List Mgmt. Trade & Free Agency talk Pt 8

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Karp3_dm said:
Exactly, if I was Freo I would go all in for Bolton
They might win multiple flags with him
Click to expand...

Here we sit offering free advice to another club on how to win a premiership. The thing is I reckon that Shai would be what they need to win one or two. If they don't they could well contend but never go over that line. The first round picks can lead to a rebuild. But that won't help them win the premiership.

I can imagine that they would be scared to go really hard because if it all stuffed up the supporters would kill the FD. But if it worked then all is GOOD!

And for Freo they can do something other clubs can't. they can buy a super star to fill a need and not break the bank. They can get us to pay for it.

But, as I said, it'd be a very ballsy move to go for it.
 
Morro said:
I dont believe we would pay 50% of Boltons contract, that is ludicrous, has that ever happened?

I do think Shai would be on near a mill

I dont think Warner would be on 1.3 -1.4 mill.
Click to expand...

Clubs have paid a large chunk of a contract to get someone off their books. And clubs have paid 1/2 of a contract to get a higher pick. GC gave Geelong a good pick plus the player to get him off their books.

We have spare salary cap space and freo would love to get him without crushing their cap.

gutsy by both teams though.
 

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energyquant said:
There is a lot of sense in us paying a big chunk of Bolton and Rioli's salary for the next 3 years if it gets us the draft picks we need.

In my dreams, I would love it if we could achieve this:

  • Bolton + Baker + 21 to Fremantle in exchange for picks 9, 13 and 15.
  • Rioli + multiple late picks to the Suns in exchange for picks 7 and 8
  • Short or Graham to Port for pick 33

That would give us 1, 7, 8, 9, 13, 15, 33, 35.

We get pick 1 again the following year when we finish dead last. Martin and Lynch are both retired ($$$) and we go to the draft and free agency.
Click to expand...
and we end up like north melbourne?
 
Dr Tigris said:
Clubs have paid a large chunk of a contract to get someone off their books. And clubs have paid 1/2 of a contract to get a higher pick. GC gave Geelong a good pick plus the player to get him off their books.

We have spare salary cap space and freo would love to get him without crushing their cap.

gutsy by both teams though.
Click to expand...
But 50% of a million dollar contract? No way Jose'
 
Dr Tigris said:
Here we sit offering free advice to another club on how to win a premiership. The thing is I reckon that Shai would be what they need to win one or two. If they don't they could well contend but never go over that line. The first round picks can lead to a rebuild. But that won't help them win the premiership.

I can imagine that they would be scared to go really hard because if it all stuffed up the supporters would kill the FD. But if it worked then all is GOOD!

And for Freo they can do something other clubs can't. they can buy a super star to fill a need and not break the bank. They can get us to pay for it.

But, as I said, it'd be a very ballsy move to go for it.
Click to expand...
I don’t think it’s ballsy at all
It’s just the right play for their current situation

They already rebuilt with high draft picks, got a gun in Jackson, got very lucky with how good Treacy is (rookie pick 7)

Going hard for Bolton or Warner to win a flag/s is the last piece of the puzzle and they know it

Peter Bell is a really good operator and won’t leave any stone unturned
 
Karp3_dm said:
I don’t think it’s ballsy at all
It’s just the right play for their current situation

They already rebuilt with high draft picks, got a gun in Jackson, got very lucky with how good Treacy is (rookie pick 7)

Going hard for Bolton or Warner to win a flag/s is the last piece of the puzzle and they know it

Peter Bell is a really good operator and won’t leave any stone unturned
Click to expand...

In a cold hard logical way, yes that's right.

But we are humans so it is gutsy .. because humans are generally stupid.

"Oh my God! You can't trade all of those first round picks. Bolton might get injured/I don't reckon he's that good/Lightning might strike him, and we could pick up the next Buddy/Dusty/Danger/Lethal Leigh with those picks. That trade is so overs!!!!"

