Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
What and work for 200k? Pfffttt
What and work for 200k? Pfffttt
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Travis Varcoe
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Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
Perhaps he gets a week coming off the bench as a sub, with the directive, "you've got one and a half quarters to work as a high impact player, now get out there and really show us what you've got."
Anyway, at 9-0, Chris seems to know what he's doing so far!
Perhaps he gets a week coming off the bench as a sub, with the directive, "you've got one and a half quarters to work as a high impact player, now get out there and really show us what you've got."
Anyway, at 9-0, Chris seems to know what he's doing so far!
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Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
No way needs more work at the contest not less,and If he's got to go back to the 2s to get it so be it.
No way needs more work at the contest not less,and If he's got to go back to the 2s to get it so be it.
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Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
He signed a long term deal in January this year.
Interesting suggestion from Turbo. Maybe Adam not being there is having an effect?[/quote]
Maybe we should do a D and A we may have pissed the wrong one off
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
You mean his form vs the Suns? He wouldnt be dropped on his "recent" form vs Hawks and Blues.
This is the trouble for us supporting Trav through this form slump. The negs just mash it all up like his form is the one thing. Total rubbish. I am certain for the people who wanted him dropped, they would be the same whiners complaining about a whole host of things as to why we lost to the Blues without those match winning goals.
And personally I dont think anyone's family issues regardless of how relevant belong in a public forum.
You mean his form vs the Suns? He wouldnt be dropped on his "recent" form vs Hawks and Blues.
This is the trouble for us supporting Trav through this form slump. The negs just mash it all up like his form is the one thing. Total rubbish. I am certain for the people who wanted him dropped, they would be the same whiners complaining about a whole host of things as to why we lost to the Blues without those match winning goals.
And personally I dont think anyone's family issues regardless of how relevant belong in a public forum.
Willo_
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Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
This is not an attack on a player, far from it.... But i am not against dropping a player and giving him a kick up the arse if he needs it... Same goes for Hawkins
We seem to have the depth to be able to do it as well, lots of players pushing for a game and someone has to miss out, doesn't hurt to give someone a couple of weeks in the 2s to get their hands on the ball and their confidence up...
Trav lit it up for a quarter against Carlton, the last half of the last quarter against the pies... but I can't remember him doing a whole lot more for a few weeks..
Was extrememly disappointing sat night in what should have been a good chance for him to get some touch
This is not an attack on a player, far from it.... But i am not against dropping a player and giving him a kick up the arse if he needs it... Same goes for Hawkins
We seem to have the depth to be able to do it as well, lots of players pushing for a game and someone has to miss out, doesn't hurt to give someone a couple of weeks in the 2s to get their hands on the ball and their confidence up...
Trav lit it up for a quarter against Carlton, the last half of the last quarter against the pies... but I can't remember him doing a whole lot more for a few weeks..
Was extrememly disappointing sat night in what should have been a good chance for him to get some touch
meto
Norm Smith Medallist
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
Don't think the coaching staff would've been fooled by that 3 goal 3rd quarter vs the Blues, got on the end of others good work and finished well I admit, but barely touched it for first half and the remaining quarter.
It was the lump sum of his game. About 12 possessions I think.
Last week was an embrassment, the way he bounced his backside off a couple of Suns players looked comical.
Are you worried he'll find it hard to gather possessions in the 2's, don't know about you but I am, if he's got to get his own ball rather than rely on being fed in the seniors he might be in trouble.
Anyhow, doesn't deserve his spot ATM, just hope Scott stands by his words and plays those that have earnt it.
Don't think the coaching staff would've been fooled by that 3 goal 3rd quarter vs the Blues, got on the end of others good work and finished well I admit, but barely touched it for first half and the remaining quarter.
It was the lump sum of his game. About 12 possessions I think.
Last week was an embrassment, the way he bounced his backside off a couple of Suns players looked comical.
Are you worried he'll find it hard to gather possessions in the 2's, don't know about you but I am, if he's got to get his own ball rather than rely on being fed in the seniors he might be in trouble.
Anyhow, doesn't deserve his spot ATM, just hope Scott stands by his words and plays those that have earnt it.
- Banned
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Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
I missed the game - so do not want to write anything specific.
