The Statistics Thread

[Allan Shorty]

I have never been very good at music but here I am blowing my own trumpet. I have just created a quiz on the Sporcle website in which you have to name as many Footscray/Western Bulldogs players as you can who have kicked a goal for us in a finals game. There is 153 names in total and all names are listed alphabetically. There will be some names you will know straight away without having to read about their playing career. Anyway, if you fancy yourself with Bulldogs player history, you might feel it worthwhile having a go. I hope 12 minutes is long enough. In case you have never played any Sporcle quizzes before, you only need to type in a surname.

https://www.sporcle.com/games/worbod/footscraywestern-bulldogs-finals-goal-kickers

What a good quiz. ! Well done. I got 50 on my second try.
I liked how typing in the first three letters of one long Italian name was enough !!

 

[worbod]

What a good quiz. ! Well done. I got 50 on my second try.
I liked how typing in the first three letters of one long Italian name was enough !!

Even though he features highly on our Most Games Played list, it's hard to tell how many people would know how to spell his name correctly. I was considering allowing four letters to be sufficient for another Italian surname for somebody who is in our team currently (Of course it's him. It's him. You know who it is). But I figured because Bont is a current player and looks set for a decent career most people know his surname. I have played a few Hawthorn quizzes on Sporcle where typing in Dipper allows DiPierdomenico's name to appear, so I figured it would be suitable for Gia.
Out of curiosity, did you consider Luke Beveridge's name first time you played?

 

[Allan Shorty]

Even though he features highly on our Most Games Played list, it's hard to tell how many people would know how to spell his name correctly. I was considering allowing four letters to be sufficient for another Italian surname for somebody who is in our team currently (Of course it's him. It's him. You know who it is). But I figured because Bont is a current player and looks set for a decent career most people know his surname. I have played a few Hawthorn quizzes on Sporcle where typing in Dipper allows DiPierdomenico's name to appear, so I figured it would be suitable for Gia.
Out of curiosity, did you consider Luke Beveridge's name first time you played?

No I didn’t get beveridge. I fluked a few - eg southern. In going for Robbins I got someone called rob.

 

[Snarls Barkley]

Thanks for the quiz. Really enjoyed it.

Only got 54. Left out some really obvious ones but the time limit got the better of me. Spent about 5 minutes unsuccessfully trying to answer Chris Grant

 

[X_box_X]

I got 75 but I typed in "Grant" and "Chris Grant" about three times and it didn't register for some reason.

It shows you in red the players you missed - I could have sworn I typed in several of those players that appear in red.

 

[dogwatch]

Here are the AFL list turnover stats for the 5 years 2013-2017. It's derived from the sum of players who have been taken off the clubs' lists each year (delistings, trades, retirements and FAs).

The Western Bulldogs have the least number of list changes of any club over the 5 year period, 17.5% less than the AFL average and 38% less than Carlton.

Worth noting also that the league average is about 9 players per club each year, so we shouldn't be too alarmed when people suggest 9-10 list changes.



Some points to note:

• Essendon had an unusually large turnover in 2016 (19) related to their drug bans
• GWS and Gold Coast have had a high number of trades as their list is still settling down (about 25% of all trades involve a GC or GWS player on the move)
• We have seen GC and Brisbane have some apparent problems with the "homesickness factor"
• There seems to be a slight correlation of list stability with ladder position, as you might expect, but it's not really strong. Four of the five best performed clubs in recent years - Hawthorn, Sydney, West Coast and Adelaide - are in the bottom half of the table. The other well-performed club, Geelong, is equal 5th.
• Delistings includes rookie delistings.

 

[worbod]

I got 75 but I typed in "Grant" and "Chris Grant" about three times and it didn't register for some reason.

It shows you in red the players you missed - I could have sworn I typed in several of those players that appear in red.

Thanks for the info about Chris Grant. I had used a hyphen instead of a forward slash when compiling the data, but I have now edited the quiz to allow Grant's name to appear when you type in "Grant". If there any other players you know of specifically whose names were not appearing, let me know and I will check for typos.

 

[BEaston]

Here are the AFL list turnover stats for the 5 years 2013-2017. It's derived from the sum of players who have been taken off the clubs' lists each year (delistings, trades, retirements and FAs).

The Western Bulldogs have the least number of list changes of any club over the 5 year period, 17.5% less than the AFL average and 38% less than Carlton.

