WCE peak Judd was better than peak GAJ and peak Dustin Martin

[Falcon3518]

Who said straight away? Were you alive back then?

I was 14 and even I knew what was going on. Have you ever switched jobs to get better pay? That’s what this is, not rocket science mate.


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[PhatBoy]

It’s amazing how much you can’t use common sense. Yep Jnr didn’t move for the money the Suns gave him the best chance of a flag. You’re sick


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I’ve literally just posted ‘the money would be a factor.’

I know you struggle with it but other forum users can read, so just because you’ve claimed I said ‘money wasn’t a factor’ doesn’t mean I’ve said it.

Money was a factor. So was captaincy. As a professional athlete the prospect of a new challenge would have been as well. As much as you think you may be the one human to come along and actually be able to re-write history after roughly 10 billion others a couldn’t manage it, you can’t. And no amount of ‘it’s right because I said so’ will change that.

 

[Falcon3518]

Yes they were earned because he played well. They don’t automatically imbue his games with a higher level of proficiency though and your inability to comprehend that is frankly quite baffling

The amount of BOGs he got does, which is what the award REPRESENTS.

 

[PhatBoy]

I was 14 and even I knew what was going on. Have you ever switched jobs to get better pay? That’s what this is, not rocket science mate.


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If it was rocket science and you were commenting on it I’d be incredibly surprised.

 

[PhatBoy]

The amount of BOGs he got does, which is what the award REPRESENTS.

The award can represent gold plated Arse nuggets for all I care, it doesn’t mean shit when assessing the level of quality someone has reached.

 

[PrinceCharles]

I was 14 and even I knew what was going on. Have you ever switched jobs to get better pay? That’s what this is, not rocket science mate.


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Oh dear, how embarrassing

 

[My Tilly]

Judd peak was out of this world. Not sure I had ever seen another midfielder his size with such electric burst of speed and finishing skills. Koutoufides was an athletic beast (191cm/100kg) but he never had the same speed as Judd. Judd was also the best clearance and contested ball winner I ever seen. To go to Carlton and lift them up to the finals in only his second season, it speaks volumes to his influence.

Some of these past players put the likes of Neale, Cripps, Oliver to shame. As sensational as what they are, Judd and co were on another level.

 

[Falcon3518]

No I want to argue with you because I’ve never encountered someone as easy to argue with as you. I’ve never seen someone on a forum of social media so bereft of the analytical, interpretational and empathetic skill and frankly it’s a sign of how pathetic my after hours existence is that I get such a kick out of highlighting the lunacy and contradictory nature of everything you post in this place and the fact that neutral fans are happy to point out your dumb logic is an even bigger indictment.

The saddest part of all - aside from my heroin like taste for pointing out the rank inconsistency in your posting, anyway - is that you don’t even have the balls as a forum user to address the posts that call out your false equivalency and poor logic. You just ignore them and act as though you were never tagged in them.

I get called out cause I post to much now I get this crap from you about ignoring post. Looks like I’m screwed either way. You’ve got issues bro, I can’t win.

You’re having a sook because another player actually beat the Abletts at something and you can’t handle it. Guess what they aren’t as great as you think. They have pros and cons like everybody else. Can any cats supporters give me a con for GAS or GAJ, is it even possible?

 

[PrinceCharles]

I get called out cause I post to much now I get this crap from you about ignoring post. Looks like I’m screwed either way. You’ve got issues bro, I can’t win.

You’re having a sook because another player actually beat the Abletts at something and you can’t handle it. Guess what they aren’t as great as you think. They have pros and cons like everybody else. Can any cats supporters give me a con for GAS or GAJ, is it even possible?

You weren't alive when Senior played.

 

[PhatBoy]

Falcon, give your pea sized historical appreciation segment of your brain some exercise.

Google a man called George Headley.

George Headley was never, for one solitary second, the best batsman on the planet. Ever.

He had a test cricket career nearly two decades long and at no stage was he the best batsman on the planet.

Several times a West Indies batsman called Shivnarine Chanderpaul was not only the best West Indies batsman, but was rated the number one batsman in the world.

Using your shithouse, and honestly if I was being kind, utterly abortional method of rating players, there is no way George Headley could have been a better batsman than Shivnarine Chanderpaul because he was never crowned the #1 batsman in the world.


