Mega Thread The 2017 'Buckley's Chances' Thread

[Countrypie]

Then why have Similar Record to back in 1999?

Let the season play out. After 3 rounds this year we will have played both of last years grand finalists...and e don;t even know the result yet Dave.

 

[swoop42]

Fascinating list.
Like many stats they are an indicator not a definer.

Not to be pedantic, Nathan has coached two finals campaigns (acquired a finals team; as did Chris Scott) and has thus far only missed three finals series (this year would be the fourth, not looking that great so far).

I love exploring the records of flag winning coaches. They are telling.
But one thing I've always noticed, is a few telling signs.

All these coaches look in charge, have authority and obviously have strong football knowledge.

One other thing they all have, is a quality team, often laden with lots of top level talent.
That surely can't be a coincidence.

The premiership coaches that do it multiple times (era sides) tend to have stars and more stars. Not every star is always available but they overall they are there.

But that is just "coincidence."

Clarkson: Franklin, Hodge, Mitchell S, Roughead, Rioli, Burgoyne, Crawford (one flag), Lake etc

Thompson: Ablett, Bartel, Johnson, Scarlett, Kelly, etc

Matthews: Voss, Black, Ackermanis, Brown, Lynch, Leppitsch etc

Jeans: Matthews, Brereton, Platten, Dunstall, Tuck, Buckenara, Jarman, Langford (amazing they didn't win more flags) NB: Joyce also had this list pretty much sans Matthews

Sheedy: Madden, Watson, Daniher, Baker, Weston, etc then had Hird, Lloyd, Mecuri, Misiti, Long etc

In conclusion there is more to coaching than meets the eye.
Nathan may never reach the ultimate success, only one in 18 succeed each year, but it is amazing how the key factor in success (the players, hello, the players!) is sometimes not as well regarded as who is who in the FD or who is who in admin etc. or even who is being the medical guru. Important but the players go and do the business.

Thanks for your reply.

I guess an argument could be made that some of the players you named became great and not just good because of the coach while some would have been great regardless.

I guess if a coach has success over a long period of time which enables him to remain employed it points to an ability to get the best out of players more often than not.

As for my stats of premiership coaches from the last 20 years it has shown only 1 man out of 14 has taken his side to 4 consecutive seasons without finals before going on to win there first premiership and that took two clubs and 9 years to achieve.

The other point of note is that only 3 out of the 14 coaches took more than 6 seasons to win there first flag.

Mick Malthouse who coached a historically struggling club in Footscray first up and not a powerhouse like Collingwood, Malcolm Blight who took Geelong to 3 losing grand finals in basically the same amount of time Buckley has been coach and Mark Thompson who went without finals for 3 years prior to the 2007 premiership.

Thompson is the only one who eventually won a flag at his initial senior coaching appointment and the one most similar in circumstance to Buckley at present.

Nathan would have to seriously buck the trend to become a premiership coach should we miss this years finals though.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Thanks for your reply.

I guess an argument could be made that some of the players you named became great and not just good because of the coach while some would have been great regardless.

I guess if a coach has success over a long period of time which enables him to remain employed it points to an ability to get the best out of players more often than not.

As for my stats of premiership coaches from the last 20 years it has shown only 1 man out of 14 has taken his side to 4 consecutive seasons without finals before going on to win there first premiership and that took two clubs and 9 years to achieve.

The other point of note is that only 3 out of the 14 coaches took more than 6 seasons to win there first flag.

Mick Malthouse who coached a historically struggling club in Footscray first up and not a powerhouse like Collingwood, Malcolm Blight who took Geelong to 3 losing grand finals in basically the same amount of time Buckley has been coach and Mark Thompson who went without finals for 3 years prior to the 2007 premiership.

Thompson is the only one who eventually won a flag at his initial senior coaching appointment and the one most similar in circumstance to Buckley at present.

Nathan would have to seriously buck the trend to become a premiership coach should we miss this years finals though.

That's all true.
Nathan would need to buck the trend.

Your list also sort of says, coaches without intitial success quickly often dissapear into the ether.

The nature of sport, in many ways.

Succeed or dissapear.

There is a bit of chicken or egg, is it the coach making the players or the other way around.

To be clear, I think the coach is important, you have to be a leader and in charge, etc, have the knowledge of the game etc.

Equally fascinating is how many coaches that had great success but when given later, a weak group of players how "unsuccessful" they were.

Eg Barassi failed at Melbourne.
Tony Jewel was never the same at other times after his flag.
Even Jock McHale after his heyday going into the WW2 period when so many men enlisted has mild performances.

But interesting discussion.

As only one coach is truly successful each year, the odds are against Nathan anyway, tick tick tick, time is running away from him.