Worth noting also that the league average is about 9 players per club each year, so we shouldn't be too alarmed when people suggest 9-10 list changes.

View attachment 540288

Some points to note:

• Essendon had an unusually large turnover in 2016 (19) related to their drug bans
• GWS and Gold Coast have had a high number of trades as their list is still settling down (about 25% of all trades involve a GC or GWS player on the move)
• We have seen GC and Brisbane have some apparent problems with the "homesickness factor"
• There seems to be a slight correlation of list stability with ladder position, as you might expect, but it's not really strong. Four of the five best performed clubs in recent years - Hawthorn, Sydney, West Coast and Adelaide - are in the bottom half of the table. The other well-performed club, Geelong, is equal 5th.
• Delistings includes rookie delistings.

Interesting. Certainly backs up the common criticism you see of JMac, that he retained players that he maybe should have gotten rid of.

 

[Mofra]

Interesting. Certainly backs up the common criticism you see of JMac, that he retained players that he maybe should have gotten rid of.

We went through a fair rebuild pre-Bevo era so had a lot of kids to develop and retain relative to other clubs but I do think there have been a few head-scratchers in recent years.
We've got at least three players who are contracted for next year who can feel pretty lucky about that (Redpath, Roberts, Webb).

 

[dogwatch]

Understandably, there's a fair bit of fear created by Free Agency. In particular that the well-to-do and well-performed clubs will simply get star players for free. And that the clubs to suffer most will be the minnows.

FA has now run for six years (2018 will be year 7) so here are the results so far.

In this chart I have not distinguished between UFAs and RFAs. There were 33 FA movements in total.
I have not included DFAs since their club didn't want them anyway. The real discussion needs to be about the UFAs and RFAs.



Comments:
Collingwood has gained four players from FA. Every other club has gained between 1 and 3 players. Not a big range really.

Hawthorn has been the biggest loser of FAs (5) followed by Melbourne and Geelong (4) while at the other end Essendon have lost none but they had the drug scandal which put a big cloud over their list for a while. The two expansion clubs have lost none but that's because no player would have qualified for FA yet.

The biggest nett gain is 2 (Collingwood, Essendon, Norf and Gold Coast) and the biggest nett loss is 3 (Melbourne).

So on sheer numbers you'd say there's no strong trend toward the better off clubs.

However I then went back and identified any FAs who were considered star players at the time of their transfer. It's pretty subjective I know, but for a quick and nasty analysis here are the ones I came up with:

Year - Type - Player - To - From
2012 UFA - Jared Rivers - Gee - Melb
2012 RFA - Brendon Goddard - Ess - StK
2013 RFA - Eddie Betts - Adel - Carl
2013 RFA - Lance Franklin - Syd - Haw
2014 UFA - James Frawley - Haw - Melb

NB:

• I left out Shaun Higgins because when he left he was a whipping boy and not the star he later became. Many were happy to see him go.
• I left out some others because although they had been very good players they were already 30-ish and/or in decline (dal Santo, Rockliff, Waite, Dale Thomas). Maybe a case could be made for Rockliff (only 28yo) but not too many clubs were clamouring for his services.

So from that short list of five you could perhaps argue that it's only the big FAs that count - the lesser known FAs are more numerous but mostly inconsequential because they frequently involve a player just looking for a better opportunity. They are not players every club would love to get on their list.

With these five stars it was the better off clubs that got them all. Interestingly there hasn't been a really big name FA for four years.
Obviously you'd add Tom Lynch to that group if he goes to Richmond this year.

 

[Sharkey66]

Need to add Dangerfield as he was a matched free agency signing who was traded

 

[dogwatch]

Need to add Dangerfield as he was a matched free agency signing who was traded

Surely not, if the club chose to trade him after matching the salary.

 

[giblj]

Just noticed that with his stellar year this year Jack Macrae (26.98) has now overtaken Terry Wallace (26.49) as the player with the most disposals per game for the Bulldogs (stats go back to 1965). Given that he's averaged over 26 from his second season onwards I'd back him to hold onto the record, too.

