The Toon Army thread

[wellsy]

Even when he does put out a good side the football is uninspiring and just generally unattractive especially the Liverpool game and from what i have read the Spurs game aswell. We need a tactician and someone who can inspire the players to perform and give their all week in week out. Souness doesnt do that at all.

Oh and in good news scans have revealed that Given doesnt have a broken thumb and it is severe bruising at the base of his thumb. Still in doubt though for Boro tonight.

 

[CarterS]

Souness wants more money to spend now Owen's out, that's fine and all but how much money have we spent already?

Our squad is already pretty bare so this talk of offloading Faye, Bowyer etc. is a bit worrying.

We've been linked to Larrson as a short term replacement, the guy I'd want to replace Shearer in the long term though is Ashton from Norwich, I've seen some of him and he looks a treat. Stick him with Owen next season.

 

[CarterS]

He's the only player on the pitch when we are playing like turkeys, that puts his 100% into everything, every tackle and challenge. The only one who doesn't look like he'd rather be anywhere else, apart from Shay and Alan. i like him, he's got fire in his belly, a lot like Bellamy, oh how we could do with Bellamy right now huh?!

 

[Mel B]

He's the only player on the pitch when we are playing like turkeys, that puts his 100% into everything, every tackle and challenge. The only one who doesn't look like he'd rather be anywhere else, apart from Shay and Alan. i like him, he's got fire in his belly, a lot like Bellamy, oh how we could do with Bellamy right now huh?!

Bellamy didn't want to wear the Black and White. Simple as that. He can go to hell at Blackburn.

 

[CarterS]

Yes he did, he just thought Souness was a tosser and he's not alone there. He's said he'd jump at the chance to come back after Souness goes, i think.

 

[Mel B]

Yes he did, he just thought Souness was a tosser and he's not alone there. He's said he'd jump at the chance to come back after Souness goes, i think.

Bellamy is not welcome back at my club.

 

[tribey]

Well, we missed out on the shame of being beaten by boro by seconds.

Awful performance, but not unexpected. Faye? Clark? Elliott? Bramble? Ramage? Ameobi? Practically a reserve team.

Not many positives at all, apart from Solano's first half and some promising signs from Luque. If Souey persists with the Spaniard up front and allows him to sharpen up and get used to our system (which at the moment is half 4-4-2, half 4-5-1 Allardyce) I reckon he'll do the business.

 

[Mel B]

Well, we missed out on the shame of being beaten by boro by seconds.

Awful performance, but not unexpected. Faye? Clark? Elliott? Bramble? Ramage? Ameobi? Practically a reserve team.

Not many positives at all, apart from Solano's first half and some promising signs from Luque. If Souey persists with the Spaniard up front and allows him to sharpen up and get used to our system (which at the moment is half 4-4-2, half 4-5-1 Allardyce) I reckon he'll do the business.

I was supposed to be at St James' Park. Newcastle Brown Stand. Row D seat 0056. But i thought ******** it. Different reasons. Hey ho.

 

[CarterS]

Forget sacking Souness, how quickly can we get Bramble and Boumsong out of there?

Just shocking. Your right though, give Luque a chance to settle in and he'll be a good player for us. I've got a bit more sympathy for Souness after this - he can't be held accountable for the defences individual mistakes - but what he can do is have 2 new centre backs in before the end of the transfer window.

 

[Borgsta]

Souness in Carr collision Jan 2 2006
By Alan Oliver, The Evening Chronicle

Graeme Souness had a bust-up with defender Stephen Carr before the Newcastle squad flew to London for Saturday's game with Spurs.

And the outcome was that, after originally being named in the squad to go to his former club, the 29-year-old former Republic of Ireland international did not even travel.

I understand that at one point Souness asked Carr if he was fully committed to Newcastle United - and there is now talk that the defender may ask for a transfer.

Whether that happens, or whether the incident is dead, remains to be seen.

However, when asked at White Hart Lane on Saturday night whether Emre or Stephen Carr would be available for today's game with Middlesbrough, assistant manager Alan Murray - who is doing a lot of the post-match press work these days - rapped: "Not Emre. I am reluctant to say anything about Stephen Carr because he trained at 9.30 on Friday morning and he was alright, and at 12 o'clock wasn't, so I don't know."

