South Africa V England- how the sides stack up

[KiwiRoo]

1 plays 2 in the world. How do the sides compare ?

here's my go

Smith v Strauss. Smith for me. Both great Captains, but Smith dominates more often.Averages 50 opening which is a great effort.

Peterson V Cook. Cook clear winner, has a great test record. Peterson is developing, but looked pretty loose at times against NZ.

Amla V Trott..Trott, just. He's a run machine.

Kallis v Pieterson..Kallis wins for his batting alone .His bowling and catching put him further ahead

De Villiers v Bell..Maybe Bell just. He's been brilliant the last couple of years..Both very good middle order players

Rudolph v Morgan ..Hard to tell , both have had up & down careers.

Boucher V Prior. Prior is ahead now comfotably. Boucher still a gutsy cricketer, but Prior scores a lot more runs nowdays & his keeping is ok.

Steyn v Anderson. matched the 2 top bowlers. very hard to separate. Steyn just.

Morkel v Broad. Very similar stats, builds ,pace. I'd go Morkel though as has the ability to get nasty.Broads batting is very handy though

Philander V Bresnan/ Tremlett/Finn..Hard to know who will get the nod for the poms. Philander has been sensational so far. Bowls a lively pace without being quick, and nips it either way with bounce. Similar to McGrath.all 3 of the poms have been good at times, but Philander wins.

Swan V Tahir. Swann, then daylight. Big plus for the poms, as cant see Tahir running through a side, or keeping it tight enough. Safas may even be tempted to play 4 quicks.

other major areas:
Tailend batting..England well ahead with Broad, Swann, Bresnan all very capable with the bat
Fielding..South Africa dropped a few yesterday, but normally very safe. England are ok too..call it a draw !

thats my thoughts. Should be a close series. South Africa with a slight edge in the pace bowling, but I'd have England ahead in the batting due to their better tail.

 

[Hellgood]

Amla or Trott is a very tough one. Both have been making mountains of runs.

I know Bell is an excellent batsman, but de Villiers is the best batsman in the world at the moment.

 

[4evablues]

Im with the Saffas. Just think they have the complete bowling attack with the inclusion of Philander.

Fan of Swann, but don't think it's enough! The difference will be in the bowling and think the Saffas would win because of it.

Would be an awesome series though...anyone know when it will happen?

 

[pigeon26]

Yeah de Villiers over Bell easily.

 

[Carbine Chaos]

Amla over Trott and De Villiers (easily) over Bell.

 

[DrVanNostrand]

I'd have ABDV ahead of Bell. de Villiers will be the world's greatest batsman in a few years and his ability to shift gears seemlessly is just amazing. He'll be one who (I think) won't get found out by English conditions. His technique is rock solid.

Eoin Morgan won't be there for England. His Test career is finished unless he has a brillliant County season. Bopara will be England's number 6. I'd have Duminy over Rudolph. Very difficult to say who will have a better time of it if the ball is darting around.

I think Tim Bresnan is England's best 3rd seamer. Especially in English conditions. His control is suprisingly good and can heat it up when he feels the need. I'm a big fan. In saying that, Philander is a whole different beast altogether.

South Africa's 4th bowler is an interesting one. I still think Tahir is a sleeping giant at international level, but suspect he's run out of chances considering his dropping against NZ. He'll stuggle to be selected unless venues like Lords or Cardiff show signs of turning (doubtful). If Kallis is fit, there's no need to play four seamers. I think South Africa may recall Paul Harris. He's a very steady slow-left-armer and does manage to snag the odd bat-pad dismissal against fairly decent players. If the seamers are running riot at the other end, I think he's the man for the job. Plus, if England's batsmen don't start getting forward to the finger spinners, he'll pick up a few LBWs as well. Points decision to Swann.

My England XI: Strauss, Cook, Trott, KP, Bell, Bopara, Prior, Broad, Bresnan, Swann, Anderson. Finn 12th.
My South Africa XI: Smith, Petersen, Amla, Kallis, ABDV, Duminy, Boucher, Steyn, Philander, Harris, Morkel. Rudolph 12th.

Let's just hope for some grass on the pitch, some overcast weather and the best Test series since 2005.

 

[Ducky Tie]

I agree de Villers over Bell as a batsman but I think against pace bowling they are about even. Spin is obviously Bells weakness and I don't think Tahir will trouble him very much.

 

[chargers 09]

YOu forgot to compare both sides' mental strength. We all know who comes out in top in that catergory.

 

[KiwiRoo]

I can live with De Villiers ahead of Bell. Dont agree with a couple of people who said easily though
His last 3 series averages before playing in that dodgy series in Dubai were

56 in the ashes
69 against Sri lanka
65 against india

he averages 47, and that includes a dodgy start to his career.

 

[KiwiRoo]

YOu forgot to compare both sides' mental strength. We all know who comes out in top in that catergory.

who ...?

 

[Selective Retention]

South Africa for talent, Poms to win. Same old same old.

 

[KiwiRoo]

South Africa for talent, Poms to win. Same old same old.

yep dont really disagree with that

Poms have plenty of talent too !

 

[JUBJUB]

South Africa for talent, Poms to win. Same old same old.

