Mega Thread Trade and List Management discussion

[TBOW]

Higgins for a second rd pick.
Minson + pick 27... for pick 15 + Smedts (Geelong).
Cooney + pick 28... for pick 16

It would give us picks 5, 15, 16, 45, etc. Plus Smedts on our list.

I would not be opposed to either of those trades, I just don't see them happening. I can't see clubs taking a 10 pick downgrade on their first round picks for players in their 30's with queries on their fitness.

Also I personally have no issue going backwards next season if it leaves us in a better position long term. I guess it is up to the club to determine whether trading out senior players would do that or do the opposite.

 

[TedDougChris]

So what's your solution ?
Keep playing Campbell and Cordy at Footscray for 5 years?

Not sure to be honest. Certainly not your suggestion above and I didn't suggest anything like this - just because I'm presenting a dissenting view on something doesn't mean that I'm suggesting complete bullshit.

I just find it strange that we are so willing to accept one of our few elite players (and when fit he is one of the best big men in the comp) walk away for a slight pick upgrade...

At the conclusion of the season one of the points repeatedly made was that we would have won a few more games if Minson and Griffen were fully fit. And after seeing how important a dominant ruckman can be in the VFL finals, I'm just surprised by the lack of recognition of this. We are all hoping for improvement next year, somewhere between 8 - 12 wins seems to be peoples targets - I can't see us going forward (in terms of wins and ladder progression) next year if we're going to struggle late in quarters and late in games with winning a ruck contest. This will translate to increased pressure on our midfield, we'll setup with a defensive mindset and potentially get run over later in games. And opposition coaches will recognise it and exploit it...

We all seem to welcome retaining Boyd - in a position where we are bursting with players trying to get a game - but happily shift Minson off when we don't have a ready replacement. In addition to this, Minson is one of the few truly aggressive players we have - important in a team of mostly younger guys.

We all know there needs to be a transition from Minson to Campbell - but on what we saw this year - he's not ready for a full season. Campbell is one of the most promising big men I can remember seeing at his age at the Dogs - but he's young for a full time ruckman. I would have thought we had more situations during the year where Cordy/Campbell are trialled at AFL level (like the Sydney game), as well as increased Minson/Campbell combinations during the year.

I realise there is a balancing act when trading out players in terms of their trade value and benefit to the both sides (existing and new club) and I accept you can't always get good value for a player - but Geelong would have played a PF this year with Minson (although they would have beat North with Stevie J as well) and appear to think he'll help them dramatically in the short term.

If we need to bring a ruckman in (which will most likely be with a later pick), then we are losing Minson, a 2nd round pick (which is what has been suggested) and a 4th round pick (for example to replace Minson with Giles) - to get an upgrade from 26 - 15 in the draft order. I'd rather just keep Minson....

Now it is the silly season and it all may amount to nothing - I'm just surprised at the lack of recognition of the impact that losing the big fella will have. And Will's form may drop off the edge of a cliff and everyone will be saying 'We should have traded him when we had the chance...'. I'll just be far less optimistic for next year if Minson leaves - and I prefer to be optimistic at this time of year.....

 

[doggies ftw]

Who, and where?

I've seen this phrase repeated 3 times in the last few days on this board (possibly by you, I'm not sure, but will use your latest instance to question it, sorry).

Apart from Giles, what other mature, capable rucks are flooding the market at the moment who will come cheap?

Giles, Sinclair, Currie, Lowden, probably quite a few others on lists and I'm sure there would be plenty of rucks in the state leagues who could come in and play as a back up which is all they would be needed for.

Clubs manage to find good enough rucks for very cheap all the time.

 

[Dogs Rule]

I reckon we could get just as much out of Cordy and Campbell as we got out of Minno this year, and I'd take a small hit in the ruck for this year if it meant we could develop those guys better and also bring in someone like Reid or another good draftee with what we get for Minno. Besides a mature ruck who is at least capable can be found just about anywhere for very little.