However one of the key reasons why Geelong has been so successful over the past 5 seasons is because we have hard bodies in the team - that go in and are willing to be strong with the footy and over the footy.
The Geelong Way people seem to talk about means ALL our footballers in the best 22 are hard bodied and will put their head over the ball.
Sure it is easier to say and than do. So younger players need a little time to develop their bodies for the rigour of elite footy - but their application and willingness to do what it takes on the field has to be present in the mind - as the body builds.
And I believe that is the Geelong Way - tough, strong, determined and skilled. If that key mental ingredient is missing - it is hard to see them progressing at GFC long term.
I hope that boy Schroder makes it ! Another Buddha type player would be great.
I missed the game - so do not want to write anything specific.
However one of the key reasons why Geelong has been so successful over the past 5 seasons is because we have hard bodies in the team - that go in and are willing to be strong with the footy and over the footy.
The Geelong Way people seem to talk about means ALL our footballers in the best 22 are hard bodied and will put their head over the ball.
Sure it is easier to say and than do. So younger players need a little time to develop their bodies for the rigour of elite footy - but their application and willingness to do what it takes on the field has to be present in the mind - as the body builds.
And I believe that is the Geelong Way - tough, strong, determined and skilled. If that key mental ingredient is missing - it is hard to see them progressing at GFC long term.
I hope that boy Schroder makes it ! Another Buddha type player would be great.
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
got on the end of others good work?
more than 90% of goals are finishing off the work of others.
seems more like an excuse to write something negative, like, he got his goals but.......
got on the end of others good work?
more than 90% of goals are finishing off the work of others.
seems more like an excuse to write something negative, like, he got his goals but.......
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
You didnt happen to venture down to princess park in 91 to watch the reserves play when one of the games greatest players only got 5 touches did you?
Some people play better around higher quality. There is no doubt.
I don't care about his possessions. It's intent I care about. And you can show that in the 2's
You didnt happen to venture down to princess park in 91 to watch the reserves play when one of the games greatest players only got 5 touches did you?
Some people play better around higher quality. There is no doubt.
I don't care about his possessions. It's intent I care about. And you can show that in the 2's
David the Cat
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Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
This is why people just take your Varcoe vendetta with a shrug and a " just another meto rant on Varcoe".
His 3 goals against Carlton were game breakers. And no credit from you on Varcoe's game against Hawthorn?.......look at this one...far from getting on the end of " others good work "....
One of the goals of the year. Try reading the comments underneath while you're at it.
Perhaps even look at the MVP votes through the year done on this board. You know...top 5 players on particular days this year? Varcoe appears in a number of games...votes done on this board...
Can't see the woods for the trees meto.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwcD7uza1oo&feature=youtu.be
PS: Sure...if he puts in games like last week then he should be dropped..as I have stated earlier...but he is no fake meto...and I would certainly want him in the games against the Hawks and Saints coming up however. Other clubs, players and supporters show him a lot more respect than you do.
Though I do note that around BF you write about him a lot.....even in threads that have no relevance to him. Is the reality that you have some man-love for him meto and its creating inner conflict?
This is why people just take your Varcoe vendetta with a shrug and a " just another meto rant on Varcoe".
His 3 goals against Carlton were game breakers. And no credit from you on Varcoe's game against Hawthorn?.......look at this one...far from getting on the end of " others good work "....
One of the goals of the year. Try reading the comments underneath while you're at it.
Perhaps even look at the MVP votes through the year done on this board. You know...top 5 players on particular days this year? Varcoe appears in a number of games...votes done on this board...
Can't see the woods for the trees meto.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwcD7uza1oo&feature=youtu.be
PS: Sure...if he puts in games like last week then he should be dropped..as I have stated earlier...but he is no fake meto...and I would certainly want him in the games against the Hawks and Saints coming up however. Other clubs, players and supporters show him a lot more respect than you do.
Though I do note that around BF you write about him a lot.....even in threads that have no relevance to him. Is the reality that you have some man-love for him meto and its creating inner conflict?
meto
Norm Smith Medallist
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
Sorry VC, all the good intentions in the world will ultimately achieve nothing, unless accompanied by actions.
Don't care about his possessions? you must be joking, that's what its all about, or does everybody else have to justify themselves ( their selection) but Travie can please himself?? LOL.