Except the thing is, during George Headley’s career there was a batsman from Australia called Donald George Bradman.
He kept Headley in second place at the time.

Again, using your foolproof logic, there is no way Headley could be a better batsman than Chanderpaul. One reached #1 in the world, the other did not.

But anyone who knows how numbers and logic work, knows that Headley reached a standard that Chanderpaul never got close to.


Saying ‘because I said so’ repeatedly won’t change how reason and logic work.

 

[Falcon3518]

The award can represent gold plated Arse nuggets for all I care, it doesn’t mean s**t when assessing the level of quality someone has reached.

Cats fans are predictable, flags mean f all cause GAS didn’t win one

Norm smiths mean f all cause GAJ didn’t win one.

Yet they are quick to talk about H&A awards cause they both had plenty of those. Pure hypocrisy.

 

[Has No Rules]

going to watch peak Judd at Subi live was something else

 

[PhatBoy]

I get called out cause I post to much now I get this crap from you about ignoring post. Looks like I’m screwed either way. You’ve got issues bro, I can’t win.

You’re having a sook because another player actually beat the Abletts at something and you can’t handle it. Guess what they aren’t as great as you think. They have pros and cons like everybody else. Can any cats supporters give me a con for GAS or GAJ, is it even possible?

Cant handle what, exactly? What have the ablett’s lost or missed out on that I’m so torn about?

Show some ticker and address what’s actually being asked of you instead of deflecting.

 

[PhatBoy]

Cats fans are predictable, flags mean f all cause GAS didn’t win one

Norm smiths mean f all cause GAJ didn’t win one.

Yet they are quick to talk about H&A awards cause they both had plenty of those. Pure hypocrisy.

Flags mean plenty for a club. They don’t present them to individuals.

I’m not about to claim Dangerfield is Fyfe’s equal because they’ve both won 0 flags. Fyfe is easily the better player.

 

[Falcon3518]

Best on grounds are fine.

Who’s played better - best on ground in a shitfest against a garbage team, or second best on ground in the game of the season between two sides at a their best?

Answer the question. Yes or no. Don’t make up another stupid excuse or award based response.

Answer it.

Who’s played better - best on ground with 23 touches and a goal in a 53-39 game where neither side gets out of 2nd gear or the bloke who’s had 33 touches and 3 goals in a pulsating match that finishes 112-104 and gets beaten for best on ground by a teammate who’s kicked 7.2 and had 3 contested marks?

It can’t be that hard. First guy or second guy. Who’s played better.

I see the problem. You don’t understand data analysis and look at raw numbers without anything else. You have to LOOK at the game, who stood up in the critical moments, who kicked junktime goals etc. This is how you determine how good a player is. For somebody who uses the eye test to judge how good players are I’m amazed you actually wrote this.


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[PhatBoy]

It’s amazing how much you can’t use common sense. Yep Jnr didn’t move for the money the Suns gave him the best chance of a flag. You’re sick


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Where did I say they gave him
The best chance for a flag? Can you find the quote where I said that? Post it for me, I just want to read it again. Quote it please falcon. Post the quote where I said that. I want to read it.


Or maybe, as anyone who can read would realise, I said that he was getting a good pay rise and believed he could eventually get them to a flag.

 

[PhatBoy]

I see the problem. You don’t understand data analysis and look at raw numbers without anything else. You have to LOOK at the game, who stood up in the critical moments, who kicked junktime goals etc. This is how you determine how good a player is. For somebody who uses the eye test to judge how good players are I’m amazed you actually wrote this.


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That’s not a yes or no answer. Stop deflecting, show some balls, and answer the question.

Who has reached a better level of sporting output. Second best onfield In an incredible game or best onfield in an absolute shitfest.

Show some balls mate and stop avoid My the question.

Has second best in the game of the year played better than BOG in a garbage contest.

Yes or no.

 

[Falcon3518]

Cant handle what, exactly? What have the ablett’s lost or missed out on that I’m so torn about?

Show some ticker and address what’s actually being asked of you instead of deflecting.

You think they are the GOATs. If a player gets too good in any way you become territorial and get vicious because it doesn’t agree with your narrative. You can’t handle somebody being considered better than the Abletts your brain would explode. I see how cats supporters treat hawks supporters with Lethal, feral.