I call so much bullshit on this it's not funny. What about all the guys young and old joking around at the Brownlow, didn't look like too much bad blood, if you follow the guys on social media they all seem pretty close - What about the holiday that Koby, Picken, Wallis, Hunter, Minno, Gia, Griff and Higgins went on after the season? What about everything you see on field pointing to the opposite of this rumour? What about Boyd, Gia, Morris and Murph all recommitting to the club this year? Along with all our main kids?

Bulllllllshitttt

But according to Caro and other 'reporters', we're a club on crisis, we're on the brink, we're imploding, our coach gave our players a bollocking after a crap season, what will become of us?

 

[Dogsman16]

Not sure to be honest. Certainly not your suggestion above and I didn't suggest anything like this - just because I'm presenting a dissenting view on something doesn't mean that I'm suggesting complete bullshit.

I just find it strange that we are so willing to accept one of our few elite players (and when fit he is one of the best big men in the comp) walk away for a slight pick upgrade...

At the conclusion of the season one of the points repeatedly made was that we would have won a few more games if Minson and Griffen were fully fit. And after seeing how important a dominant ruckman can be in the VFL finals, I'm just surprised by the lack of recognition of this. We are all hoping for improvement next year, somewhere between 8 - 12 wins seems to be peoples targets - I can't see us going forward (in terms of wins and ladder progression) next year if we're going to struggle late in quarters and late in games with winning a ruck contest. This will translate to increased pressure on our midfield, we'll setup with a defensive mindset and potentially get run over later in games. And opposition coaches will recognise it and exploit it...

We all seem to welcome retaining Boyd - in a position where we are bursting with players trying to get a game - but happily shift Minson off when we don't have a ready replacement. In addition to this, Minson is one of the few truly aggressive players we have - important in a team of mostly younger guys.

We all know there needs to be a transition from Minson to Campbell - but on what we saw this year - he's not ready for a full season. Campbell is one of the most promising big men I can remember seeing at his age at the Dogs - but he's young for a full time ruckman. I would have thought we had more situations during the year where Cordy/Campbell are trialled at AFL level (like the Sydney game), as well as increased Minson/Campbell combinations during the year.

I realise there is a balancing act when trading out players in terms of their trade value and benefit to the both sides (existing and new club) and I accept you can't always get good value for a player - but Geelong would have played a PF this year with Minson (although they would have beat North with Stevie J as well) and appear to think he'll help them dramatically in the short term.

If we need to bring a ruckman in (which will most likely be with a later pick), then we are losing Minson, a 2nd round pick (which is what has been suggested) and a 4th round pick (for example to replace Minson with Giles) - to get an upgrade from 26 - 15 in the draft order. I'd rather just keep Minson....

Now it is the silly season and it all may amount to nothing - I'm just surprised at the lack of recognition of the impact that losing the big fella will have. And Will's form may drop off the edge of a cliff and everyone will be saying 'We should have traded him when we had the chance...'. I'll just be far less optimistic for next year if Minson leaves - and I prefer to be optimistic at this time of year.....

I think we are over complicating this, rather we should have Campbell and Roughy in a 50/50 ruck split and both of them say playing 30% of time in the forward line as well. Whilst they are playing forward they can also take the ruckwork when their is a stoppage or boundary throw in, inside forward 50. Of course we get Giles or Griffin as insurance but I think this could work. A nice structure for a forward 50 stoppage would be Campbell inside forward 50 taking the ruck work and Roughy sitting 1 kick behind play taking intercept marks. Also if we need to sub say a tall forward or a tall defender off, Roughy can cover either end and Campbell should be fit enough to ruck say the last quarter by himself as rucktime is split 50/50 and he isn't being worked over.
The time for 2 legitimate ruckman is over who can't play anywhere else luckily Campbell but in particular Roughy can slot into any part of the ground. Use them like a Cox/Natanui combo (just not as good or experienced) and with ruck insurance we should be fine. Cordy waiting in the wingss if say Roughy goes down and Giles/Griffin/other ruck stock to cover Campbell and Roberts and Talia + maybe a traded in or draftee to fill in defensive 50 KPP.

