2nds West Coast Eagles WAFL Watch 2024

[Alesana]

Is the game being broadcast anywhere?

There should a link on this page once it's live

AFL - News, Fixtures, Scores & Results - AFL.com.au

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www.afl.com.au

 

[Tyberious Funk]

Our development coaches help with the WAFL side on game days - so the likes of Shannon Hurn and Jacob Brennan. Also Steve Trewhella

But there all part of the AFL umbrella as well which would be why they’re not named

That said, on balance the WAFL sides would have more resources than our side

If you look at, say, the coaching panel at Subiaco;

Men's Coaching Panel - Subiaco FC

SENIOR COACH

subiacofc.com.au

There's a senior coach, plus 6 assistants. Plus a whole slew of support staff. Granted, I imagine that many of them are part time. But that's a heck of a lot more resources than we seem to be putting in. Particularly when you consider that resources like Hurn, Brennan and Trewhella are presumably spread across the AFL and WAFL teams.

IMHO, if we want to run a stand-alone side, we need to treat it like a real club. Resource it accordingly, help it to grow it's own identity and support all the players... not just the AFL-listed ones.

 

[WCErevival]

Is there any chance of a new WAFL team being formed and having the Eagles aligned with them? Like the Vic Park Velociraptors or something like that? Or is there not enough room for another team.

 

[plays tall 1]

Is there any chance of a new WAFL team being formed and having the Eagles aligned with them? Like the Vic Park Velociraptors or something like that? Or is there not enough room for another team.

I’ve suggested this before, I think it’s the best possible outcome for the Eagles. Given the enormous population growth Perth is experiencing, it should be feasible. But, given how strong Peel have been with this sort of model, I’m sure the WAFL clubs will vigorously oppose it. I’m not sure what levers the WAFC has to pull to force something through.

If we can’t have that, then I think we should be proposing that the Beagles have a substantially higher salary cap given the systemic issues that make it difficult to attract players. Money talks, there must be some very handy WAFL, VFL and SANFL players who'd be prepared to play for the Beagles despite the shortcomings others have outlined already in this thread if they’re appropriately compensated.

No doubt the other WAFL clubs like to see the Beagles totally uncompetitive but it really is time for forceful negotiation by the Eagles, and for the WAFC to become a bit more assertive in order to achieve a sustainable structure.

 

[kane249]

Clubs were pissed when Peel first came in as it meant redoing all the recruitment zones. Would be similar resistance if they did it again adding a 10th proper club

 

[Tyberious Funk]

I’ve suggested this before, I think it’s the best possible outcome for the Eagles. Given the enormous population growth Perth is experiencing, it should be feasible. But, given how strong Peel have been with this sort of model, I’m sure the WAFL clubs will vigorously oppose it. I’m not sure what levers the WAFC has to pull to force something through.

If we can’t have that, then I think we should be proposing that the Beagles have a substantially higher salary cap given the systemic issues that make it difficult to attract players. Money talks, there must be some very handy WAFL, VFL and SANFL players who'd be prepared to play for the Beagles despite the shortcomings others have outlined already in this thread if they’re appropriately compensated.

No doubt the other WAFL clubs like to see the Beagles totally uncompetitive but it really is time for forceful negotiation by the Eagles, and for the WAFC to become a bit more assertive in order to achieve a sustainable structure.

Salary cap isn't the issue. I think it was posted earlier in the thread that we are at 65% of the base salary cap, which IMHO seems pretty reasonable given the number of players we need to fund. I like to throw shit at the WAFC, but the problems with the WAFL team start with our mismanagement.

 

[Cuzz09]

Minimal injuries should see us being competitive in most games.



Sent from my SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Nelson was officially cleared to Old Geelong two weeks ago, for anyone keeping track (which excludes everyone in the West Coast communications team, and probably the footy department as well).

 

[Keys]

View attachment 2175872

Nelson was officially cleared to Old Geelong two weeks ago, for anyone keeping track (which excludes everyone in the West Coast communications team, and probably the footy department as well).

