Banter Who will be better in 2024? Carlton or Collingwood?

[Corn Cobbers]

One player is regularly torn to shreds by their own supporters, and the other is Charlie Curnow.

That is true, we do have some ignorant supporters but those who know about the game and watch Collingwood regularly understand the value this guy brings

He had a very good grand final and a good game the week before where he kicked a massive match winning goal

His 2018 prelim was epic and prevented Richmond from winning a devastating 4 in a row, then played a top notch grand final the next week while Grundy absolutely went missing

Then there's the 2020 Elim, three goals in the first quarter to set up a huge upset win

A statement player who energises the formidable Collingwood army

He's got plenty of runs on the board, in big games, while Charlie is barely off the mark at this stage, everyone knows he's a finals flop and it will eat at him in September until he shakes the monkey off his back with a big game

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[doppleganger]

tldr; buzz off minnow

Ill take that as confirmation you have nothing and really are a battler.

 

[doppleganger]

Read the first part of this rubbish and just laughed. Fancy going back three years just so you could count a year that Charlie pretty much didn't play. Let me riddle you this. How may players in the AFL have kicked 145 goals in the last two years (2022 & 2023)? Go on, you know the answer.

Not sure you comprehended what you were reading?

It was the Carlton battler who mentioned 3 years and that the best key forwards were missed.

No idea who he thought they were, and he is too embarassed to respond it seems.

Also if you were following along (clearly you weren't) the entire premise was comparing Charlie and Harry to other key forwards.

Once you get so pathetic to try and include years where a player was injured to try and make an argument against them you will probably understand why I didn't bother with the rest.

A shame you didn't bother, would have made for an entertaining read seeing as how poorly you grasped the first part.

You failed to note I didnt introduce 3 years, it was the battler, and all arguments I have made re Charlie are when he is on the park.

 

[Worm4]

That is true, we do have some ignorant supporters but those who know about the game and watch Collingwood regularly understand the value this guy brings

He had a very good grand final and a good game the week before where he kicked a massive match winning goal

His 2018 prelim was epic and prevented Richmond from winning a devastating 4 in a row, then played a top notch grand final the next week while Grundy absolutely went missing

Then there's the 2020 Elim, three goals in the first quarter to set up a huge upset win

A statement player who energises the formidable Collingwood army

He's got plenty of runs on the board, in big games, while Charlie is barely off the mark at this stage, everyone knows he's a finals flop and it will eat at him in September until he shakes the monkey off his back with a big game

On SM-A225F using BigFooty.com mobile app

It's only a matter of time where Masons credits will get used up and the masses will turn such is the Collingwood way nothing surer.
As for Curnow, well we will just have to wait and see if and when that happens for him in finals, however I suspect it will be more of a matter of when. The delivery to him in last year's finals was putrid. I'm sure the structures and game plan this year will assist both our forwards in scoring goals as already proven thus far for 2024

 

[Worm4]

Has Mason Cox

46

Mason Cox

Age

33

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211cm

Wt

110kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.7

2star

K

5.2

2star

HB

3.5

3star

M

4.0

4star

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1.6

4star

G

1.2

4star

D

6.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

2star

M

2.3

2star

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0.3

1star

G

1.0

4star

D

9.0

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

2.4

4star

G

1.8

5star

even hit the scoreboard this year in 4 games - asking for a friend

 

[Worm4]

The same Charlie that was running at 80% for three goals in three finals?

Big finals overwhelm some players. They're not for everybody.

Enter Jamie Elliot.
Ripping 2023 finals series.
You're right, they aren't for everybody

 

[Fadge]

It's only a matter of time where Masons credits will get used up and the masses will turn such is the Collingwood way nothing surer.
As for Curnow, well we will just have to wait and see if and when that happens for him in finals, however I suspect it will be more of a matter of when. The delivery to him in last year's finals was putrid. I'm sure the structures and game plan this year will assist both our forwards in scoring goals as already proven thus far for 2024

This is written as though it's a given Carlton will be playing finals again...

 

[Worm4]

This is written as though it's a given Carlton will be playing finals again...

So what. Are we not allowed to believe, or that not allowed because you said so ? Phuc me

 

[doppleganger]

And yet hasn't responded to these clear facts...