Carr has not played for United since the derby victory over Sunderland at St James' Park on October 23.

He went to Germany a couple of days later for a hernia operation and was followed within the week by Alan Shearer.

And while the skipper missed only one game - at Chelsea - Carr has yet to return to first team duty, and in the present circumstances Souness's frustration is understandable.

However, while I gather Carr's hernia is okay after the operation, he has had a problem with his groin on the other side.

Carr has been booed by Spurs fans whenever he has played for United against his former side and Saturday would have been no different.

Indeed, after taunting Souness on Saturday with chants of "Souness out" and "There's only one Bobby Robson," the ecstatic Spurs supporters turned their attention to their former long-serving full-back.

About 15 minutes from the end the chant of "Are you watching Stephen Carr? " reverberated around White Hart Lane. And, unknown to the Spurs fans, the answer was no.

These are difficult times for Souness, and the bust-up with Carr follows on from a report that said the England Under-21 camp expected Steven Taylor to have the operation on his shoulder after he was injured training with them back in November.

But Taylor only had the op over the weekend and, like Michael Owen, is expected to be out for 10 weeks.

 

[wellsy]

Yes he did, he just thought Souness was a tosser and he's not alone there. He's said he'd jump at the chance to come back after Souness goes, i think.

Agreed, Bellamy tried his heart out for this club in the time he was here but inevitably just didnt see eye to eye with Souness.

Souness in Carr collision

Here we go again, from what NUFC.com are saying Souness wanted him rushed back into the first team but Carr wanted to give it a bit longer. As NUFC.com also said in our situation with rushing players back it seems like a pretty logical call.

Last night was another pathetic performance and Clark saved Souness from more pressure until we lose at Mansfield in a few days. I hope to god he goes soon the football is shocking.

The 3 B's at the back were shocking, not quite the B Sharps but at times they were shocking. It is frustrating that it is conceding us goals...

 

[Ed_Gein]

Bellamy fell out with Shearer too if the news reports i read are correct. After he joined Celtic, apparently Bellamy sent Shearer text messages saying he is 'too old and slow' and the likes.

 

[wellsy]

Bellamy fell out with Shearer too if the news reports i read are correct. After he joined Celtic, apparently Bellamy sent Shearer text messages saying he is 'too old and slow' and the likes.

That was also true. Compared to Bellamy, Shearer is old and slow i guess thats what he meant

 

[tribey]

Ameobi has collected a hip injury apparently, yet to be fully assessed but the current state of play is:

# Given - severely bruised thumb, should be ok though he wasn't at all tested vs. boro
# Ramage - achilles pinch, was passed fit but looked to be labouring from the hour mark
# Carr - hernia, groin, bustup with souness(?)
# Taylor - dislocated shoulder
# Moore - hamstring
# Emre - hamstring
# Parker - knee
# Bowyer - suspended (next available for Fulham away)
# Dyer - hamstring, complications due to medication for unrelated condition
# Owen - broken toe/foot
# Ameobi - hip

How long until Souey does a Gullit and pulls the shirt on, I wonder?

 

[CarterS]

Parker and Ameobi have been injured now.

This is a circus!

 

[moomba]

At some stage you need to ask the question whether it's bad luck or bad management (Geordies have probably been asking this for a while). If I was a toon supporter I'd want to know:

- Are players being rushed back and forced to play before they are fully recovered (a la Taylor)

- Are injections used more than at other clubs, just to get players out on the pitch more.

- What is the state of the training facilities, and is the training itself contributing to injuries (I know Souness has blamed the hardness of the ground at the training facility before). I can't recall if Blackburns injury record under Souness was particularly bad (or good).

- are match day recovery procedures the same as other clubs.

- is a night out after the match still par for the course (alcohol being a big contributor to soft tissue injuries).

- what is the state of the physio/medical facilities compared to other clubs.

- what is the quality of the physio/medical staff compared to other clubs.

I know some of the injuries (breaks etc) can't be blamed on anything other than bad luck, but this does seem out of the ordinary. City isn't a great example to follow, Danny Mills played with a break in his shin for a month before it was diagnosed, Claudio Reyna played with a break in his foot/ankle for a month before diagnosis.