(EDIT: Updated for the end of the 2018 season)

The top 10 is:
1. Jack Macrae (26.98 disposals per game)
2. Terry Wallace (26.49)
3. Scott West (25.38)
4. Matthew Boyd (25.04)
5. Simon Atkins (24.44)
6. Daniel Cross (23.53)
7. Adrian Gallagher (23.39)
8. Lachie Hunter (23.30)
9. Peter Featherby (22.90)
10. David Thorpe (22.81)

 

[giblj]

Some updates to Bulldogs record lists after this season:

New club records achieved:
- Jack Macrae's 47 disposals against Brisbane in round 8 equalled the club record.
- Jack Macrae broke the club record for most contested possessions in a game with 25 against Gold Coast in round 7, and then equalled his own record against Adelaide two weeks later.
- Lachie Hunter equalled the club record for most uncontested possessions in a game with 32 against North Melbourne in round 21 (32 has now been achieved four times: by Nathan Eagleton and Jack Macrae once each and by Lachie Hunter twice).

Top 10 in single season club records:
- Lachie Hunter's 431 uncontested possessions is the 4th most by a Bulldogs player in a single season (Record: 514 by Lachie Hunter in 2016).
- Toby McLean's 126 tackles this season is the 9th most by a Bulldogs player in a single season (Record: 173 by Tom Liberatore in 2014).

Top 10 in single game club records:
- Jack Macrae's 29 handballs against Brisbane in round 8 is equal 3rd most by a Bulldog (Record: 31 by Matthew Boyd)
- Hayden Crozier's 12 rebounds against North Melbourne in round 14 and Jason Johannisen's 12 against St Kilda in round 20 are equal 3rd most by a Bulldog (Record: 15 by Lindsay Gilbee)
- Lewis Young's 14 one percenters against Gold Coast in round 7 is the equal 5th most by a Bulldog (Record: 15 by Brian Lake and Jordan Roughead)
- Caleb Daniel's 31 uncontested possessions against North Melbourne in round 21 is the equal 5th most by a Bulldog (Record: 32 by Nathan Eagleton, Jack Macrae and Lachie Hunter).
- Jason Johannisen's 30 uncontested possessions against Hawthorn in round 16 and Jack Macrae's 30 against Richmond in round 23 are equal 7th most by a Bulldog.
- Lachie Hunter's 44 disposals against North Melbourne in round 21 is equal 8th most by a Bulldog (Record: 47 by Jack Macrae and some other guy maybe).
- Aaron Naughton's 5 contested marks against Richmond in round 23 is equal 9th most by a Bulldog (Record: 7 by Chris Grant).
- Toby McLean's 13 tackles against Gold Coast in round 7 and Jack Macrae's 13 against Adelaide in round 9 are equal 10th most by a Bulldog (Record: 19 by Tom Liberatore).

 

[Fossie 32]

Some updates to Bulldogs record lists after this season:

New club records achieved:
- Jack Macrae's 47 disposals against Brisbane in round 8 equalled the club record.
- Jack Macrae broke the club record for most contested possessions in a game with 25 against Gold Coast in round 7, and then equalled his own record against Adelaide two weeks later.
- Lachie Hunter equalled the club record for most uncontested possessions in a game with 32 against North Melbourne in round 21 (32 has now been achieved four times: by Nathan Eagleton and Jack Macrae once each and by Lachie Hunter twice).

Top 10 in single season club records:
- Lachie Hunter's 431 uncontested possessions is the 4th most by a Bulldogs player in a single season (Record: 514 by Lachie Hunter in 2016).
- Toby McLean's 126 tackles this season is the 9th most by a Bulldogs player in a single season (Record: 173 by Tom Liberatore in 2014).

Top 10 in single game club records:
- Jack Macrae's 29 handballs against Brisbane in round 8 is equal 3rd most by a Bulldog (Record: 31 by Matthew Boyd)
- Hayden Crozier's 12 rebounds against North Melbourne in round 14 and Jason Johannisen's 12 against St Kilda in round 20 are equal 3rd most by a Bulldog (Record: 15 by Lindsay Gilbee)
- Lewis Young's 14 one percenters against Gold Coast in round 7 is the equal 5th most by a Bulldog (Record: 15 by Brian Lake and Jordan Roughead)
- Caleb Daniel's 31 uncontested possessions against North Melbourne in round 21 is the equal 5th most by a Bulldog (Record: 32 by Nathan Eagleton, Jack Macrae and Lachie Hunter).
- Jason Johannisen's 30 uncontested possessions against Hawthorn in round 16 and Jack Macrae's 30 against Richmond in round 23 are equal 7th most by a Bulldog.
- Lachie Hunter's 44 disposals against North Melbourne in round 21 is equal 8th most by a Bulldog (Record: 47 by Jack Macrae and some other guy maybe).
- Aaron Naughton's 5 contested marks against Richmond in round 23 is equal 9th most by a Bulldog (Record: 7 by Chris Grant).
- Toby McLean's 13 tackles against Gold Coast in round 7 and Jack Macrae's 13 against Adelaide in round 9 are equal 10th most by a Bulldog (Record: 19 by Tom Liberatore).