"On the Richmond side. Shai is our most talented player, we'll be so bad for 5/10/25 years!! We didn't get the right compo for him. The draft is a lottery"

If we help Freo win a premiership that's good business for us and them. Teams have a 1 in 18 chance each year - roughly. That is at least 2 rebuilds. If you are close then going over the top is worth the shot in my opinion.
 
Morro said:
But 50% of a million dollar contract? No way Jose'
Click to expand...
Why not. If that = a first round pick + what we get for the player. Doesn't actually cost us much as we aren't using the salary at the moment. It buys us another high end talent to rebuild.
 
voorhees said:
you would be good in going into 25' with all
Bolton , Baker, Short, Rioli, Dusty, Graham still all on our list
meaning we made no trade's during the 24' period
Click to expand...
I only want the club to trade if we are getting really good picks.
I don't want to us losing talent for late 20 or worse picks and I don't want us forcing players out that don't want to go.
Of your list Graham is the only one a would prefer to go because we ah e too many slow midfielder players on the list and need to get more depth with speed and skill.
Dusty, should probably retire, but I'm happy for the club to give the greatest players I've had the privilege to watch another year if that's what he wants.
We our first pick, likely 1 or 2 and enough picks to trade up to another mid first round pick or better. If we can get another first round pick that would be great given the reported depth in this draft and then a stab at a couple more later in the draft.
5 picks in the draft, and our 2 mid season picks and then add a DLFA or PSD pick or two and that's plenty of new talent to work with.
 
Meteoric Rise said:
Oh yes they do.

2023 Fremantle rd 1 - likely about pick 15 in the end.

2024 Collingwood rd 1 - Likely around pick 9.

2024 Port Adelaide rd 1 - likely around say pick 12.

2025 Fremantle rd 1 - expected value w/Bolton + half wage paid = pick 17.


How much do you want to win your first flag Fremantle? There is only one Shai Bolton in the AFL and this is your only chance to get him soon enough to get 6 or so high class years out of him, without having to make player cuts.

Bolton w/50% of his current contract paid for them, we want all 4 rd 1 picks, and maybe we send back a couple of rd 2 picks. If the value of this year's picks continues to increase then maybe we just take those 3 and nothing going back.
Click to expand...
Top 10 picks or forget it
 

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energyquant said:
There is a lot of sense in us paying a big chunk of Bolton and Rioli's salary for the next 3 years if it gets us the draft picks we need.

In my dreams, I would love it if we could achieve this:

  • Bolton + Baker + 21 to Fremantle in exchange for picks 9, 13 and 15.
  • Rioli + multiple late picks to the Suns in exchange for picks 7 and 8
  • Short or Graham to Port for pick 33

That would give us 1, 7, 8, 9, 13, 15, 33, 35.

We get pick 1 again the following year when we finish dead last. Martin and Lynch are both retired ($$$) and we go to the draft and free agency.
Click to expand...
this would be the ultimate dream one could have when head hits pillow..
could u imagine what draft night would be like?
magnum champagne for everyone!!
 
While I get the fascination with going after all the R1 picks by trading out a heap of experienced players with currency, I believe it's the wrong path to go down and that we'll end up regretting it in a major way if we do.

Below is the core group of 24-28 year olds we should be building around in 2025:

Backs: D.Rioli Miller Young

Midfield/Ruck: Hopper Taranto Graham Hayes-Brown Ross Ryan

Forwards: Baker Lefau Bolton Balta Mansell Koschitzke

Now I fully understand that not all of them are elite players, but no team has ever been full of elite players in every position on the field. As we all know it's a combination of players that make a team successful, from the truly elite to the solid supporting cast and the fringe types who play roles that often go unrecognized by the average punter and are the first ones to cop heat when the team is struggling.

I'm not going to sit here and say that all those named above will be part of our next premiership side or even our next finals win, but heading into 2025 given where we're currently sitting some of those players can play roles in the side as we rebuild to become a contender again.