To be fair, as of yesterday he was still working at the club. (saw him walking to get lunch wearing a club polo)

 

[plays tall 1]

Salary cap isn't the issue. I think it was posted earlier in the thread that we are at 65% of the base salary cap, which IMHO seems pretty reasonable given the number of players we need to fund. I like to throw shit at the WAFC, but the problems with the WAFL team start with our mismanagement.

The question is what is causing this underpayment (if it is indeed a fact).

Others in this thread have noted that the club has great difficulty attracting decent players for the following reasons:

• risk of missing out on games to make way for AFL players
• likelihood of uncompetitiveness due in large part to the need to include amateurs
• perception of lack of tradition of the club
• lack of development pathway meaning no players come through the system with an attachment to the WAFL Beagles

With the current salary cap, the club can’t even retain ex-players let alone attract new players. But as in all aspects of life, eventually money talks…players will compromise on these issues if the compensation demands it.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

To be fair, as of yesterday he was still working at the club. (saw him walking to get lunch wearing a club polo)

Get your rational facts out of here.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

The question is what is causing this underpayment (if it is indeed a fact).

Others in this thread have noted that the club has great difficulty attracting decent players for the following reasons:

• risk of missing out on games to make way for AFL players
• likelihood of uncompetitiveness due in large part to the need to include amateurs
• perception of lack of tradition of the club
• lack of development pathway meaning no players come through the system with an attachment to the WAFL Beagles

With the current salary cap, the club can’t even retain ex-players let alone attract new players. But as in all aspects of life, eventually money talks…players will be compromise on these issues if the compensation demands it.

The Eagles have 15-20 players that are paid in the AFL salary cap. That salary they receive as an AFL listed player is their payment.

At a WAFL club they have a Salary cap of around 270k per season which is to pay their entire squad of 45-50 players. Obviously the bulk of that goes to the Regular League players.

The salary cap for the Beagles is something like 65% of that figure which is more than enough to recruit players with, they only need to recruit around 10 - 20 players and barring major injuries only a maximum of 8-10 will play regularly.

The Beagles find it hard to recruit not because of money but because they are not a team that is hell bent on winning the WAFL premiership, why play for them when you can play for another WAFL club who are all in on achieving something together.

I still think the Beagles will be ok if they can get their players fit and stop with the huge injury run they have had for the last 3 years. A fit senior team will make the seconds team very competitive. They just need to go out and recruit some reasonable second tier players and utilise the points they have been given. They didn't recruit last year and only used like 70% of their available points. Thats on the WCE.

So Money is not the issue, recruiting is the issue and the biggest issue is providing a platform that if you do recruit a decent 2nd tier player he still gets a game when the Eagles are at full strength in his best position. No point recruiting a good midfielder from another club only to throw him in a forward pocket or on the bench when you don't have injuries.

Its just not that easy any of this. This is why an alignment model is a better model.

 

[Elite Pete]

VFL clubs are on a signing spree…..

 

[plays tall 1]

The Eagles have 15-20 players that are paid in the AFL salary cap. That salary they receive as an AFL listed player is their payment.

At a WAFL club they have a Salary cap of around 270k per season which is to pay their entire squad of 45-50 players. Obviously the bulk of that goes to the Regular League players.

The salary cap for the Beagles is something like 65% of that figure which is more than enough to recruit players with, they only need to recruit around 10 - 20 players and barring major injuries only a maximum of 8-10 will play regularly.

The Beagles find it hard to recruit not because of money but because they are not a team that is hell bent on winning the WAFL premiership, why play for them when you can play for another WAFL club who are all in on achieving something together.

I still think the Beagles will be ok if they can get their players fit and stop with the huge injury run they have had for the last 3 years. A fit senior team will make the seconds team very competitive. They just need to go out and recruit some reasonable second tier players and utilise the points they have been given. They didn't recruit last year and only used like 70% of their available points. Thats on the WCE.

So Money is not the issue, recruiting is the issue and the biggest issue is providing a platform that if you do recruit a decent 2nd tier player he still gets a game when the Eagles are at full strength in his best position. No point recruiting a good midfielder from another club only to throw him in a forward pocket or on the bench when you don't have injuries.