What response are you wanting?

If you exclude games when he got heaps of frees his record looks more like next rung of key forwards....No shit.

It isnt a single year thing, Harry and Charlie both recieved 68 free kicks across 2022-23, no other key forward cracked 60.

And after 3 games in 2024, they are on 5 and 6 respectively, pushing them up to 74 and 73 frees since the start of 2022. Both on track to get 100+ frees across 3 seasons, will be a good watch.

Meanwhile TomaHawk is on 26 frees despite playing more games than Harry in the same period.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Definitely not them. It's someone who wrote exactly like you, but predates you. The Old Dark Navy's will know who it is.

That poster disappeared after stating that Kade Simpson was too skinny to make it in the AFL.

 

[doppleganger]

Lucky you took that.

I'll try and explain it for you in easy words. It is sad that the poster tried to include 2021 in the figures to make Charlie look bad (as in he's not one of the three players to kick 150 goals in the last 3 years). He knows full well that Charlie was out injured for the vast majority of 2021 . So the 3 forwards he mentions all had a chance to kick 50'ish of their 150 in 2021 whist Charlie didn't.

However in 2022 & 2023 Charlie has kicked 145 goals. Clearly the most in the league.

It's a bit pathetic to use a year that a player couldn't play as part of an argument as to why he isn't the most prolific forward. It would be as ridiculous as me saying that Jamie Elliott was one of the worst forwards in the comp between 202016 - 2018 because he only kicked 34 goals in that time whilst knowing full well that he didn't play in 2016 or 2018.

Might be best you not take it from here.

Are you still going with this crap?

It was the battler who introduced the 3 years.

Dominant key forwards in 'recent times' and you exclude teh best two forwards in teh game over teh last 3 years? I mean really?

And if you were too daft to realise, the point was which key forwards to compare against Charlie.

Might be best that you dont bother anymore.

 

[Worm4]

What response are you wanting?

If you exclude games when he got heaps of frees his record looks more like next rung of key forwards....No s**t.

It isnt a single year thing, Harry and Charlie both recieved 68 free kicks across 2022-23, no other key forward cracked 60.

And after 3 games in 2024, they are on 5 and 6 respectively, pushing them up to 74 and 73 frees since the start of 2022. Both on track to get 100+ frees across 3 seasons, will be a good watch.

Meanwhile TomaHawk is on 26 frees despite playing more games than Harry in the same period.

Is there a rule that stipulates that the free kicks amongst forwards should be even but ? I understand that you all get a but upset when he kicks 6 on Moore because he doesn't know how to defend properly, but really, you are clutching at straws here. Perhaps consider that they work together better than most, help each other, block for one another etc to get the best possible chance to score whether it be from marks or free kicks because free kicks are an actual thing in AFL football like it or not. The key is to not give them away in crucial areas. Blame the defenders, not the forwards

 

[Corn Cobbers]

Has Mason Cox

46

Mason Cox

Age

33

Ht

211cm

Wt

110kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.7

2star

K

5.2

2star

HB

3.5

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.6

4star

G

1.2

4star

D

6.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

3.0

2star

M

2.3

2star

T

0.3

1star

G

1.0

4star

D

9.0

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

2.4

4star

G

1.8

5star

even hit the scoreboard this year in 4 games - asking for a friend

No but he's had 85 hit outs...

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[doppleganger]

Enter Jamie Elliot.
Ripping 2023 finals series.
You're right, they aren't for everybody

Jamie had 17 score involvements across the 2023 finals series, the equal most of any Pie.

 

[doppleganger]

Is there a rule that stipulates that the free kicks amongst forwards should be even but ?

Of course there isnt.

It is just an interesting anomaly that sticks out.

Perhaps consider that they work together better than most, help each other, block for one another etc to get the best possible chance to score

You dont reckon that is what TomaHawk and Cameron do?

They are the key forward pairing that has kicked the most goals in recent times.

whether it be from marks or free kicks because free kicks are an actual thing in AFL football like it or not. The key is to not give them away in crucial areas. Blame the defenders, not the forwards.

Agree, that the key is getting frees in crucial areas.