 

[ivan rassmussen]

I am looking forward to 12th December (see dates listed below), although by then, this thread will be up to 1,500 pages, and even more unreadable than it is now.

On the positive side, at least by then we will also know that Carlisle, Reid, Jaksch, Hosken-Elliott and Cameron are all Bulldogs, and we will be guaranteed at least top 4 in 2015...

Team for R1 next year should look like:

B: Austin Carlisle Morris
HB: Howard Jaksch Murphy
C: Hosken-Elliott Bontempelli Macrae
HF: Crameri Reid Higgins
F: Stringer Cameron Hunter
R: Cordy Griffen Liberatore
I/C: Goodes Boyd Wallis Picken

What's that? Where are Dahlhaus, Minson, Campbell, Roughead, Jones, Johannisen, Hrovat and Honeychurch?

Why they were the sacrifices we had to make to get the KPPs, of course, so Austin and Goodes and Howard play on!

ROFL.....

2014 key trade, draft and free agency dates

Friday August 1, by 2pm - Draft-eligible Academy player nominations lodged

Friday October 3 - NAB AFL restricted free agency offer and unrestricted free agency period begins

Friday October 3, by 2pm - NAB AFL father/son bidding nominations; Academy bidding nominations lodged with AFL

Monday October 6, 10am - Father/son and Academy players bidding meeting; NAB AFL Trade Period begins

Monday October 13, at 5pm - Close of NAB AFL restricted free Agency offer and unrestricted free agency period

Thursday October 16 - NAB AFL restricted free agency matching offer three-day period ends

Friday October 17, at 2pm - NAB AFL Trade Period closes

Friday October 31, by 2pm - List lodgement (1); Rookie promotion to primary list; Retained second and third-year rookies; Scholarship players; Alternate talent player nominations, Total player payment (TPP) estimates.

Saturday November 1 - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (1) begins

Wednesday November 12 - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (1) closes; Out of contract listed AFL primary list players draft nomination form and player request for removal from list form Lodged with AFL; New or expired (after three years) draft nomination form lodgement.

Thursday November 13, by 2pm - List lodgement (2).

Friday November 14 - AFL delisted player free agency period (2) begins

Wednesday November 19 - Delisted primary list draft nomination form lodgement; Non–retained rookie players draft nomination form lodgement; Players not registered or played for three years rookie nomination. NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (2) closes

Thursday November 27 - NAB AFL Draft selection meeting (Gold Coast Convention Centre).

Friday November 28 - NAB AFL delisted free agency Period (3) begins

Monday December 1 - AFL delisted player free agency period (3) ends. AFL club list lodgement (3) and TPP estimates. International players inclusion on rookie list form; Scholarship players rookie list form lodged; Father/son and Academy pre-selected rookie nominations.

Wednesday December 3 - NAB AFL Pre-Season Draft selection meeting (11am); Notification of pre-selected rookies nominated on Monday November 25 if not selected in the pre-season draft (11.05am); NAB AFL Rookie Draft selection meeting (11.10am)

Monday December 5 – Final club list lodgement

Friday December 12, by 2pm - International players inclusion on rookie list

 

[dogwatch]

All this talk of Campbell not being ready yet. Maybe so.

But we need to recognise that 2015 is another year on. So it may not be legit to judge his 2015 capability on what he did in 2014. If he's getting a 20% better tank each year then he might be cherry ripe by next March. Anyway to me it seemed like he has been running out games pretty well and if teamed 60/40 or 70/30 with another ruck (say Cordy or a traded ruck) he should be able to run out full games week after week.

I'm not in the "trade Minson" camp and would like to see him play out his career at the WB ... but I'm open to options.