 

[MISFITS]

Thanks for your reply.

I guess an argument could be made that some of the players you named became great and not just good because of the coach while some would have been great regardless.

I guess if a coach has success over a long period of time which enables him to remain employed it points to an ability to get the best out of players more often than not.

As for my stats of premiership coaches from the last 20 years it has shown only 1 man out of 14 has taken his side to 4 consecutive seasons without finals before going on to win there first premiership and that took two clubs and 9 years to achieve.

The other point of note is that only 3 out of the 14 coaches took more than 6 seasons to win there first flag.

Mick Malthouse who coached a historically struggling club in Footscray first up and not a powerhouse like Collingwood, Malcolm Blight who took Geelong to 3 losing grand finals in basically the same amount of time Buckley has been coach and Mark Thompson who went without finals for 3 years prior to the 2007 premiership.

Thompson is the only one who eventually won a flag at his initial senior coaching appointment and the one most similar in circumstance to Buckley at present.

Nathan would have to seriously buck the trend to become a premiership coach should we miss this years finals though.

Bomber Thompson coached Geelong to a Preliminary final in 2005.
Then the Cats missed the 2006 finals.

 

[left at home]

Then why have Similar Record to back in 1999?

did not know the season had ended already, but it has a long way to go yet. does not have that years feel to it.

 

[soreplums]

I don't think we are far off. If we kick the sitters in front of goal that we miss and don't have that 15minute lapse where we concede easy goals (at least make them earn it) and we go from 0-2 to 2-0. We have been in winning positions in both games.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Accuracy

 

[TradeDraft]

The Reason Bucks will lose his job is how bad we use the ball

 

[soreplums]

The Reason Bucks will lose his job is how bad we use the ball

We were pinpoint in the first quarter. A couple of bad decisions by Smith and Reid gifted the Swans 3 goals.

 

[10571z]

We were pinpoint in the first quarter. A couple of bad decisions by Smith and Reid gifted the Swans 3 goals.

Yep i thought our kicking was decent tonight. Our forward entries are shocking. Surely Moore can lead in a line to the ball and outrun an opponent?

 

[mike123]

Yep i thought our kicking was decent tonight. Our forward entries are shocking. Surely Moore can lead in a line to the ball and outrun an opponent?

The opposition defenders cut him off though.

 

[mike123]

The Swans were also inaccurate...

 

[Iskender Time]

So we'll be signing him for another four years?

 

[PIrOed]

So we'll be signing him for another four years?

Pfft...too conservative for my tastes. Sign him up for life!

 

[The Plowking]

The Swans were also inaccurate...

And pies...

 

[Saintly Viewed]

As my thoughts are well known I'll leave it at this:
They played for each other, they were engaged, well done to all the coaches.

When the wheel turns and we click, and have success I hope our chief architect is at the helm

 

[TheGooch]

Good coach Buckley ;-)

 

[JG13]

50/50 I'd say. I get where you're coming from.. not sure there are replays on the internet of 360 for you to have a look at and form an opinion.

having watched him on footy tonight, its odd but not entirely surprising that i walked away from the interview thinking that treloar actually loved playing for bucks.....

 

[TradeDraft]

We were pinpoint in the first quarter. A couple of bad decisions by Smith and Reid gifted the Swans 3 goals.

Yeah and Swans Effort in 1st Qtr was Pathetic

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Elliot can only assist

 

[left at home]

Elliot can only assist

which way is the question

 

[Saintly Viewed]

which way is the question

Elliot just assists everything

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Has there been a coach in history that has been under a lot of scrutiny that has actually kept his job?

Perhaps Hardwick? What's the status of his contract.. I'm hoping Richmond offer him an extension cause he's shit but they're winning. Add to their misery.

I'm hoping if we do have a consistent run of wins we don't make the same stupid decision to sign Bucks on an extra yr or 2.

Just make an offer to Clarko.. or get Dew in there. Please!!! Let's start playing attractive and brutal football again.. instead of this high pressure crap that Buck's has used as a cop out for his inability to coach.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Has there been a coach in history that has been under a lot of scrutiny that has actually kept his job?

Mark Thompson
Pre 2007 the review and all that

Clarkson was close to getting the chop, though some don't believe that, he was close enough, Jeff Kennett or not.

Jock McHale very early on was highly vulnerable .... I think he passed

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Mark Thompson
Pre 2007 the review and all that

Clarkson was close to getting the chop, though some don't believe that, he was close enough, Jeff Kennett or not.

Jock McHale very early on was highly vulnerable .... I think he passed

Hard to quantify really.. but when the blow torch is on soneone.. normally they're given the a.ss