The TomaHawk n Cameron combo have only received 76 combined since 2022, half of the 147 frees that H and Charlie have received.

I bet Geelong fans would love for their key forwards to get a free everytime a defender scragged their key forwards.

 

[Worm4]

Jamie had 17 score involvements across the 2023 finals series, the equal most of any Pie.

1 goal . If Curnow is under such a microscope for his 3 goals, why not Elliot. Just saying...

 

[Worm4]

Of course there isnt.

It is just an interesting anomaly that sticks out.


You dont reckon that is what TomaHawk and Cameron do?

They are the key forward pairing that has kicked the most goals in recent times.


Agree, that the key is getting frees in crucial areas.

The TomaHawk n Cameron combo have only received 76 combined since 2022, half of the 147 frees that H and Charlie have received.

I bet Geelong fans would love for their key forwards to get a free everytime a defender scragged their key forwards.

But Geelongs forwards don't play the same way as Carltons do . They both lead to the players with possession and have more room to work with . Geelong players generally lower their eyes moving forward. For the past 2 years, Carlton have a game plan of bombing the ball in trying to create manic pressure on defence. Of course they would naturally draw more free kicks

 

[doppleganger]

1 goal . If Curnow is under such a microscope for his 3 goals, why not Elliot. Just saying...

Curnow is under the microscope as he was bog ordinary in all 3 finals.

There is more to Jamie's game than just goals. He had a quiet QF, but was still a connector and played fine in PF and GF, and went at his season avg in relation to score involvements across the finals series.

 

[Worm4]

No but he's had 85 hit outs...

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And out of those 85 hit outs, only 23 to advantage. Yikes

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

Curnow is under the microscope as he was bog ordinary in all 3 finals.

There is more to Jamie's game than just goals. He had a quiet QF, but was still a connector and played fine in PF and GF, and went at his season avg in relation to score involvements across the finals series.

And Curnow single handedly brought the ball to ground against one of the best defenses in the comp in Melbourne when McKay was out.

Your nuffies still like bringing up that he didn't perform at his best

 

[Corn Cobbers]

And out of those 85 hit outs, only 23 to advantage. Yikes

Still a big improvement on his early-career ruck work

He ain't Polly Farmer

But what a scrapbook the big Texan is collatingView attachment 1948986View attachment 1948987

On SM-A225F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[doppleganger]

But Geelongs forwards don't play the same way as Carltons do . They both lead to the players with possession and have more room to work with . Geelong players generally lower their eyes moving forward. For the past 2 years, Carlton have a game plan of bombing the ball in trying to create manic pressure on defence. Of course they would naturally draw more free kicks

Good theory, but the actual stats dont align with your thesis.

Carlton are the slower more deliberate kick mark team with lower meters per disposal and it is Harry who avg the most marks on lead in last couple of seasons of all 4 players.

Also not sure of your belief that being on the lead would not draw free kicks, a key forward on a lead inside 50 is when the defender panics and holds or chops the arm.

 

[Worm4]

Good theory, but the actual stats dont align with your thesis.

Also not sure of your belief that being on the lead would not draw free kicks, a key forward on a lead inside 50 is when the defender panics and holds or chops the arm

I didn't say that the leading player would not draw free kicks. Where did I say that ?

 

[doppleganger]

And Curnow single handedly brought the ball to ground against one of the best defenses in the comp in Melbourne when McKay was out.

Your nuffies still like bringing up that he didn't perform at his best

LoL...Jamie had more pressure acts in the GF than Charlie managed in all 3 finals combined.

Curnow was bog average in all 3 finals, not sure why Carlton fans are trying to make out he wasn't....but then also pot other players who actually did their bit?

 

[Worm4]

And Curnow single handedly brought the ball to ground against one of the best defenses in the comp in Melbourne when McKay was out.

Your nuffies still like bringing up that he didn't perform at his best

He didn't perform at his best , but when the game is played predominantly in Brisbane's forward line for the last 3 quarters of the game, im not sure exactly what the key forward is suppose to do.
He did have score involvements , a little stat brought up by our collingwood brethren, so wasn't completely void of presence as much as they like to suggest