When we say you have to give up something worthwhile to get something worthwhile we often look to young guns as the obvious candidates (Hrovat's name has come up a bit). However players like Minson might also fill the bill. TBH if we had a really good player offered to us I'd rather lose an ageing Minson than a young Hrovat who has 10 quality years left in his career.

 

[Dogsman16]

WHAT HE SAID ^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[doggies ftw]

I think we are over complicating this, rather we should have Campbell and Roughy in a 50/50 ruck split and both of them say playing 30% of time in the forward line as well. Whilst they are playing forward they can also take the ruckwork when their is a stoppage or boundary throw in, inside forward 50. Of course we get Giles or Griffin as insurance but I think this could work. A nice structure for a forward 50 stoppage would be Campbell inside forward 50 taking the ruck work and Roughy sitting 1 kick behind play taking intercept marks. Also if we need to sub say a tall forward or a tall defender off, Roughy can cover either end and Campbell should be fit enough to ruck say the last quarter by himself as rucktime is split 50/50 and he isn't being worked over.
The time for 2 legitimate ruckman is over who can't play anywhere else luckily Campbell but in particular Roughy can slot into any part of the ground. Use them like a Cox/Natanui combo (just not as good or experienced) and with ruck insurance we should be fine. Cordy waiting in the wingss if say Roughy goes down and Giles/Griffin/other ruck stock to cover Campbell and Roberts and Talia + maybe a traded in or draftee to fill in defensive 50 KPP.

Love the idea of that set up. Campbell doing ruck work inside 50 while Rough sits on the 50m mark, as he's such a good intercept marker. Also really good to have the versatility to send Roughy back if needed like you said. Roughy would be such a good second ruck he's as he's so mobile and agile for a tall and can fit in anywhere, genuinely skilful too.

Apparently Campbell was smashing Will in the inter club practices. I don't think he's too far off.

 

[Butane]

Smacks of poor man-management skills. What happens when the younger players get to be middle players and middle players get to be older players does he then upset them.

There is a nice German word for this - 'verschlimmbessern', that means while you are trying to make something better, you are actually making it worse.
Better just shorten that word to 'bessen'.

I think that we would be bessen if we lost Minson, Jones and Higgins; good standard AFL players don't just grow on trees.

'verschlimmbessern' - I like it. I'm learning things on bigfooty.

Yesterday I learnt about Hanlon's razor - 'Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity'

 

[themightydoggies]

When Are they gonna list the delstings ?

 

[themightydoggies]

When Are they gonna list the delstings ?

 

[Dogsman16]

Love the idea of that set up. Campbell doing ruck work inside 50 while Rough sits on the 50m mark, as he's such a good intercept marker. Also really good to have the versatility to send Roughy back if needed like you said. Roughy would be such a good second ruck he's as he's so mobile and agile for a tall and can fit in anywhere, genuinely skilful too.

Apparently Campbell was smashing Will in the inter club practices. I don't think he's too far off.

I really think it could work Roughy acting as the quarterback across the middle and defensive 50 when their is a forward 50 stoppage is ideal. Hell I would even let Jones chop out in the ruck if its deep inside 50 (if Campbell is resting) to still allow Roughy to be that kick down the line defensive wall. What we know is, is that Roughy is a great reader of the flight and can take contested and intercept marks, lets use him in that capacity to help out or defensive structure and will help out Talia and Roberts to the point where I would be very assured we aren't going to get caught on the rebound from forward 50. Get more speed around the stoppages like a Shaw and or JJ etc to prevent the quick release and Roughy will murder them across the ground. Think we can forget about winning the hitouts every week, but I think Campbell in the Ruck and Forward and Roughy around the ground will be a far better ruck combination that the one we have presently. Time for our young defenders in Roberts and Talia to take number 1 and 2 KPF's Moz on number 3 and Roughy to sweep back when in the ruck. Can also be used if we lose a defender where Minson or Campbell can't be.
I think this is a great setup say on a Hawthorn type forward line
Wood, Roberts, Moz
Puopolo, Hale/Ceglar, Gunston
Picken, Talia, Murph
Rioli, Roughead, Resting mid

Roughy to sweep across when opposition ruckman pushes forward and get in front of Gunston and Roughy who will lead up field.