Its just not that easy any of this. This is why an alignment model is a better model.

How much does the average regular WAFL player receive per season? And the average WAFL reserves and colts players?

 

[Tyberious Funk]

The Beagles find it hard to recruit not because of money but because they are not a team that is hell bent on winning the WAFL premiership, why play for them when you can play for another WAFL club who are all in on achieving something together.

Exactly. They are literally described as "top up players". Doesn't that sound inspiring? There is almost zero incentive for an amateur/semipro WAFL player to join a club that's effectively treating them like a training dummy.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

How much does the average regular WAFL player receive per season? And the average WAFL reserves and colts players?

The WAFL reserves and Colts get very little. A top tier WAFL player may get between $1000 and $3000 per game. But this would be only for the very best players in each WAFL club. The fact that country clubs can entice WAFL players to leave their WAFL club and go to the country for $700 -$1000 per game shows just how little they are paid.

The WAFL SANFL and VFL players all extremely underpaid for the time and effort they are required to put in.

 

[plays tall 1]

The WAFL reserves and Colts get very little. A top tier WAFL player may get between $1000 and $3000 per game. But this would be only for the very best players in each WAFL club. The fact that country clubs can entice WAFL players to leave their WAFL club and go to the country for $700 -$1000 per game shows just how little they are paid.

The WAFL SANFL and VFL players all extremely underpaid for the time and effort they are required to put in.

Interesting. Based on your figures the Beagles salary cap is around $175.5k

You mentioned that only 8-10 of the Beagles “top-up” players will play regularly. If we assume the Beagles only recruit the very cheapest WAFL players (@$1k per WAFL game) and that 9 of those play 18 games, that’s $162k. There’s about $13.5k to cover the rest of the players they use to top up.

It’s hard to see how the Beagles could seek to recruit any high paid WAFL players (the $3k per game types you mentioned). And if the Beagles are only offering the average WAFL player $1k per game (the same as their current club) there really is no incentive for WAFL players to move (for the numerous structural problems previously mentioned).

The fact that the Beagles have not spent their salary cap in previous years suggests they’re either too lazy/can’t be bothered, or that there are structural impediments to doing that. It’d be interesting to hear Don Pyke’s response if these points were put to him and he was asked to explain why the Eagles haven’t spent their cap in recent years.

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

Have we joined the VFL yet (again)?

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Have we joined the VFL yet (again)?

How will that fix anything?

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Interesting. Based on your figures the Beagles salary cap is around $175.5k

You mentioned that only 8-10 of the Beagles “top-up” players will play regularly. If we assume the Beagles only recruit the very cheapest WAFL players (@$1k per WAFL game) and that 9 of those play 18 games, that’s $162k. There’s about $13.5k to cover the rest of the players they use to top up.

It’s hard to see how the Beagles could seek to recruit any high paid WAFL players (the $3k per game types you mentioned). And if the Beagles are only offering the average WAFL player $1k per game (the same as their current club) there really is no incentive for WAFL players to move (for the numerous structural problems previously mentioned).

The fact that the Beagles have not spent their salary cap in previous years suggests they’re either too lazy/can’t be bothered, or that there are structural impediments to doing that. It’d be interesting to hear Don Pyke’s response if these points were put to him and he was asked to explain why the Eagles haven’t spent their cap in recent years.

It seems only the Eagles are struggling to manage? VFL standalone clubs salary cap is 220k. And with that you need to recruit and convince players to take up their weekend with their family travelling instead of just staying at home and playing for their WAFL club. None of this has an easy answer other than if the Eagles don't get injuries then the Beagles will be fine I reckon and no one will say to much all of a sudden.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Interesting. Based on your figures the Beagles salary cap is around $175.5k

You mentioned that only 8-10 of the Beagles “top-up” players will play regularly. If we assume the Beagles only recruit the very cheapest WAFL players (@$1k per WAFL game) and that 9 of those play 18 games, that’s $162k. There’s about $13.5k to cover the rest of the players they use to top up.

