The Jill Meagher case: please read notice in OP

[MaddAdam]

We went to Belfast too and despite all the horror stories we heard it was surprisingly tame. There weren't many people on the streets at night as apparently most people there just get cabs everywhere at night rather than walking.

We still walked around there a fair bit and didn't have any problems. Only worrying thing was a wreath of flowers placed outside a Maccas that we went to, we asked the guy behind the counter what it was all about and he told us some bloke got gunned down there a couple of nights ago which was a tad disturbing. He didn't seem too concerned though like it was just par for the course there.

What I always found about Belfast and Derry was that if you weren't involved in anything, you wouldn't get trouble.

But this is off topic.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I too went down the "it's always the husband" angle, feel like a right twat.

It might be the case for the majority but I won't be doing it again.

Can't think how he must be feeling. My skin was crawling last night FFS.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

If there is to be a crime board, could there possibly have a bit stricter of style of moderating? Like if people are taking the piss that might pass elsewhere.

Particularly if it's violent crime, people just get their back up quickly and it ruins things.

Think this thread shows it can be good if you just have people who are interested in discussion.

 

[DivideandMultiply]

I too went down the "it's always the husband" angle, feel like a right twat.

It might be the case for the majority but I won't be doing it again.

Can't think how he must be feeling. My skin was crawling last night FFS.

Yeah especially with the blanks that have been left about what happened.

On the websleuth forum one of the posters is a journalist. He claimed that when privately briefed one of the reporters actually threw up. The gist was these were hardened reporters and what they were told or shown was truly horrific in nature.

I have a hunch that thankfully the more graphic details (if such things exist) won't make the press.

As for the case, I found this quote again:

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...f-murder-hearing/story-e6frg6n6-1226482868669

Earlier, Coburg neighbour Dale Trotter said he saw at least two cars pull up outside the Coburg house at about 2am on Saturday morning.
"I saw some cars rock up. I didn't suspect anything of it," Mr Trotter said.
Another neighbour, Trish Murray, said she noticed up to four cars outside the house on Saturday.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...f-murder-hearing/story-e6frg6n6-1226482868669

 

[MaddAdam]

I too went down the "it's always the husband" angle, feel like a right twat.

It might be the case for the majority but I won't be doing it again.

Can't think how he must be feeling. My skin was crawling last night FFS.

Him and the brother rocking up to court this morning, fewer than 24 - barely 12 - hours after finding out what had happened to their husband/sister.

Yet calm and dignified despite everything. Admirable.

Talk about putting your head over the ball.

 

[grizzlym]

The cops are red hot on social media sub judice stuff and more importantly, the husband has asked people tone it down.

I strongly suspect this case will be the kicking off point of some major debate and reform about how we manage sub judice in the "age of social media".

Interestingly, I was talking to someone at a media agency today (as in buying/placing/media strategy) and they offered the opinion that this case has seen a quantam leap in how 'normal people' were using social media and actually feeling emotionally involved, and actually contributing. A lot of good could come from this, especially if it ushers in a deeper use of the media by the general public. Especially if you look at how some agencies/organisations are really using social media very effectively i.e Queensland Police. People are actively participating daily, and it's more than just a relaying of information but a two-way dialogue has been created.

 

[grizzlym]

If there is to be a crime board, could there possibly have a bit stricter of style of moderating? Like if people are taking the piss that might pass elsewhere.

Particularly if it's violent crime, people just get their back up quickly and it ruins things.

Think this thread shows it can be good if you just have people who are interested in discussion.

Yes, we'll probably get a group of you people together and find out your thoughts on the board and how it could/should be run.

 

[MaddAdam]

Interestingly, I was talking to someone at a media agency today (as in buying/placing/media strategy) and they offered the opinion that this case has seen a quantam leap in how 'normal people' were using social media and actually feeling emotionally involved, and actually contributing. A lot of good could come from this, especially if it ushers in a deeper use of the media by the general public. Especially if you look at how some agencies/organisations are really using social media very effectively i.e Queensland Police. People are actively participating daily, and it's more than just a relaying of information but a two-way dialogue has been created.

Yeah, it is the proverbially evolving medium. I think here we have seen about the best possible example of how social media can be used for good. But inevitably it can also be abused too and sadly it will be.

Queensland has indeed been a leader in using social media and they are to be commended for that. But there's also concerns about relying on it too much. The fact remains that it is an inherently unstable medium open to massive abuse. FFS - I reckon about a fifth of the accounts I follow on Twitter are "knowingly" fake - Carowhine Wilson etc.

When it comes to offences like Jill Meagher's murder, I'll be willing to lay pounds to ackers that while technology was useful, what really cracked it was good old fashioned police work. Not to get too Jimmy McNulty here, but cops were solving these kind of cases before TV and the telegraph were invented.

 

[HeavyPop]

When it comes to offences like Jill Meagher's murder, I'll be willing to lay pounds to ackers that while technology was useful, what really cracked it was good old fashioned police work. Not to get too Jimmy McNulty here, but cops were solving these kind of cases before TV and the telegraph were invented.

I agree. My dad is an ambulance officer and so he deals with the police quite a bit through assaults etc. He said the police always have a good idea of who to look at whenever something happens due to 99% of these cases involving someone with priors. I suppose the CCTV helped them make the arrest quickly, but I feel like they would have gotten the guy even if they didn't have the footage.

 

[MaddAdam]

I agree. My dad is an ambulance officer and so he deals with the police quite a bit through assaults etc. He said the police always have a good idea of who to look at whenever something happens due to 99% of these cases involving someone with priors. I suppose the CCTV helped them make the arrest quickly, but I feel like they would have gotten the guy even if they didn't have the footage.