 

[maddog37]

When Are they gonna list the delstings ?

I think they will list the delistings when they have completed the list of lists that are need to fully list the definitive requirements of listed players to be retained on the list.

 

[inyourfacedunk]

Apparently Campbell was smashing Will in the inter club practices. I don't think he's too far off.

The same Minson who was suffering from a pretty bad back injury? I wouldn't take too much out of Campbell beating Minson in an intraclub.

Now if he can beat him in this coming pre-season, then we'll be talking.
I believe Campbell will be the next long term number 1 ruck. Just not right now.

 

[ivan rassmussen]

I think they will list the delistings when they have completed the list of lists that are need to fully list the definitive requirements of listed players to be retained on the list.

I'm listing to starboard just reading that...

What would Franz Liszt say?

 

[VitalDread]

First round of delisting think need to be done by mid next week

 

[TedDougChris]

I think we are over complicating this, rather we should have Campbell and Roughy in a 50/50 ruck split and both of them say playing 30% of time in the forward line as well. Whilst they are playing forward they can also take the ruckwork when their is a stoppage or boundary throw in, inside forward 50. Of course we get Giles or Griffin as insurance but I think this could work. A nice structure for a forward 50 stoppage would be Campbell inside forward 50 taking the ruck work and Roughy sitting 1 kick behind play taking intercept marks. Also if we need to sub say a tall forward or a tall defender off, Roughy can cover either end and Campbell should be fit enough to ruck say the last quarter by himself as rucktime is split 50/50 and he isn't being worked over.
The time for 2 legitimate ruckman is over who can't play anywhere else luckily Campbell but in particular Roughy can slot into any part of the ground. Use them like a Cox/Natanui combo (just not as good or experienced) and with ruck insurance we should be fine. Cordy waiting in the wingss if say Roughy goes down and Giles/Griffin/other ruck stock to cover Campbell and Roberts and Talia + maybe a traded in or draftee to fill in defensive 50 KPP.

Fair points - as I posted earlier, Minsons form could drop right off and we're forced into this situation anyway.

But we appear to be doing a fair amount of restructuring here. We're shifting our only young KPD of AFL standard (Talia and Roberts may prove to be next year) away from FB to play a partial ruck role. So we need to restructure our defense and do it quickly while Morris and Murphy are there to teach. We're then talking about recruiting a ruckman to replace one that we already had - which will cost a pick or player, and then our mids need to learn to read the new ruck combination.

We appear to be creating as many holes/problems as we'd hope to fill....

 

[Metal]

Absolute NO to trading Minson.

I can't believe the logic that says we keep a player on while he is developing his craft / plays second banana, but as soon as he reaches his peak as our premier ruckman, we go...wow he has value, let's get rid of him. The club expect Big Will to return to form next year as he gets over the debilitating back injury. I can understand with the likes of Cooney, that they have given service for years and if they wish to go, then we do the best we can do in a trade. But Minson has only just reached his best, so why would we so quickly want him out? Just defies logic to me, unless his injury is far worse than we thought.

 

[ivan rassmussen]

First round of delisting think need to be done by mid next week

From the dates I quoted on the previous page (from AFL website), the first official list lodgement is 31 October - there doesn't seem to be any requirement to do it before then. Contracts are usually until 31 Oct, anyway, so maybe clubs do it now to give the players time to start looking around, as a courtesy, rather than an obligation?

 

[ivan rassmussen]

Absolute NO to trading Minson.

Agree. On top of that, Minson is a club-fabric type of player, like Murphy, and whilst probably an outdated sentiment, I still think you have to be very wary of trading those type of players. Encourage them into retirement when the time comes by all means, but don't trade them out when they can still contribute mutiple seasons to the club.