It’s hard to see how the Beagles could seek to recruit any high paid WAFL players (the $3k per game types you mentioned). And if the Beagles are only offering the average WAFL player $1k per game (the same as their current club) there really is no incentive for WAFL players to move (for the numerous structural problems previously mentioned).

The fact that the Beagles have not spent their salary cap in previous years suggests they’re either too lazy/can’t be bothered, or that there are structural impediments to doing that. It’d be interesting to hear Don Pyke’s response if these points were put to him and he was asked to explain why the Eagles haven’t spent their cap in recent years.

Still very difficult for me to get my head wrapped around that the AFLW salary cap is 6 times what the VFL/SANFL and WAFL salary cap is.

 

[plays tall 1]

It seems only the Eagles are struggling to manage? VFL standalone clubs salary cap is 220k. And with that you need to recruit and convince players to take up their weekend with their family travelling instead of just staying at home and playing for their WAFL club. None of this has an easy answer other than if the Eagles don't get injuries then the Beagles will be fine I reckon and no one will say to much all of a sudden.

The VFL is an entirely different proposition to the WAFL. Most of the best Victorian juniors come through the Coates Talent League which is an under 18 competition. The CTL teams aren’t represented in the VFL. The VFL is the premier competition outside of the AFL. No doubt large numbers of CTL juniors who don’t get drafted would try to join one of the VFL clubs, and they would have no particular allegiance to the traditional VFL clubs like Williamstown, Werribee, Port Melbourne etc.. So it's likely to be much easier for the AFL clubs to attract these kids than it is for the Eagles to attract players who have come through the WAFL clubs.

As for the NSW and Queensland teams in the VFL, I expect the local NSW and Qld kids with aspirations to play AFL would be very keen to play in the VFL rather than the NEAFL or whatever other local competitions they have.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

The VFL is an entirely different proposition to the WAFL. Most of the best Victorian juniors come through the Coates Talent League which is an under 18 competition. The CTL teams aren’t represented in the VFL. The VFL is the premier competition outside of the AFL. No doubt large numbers of CTL juniors who don’t get drafted would try to join one of the VFL clubs, and they would have no particular allegiance to the traditional VFL clubs like Williamstown, Werribee, Port Melbourne etc.. So it's likely to be much easier for the AFL clubs to attract these kids than it is for the Eagles to attract players who have come through the WAFL clubs.

As for the NSW and Queensland teams in the VFL, I expect the local NSW and Qld kids with aspirations to play AFL would be very keen to play in the VFL rather than the NEAFL or whatever other local competitions they have.

I disagree the VFL is the premier comp outside the AFL. In fact I think it’s about the third best comp.
You need to remember the AFL clubs are full of young kid’s developing so virtually a colts comp.
The really good players who do t get drafted head to VIC Country leagues or the VIC ammo’s where they can get far greater money than playing VFL or head to the SANFL or WAFL if the offer is right.
No doubt the AFL is miles in front as the best comp but the next best 22 on AFL lists are unknown talent developing or known talent as list cloggers.
We got a few of those cloggers at the EAgles.

 

[TOA.]

Exactly. They are literally described as "top up players". Doesn't that sound inspiring? There is almost zero incentive for an amateur/semipro WAFL player to join a club that's effectively treating them like a training dummy.

I am almost certain some AFL clubs (Dogs and Saints?) promise to take one player from their VFL team each year in the rookie draft as some sort of incentive for these blokes. It wouldnt be ideal clogging up a spot for us but if it attracts 3-5 good players with that hope in mind, it might build some culture and be worth the cost. We need to do something abit different as this plainly isnt working.

 

[Elite Pete]

I am almost certain some AFL clubs (Dogs and Saints?) promise to take one player from their VFL team each year in the rookie draft as some sort of incentive for these blokes. It wouldnt be ideal clogging up a spot for us but if it attracts 3-5 good players with that hope in mind, it might build some culture and be worth the cost. We need to do something abit different as this plainly isnt working.

Saints made this commitment and broke it this year already

 

[TOA.]

Saints made this commitment and broke it this year already

haha, fair. List spots are really tight.