I don't know about that as such. Look at Peter Dupas. Took the cops ages to actually nail him. Doesn;t mean the cops didn't KNOW it was him, burden of proof etc.

I suppose the tech gives them an in now.

 

[Aussie Assault]

I agree. My dad is an ambulance officer and so he deals with the police quite a bit through assaults etc. He said the police always have a good idea of who to look at whenever something happens due to 99% of these cases involving someone with priors. I suppose the CCTV helped them make the arrest quickly, but I feel like they would have gotten the guy even if they didn't have the footage.

With this sought of thinking from the police I wonder what they think of the lenient crimes these guys often get through the courts only to get back out quickly & reoffend, often in worse situations. They must feel all their hard work of getting the thugs off the streets in the first place is being undone with our judicial system.

 

[HeavyPop]

I don't know about that as such. Look at Peter Dupas. Took the cops ages to actually nail him. Doesn;t mean the cops didn't KNOW it was him, burden of proof etc.

I suppose the tech gives them an in now.

Sure. I forgot the cops also had that additional CCTV that hasn't be publicly released, so I guess there was maybe a clearer image of the guy in one of those tapes.

 

[Silent Alarm]

Officially creeped the fuark out again. Especially after falling into the trap of murders on Wikipedia.

 

[tandino]

What happened to the mobile phone? Did it turn up?

 

[DrVanNostrand]

Officially creeped the fuark out again. Especially after falling into the trap of murders on Wikipedia.

I do this as well. Stumble accross a random crim's wiki page and end up spending all night reading about serial killers and unsolved murders. Makes sleep and leaving any kind of window open very difficult.

Neighbour's statement about multiple cars is huge. The accused's history was broadcast on c7 up here tonight and was brushed over fairly quickly and not even given in full (as we know it anyway). Leads me to believe these were not the gruesome details that have been alluded to.

 

[HeavyPop]

Yeah, I keep thinking about these horrifying 'off the record' comments and what they could be..

 

[Silent Alarm]

I do this as well. Stumble accross a random crim's wiki page and end up spending all night reading about serial killers and unsolved murders. Makes sleep and leaving any kind of window open very difficult.

Neighbour's statement about multiple cars is huge. The accused's history was broadcast on c7 up here tonight and was brushed over fairly quickly and not even given in full (as we know it anyway). Leads me to believe these were not the gruesome details that have been alluded to.

Definitely. Me and my parents got into Crime Investigation Australia for a while. Probably a pretty elementary TV show, but jesus... some of those stories really creeped me out. I mean, I'm looking forward to it opening, but this crime board will do the same.

Yeah, I keep thinking about these horrifying 'off the record' comments and what they could be..

They'll come out, one day. But they must be pretty awful. These are seasoned journalists, people who have been witness to some pretty horrifying scenes.

 

[DivideandMultiply]

I do this as well. Stumble accross a random crim's wiki page and end up spending all night reading about serial killers and unsolved murders. Makes sleep and leaving any kind of window open very difficult.

Neighbour's statement about multiple cars is huge. The accused's history was broadcast on c7 up here tonight and was brushed over fairly quickly and not even given in full (as we know it anyway). Leads me to believe these were not the gruesome details that have been alluded to.

I think a full or partial criminal history was displayed on screen on Channel 9 in Queensland.

It is only Victoria where these reports and the photo of the accused cannot be shown.

 

[mayhem]

With the report from the neighbor earlier stating cars arriving at 2am, would this be a line of inquiry still being perused?

 

[tandino]

I find the whole "I know something you don't know" sort of stuff by some in the media as serving little purpose.

It just adds to speculation and conjecture. It doesn't add anything apart from the knowledge that something awful has happened on top of what we already know. Tell us, or don't tell us.

I rather not know myself.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Why on earth would they tell the media stuff and then not let them release it? Why tell them?

Bit of a tactic to get them onside and cooperative, rather than just having them dig and dig and find stuff they then release?

 

[DrVanNostrand]

Why on earth would they tell the media stuff and then not let them release it? Why tell them?

Bit of a tactic to get them onside and cooperative, rather than just having them dig and dig and find stuff they then release?

A good thought. If the body was found in tact (which seems to be the case), it's definetely possible. Although these "details" were released before the body was found.

Another idea I had is that the extra details might be what they found at his house, ie. proof of premeditation.

 

[MaddAdam]

I find the whole "I know something you don't know" sort of stuff by some in the media as serving little purpose.

It just adds to speculation and conjecture. It doesn't add anything apart from the knowledge that something awful has happened on top of what we already know. Tell us, or don't tell us.

I rather not know myself.

I agree. The "lead on" approach by the Victorian media - perfected during the gangland stuff - is reprehensible.

 

[DivideandMultiply]

A good thought. If the body was found in tact (which seems to be the case), it's definetely possible. Although these "details" were released before the body was found.

Another idea I had is that the extra details might be what they found at his house, ie. proof of premeditation.

Or evidence of a crime, such as videos or pictures. It would explain the supposed media reactions and how quickly they were able to elicit a confession.

Either that, or that had found a separate murder scene before arresting the suspect.

Mmmmmm some of the reactions or stories seem genuine, some may be cynically contrived. Personally I hope it is the latter and that her suffering was minimal.

 

[MaddAdam]

Why on earth would they tell the media stuff and then not let them release it? Why tell them?

Bit of a tactic to get them onside and cooperative, rather than just having them dig and dig and find stuff they then release?

This is just me speculating but I'm now thinking that the given what everyone knows but can't be mentioned as regards the arrested party, the cops informed the media of all this in attempt to try and prevent prejudicial leaks.