 

[Dogsman16]

Fair points - as I posted earlier, Minsons form could drop right off and we're forced into this situation anyway.

But we appear to be doing a fair amount of restructuring here. We're shifting our only young KPD of AFL standard (Talia and Roberts may prove to be next year) away from FB to play a partial ruck role. So we need to restructure our defense and do it quickly while Morris and Murphy are there to teach. We're then talking about recruiting a ruckman to replace one that we already had - which will cost a pick or player, and then our mids need to learn to read the new ruck combination.

We appear to be creating as many holes/problems as we'd hope to fill....

Hmmm I don't this year we could classify Roughy as of AFL standard defender think he conceded 2.5 goals a game on his direct opponent which was the worst of any number 1 defender this year (Tom Lonegan was the best with 1.3). Restructing our defence only really is in the KPP's with Roberts swapping for Roughy and Talia for Austin which I think looks better than what it was this year. Also hypothetically if we trade Minson and say 26 for 14 and Smedts then we could use pick 14 to trade in a quality KPD who would instantly improve our KPD stocks think Carlisle if he walks Frost from Collingwood and say seedsman if Collingwood want another first rounder, May etc. If we can trade for someone and still have that vital pick 5 then we could hypothetically say have Carlisle, Talia, Roberts as our 3 KPD's or better yet package up 5 and 14 + something else for Tom Lynch. I know this is very hypothectical and circumstancial but having picks 5 and 14 at the trade period or draft time puts us in a huge position to launch for some good KPP's.

Minson only finished 17th in this years BnF, can we cover for him. Yes if we trade smartly!!

This is regarding how many Goals roughy conceded on average compared to other KPD's
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...ralian-selection/story-fni5f6yf-1227037688711

 

[Flash86]

I am looking forward to 12th December (see dates listed below), although by then, this thread will be up to 1,500 pages, and even more unreadable than it is now.

On the positive side, at least by then we will also know that Carlisle, Reid, Jaksch, Hosken-Elliott and Cameron are all Bulldogs, and we will be guaranteed at least top 4 in 2015...

Team for R1 next year should look like:

B: Austin Carlisle Morris
HB: Howard Jaksch Murphy
C: Hosken-Elliott Bontempelli Macrae
HF: Crameri Reid Higgins
F: Stringer Cameron Hunter
R: Cordy Griffen Liberatore
I/C: Goodes Boyd Wallis Picken

What's that? Where are Dahlhaus, Minson, Campbell, Roughead, Jones, Johannisen, Hrovat and Honeychurch?

Why they were the sacrifices we had to make to get the KPPs, of course, so Austin and Goodes and Howard play on!

ROFL.....

2014 key trade, draft and free agency dates

Friday August 1, by 2pm - Draft-eligible Academy player nominations lodged

Friday October 3 - NAB AFL restricted free agency offer and unrestricted free agency period begins

Friday October 3, by 2pm - NAB AFL father/son bidding nominations; Academy bidding nominations lodged with AFL

Monday October 6, 10am - Father/son and Academy players bidding meeting; NAB AFL Trade Period begins

Monday October 13, at 5pm - Close of NAB AFL restricted free Agency offer and unrestricted free agency period

Thursday October 16 - NAB AFL restricted free agency matching offer three-day period ends

Friday October 17, at 2pm - NAB AFL Trade Period closes

Friday October 31, by 2pm - List lodgement (1); Rookie promotion to primary list; Retained second and third-year rookies; Scholarship players; Alternate talent player nominations, Total player payment (TPP) estimates.

Saturday November 1 - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (1) begins

Wednesday November 12 - NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (1) closes; Out of contract listed AFL primary list players draft nomination form and player request for removal from list form Lodged with AFL; New or expired (after three years) draft nomination form lodgement.

Thursday November 13, by 2pm - List lodgement (2).

