is now all the rage in AFL defensive setups. Chasing pressure from behind allows the defender(s) ahead of the ball to maintain their positioning, without being caught in two minds as to whether to come off their man to affect the play, having to trust that a team mate will be able to cover for them.

 

[martinson]

Correct.

How often do you see your defender drawn in to the opposition forward thrust because there's no one stopping him/pressuring him, yelling at him from behind , and they get the easy overlap. Cameron's opponent didn't get sucked in because he could see Joe being chased with intent.

Am I wrong in thinking we're one of the main culprits ? Especially when the game opens up and some players are a little tired.

 

[luthor]

Just saw Joe burning Charlie running back towards goal in the third quarter come up on Clangers on Bounce (I'm only watching cos I'm impatiently waiting for First Crack ).

This happened at the end we were sitting at the game. I actually thought Joe made the right decision at the time. My impression was he was trying to draw Charlie's opponent back towards him, flip the handball over the top for Charlie to run in unmarked.

Joe probably didn't count on the fact that he had a guy chasing him, perhaps a fraction closer than he realised, and he certainly didn't count on making such a mess of that fatal bounce.

The kick to a team mate running away from you with an opponent anywhere in the vicinity is fiendishly difficult to nail. You not only have to get the direction absolutely spot on but you also have to 100% nail the distance. Put it too short and it gets picked off by a taller opponent. Put it too long and it dribbles through for a behind or out of bounds and, again, everyone's potting Joe for being selfish or some such.

If we're gonna be dark on Joe for anything, let's be dark on him for fluffing the bounce the way he did, not for his decision making in that moment. Yet another example of us doing so much right in-game with regards to strategy and playing the game on our terms for most of the day, but failing to nail the fundamentals, like goal kicking, finishing games as well as we start them, and how to bounce the god damn f*cking Sherrin.

Absolutely correct.

I've been banging on about this twice before in the post mortems of this game.

So much vitriol and BS directed at Joe for being "selfish" in this incident when all he is attempting to do is to get Charlie to lead to space for either a kick and mark or a handball over the top for a "Joe the Goose"

The bounce was a skill error pure and simple but Charlie made things so much more difficult for Joe by running away from him rather than towards him. Or alternatively , running to somewhere else into the ample space that was available to him.

If "blame" is to be allocated, Charlie is more of the culprit than Joe here

 

[harvester]

I think Joe's awesome. He's a great player, a character, and he is enjoying his footy. He is one of the reasons I watch footy.

 

[Dalions]

Didn't see it that way myself and it's already been covered at length on this thread.

Joes was 3 or 4 little things and a couple of missed shots off having a 10/10 game.

He went to the backline and busted his gut trying to stem the flow several times.

People expect far too much of him when the majority of the time he's a gun.

Joe most definitely should have kicked that ball.
When he got it he took a couple of steps looked up saw Charlie, hesitated, imo because it was Charlie and then decided to bounce which is where things went horribly wrong.
My words sitting there at the game only about 30m away from Joe were, they do not trust Charlie anymore and I honestly think that is the reason why Joe didn’t kick it.
It was the wrong decision and it should have been an easy goal out the back.
But that was completely on Joe.

 

[CarterS]

Up by 30 two weeks in a row and lose, what a pair of missed opportunities. Should be cruising into top 2 right now.

 

[Zacs_Magic_Tooth]

After giving up the massive finals advantage the past 2 weeks the thought of us having to kick fairly accurately 4 games in a row to win the flag is making me shudder

 

[Nathan Barley]

So this is the clip?

Joe could've gone early but tried to improve the shot. The other 3 I'd argue they were in a better position to take the shot rather than risk a handball

Watching David King really just makes people dumber

‘It hurt, Joe’: Ugly vision exposes AFL contender’s big problem

‘It hurt, Joe’: Ugly vision exposes AFL contender’s big problem

www.foxsports.com.au

 

[Tom14]

Would’ve been paid a trip at the Gabba

Unless it is Jeremy Cameron doing the tripping!

 

[3KZ is Football]

His team mates should be aware of this and screaming "get rid of the ****ing ball Zac!"

“YOU’RE HOT! YOU’RE HOT! YOU’RE HOT!”
It’s not hard.

 

[On the quiet]

Mainly through poor kicking for goal.

Calling for a replacement for Fagan is premature.

agree. Lets just wait to see how we finish up, and IF knocked out early in the finals then start preparing for 2026. IMO Fages deserves to see out his contract but I am starting to think a fresh voice and assistance might be needed beyond 2025.

 

[PopsPride]

“YOU’RE HOT! YOU’RE HOT! YOU’RE HOT!”
It’s not hard.

It's not hard, but maybe hearing them is with big crowds (I don't know).

 

[PopsPride]

Up by 30 two weeks in a row and lose, what a pair of missed opportunities. Should be cruising into top 2 right now.

Evident when the pressure is turned up that the Lions are weak mentally (I'm a Lions supporter). One can practice goal kicking technique at training but that is not the same as when under pressure. Joe is Joe but still has 45 goals and double that of the other designated forward who, let's face it, has zero impact 5 games out of every 6.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Evident when the pressure is turned up that the Lions are weak mentally (I'm a Lions supporter). One can practice goal kicking technique at training but that is not the same as when under pressure. Joe is Joe but still has 45 goals and double that of the other designated forward who, let's face it, has zero impact 5 games out of every 6.