 

[PhatBoy]

You think they are the GOATs. If a player gets too good in any way you become territorial and get vicious because it doesn’t agree with your narrative. You can’t handle somebody being considered better than the Abletts your brain would explode. I see how cats supporters treat hawks supporters with Lethal, feral.

No, I just think one in particular was the best of the three players being discussed in this thread.

What you think of Gary Ablett Sr means about as much to me as the contents of a sanitary bin at a music festival and while there are plenty of good players vying legitimately with him for a spot in that argument, including one of his own rival full forwards, no one in the last decade is among them and your gutless inability to actually address any of the rank inconsistencies in any theory you have on AFL football isn’t going to impact that.

Not sure what other cats supporters’ opinions of Leigh Matthews really have to do with my assessment that he’s arguably the best player of
All time.

Seems you f****ed that attempt up pretty royally too, doesn’t it?

 

[Falcon3518]

That’s not a yes or no answer. Stop deflecting, show some balls, and answer the question.

Who has reached a better level of sporting output. Second best onfield In an incredible game or best onfield in an absolute shitfest.

Show some balls mate and stop avoid My the question.

Has second best in the game of the year played better than BOG in a garbage contest.

Yes or no.

Player B

 

[PhatBoy]

Player B

Then you are dumber than I thought.

But thank you for making it official.

 

[Falcon3518]

Then you are dumber than I thought.

But thank you for making it official.

I mean the 33 disposal 3 goal guy. Really, you reckon the other one?


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[PhatBoy]

I mean the 33 disposal 3 goal guy. Really, you reckon the other one?


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That was player A by my reckoning but I’m a few drinks deep.

Ok. I rescind my last post.

Ok so to me that tells me you CAN appreciate logic to some extent.

So, by extension, if you can see that a player who in one GAME might be second best but relative to another game has performed better than another player.

What is preventing you from being able to understand that, for example, a player who was second best over a season where the standard was exceptionally high, could be better than a Brownlow medallist in a season where the standard was exceptionally low?

 

[Falcon3518]

That was player A by my reckoning but I’m a few drinks deep.

Ok. I rescind my last post.

Ok so to me that tells me you CAN appreciate logic to some extent.

So, by extension, if you can see that a player who in one GAME might be second best but relative to another game has performed better than another player.

What is preventing you from being able to understand that, for example, a player who was second best over a season where the standard was exceptionally high, could be better than a Brownlow medallist in a season where the standard was exceptionally low?

You called him ‘the second guy’ in the first post about it which is why I referred to him as player B.

You mean like Priddis? Sure, don’t see the relevance to these 3 guys though.


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[PhatBoy]

You called him ‘the second guy’ in the first post about it which is why I referred to him as player B.

You mean like Priddis? Sure, don’t see the relevance to these 3 guys though.


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Yes like priddis that’s actually a very good example.

Priddis won a brownlow outright.

That makes him equal with Michael voss, theoretically, using some of the logic you have based your posts around.

Really he’s ahead of Voss because Voss shared his medal with Hird, and Mckernan.

But he’s not ahead, is he?

Because as anyone who watched both Priddis’ Brownlow winning season, and those of Hird and Voss, would probably concur that both Hird AND Voss played better footy in 1996 than Priddis did in his winning year.


Applying the same standards and logic, it becomes apparent that JUST BECAUSE a player has had a season where they win a Brownlow, a coaches award, a MVP, a flag, a Norm Smith it does not therefore inherently mean that their season was better than someone who may have reached a higher level of output but ok let’s say it’s a Jimmy Bartel (only an example) who wins a Brownlow in a season in which Gary Ablett plays incredible footy, wins a flag, plays fantastic in a grand final.


Now how does his level of play compare to Martin in 2017 - and no I’m not saying Bartel had a better 2007 than Martin did in 2017 - but straight away he’s had to beat out Gary Ablett Jr to win the Brownlow who was the bookies favourite. He’s played fantastic against Port on grand final day - it’s not Bartel’s fault Geelong ****ing pounded them so there was no need for him to single handedly win us the game, like ther was for Martin in 17 or 20.

Is it Bartel’s fault that his teammates were all at their best as well? To look at your logic, yes it is. But we know that it’s not.