Awesome thanks!

 

[JJHunter]

Hopefully enough people have a read here..
https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy...2=19&type=A&pid1=3842&pid2=3450&fid1=S&fid2=S

Hunters year not looked on probably as good as it should have been.
People love Gaff but essentially nothing between them

 

[giblj]

Hopefully enough people have a read here..
https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy...2=19&type=A&pid1=3842&pid2=3450&fid1=S&fid2=S

Hunters year not looked on probably as good as it should have been.
People love Gaff but essentially nothing between them

He's a severely underrated player in the wider football world and probably even more underrated by fans of his own club.

 

[dogwatch]

Hopefully enough people have a read here..
https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy...2=19&type=A&pid1=3842&pid2=3450&fid1=S&fid2=S

Hunters year not looked on probably as good as it should have been.
People love Gaff but essentially nothing between them

Gaff has him covered on most stats but not by a lot. When you consider Gaff has entered his prime years (25+) while Hunter is still 23 (2.5 years younger) there's certainly a lot to like about Lachie.

However if Hunter put himself on the market what do you think he'd get? I reckon it wouldn't be a long way behind what Gaff's asking.

The perception that Hunter is a bit bland might come from the fact that what he does is rarely eye-catching ... no scintillating bursts away from the pack. No 40m bullet passes onto the tit of a leading forward. In fact it's been said more than once that you need to be at the ground (not watching TV) to appreciate a lot of the good work and gut-running that Hunter does.

I reckon his contribution will be well recognised on CSM night. He's my pick for second behind Macrae, but he could even win it because he played 2 games more than Macrae and would rack up votes in nearly every game.

 

[worbod]

Bulldogs players who won a club best and fairest and also won a club best and fairest in another major competition.

Player	Bulldogs Best & Fairest	Other club Best & Fairest
Gary Dempsey	1970, 1973, 1974, 1975, 1976, 1977	Southport (QAFL) 1986
Brad Hardie	1986	South Fremantle (WAFL) 1982
Tony McGuinness	1987	Glenelg (SANFL) 1982
Arthur Olliver	1941, 1944	New Norfolk (TFL) 1951
Andrew Purser	1984	East Fremantle (WAFL) 1981

 

[worbod]

Bulldogs coaches who also coached a club in another major competition. (listed alphabetically)