 

[Convict]

rumors floating around that souey will be gone by the mansfield game...

also big-ups to moomba for bringing alot to this thread from a non toon supporters perspective


Parker out for 8 weeks! Man we are screwed

 

[CarterS]

Quiet rumour going around that Shearer will be boss with Rob Lee 2nd in charge (having actual qualifications is secondary)

Obituaries being drawn up for Souey though, his time seems to have come, all the NUFC boards are in overdrive.

 

[Borgsta]

Parker out for 8 weeks! Man we are screwed

Wow that is really the end of the line Id think. Newcastle are in a lot of trouble and to add this is possibly the final straw. Souey is definately gone and unfortunately for him it aint all his fault.

Moomba's previous post is spot on too, does anyone have the answers to his questions?

 

[wellsy]

- Are players being rushed back and forced to play before they are fully recovered (a la Taylor)

Taylor said it himself that it was a risk and he was happy to take it. Obviously it didnt work and he could of gotten through that game and played out the whole season without it going again or he could last 4 games or only half a game. It was a risk that Taylor was happy to take and the management took that risk. Now we know in hindsight maybe a pin to set it in place would of been the better option.

I dont however agree we are bringing some players back too quickly, we always have rushed players back from injury and not brought them through the right channels eg the reserves or giving them bits of game time etc

- Are injections used more than at other clubs, just to get players out on the pitch more.

Dont think i or we could answer that one, guess thats up for the management and physios to work out. Anything from supporters would just be a guess.

- What is the state of the training facilities, and is the training itself contributing to injuries (I know Souness has blamed the hardness of the ground at the training facility before). I can't recall if Blackburns injury record under Souness was particularly bad (or good).

We moved to rectify the situation with the new training ground after Emre's hamstring went (i think) and it semi worked. Maybe the cold north east could be a problematic area but then again the management side should be smart enough to realise this and change the training accordingly. I dont even know if they have a strength and conditioning coach of any sort to help out in these areas.

I think Souness had a poor fitness record at Blackburn and in general a poor training record aswell. I dont think any of our staff actually have a UEFA coaching badge at all....

- are match day recovery procedures the same as other clubs.

Going out on the ******** isnt acceptable? Nah once again i would be only guessing as to what we do. CHO replacement would obviously be high as well as replacing lost electrolytes. Cool downs and warm downs with ice baths, showers, stretching and general dietary needs would probably be maintained by the dietician at the club (if we have one, being such a high profile sport and such a big club you would think they would have one... wouldnt you?)

- is a night out after the match still par for the course (alcohol being a big contributor to soft tissue injuries).

Once again it should be the players responsibility to know that drinking alcohol during the season is basically a no no. Some players in the past have had the bling bling attitude and have been seen out on the town. But ulitimately they will pay through their careers. Professional players like Parker will set an example for the others. But ultimately it is the players responsibility. Wouldnt think Emre, Luque, Parker, Ameobi, Shearer et al would be big drinkers to be honest.

- what is the state of the physio/medical facilities compared to other clubs.

- what is the quality of the physio/medical staff compared to other clubs.

Always a big talking point with the club. Maybe it is time to change but apparently (i might have to dig it up cause im not sure) but we have one the leading physio's going around whom came on board earlier in the season. Cant remember his name though....

Take an AFL case in point during this year. AC took Andrew Russell from Port Adelaide and basically we have had a huge reduction in soft tissue injuries due to improved training methods. Although this has nothing to do with the medical or physio side but as an additional strength and conditioning coach it would be handy to have for NUFC to oversee our training compared to Souness and his henchmen.

 

[CarterS]

At some stage you need to ask the question whether it's bad luck or bad management (Geordies have probably been asking this for a while). If I was a toon supporter I'd want to know:

- Are players being rushed back and forced to play before they are fully recovered (a la Taylor)

- Are injections used more than at other clubs, just to get players out on the pitch more.

- What is the state of the training facilities, and is the training itself contributing to injuries (I know Souness has blamed the hardness of the ground at the training facility before). I can't recall if Blackburns injury record under Souness was particularly bad (or good).

- are match day recovery procedures the same as other clubs.

