Trade hypotheticals

[boncer34]

The only people who shouldn't be traded before Bellchambers on our list are Ryder, Watson, Goddard, Heppell and Daniher. Trading him would be list management idiocy with our current ruck depth

Blokes running around in the twos. Depth is nice and all but he has serious trade currency, we could find a depth ruckman in the draft/discards and strengthen another part of our list with what we get for T-Bell.

Not saying we will or should trade but declaring a bloke who can't get a game in the ones as untradable is idiocy. Not floating the idea.

 

[Mercuri Rising]

Blokes running around in the twos. Depth is nice and all but he has serious trade currency, we could find a depth ruckman in the draft/discards and strengthen another part of our list with what we get for T-Bell.

Not saying we will or should trade but declaring a bloke who can't get a game in the ones as untradable is idiocy. Not floating the idea.

He didn't have a pre-season and was rushed back into the squad. Could be immense in the next 2-3 years if he finds some consistency, and no-one should be thinking of trading him based solely on this year's form. It'd have to be massive, massive overs to pry him loose.

 

[eth-dog]

Blokes running around in the twos. Depth is nice and all but he has serious trade currency, we could find a depth ruckman in the draft/discards and strengthen another part of our list with what we get for T-Bell.

Not saying we will or should trade but declaring a bloke who can't get a game in the ones as untradable is idiocy. Not floating the idea.

You fail list management 101. Well done, the only people who fail it are complete idiots. Don't **** around with your already thin ruck depth

 

[hollywood23]

Would happily give our second rounder for Bellchambers. Apart from Minson and Campbell, (Cordy is rubbish) we need an extra ruckman/who is capable playing as a resting forward. In fact I almost succumbed to madness and considered this type

Dogs 2nd round pick (26) for Bellchambers*
Minson to PA for Mason Shaw + swap of picks

*would consider throwing in a player if essendon thought it was unders.

Considering Minson is almost 30 and PA need another ruckman and we could do with more KPF depth wouldn't be the worst idea.

LOL...we got reemed once by the dogs, won't happening again with that pox trade suggestion.

 

[boncer34]

You fail list management 101. Well done, the only people who fail it are complete idiots. Don't **** around with your already thin ruck depth

You saying there is zero chance of there being any depth Ruckman out there?

 

[eth-dog]

You saying there is zero chance of there being any depth Ruckman out there?

I'm saying that you don't get rid of a good ruckman when you literally have1 other AFL standard ruck on your list when you're hoping to push for a flag soon. I'm a big defender of Dodoro but if he trades Bellchambers I will ****ing raze his house to the ground

 

[LukeParkerno1]

You saying there is zero chance of there being any depth Ruckman out there?

You are off your nana's if you want to trade our ONLY AFL standard spare ruck to Ryder when we would be thinking of playing finals next season. Plus he is worth more to us than other clubs...

 

[go you pups]

He is an awkward height though being a bit of an inbetweener and there is a huge step up in class for those types going against the bigger quicker athletes in the AFL. Some adapt but the majority do not. I am not writing him off but I would not be expecting a lot in return for him if anything. Patfull was a rookie at Port, similar measurables and we got him for nothing.

From memory I don't think you can trade rookies either.

Mumford if I can recall was the 1st rookie who was traded, from Geelong to Sydney.

 

[dazbroncos]

Cats fans out there . Scott selwood for your first rounder ?

Done. Where do I sign

Go Catters

 

[Tragic sainter]

You are off your nana's if you want to trade our ONLY AFL standard spare ruck to Ryder when we would be thinking of playing finals next season. Plus he is worth more to us than other clubs...

The McEvoy trade worked out remarkably well for us and we only had two afl standard ruckman on our list at the time. Sometimes you have to think outside of the box. Got rid of McEvoy and dal and brought in Dunstan, acres, savage, longer and delany.

 

[boncer34]

I'm saying that you don't get rid of a good ruckman when you literally have1 other AFL standard ruck on your list when you're hoping to push for a flag soon. I'm a big defender of Dodoro but if he trades Bellchambers I will ******* raze his house to the ground

Well yeah.

That is why I keep saying we'd only do it if we could het depth somewhere else. Or are you skipping that part in your rush to abuse me?

 

[Two Planks]

Everybody at St Kilda that speaks of the trade / draft period that is approaching keeps saying they will aim for 3 picks inside the top 20. With pick 1 and 20 (second round selection that may move after free agency compensation) already in the bag, where is the other pick going to come from. They dont seem to have any 24-27 year olds that would attract a top 20 pick that they would be happy to give up.

 

[Wild Bill]

You fail list management 101. Well done, the only people who fail it are complete idiots. Don't **** around with your already thin ruck depth

We moved McIntosh at risk and only had an un tried Daw or Currie as back up. Bellchambers would be the number 1 ruck at a lot of clubs. For a team that should look to get into the 1st round he would be the only one that would get you a good pick that you would be willing to trade. Get a back up VFL ruck and hope - like us - your number 1 ruck stays fit.