Friday November 14 - AFL delisted player free agency period (2) begins

Wednesday November 19 - Delisted primary list draft nomination form lodgement; Non–retained rookie players draft nomination form lodgement; Players not registered or played for three years rookie nomination. NAB AFL delisted player free agency period (2) closes

Thursday November 27 - NAB AFL Draft selection meeting (Gold Coast Convention Centre).

Friday November 28 - NAB AFL delisted free agency Period (3) begins

Monday December 1 - AFL delisted player free agency period (3) ends. AFL club list lodgement (3) and TPP estimates. International players inclusion on rookie list form; Scholarship players rookie list form lodged; Father/son and Academy pre-selected rookie nominations.

Wednesday December 3 - NAB AFL Pre-Season Draft selection meeting (11am); Notification of pre-selected rookies nominated on Monday November 25 if not selected in the pre-season draft (11.05am); NAB AFL Rookie Draft selection meeting (11.10am)

Monday December 5 – Final club list lodgement

Friday December 12, by 2pm - International players inclusion on rookie list

Obviously this is a bit of a joke piece, as we would never have that team, but gee that team looks good.
Yes we had to give up Dahlhaus, Minson, Campbell, Roughead, Jones, Johannisen, Hrovat and Honeychurch.
But we got Carlisle, Reid, Jaksch, Hosken-Elliott and Cameron. Would choose the recruited players over departed players every day of the week.

I still think Talia would get a game over Austin next year, and Wood would be playing over Howard.

This thread is getting a bit out of hand. Is there any other team that has a 800 page thread on list management?
I am looking forward to October 3 when Free agency starts and October 6 when trade period starts, cause then there will be real news to talk about. At the moment, like others have said, we are hearing some pretty crazy trades going round.

Sounds like we are out of the race for Jaksch. I pretty confident we will get Reid though. not sure why. Maybe cause he is on big money, which is more than what he is worth due to signing a big contract with Sydney, so most teams won't be willing to pay him that much, let alone give away a high draft pick for him.

I would still do a three way trade which people are talking about.
Western Bulldogs: Reid
Sydney: Pick 15
Geelong : Minson

Then go to the draft, but I also seeing us trading a low draft pick for a young player at GWS or Gold Coast, similar to what we paid for Darley. Darley has shown a bit for a pick 80 draft pick we traded. Miles was a great pick up for Richmond.
But realistic, we will trade in one KPP player, draft Wright, Zaine and Foster. Won't be as exciting as some might think

 

[Butane]

Pretty difficult to delist players when Higgins, Jones and Wood are still out of contract. Need to figure out what they're doing so we can figure out numbers/positions for next year.

 

[lachy]

Hmmm I don't this year we could classify Roughy as of AFL standard defender think he conceded 2.5 goals a game on his direct opponent which was the worst of any number 1 defender this year (Tom Lonegan was the best with 1.3). Restructing our defence only really is in the KPP's with Roberts swapping for Roughy and Talia for Austin which I think looks better than what it was this year. Also hypothetically if we trade Minson and say 26 for 14 and Smedts then we could use pick 14 to trade in a quality KPD who would instantly improve our KPD stocks think Carlisle if he walks Frost from Collingwood and say seedsman if Collingwood want another first rounder, May etc. If we can trade for someone and still have that vital pick 5 then we could hypothetically say have Carlisle, Talia, Roberts as our 3 KPD's or better yet package up 5 and 14 + something else for Tom Lynch. I know this is very hypothectical and circumstancial but having picks 5 and 14 at the trade period or draft time puts us in a huge position to launch for some good KPP's.

Minson only finished 17th in this years BnF, can we cover for him. Yes if we trade smartly!!

This is regarding how many Goals roughy conceded on average compared to other KPD's
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...ralian-selection/story-fni5f6yf-1227037688711

What were his statistics like before the shoulder went. Can't remember big bags being kicked on him before then.

In saying that I see him more as a forward in the future, but he would not be the worst by a long way before the shoulder injury