- is a night out after the match still par for the course (alcohol being a big contributor to soft tissue injuries).

- what is the state of the physio/medical facilities compared to other clubs.

- what is the quality of the physio/medical staff compared to other clubs.

I know some of the injuries (breaks etc) can't be blamed on anything other than bad luck, but this does seem out of the ordinary. City isn't a great example to follow, Danny Mills played with a break in his shin for a month before it was diagnosed, Claudio Reyna played with a break in his foot/ankle for a month before diagnosis.

- yes, this was the reason for the supposed bustup between Souness and Carr, after seeing Dyer, Emre, Parker, Taylor all injured after being rushed back he didn't want to come straight back in after 2 1/2 months out.

- Bramble is currently on injections to manage an injury, that might explain some of his mistakes and immobility.

- considering the number of hammy injuries we are suffering the hardness of the training surface is probably a big issue.

can't really answer the rest of the questions, but Real Madrid did blame Woodgate's injury on the incompetence of our medical staff. it has to be more than luck, i do feel some sympathy for Souness, i like the toughness he brought to us and he definitely sorted out some of the people who needed sorting out in the dressing room, his work in the transfer window has been generally very good, but tactically he just doesn't seem to be up to it. Hope he gets another chance at another club though.

 

[wellsy]

can't really answer the rest of the questions, but Real Madrid did blame Woodgate's injury on the incompetence of our medical staff.

Funny thing is did their medical staff put him through a medical? He did have a thigh injury at the time so god knows. Maybe the Real Madrid staff are as bad as ours!

 

[tribey]

Nice post Moomba.

In regards to Steven Taylor, as I said after he re-did his shoulder at Anfield:

# Our medical staff are complete and utter ****wits. The vast majority of us here with backgrounds in Aussie Rules could tell you that you can't cure shoulder dislocations with rest - it's surgery or surgery. Yet we give Taylor a month or so's rest and send him out against a bloke who's 6'7"... see you next season Steven.

This isn't a phenomenon limited to Souness' reign however. In past years we've had Cort, Bellamy, Dyer (repeatedly), Lua Lua, Viana and Woodgate all rushed back after injury - only to reinjure or further aggravate the existing complaint.

In some of those cases above the risk has been well worth it as we've been in battles for 4th place, extended cup runs or even unlikely title challenges, but this season has been ridiculous, with key men such as Emre, Taylor and Dyer - you could even count Moore given our shoddy backline - rushed back with a majority of the season still to go.

Whatever the case, the entire club needs an overhaul.

# Our physios/medicos need replacing. They're either incompetent or gutless.

# The academy has produced one cast-iron first teamer since Aaron Hughes graduated in 97. Meanwhile even the likes of Boro have kids coming through everywhere.

# If we have a defensive coach he should be shot. If we don't, we should get one.

Funny thing is did their medical staff put him through a medical? He did have a thigh injury at the time so god knows. Maybe the Real Madrid staff are as bad as ours!

Remember when that story first broke?!

£13.5m or whatever it was for a player who practically ripped his quad in half a couple of months beforehand and hadn't played since.

Pure idiocy on their part.

 

[CarterS]

I think i might be the only Toon supporter that actually wouldn't mind if we appointed David O'Leary. Never finished outside the top 5 at Leeds, their collapse wasn't really his fault. And i think with some resources he could do much better than he is currently doing with Villa.

 

[Borgsta]

Not really big news, but I think its definately good news.

French winger Robert completes Benfica move


Laurent Robert has completed a transfer to Benfica after passing a medical this morning.

The 30-year-old French midfielder, who cost Newcastle £9.5million when he signed from Paris St-Germain in August 2001, has joined the Lisbon club on what is thought to be a free transfer.

Robert moved to Portsmouth last June on loan but has since been deemed surplus to requirements at Fratton Park following the recent return of Harry Redknapp as manager.

He could be in line for a return to England in February when Liverpool play Benfica in the Champions League.

Robert, who is reported to have signed a two-and-a-half year contract, told the Portuguese press soon after his arrival this morning: 'This is a super club and they showed a lot of interest in me. I am very happy to be here.

'To be able to play in the Champions League is fantastic, and that is why I am here today.'