 

[eth-dog]

We moved McIntosh at risk and only had an un tried Daw or Currie as back up. Bellchambers would be the number 1 ruck at a lot of clubs. For a team that should look to get into the 1st round he would be the only one that would get you a good pick that you would be willing to trade. Get a back up VFL ruck and hope - like us - your number 1 ruck stays fit.

Or, considering he's a contracted, best 22 player when he's 100% fit, keep him because North's solution was just plain stupid and have been extremely lucky that Goldstein wasn't injured seriously round 1.

Trading McIntosh was a dumb decision on North's par

 

[Tragic sainter]

Or, considering he's a contracted, best 22 player when he's 100% fit, keep him because North's solution was just plain stupid and have been extremely lucky that Goldstein wasn't injured seriously round 1.

Trading McIntosh was a dumb decision on North's par

What are your thoughts on how st kilda traded McEvoy?

 

[Wild Bill]

Or, considering he's a contracted, best 22 player when he's 100% fit, keep him because North's solution was just plain stupid and have been extremely lucky that Goldstein wasn't injured seriously round 1.

Trading McIntosh was a dumb decision on North's par

You keep forgetting to add - "in your opinion"

Goldy and H struggled to play together - he could have played out his days at Werribee but we got a 2nd round pick and brought in Currie. Looks like good list management - IMO.

Is Bellchambers playing unfit in the two's? Which tall will he force out when he is 100% fit? Maybe Ambrose but he has been soild and adds more when the ball hits the ground.

 

[Lefthanded]

I'm strictly spitballing here, but is it? Bucks plays him possibly a bit underdone (didn't look to be at 100% even before he did the ankle) and omits Keefe who was definitely the better match up for our talls, the only reason i could think of is that he really values he leadership, intercepting and organisation at the back that Maxy offers, and that's exactly what Steinberg is doing at VFL level.

He's nothing like Langdon or Oxley, and you'd be wasting Scharenberg putting him in that role imo.

As I said before, strictly hypothetical

Fair enough comments (I wouldn't know what Steinberg does at VFL level, I've just taken your comments about ability and seen his height & games played), I just don't think a guy that young with no AFL experience is the guy to bring in to provide leadership & organisation down back at AFL level. Maybe that's a strange thing to say given the experience level of the 3 guys I mentioned but I wasn't suggesting they provide those things just yet, although in the absence of Maxy other players need to step up. Reality is that outside the club most people wouldn't be able to say who can / will step up. I think Keeffe is in the leadership group so he's one option but hasn't heaps of experience himself. Keeffe omission against Dons was probably as much about Keeffe (Bucks saying you need to step up) as it was about Maxy.

Steinberg nothing like Langdon seems a strange comment to me (maybe it's just that I don't know either well enough). You think Steinberg a good replacement for Maxy but I see a lot of Maxy in Langdon (both overlooked for senior list spot in 1st draft), both had point to prove, both have surprised people at AFL level. Scharenburg wasted in back half - maybe in long term but whilst he adjusts to AFL level and if we have a deficiency there than I don't see it as a waste. Quick play with good decisions out of defence sets up a lot of attacks. A utility of his class is also a difficult match up and can confuse the opposition by switching between different positions.

 

[eth-dog]

What are your thoughts on how st kilda traded McEvoy?

I never particularly rated McEvoy, but Longer had already nominated St. Kilda hadn't he?

You keep forgetting to add - "in your opinion"

Goldy and H struggled to play together - he could have played out his days at Werribee but we got a 2nd round pick and brought in Currie. Looks like good list management - IMO.

Is Bellchambers playing unfit in the two's? Which tall will he force out when he is 100% fit? Maybe Ambrose but he has been soild and adds more when the ball hits the ground.

Currie is crap. It's an incredibly lucky poor list management decision.

He's out injured in the 2's apparently. And who says you drop a tall? Personally the way he's been playing I'd drop J Merrett. Play Ambrose as a small and watch him dominate a small defender in the air.

 

[Wild Bill]

I never particularly rated McEvoy, but Longer had already nominated St. Kilda hadn't he?

Currie is crap. It's an incredibly lucky poor list management decision.

He's out injured in the 2's apparently. And who says you drop a tall? Personally the way he's been playing I'd drop J Merrett. Play Ambrose as a small and watch him dominate a small defender in the air.

Goldy is extremely durable and been a premier ruck for years now. At 26 he is about to come into his prime. Not many teams play two ruckmen anymore. I have no problem moving on an injury riddled decent ruckman. We have time to develop a back up.

Things could have been worse in regard to our list management. Josh Jenkins 5 V the Hawks was impressive.

 

[eth-dog]

Goldy is extremely durable and been a premier ruck for years now. At 26 he is about to come into his prime. Not many teams play two ruckmen anymore. I have no problem moving on an injury riddled decent ruckman. We have time to develop a back up.