He's far away from being a great, unlike the true No 5, can he proove himself in the two's that the question!
If he can then, great, come back in, no problem with that?
Other players get dropped Dave,VC, if he's as great as you say then he'll quickly prove his superiority, don't you think????
We need to present our best team each week, why wouldn't you agree on improving our chances of success by seeing this guy qualify himself amongst those pressing for an opportunity which he is being gifted.
Sorry VC, all the good intentions in the world will ultimately achieve nothing, unless accompanied by actions.
Don't care about his possessions? you must be joking, that's what its all about, or does everybody else have to justify themselves ( their selection) but Travie can please himself?? LOL.
He's far away from being a great, unlike the true No 5, can he proove himself in the two's that the question!
If he can then, great, come back in, no problem with that?
Other players get dropped Dave,VC, if he's as great as you say then he'll quickly prove his superiority, don't you think????
We need to present our best team each week, why wouldn't you agree on improving our chances of success by seeing this guy qualify himself amongst those pressing for an opportunity which he is being gifted.
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
Yeah - pretty much.
I think I might have a re-watch and see how many times I can spot Varcoe shirking a contest. I have a feeling that I will find a few too many.
Absolutely bloody awful last weekend - and let's face it, outside of that third quarter barrage against the Blues, he has been way, way down on expectations. Needs to go back to the VFL to learn how to commit to a contest.
Yeah - pretty much.
I think I might have a re-watch and see how many times I can spot Varcoe shirking a contest. I have a feeling that I will find a few too many.
Absolutely bloody awful last weekend - and let's face it, outside of that third quarter barrage against the Blues, he has been way, way down on expectations. Needs to go back to the VFL to learn how to commit to a contest.
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Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
He wasn't great against the Suns, correct.
But how many times has he stood up when we have really needed someone to? I think all of his great goals have come against the better sides.
He wasn't great against the Suns, correct.
But how many times has he stood up when we have really needed someone to? I think all of his great goals have come against the better sides.
Vdubs
Hall of Famer
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
But you do not lose sheer talent, it's confidence that has escaped.
AGREE. How were his efforts the last 2 times we played Hawks? THE TACKLE of the year on a rampaging Buddy, that goal this year. Just when we needed a goal against Swans, against Blues. There is no way I'd like to see him do that Varcoe magic in the 2's. Not yet. His problem appears to be that his potential mid role has been taken by Stokes, and he is floundering around as a goal sneak and thus just flashes in and out. Maybe a bit more responsibility, and admittedly, a lot more effort around the contests.
But you do not lose sheer talent, it's confidence that has escaped.
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
It's not confidence.
It's intent.
A damaging finisher (possibly elite by foot)? You bet
A damaging tackler(possibly elite) ? You bet
The way he is running at the moment I could see him crunching an opponent at 1/2 back and running into an open goal seconds later.
The problem? He aint going to crunch anyone right now. And we need it.
It's not confidence.
It's intent.
A damaging finisher (possibly elite by foot)? You bet
A damaging tackler(possibly elite) ? You bet
The way he is running at the moment I could see him crunching an opponent at 1/2 back and running into an open goal seconds later.
The problem? He aint going to crunch anyone right now. And we need it.
Hoffy95
Norm Smith Medallist
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
With confidence comes intent though.
It's hard to put in the effort when the chips are down. There's a lack of energy that goes hand in hand with the lack of confidence. When things are going well you can run all day.
With confidence comes intent though.
It's hard to put in the effort when the chips are down. There's a lack of energy that goes hand in hand with the lack of confidence. When things are going well you can run all day.
David the Cat
Moderator
- Moderator
- #120
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
Possessions are not what its all about. Do I care how many possessions Lonergan gets? Not really. Scarlett sometimes gets 30 possessions....sometimes he gets 10...and sometimes his 10 possession game is more valuable than his 30 possession game. As Scott said on Saturday..." we can be seduced by statistics.. "...and so many are.
Travis is not " great " at the moment, but he is a class player. He played poorly last week...no-one will know that better than TV himself. He must improve on that performance or he may well look at a stint in the reserves. Of course, thats assuming he didn't fulfil the role set for him before the game!! Thats a matter for the MC and Scott to know and the decision of whether to play him, rest him or play him in the 2's would follow naturally from there.