This may change as the end of the year comes and trade requests are made, but right now I hope that this is the clubs thinking and judging by the Taranto story from last week it would appear that he is trying to get the same sort of thing happening.
 
So much time wasting in here. There is no way the club is going to have a clean out. It just won’t happen. Some living in fantasy land, the club definitely doesn’t want to rebuild with multiple first rounders by trading out our core.

My assumption is the club thinks it can bounce back next year.

Unless they all ask to be traded, none will.
 
guruisatiger said:
Kane is full of shit
Click to expand...
McGuire's kid came up with the Baker, Bolton Bombshell 5,6 weeks ago. I noticed Eddie quoted X McGuires bombshell last week as Bolton departure as fact. The Monday Footy Class now quoting the news story, yesterday.
www.nine.com.au

Dockers to pull trigger on stunning Tigers trade raid

Young guns in their sights
www.nine.com.au www.nine.com.au
Chuck in Bolton at a charity event in Perth during the bye. equals Bolton OUT.

see what happens
 
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I’ll remind everyone. On average, players drafted between 11-20 play 118 games. 47% don’t get to 80-games. 1 in 6 become AA’s.

So we will be very careful with any trading we do as the draft is very much a lottery.

My preference would be to retain everyone except D Rioli and Graham.

I only say this as we will get massive ‘overs’ for Rioli, whilst we will get market value or slight unders for Baker as he’s uncontracted. I’m happy if Rioli stays as he’s a quality player, but he’s by far the best outcome for us.

And then Graham would net us a band-4 at worst (approx pick 40).

With point swaps and trading into next year, that would be enough to ensure really strong draft hands over the next 2 x drafts without gutting our list to the point of being uncompetitive for 5-years ala Norf. If we lose Baker, Bolton, Rioli, Martin and Graham we will be absolutely obliterated for years…. and if we draft poorly we will be diabolical for a generation.

And with so many picks in a really strong draft in 2024, watch Blair go to work. It’ll be what we did in 2023 on steroids. We went from 35 to 40 and picked up a couple of 3rd rounders on the way to still getting our man in McAuliffe.

With so many clubs clambering for players in this draft, I am predicting Blair will ensure we have loads of picks in that 17-30 range, whereby I can see live trading where teams without quality picks (Pies, Dogs, Port) will offer up future 2nd and 3rd’s by the truckload to get the player they want in this draft.

Example … gets to our pick-21 … Pies have a player in mind, so swap their pick 26 for our 21 in this draft, and throw in 2025’s second rounder. Then we get to 26 and Dogs have a player they want … so swap their 29 for our 26 and throw in their 2025 3rd rounder. Then Port swap their 30 for our 29 for a player they want, and throw in their third rounder in 2025.

So we go from 21 to 30, and pick up 1 x 2nd rounder and 2 x 3rd rounders for 2025 in the process.

This year draft is gonna be unbelievable viewing, where coaches under pressure (Port, Dogs and Pies) are not waiting for 2025 … if their man is available they will trade up for sure.

Exciting times !!


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 
Noidnadroj said:
I’ll remind everyone. On average, players drafted between 11-20 play 118 games. 47% don’t get to 80-games. 1 in 6 become AA’s.

So we will be very careful with any trading we do as the draft is very much a lottery.

My preference would be to retain everyone except D Rioli and Graham.

I only say this as we will get massive ‘overs’ for Rioli, whilst we will get market value or slight unders for Baker as he’s uncontracted. I’m happy if Rioli stays as he’s a quality player, but he’s by far the best outcome for us.

And then Graham would net us a band-4 at worst (approx pick 40).

With point swaps and trading into next year, that would be enough to ensure really strong draft hands over the next 2 x drafts without gutting our list to the point of being uncompetitive for 5-years ala Norf. If we lose Baker, Bolton, Rioli, Martin and Graham we will be absolutely obliterated for years…. and if we draft poorly we will be diabolical for a generation.