Things could have been worse in regard to our list management. Josh Jenkins 5 V the Hawks was impressive.

So what? So is West. So is McEvoy. So is Pyke. So is Ryder. Didn't stop them getting injured this season. It was a poor list management decision, if Goldstein went down now North would be screwed.

Bellchambers' 5 goals on Alipate Carlile when he was fit last year was impressive as well. As was Jackson Merrett's 8 tackle game vs Hawthorn. If you're saying trading JJ was a mistake you're incredibly short sighted. Swap Bellchambers and Jenkins right now and Bellchambers would be far better, whereas right now it's debatable who's better.

 

[Jeremias]

Everybody at St Kilda that speaks of the trade / draft period that is approaching keeps saying they will aim for 3 picks inside the top 20. With pick 1 and 20 (second round selection that may move after free agency compensation) already in the bag, where is the other pick going to come from. They dont seem to have any 24-27 year olds that would attract a top 20 pick that they would be happy to give up.

It'll be very interesting to see if St Kilda do manage to get that extra pick inside the top 20. They have made their intentions very clear and we know they aren't afraid to get aggressive, so I'd say there is every chance that they will pull something quite unexpected.

I think there are two ways they can go about getting that extra top 20 pick:

1) Trade a top player in a direct swap; or
2) Upgrade a later pick to better pick by adding a player

Given their list at the moment, there aren't too many players who would get a top 20 pick in return as a straight swap. A quick browse suggests to me that Stevens, Billings, Acres, Dunstan and possibly Armitage would be the only ones. How many of them would St Kilda be willing to part with? Not many, if any. Armitage may well be the only one.

I dare say their best bet would be the 2nd option whereby they package their 2nd or 3rd pick with a player to get that higher pick.

 

[Wild Bill]

So what? So is West. So is McEvoy. So is Pyke. So is Ryder. Didn't stop them getting injured this season. It was a poor list management decision, if Goldstein went down now North would be screwed.

Bellchambers' 5 goals on Alipate Carlile when he was fit last year was impressive as well. As was Jackson Merrett's 8 tackle game vs Hawthorn. If you're saying trading JJ was a mistake you're incredibly short sighted. Swap Bellchambers and Jenkins right now and Bellchambers would be far better, whereas right now it's debatable who's better.

What if's?? Who cares we are on the move because of our list management - 10th to 6th and climbing. I am happy with our list management. Saying sweeping statements like "if Goldy went down we would be screwed" is like saying the same thing about Essendon with Watson. Teams can adapt. The hawks won a flag with Max Bailey.

Jenkins 34 goals in 14 games no longer makes it a debate. He is very good - getting better. TBC has stalled and borderline best 22 in a similar ranked side. But as a ruck he was value - for now.

 

[eth-dog]

Because North have as good a midfield as Lewis, Mitchell, Hodge, Burgoyne, Shiels and I Smith. Plus Max Bailey is a far better ruckman than Daniel Currie.

It was a poor list management decision. Theoretically, if Goldstein's shoulder injury in round 1 put him out for the season, you would be stuck with Currie. Who is ****ing shit.

It's amazing what a good forward structure can do. I guarantee that if Bellchambers were at Adelaide and Jenkins at Essendon Bellchambers would be far ahead of him. Once we get a good forward structure, Jenkins wouldn't come close to Bellchambers.

 

[Wild Bill]

Because North have as good a midfield as Lewis, Mitchell, Hodge, Burgoyne, Shiels and I Smith. Plus Max Bailey is a far better ruckman than Daniel Currie.

It was a poor list management decision. Theoretically, if Goldstein's shoulder injury in round 1 put him out for the season, you would be stuck with Currie. Who is ******* shit.

It's amazing what a good forward structure can do. I guarantee that if Bellchambers were at Adelaide and Jenkins at Essendon Bellchambers would be far ahead of him. Once we get a good forward structure, Jenkins wouldn't come close to Bellchambers.

What if's are loaded rubbish. We are sitting 6th and could push higher - I think our list managment and player management is very good. Not sure all teams can say the same.

Would be an interesting poll.

How would a forward structure of Jenkins, Crameri, Monfries, Daniher and Chapmen go? Looks pretty good to me.

 

[eth-dog]

What if's are loaded rubbish. We are sitting 6th and could push higher - I think our list managment and player management is very good. Not sure all teams can say the same.

Would be an interesting poll.

How would a forward structure of Jenkins, Crameri, Monfries, Daniher and Chapmen go? Looks pretty good to me.

How would a midfield of Stanton, Heppell, Zaharakis, Hocking and Melksham go? Looks a lot weaker to me. Crameri is shit. Jenkins would have kicked 10 goals if he's lucky for us. Monfries is struggling atm. Chapman and Daniher? Have them, so no difference.