If he is going to be rested or given a run in the 2's ( less likely ) I would prefer to see it this week, rather than against Hawthorn and St Kilda.
We need players with elite foot skills, pace and run when we play the better sides and Varcoe has those attributes in spades. And he usually delivers against the better sides.
I have watched last weeks game a few times and what interested me most about TV was that far from being an outside runner, he was often in traffic, handballing, rather than being outside and using his foot skills. I don't know if that was by design ( game plan/instruction ) or just how it panned out. He had 2 kicks and 10 handballs...a player like him should ( IMO ) have a far greater balance between handballs and kicking, and I agree, be getting more of it. But.....was that what Scott and the MC wanted from Varcoe against the GC? Well I don't know and neither does anyone else here. I guess we will find that out soon enough!
Like you, and others, I would love him to be getting 20 possessions and kicking a couple of goals each week, but what we don't know is whether thats the objective set for him every game. As I wrote on another thread, football is like a business these days..each player having objectives to achieve and action plans to carry out. We don't know what they are week to week....they don't remain the same week in and week out. If they were, how easy would we be to plan against!!! We would be taken to the cleaners on a regular basis.
Thats why I believe people should be very wary of criticising players too vehemently here when we don't know their role from week to week.
Football is not as black and white as it was in the old days.
Possessions are not what its all about. Do I care how many possessions Lonergan gets? Not really. Scarlett sometimes gets 30 possessions....sometimes he gets 10...and sometimes his 10 possession game is more valuable than his 30 possession game. As Scott said on Saturday..." we can be seduced by statistics.. "...and so many are.
Travis is not " great " at the moment, but he is a class player. He played poorly last week...no-one will know that better than TV himself. He must improve on that performance or he may well look at a stint in the reserves. Of course, thats assuming he didn't fulfil the role set for him before the game!! Thats a matter for the MC and Scott to know and the decision of whether to play him, rest him or play him in the 2's would follow naturally from there.
If he is going to be rested or given a run in the 2's ( less likely ) I would prefer to see it this week, rather than against Hawthorn and St Kilda.
We need players with elite foot skills, pace and run when we play the better sides and Varcoe has those attributes in spades. And he usually delivers against the better sides.
I have watched last weeks game a few times and what interested me most about TV was that far from being an outside runner, he was often in traffic, handballing, rather than being outside and using his foot skills. I don't know if that was by design ( game plan/instruction ) or just how it panned out. He had 2 kicks and 10 handballs...a player like him should ( IMO ) have a far greater balance between handballs and kicking, and I agree, be getting more of it. But.....was that what Scott and the MC wanted from Varcoe against the GC? Well I don't know and neither does anyone else here. I guess we will find that out soon enough!
Like you, and others, I would love him to be getting 20 possessions and kicking a couple of goals each week, but what we don't know is whether thats the objective set for him every game. As I wrote on another thread, football is like a business these days..each player having objectives to achieve and action plans to carry out. We don't know what they are week to week....they don't remain the same week in and week out. If they were, how easy would we be to plan against!!! We would be taken to the cleaners on a regular basis.
Thats why I believe people should be very wary of criticising players too vehemently here when we don't know their role from week to week.
Football is not as black and white as it was in the old days.
meto
Norm Smith Medallist
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
That's a first class response Dave, you're no dope! maybe I do expect not necessarily quantum possessions, but a high imput factor with all players,no matter their team role.
It could be the issue, his role is not what suits, however, the last two weeks apart from the cameo third quarter against Carlton have been lacking intensity which is obvious to all.
We've now got some little toughnuts that are dying to get a game, for instance little Bundy, played 11/2 quarters for a dozen possessions and fed Varcoe his first goal in the third against Carlton.
How do you think he'd feel if Varcoe keeps getting picked over him, you do have a duty toward the others, that's what went wrong under Thompson, just kept playing the same old.
That's a first class response Dave, you're no dope! maybe I do expect not necessarily quantum possessions, but a high imput factor with all players,no matter their team role.
It could be the issue, his role is not what suits, however, the last two weeks apart from the cameo third quarter against Carlton have been lacking intensity which is obvious to all.
We've now got some little toughnuts that are dying to get a game, for instance little Bundy, played 11/2 quarters for a dozen possessions and fed Varcoe his first goal in the third against Carlton.