Coach	club	games	won	lost	draw	win %	finals	won	lost	win %	premierships
Alec Eason	Footscray, 1929	18	6	11	1	36.11	0	0	0	-	0
	Prahran (VFA), 1933	22	5	16	1	25.00	0	0	0	-	0
	TOTAL	40	11	27	2	30.00	0	0	0	-	0
Bill Goggin	Footscray, 1976-78	46	21	23	2	47.82	1	0	1	0.00	0
	Geelong, 1980-82	71	41	30	0	57.74	5	1	4	20.00	0
	Geelong West (VFA), 1972-75, 1979	99	76	23	0	76.76	9	5	4	55.55	2
	TOTAL	216	138	76	2	64.35	15	6	9	40.00	2
Allan Hopkins	Footscray, 1930	18	4	14	0	22.22	0	0	0	-	0
	Yarraville (VFA), 1935-36, 1940	58	27	31	0	46.55	2	2	0	100.00	1
	TOTAL	76	31	45	0	40.78	2	2	0	100.00	1
Alan Joyce	Footscray, 1994-96	57	25	30	2	45.61	3	0	3	0.00	0
	Hawthorn, 1988, 1991-93	93	67	26	0	72.04	7	5	2	71.42	2
	Preston (VFA), 1966-70	98	70	28	0	71.42	8	5	3	62.50	2
	East Fremantle (WAFL), 1971-72, 77-78	89	47	42	0	52.80	5	2	3	40.00	0
	Perth (WAFL), 1980-81	42	10	32	0	23.80	0	0	0	-	0
	TOTAL	379	219	158	2	58.04	23	12	11	52.17	4
Don McKenzie	Footscray, 1978-79, 1982	44	14	29	1	32.95	0	0	0	-	0
	Sunshine (VFA), 1971-74	74	35	39	0	47.29	2	2	0	100.00	1
	TOTAL	118	49	68	1	41.94	2	2	0	100.00	1
Alby Morrison	Footscray, 1934-35	16	4	12	0	25.00	0	0	0	-	0
	Preston (VFA), 1939-40	41	23	18	0	56.09	1	0	1	0.00	0
	TOTAL	57	27	30	0	47.36	1	0	1	0.00	0
Arthur Olliver	Footscray, 1943-46, 1948-50	131	68	62	1	52.29	2	0	2	0.00	0
	New Norfolk (TFL), 1951-53	46	14	32	0	30.43	1	0	1	0.00	0
	TOTAL	177	82	94	1	46.61	3	0	3	0.00	0
Peter Rohde	Western Bulldogs, 2002-04	45	9	35	1	21.11	0	0	0	-	0
	Norwood (SANFL), 1996-99	92	63	29	0	68.47	12	6	6	50.00	1
	TOTAL	137	72	64	1	52.91	12	6	6	50.00	1
Terry Wheeler	Footscray, 1990-94	91	50	40	1	55.49	3	1	2	33.33	0
	Williamstown (VFA), 1984-88	101	64	37	0	63.36	11	8	3	72.72	1
	TOTAL	192	114	77	1	59.63	14	9	5	64.28	1
Ted Whitten	Footscray, 1957-66, 1969-71	228	91	137	0	39.91	3	2	1	66.66	0
	Williamstown (VFA), 1975	18	4	14	0	22.22	0	0	0	-	0
	TOTAL	246	95	151	0	38.61	3	2	1	66.66	0

 

[TempletonTheRat]

oh, I always though Goggin came to us from Geelong and brought Bluey with him. I guess he sort of did as he played for them but I didn't realise it was via the VFA

 

[dogwatch]

Gaff has him covered on most stats but not by a lot. When you consider Gaff has entered his prime years (25+) while Hunter is still 23 (2.5 years younger) there's certainly a lot to like about Lachie.

However if Hunter put himself on the market what do you think he'd get? I reckon it wouldn't be a long way behind what Gaff's asking.

The perception that Hunter is a bit bland might come from the fact that what he does is rarely eye-catching ... no scintillating bursts away from the pack. No 40m bullet passes onto the tit of a leading forward. In fact it's been said more than once that you need to be at the ground (not watching TV) to appreciate a lot of the good work and gut-running that Hunter does.

I reckon his contribution will be well recognised on CSM night. He's my pick for second behind Macrae, but he could even win it because he played 2 games more than Macrae and would rack up votes in nearly every game.

LOL, nice pick-up Fossie 32 especially that last para.

Might change my BF name to nostradogwatch ...

 

[worbod]

In the VFL on June 14, 1980, Footscray, also known as the Bulldogs, had their first win for the season when they defeated Fitzroy by 44 points: 25.17 (167) to 18.15 (123).
In the NWFU on June 14, 1980, Cooee, also known as the Bulldogs, had their first win for the season when they defeated Devonport by 44 points: 19.19 (133) to 12.17 (89).

 

[VL3OJ]

I have never been very good at music but here I am blowing my own trumpet. I have just created a quiz on the Sporcle website in which you have to name as many Footscray/Western Bulldogs players as you can who have kicked a goal for us in a finals game. There is 153 names in total and all names are listed alphabetically. There will be some names you will know straight away without having to read about their playing career. Anyway, if you fancy yourself with Bulldogs player history, you might feel it worthwhile having a go. I hope 12 minutes is long enough. In case you have never played any Sporcle quizzes before, you only need to type in a surname.

https://www.sporcle.com/games/worbod/footscraywestern-bulldogs-finals-goal-kickers

POTY - Superb effort!

 

[giblj]

Bulldogs players whose 2018 disposal output was the biggest percentage above their career average entering the year:

1. Hayden Crozier - 50% above previous career average
2. Josh Dunkley - 41%
3. Josh Schache - 39%
4. Lachie Hunter - 38%
5. Jack Macrae - 27%
6. Bailey Williams - 25%
7. Matt Suckling - 21%
8. Toby McLean - 21%
9. Jackson Trengove - 18%
10. Tom Boyd - 14%