Huh?

 

[martinson]

Joe most definitely should have kicked that ball.
When he got it he took a couple of steps looked up saw Charlie, hesitated, imo because it was Charlie and then decided to bounce which is where things went horribly wrong.
My words sitting there at the game only about 30m away from Joe were, they do not trust Charlie anymore and I honestly think that is the reason why Joe didn’t kick it.
It was the wrong decision and it should have been an easy goal out the back.
But that was completely on Joe.

Thanks for that Dalions. It's a perspective I hadn't considered because it really isn't Joe's form overall to burn players. My impression was that when he looked up and saw where Charlie was he instantly decided not to kick it there ,to get some better positioning. But I can see what you're saying , he thought that was a risky option. and I hadn't considered your reason.

Overall the media preys on Joe so they can get mileage out of every mistake he makes . They delight in it. No wonder he doesn't have a TV.

 

[Pride of lions]

It's not hard, but maybe hearing them is with big crowds (I don't know).

We were sitting right in front of where that happened and it was really noisy at the time. But he really should have hand balled forward to Charlie before that if I recall correctly.

 

[McIvor]

Evident when the pressure is turned up that the Lions are weak mentally (I'm a Lions supporter). One can practice goal kicking technique at training but that is not the same as when under pressure. Joe is Joe but still has 45 goals and double that of the other designated forward who, let's face it, has zero impact 5 games out of every 6.

There was a graph on Footy Furnace last night comparing Jesse Hogan and Joe's accuracy and basically if Joe took things more seriously instead of this lol Joe shctick of Joe being Joe thing then we'd better better served:

Jesse Hogan = 67 goals / 23 behinds (90 shots) (can't remember but I think there was another line about OOTF)
Joe Daniher = 49 goals / 42 behinds (91 shots)

If Joe converts half of those misses, our prospects are probably completely different. Same could be said for Cam and Charlie who's goal kicking has regressed - good to see the club has addressed this this throughout the year.

 

[Gadzorks]

After giving up the massive finals advantage the past 2 weeks the thought of us having to kick fairly accurately 4 games in a row to win the flag is making me shudder

For the past two weeks pressure of top two (which is also gf pressire) made everyone a little tense and it was enough to impact on goal accuracy, fumbling and those 0.1 second hesitations that are so costly.

We now have the perfect opportunity for players to address those nerves and find a way through them while we still alive in this season. Can't address during off season when there is nothing at stake.

The dreaded learnings opportunity is real.

 

[McIvor]

We now have the perfect opportunity for players to address those nerves and find a way through them while we still alive in this season. Can't address during off season when there is nothing at stake.

The dreaded learnings opportunity is real.

Didn't we have the same opportunity against Collingwood because its not like the club weren't banging on all last week about how great it was to face Collingwood again at the MCG and make amends?

 

[martinson]

The good thing about footy is that we get at least another 2 chances.

 

[dlanod]

There was a graph on Footy Furnace last night comparing Jesse Hogan and Joe's accuracy and basically if Joe took things more seriously instead of this lol Joe shctick of Joe being Joe thing then we'd better better served:

Jesse Hogan = 67 goals / 23 behinds (90 shots) (can't remember but I think there was another line about OOTF)
Joe Daniher = 49 goals / 42 behinds (91 shots)

If Joe converts half of those misses, our prospects are probably completely different. Same could be said for Cam and Charlie who's goal kicking has regressed - good to see the club has addressed this this throughout the year.

Jesse Hogan won't take a shot over 40m out from goal and he generally plays out of the goal square, so marks are often taken close to goal and right in front.

Joe roams a lot further afield and often has his set shots on an angle because of our plan of playing down the wings as well as often being from further out.

I don't think Joe would be as good a shot as Hogan has been this season if you gave them identical shots, but Joe is taking shots from much harder locations than Hogan. As a quick estimate, I'd say at least half the goal difference would be accounted for (the other half being reliability and consistency).

 

[martinson]

Jesse Hogan won't take a shot over 40m out from goal and he generally plays out of the goal square, so marks are often taken close to goal and right in front.

Joe roams a lot further afield and often has his set shots on an angle because of our plan of playing down the wings as well as often being from further out.

I don't think Joe would be as good a shot as Hogan has been this season if you gave them identical shots, but Joe is taking shots from much harder locations than Hogan. As a quick estimate, I'd say at least half the goal difference would be accounted for (the other half being reliability and consistency).

Plus Joe can kick the occasional miracle one which is a team lifter.

 

[buttermuffs]

I know 2 regular umpires who both have a very low opinion of Stevic. He takes a set against one side and that's all she wrote.

Sent from my SM-N920I using Tapatalk

From the umpires I knew they held Stevic in very high regard. Funny how those opinions can vary.

 

[Elixuh]

Jesse Hogan won't take a shot over 40m out from goal and he generally plays out of the goal square, so marks are often taken close to goal and right in front.

Joe roams a lot further afield and often has his set shots on an angle because of our plan of playing down the wings as well as often being from further out.

I don't think Joe would be as good a shot as Hogan has been this season if you gave them identical shots, but Joe is taking shots from much harder locations than Hogan. As a quick estimate, I'd say at least half the goal difference would be accounted for (the other half being reliability and consistency).

Yep 100%, this is a great point.

I love what Hogan has done this season and he is a very worthy Coleman medalist and has done it with a high degree of skill.