How do you think he'd feel if Varcoe keeps getting picked over him, you do have a duty toward the others, that's what went wrong under Thompson, just kept playing the same old.
David the Cat
Moderator
- Moderator
- #122
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
Mate, I am as dumb as dog shit after a few rums...
Intensity IS an issue I grant that. And just between you and I, I see good things in young Bundy, so I take your point.
Lets see how things transpire over the next few weeks when we play some big games....and revisit because all players including Varcoe need to show they can mix it with the big boys, and the upcoming games will provide us an opportunity to see who can do it when the heats on.
The big games in September are what its all about in the long run.
Mate, I am as dumb as dog shit after a few rums...
Intensity IS an issue I grant that. And just between you and I, I see good things in young Bundy, so I take your point.
Lets see how things transpire over the next few weeks when we play some big games....and revisit because all players including Varcoe need to show they can mix it with the big boys, and the upcoming games will provide us an opportunity to see who can do it when the heats on.
The big games in September are what its all about in the long run.
meto
Norm Smith Medallist
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
Fine!
If he plays he plays, and good luck, for the teams sake.
Think we all need patience for the next 3-4 weeks while they shuffle things about.
Looks like Hawkins is under the pump from Scott, although I like his strength and tackling power around the packs its just not happening enough according to the coach. Hope this ignites the fire what with the emergence of Vardy as well, our tall stocks need a boost.
Mate, I am as dumb as dog shit after a few rums...
Intensity IS an issue I grant that. And just between you and I, I see good things in young Bundy, so I take your point.
Lets see how things transpire over the next few weeks when we play some big games....and revisit because all players including Varcoe need to show they can mix it with the big boys, and the upcoming games will provide us an opportunity to see who can do it when the heats on.
The big games in September are what its all about in the long run.
Fine!
If he plays he plays, and good luck, for the teams sake.
Think we all need patience for the next 3-4 weeks while they shuffle things about.
Looks like Hawkins is under the pump from Scott, although I like his strength and tackling power around the packs its just not happening enough according to the coach. Hope this ignites the fire what with the emergence of Vardy as well, our tall stocks need a boost.
David the Cat
Moderator
- Moderator
- #124
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
Clearly Scott likes what he sees in Vardy. Young Vardy is an impressive looking specimen that's for sure! I think Scott is letting Tommy know that Vardy's emergence is a threat to his position in the team and putting him on notice.
Like you, I think Hawkins is treated a little harshly on here, but the writing is now on the wall for him.
It will be really interesting how he responds. It could be the making of him.
Clearly Scott likes what he sees in Vardy. Young Vardy is an impressive looking specimen that's for sure! I think Scott is letting Tommy know that Vardy's emergence is a threat to his position in the team and putting him on notice.
Like you, I think Hawkins is treated a little harshly on here, but the writing is now on the wall for him.
It will be really interesting how he responds. It could be the making of him.
Re: Calls for Varcoe to be dropped
I am not sure I agree with this unseen team role theory. The quite clear role Varcoe has is as a game breaker, with goals and thrilling runs, one he has fullfilled well. There is no real tactical masterclass here.
What the supporters and the coaches are disappointed is the total absence of a contribution in any other facet of the game.
There is no debate Varcoe is worth a game, he is a brilliant game breaker in a team no longer awash with them. The debate is whether he needs a rocket from the coaches in the form of a demotion.
He is not even at last year's level and we expected, and presumably paid him accordingly, a big upturn. Some people even suggested he was worth more than a million a year to GWS. At current form, about a fifth of that is appropriate.
I am not sure I agree with this unseen team role theory. The quite clear role Varcoe has is as a game breaker, with goals and thrilling runs, one he has fullfilled well. There is no real tactical masterclass here.
What the supporters and the coaches are disappointed is the total absence of a contribution in any other facet of the game.
There is no debate Varcoe is worth a game, he is a brilliant game breaker in a team no longer awash with them. The debate is whether he needs a rocket from the coaches in the form of a demotion.
He is not even at last year's level and we expected, and presumably paid him accordingly, a big upturn. Some people even suggested he was worth more than a million a year to GWS. At current form, about a fifth of that is appropriate.
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