And with so many picks in a really strong draft in 2024, watch Blair go to work. It’ll be what we did in 2023 on steroids. We went from 35 to 40 and picked up a couple of 3rd rounders on the way to still getting our man in McAuliffe.

With so many clubs clambering for players in this draft, I am predicting Blair will ensure we have loads of picks in that 17-30 range, whereby I can see live trading where teams without quality picks (Pies, Dogs, Port) will offer up future 2nd and 3rd’s by the truckload to get the player they want in this draft.

Example … gets to our pick-21 … Pies have a player in mind, so swap their pick 26 for our 21 in this draft, and throw in 2025’s second rounder. Then we get to 26 and Dogs have a player they want … so swap their 29 for our 26 and throw in their 2025 3rd rounder. Then Port swap their 30 for our 29 for a player they want, and throw in their third rounder in 2025.

So we go from 21 to 30, and pick up 1 x 2nd rounder and 2 x 3rd rounders for 2025 in the process.

This year draft is gonna be unbelievable viewing, where coaches under pressure (Port, Dogs and Pies) are not waiting for 2025 … if their man is available they will trade up for sure.

Exciting times !!


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
Click to expand...

Can't remember exactly what was offered but I vaguely remember hearing the mind boggling offers Freo got in the 2021 draft before commencement of the 2nd round picks on night 2. Hoping there's a few juicey sliders and we make out like bandits. Pick 1 has me nervous and unless an absolute head and shoulders frontrunner emerges through rest or season, finals and draft combine I'd potentially rather club trade it away. I'm nervous we could land a Cale Morton, Anthony Morabito type and set our rebuild back 3 years (factoring in Tassie) really need our Next Dusty/ Deledio with pick 1 or a Prestia/ Tom Lynch double header of top 10 picks would be better.
 
sante said:
Unless they all ask to be traded, none will.
Click to expand...
Well, that’s a given. Not sure why anyone would think that’s likely.

Maybe some more expendable types like Graham, Short, Broad etc. but I would be staggered if any topliners are being tapped on the shoulder.

Surely this whole discussion needs to be prefaced with “if player X requests a trade”.
 
_RT_ said:
While I get the fascination with going after all the R1 picks by trading out a heap of experienced players with currency, I believe it's the wrong path to go down and that we'll end up regretting it in a major way if we do.

Below is the core group of 24-28 year olds we should be building around in 2025:

Backs: D.Rioli Miller Young

Midfield/Ruck: Hopper Taranto Graham Hayes-Brown Ross Ryan

Forwards: Baker Lefau Bolton Balta Mansell Koschitzke

Now I fully understand that not all of them are elite players, but no team has ever been full of elite players in every position on the field. As we all know it's a combination of players that make a team successful, from the truly elite to the solid supporting cast and the fringe types who play roles that often go unrecognized by the average punter and are the first ones to cop heat when the team is struggling.

I'm not going to sit here and say that all those named above will be part of our next premiership side or even our next finals win, but heading into 2025 given where we're currently sitting some of those players can play roles in the side as we rebuild to become a contender again.

This may change as the end of the year comes and trade requests are made, but right now I hope that this is the clubs thinking and judging by the Taranto story from last week it would appear that he is trying to get the same sort of thing happening.
Click to expand...

yeah, nah,

we are building around the 2024 draft, or should be, other clubs are not in our position, and Brown and others like Gibcus and Balta if he wants. Mccauliffe and Sonise as well as others are needed clearly

the emphasis is on quality to put us in a position to win premierships and not f... around for another 30 plus years and Prestia, Dusty and others can help us in this regard. our old timers can help the kids.

Taranto may be current but going forward he is second fiddle to those clashing in the Vic Metro/Vic Country clash and RFC is focused on winning premierships in the future


knowing where your at... we are not winning premierships in the next few years, but we could set ourselves up to win many in the not too distant future if we choose not to cut our own throats.

Why should RFC apologise for trying to win not just one but multiple premierships into the future?? I certainly am not apologising!!!
 
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