If South Africa had a half decent spinner the Poms would be up shit creek given their recent efforts against spinners.Sadly the Saffies only have that Pakistan reject who thinks he's an aeroplane and he's about as dangerous as a fart in an elevator.

 

[philohk]

Agree with a couple of other posters - England. Expect them to play better for longer. Will be a cracking series though.

Im with the Saffas. Just think they have the complete bowling attack with the inclusion of Philander.

Fan of Swann, but don't think it's enough! The difference will be in the bowling and think the Saffas would win because of it.

Would be an awesome series though...anyone know when it will happen?

July.

 

[frankrizzo]

Sadly it's only 3 tests, this matchup is crying out for a 5 test series.

 

[DrVanNostrand]

Sadly it's only 3 tests, this matchup is crying out for a 5 test series.

But the ECB have to squeeze in their precious 5-match ODI series against Australia outside of an Ashes series!

 

[The Speaker]

YOu forgot to compare both sides' mental strength. We all know who comes out in top in that catergory.

Australia?

South Africa's 4th bowler is an interesting one. I still think Tahir is a sleeping giant at international level, but suspect he's run out of chances considering his dropping against NZ. He'll stuggle to be selected unless venues like Lords or Cardiff show signs of turning (doubtful).

I agree, and I think Tahir is suffering partly because Smith has no idea how to use him. Who was the last agressive, wicket taking Saffer spinner?

Also, if they replace Tahir, Peterson may be the replacement, not Harris. Thereby giving us Petersen, Peterson and Pietersen.

 

[KiwiRoo]

Tahir has some talent. Got a brilliant googly.But i cant remember him turning one the other way.

He also suffers because the saffas have Kallis who bowls a lot of the overs that a spinner in another side would bowl..and he's probably more likely to get wickets too.

 

[Surkin]

Bell better than De Villiers? i don't think so. De Villiers is the best batsman in cricket right now.

 

[western royboy]

I reckon Boucher will struggle to make it - I think he's been tapped on the shoulder.

 

[KiwiRoo]

De Villiers has averaged
59,63,71 in his last 3 series

Bell
56 in the ashes
69 against Sri lanka
65 against india


so theres not much in it as far as averages are concerned.
But as i said happy enough for De Villiers over Bell

 

[KiwiRoo]

I reckon Boucher will struggle to make it - I think he's been tapped on the shoulder.

I would have thought they would have blooded a keeper against NZ if they werent going to take Boucher to England ?
Either that or De Villiers will keep & they play both Duminy & Rudolph ?

 

[DrVanNostrand]

Boucher has said he's more than likely to retire after this England series, so I think the selectors will let him play the series out regardless of performance.

I don't think de Villiers will want to keep in full-time in Tests. He's the next captain and his side's premier batsman once Kallis retires.

In the last round of Cricket South Africa central contracts, Thami Tsolekile (played 3 Tests in 2004) was given a contract, a sign he is the planned replacement. I don't remember anything about his keeping, but his FC/List-A numbers are pretty ordinary, he's 31. Morne van Wyk has been used in t20 cricket over the last few years as well. but he's 33. Heino Kuhn has fantastic numbers at FC level, don't know where he stands/what he's done wrong, and only 27.

 

[western royboy]

Boucher has said he's more than likely to retire after this England series, so I think the selectors will let him play the series out regardless of performance.

I don't think de Villiers will want to keep in full-time in Tests. He's the next captain and his side's premier batsman once Kallis retires.

In the last round of Cricket South Africa central contracts, Thami Tsolekile (played 3 Tests in 2004) was given a contract, a sign he is the planned replacement. I don't remember anything about his keeping, but his FC/List-A numbers are pretty ordinary, he's 31. Morne van Wyk has been used in t20 cricket over the last few years as well. but he's 33. Heino Kuhn has fantastic numbers at FC level, don't know where he stands/what he's done wrong, and only 27.

Doubt de Villiers will keep in Tests, big risk to his fingers. I have doubts on both Tsolekile and van Wyk from what I have seen. Tsolekile kept for a few tests when Ray Jenning came in as coach and stirred things up a few years ago by dropping players that he thought were "too comfortable" - Boucher was top of the list but he didn't make it with the bat and after that he actually lost his place in his domestic team for a period. de Villiers did it for a few tests before Boucher was rightly reinstated. van Wyk could best be described as a journeyman and at 33 it's not a step for the future. Heino Kuhn would appear to be the one.

It's a massive step change, since re introduction they have effectively only had two keepers, Dave Richardson & Boucher - who was pretty young when he started.

 

[realsniper09]

I'm going with England. They have a more balanced team, and most importantly, they get the results.

RSA have a great team of course as well. Their top-line batsmen are some of the world's best (Smith, Amla, Kallis, de Villiers), and they have their amazing fast bowling combination (Steyn, Philander, Morkel), but depth is not as good.

England probably don't have the top-notch quality, but their spread of talent is fantastic and quality is very, very good.

Also, I think RSA have won like 3 of their last 9 test series or something like that.
England have won 8 of their last 10, losing to Pakistan of course in the last series and the draw against RSA.
That's telling.